Deconversion Complete

[LosingMyReligion]

Two weeks ago I came out to my mother and told her I was gay.

 

Coming from an evangelical Baptist Christian family, in Texas, I knew it would not be well recieved. I'm in my mid 20's now and I've been struggling with my sexual orientation since I was around eight or nine years old. I only recently accepted as a natural part of myself(around 7 months ago). In those last few months I have been going to support groups and etc, to find strength.

 

So I told her and she basically acted like I had just died or killed somebody...Which was cool, I knew she would respond like that because God wrote the bible himself as far as she's concerned.

However, she has been very good about accepting me and we are working through this together. I already told her that I didn't care what the bible had to say(she dramatically clutched her chest when I said that). I have to live my life for myself and not you. The fact that I still believe in a higher power wasn't good enough for her...She thinks it is the Judeo Christian god or nothing.

 

Moving on from that. I knew that my mom was having a hard time with my sexuality so I gave her permission to talk to my aunt(her son, my cousin, is also gay....and we have three other gay relatives also on that side of the family.) about it. Well, my aunt, I found out, is a loud mouth, two faced, troll. After she got off the phone with my mom she telephoned every single one of my immediate family members and told them I was gay.

The next thing I know everyone(my brothers, cousins, and etc)are calling and chewing my mother out and blaming her for making me gay. They said I am going through a phase and I am just trying to be different(mind you, I am in my mid 20's...).

 

To make a long story short my oldest brother called me up on my cell phone and asked me if I wanted to hang out and grab a bite to eat. I said okay, knowing full well what it was going to be about.

Now, mind you, it has just been revealed that I'm gay. So my brother took me to a HOOTERS restaraunt. I had to keep myself from laughing...As if I was going to turn straight after 20 some odd years just seeing waitresses dressed in skimpy outfits.

Anyway, we got into the inevitable conversation...

And before long out come the Bible scriptures and condemnation...

He started talking about something must have happened to me in my childhood, something I didn't remember. I told him, "The way you talk about it makes it like a needle prick would have turned me gay. My mental state was not that fragile..."

Then he starts going on and on about how there is a heaven and a hell and how we will all be held accountable for sin.

By this point I am getting really mad, but I just sorta blow it off. Then I said, "Well, I don't want to know a tyrant of a god who would make me one way and then condemn afterwards."

And I also told him that I did not want to be one of those men who got married and ended up cheating on his wife with another man to fulfill his sexual urges...

And then he said, "Well, what would be wrong with that? That would be no different than cheating with a woman...You could get married and lead and normal life while satisfying yourself."

Now that shocked the hell out of me...He's up here telling me about all of these morals and etc..etc...and telling me to be immoral in the same breathe.

 

The conversation continued on and on and I did not relent in my position. And in those moments something just clicked inside of me.

I remembered my mother and looked at my brother as well. I pity both of them, because they are nothing but slaves to the religion. They have lived their entire lives believing that all their suffering comes from god and any form of pleasure and contentment is from satan.

My brother asked me if my peace of mind(since accepting my sexuality)was a product of satan. I retorted with, "Isn't Jesus supposed to be the prince of peace?"

 

Anyway, Christianity has made my life a living hell. It has messed me up so badly, and I haven't been able to see it until now. I look at all of my family and friends and I really do pity them. I still believe in a highpower, but I choose to believe that god(whether it be male, female, or some force) is bigger than any dogma, church, or set of rules written by a bunch of men thousands of years ago.

I refuse to waste away the rest of my life hating who I am and trying to change it Just because the church says so.

 

So I say good bye to the Christian faith... I don't need a religion that tells me I am a horrible person just for being who I am.

 

I officially LOSTmyReligion.

[pandora]

Congratulations! It's really liberating.

 

One thing that struck me was your brother's response that you could cheat while married. What about the woman you married? What about the equality of all "sins" in God's eyes? That's just... ignorant and heartless and... few words describe that kind of thinking.

 

I wish you peace in your dealings with your family. I have two cousins that are gay (and one in the final stages of AIDS). The one who has AIDS came out to his uber-fundy mother when I was in middle school. She was completely heartless, dramatic (much like your mom), and she said many hurtful things to my cousin. But there's hope--- today she completely accepts him, and as a result of his coming out, she is now a moderate Christian that thinks being gay is A-okay. I guess it just takes time. To them, it is like you died... it doesn't make sense, but that's how it is. I am glad that you came to have some sense of peace about it. Hang in there!

[pitchu]

LMR,

 

Good for you.

 

It sounds like you handled these amazingly uncaring reactions with great aplomb and dignity.

 

I wonder if your mom or brother or any of the others even realize that every day (probably every hour) someone comes out to a member of their family and is met with, "Y'know, I'd kind of been wondering, but I thought it was up to you to tell me. I'm glad you did. Come give me a hug."

 

I wonder why people can't just go instantly to the place of love instead of retribution.

[Gnosis of Disbelief]

Good for you! I suppose I'm not surprised by your family's reaction,

but it's something that will never make sense to me. So you like to

sleep with other guys? So what? It's not like you killed anybody.

I also find your brother's preaching to you in a Hooter's rather.....

ironic......

[godlessgrrl]

Awesome!

 

Congratulations, LMR - and good for you for standing your ground. Hopefully your family will come around and learn some tolerance about it. Ironically their preaching, while annoying, shows that at this point at least they're still willing to talk to you... so I'd bet there's some hope.

 

But you're absolutely right not to live your life dishonestly, hiding who and what you are. That's just bullshit and a horrible thing for anyone to have to do.

 

BTW what part of Tex-ass are you from? I had relatives in Weatherford. Interesting state...

 

Kudos to you again. Don't let the religious bastards get you down.

[thunderbolt]

Hey LMR

 

Good for you, and glad you took the courage to live out loud, and to live the life you feel is best for you. The biggest part of your struggle is over, and always remember that you are not responsible for their choices and or how they react towards the decision about your life.

 

Chin up!

[All Gods Fail]

LMR, you so did the right thing. I can think of few more horrible ways to live than as a repressed, closet-case Texas Baptist. You'd probably wind up like a Fred Phelps, so horribly twisted he can only find pleasure in hatred.

 

Coming out and ditching the church is double hard - I'd say you were a pretty strong guy to be able to do both and still be able to laugh about it!

[LosingMyReligion]

Good for you! I suppose I'm not surprised by your family's reaction,

but it's something that will never make sense to me. So you like to

sleep with other guys? So what? It's not like you killed anybody.

I also find your brother's preaching to you in a Hooter's rather.....

ironic......

 

Totally, and I suggested a quaint literally restauraunt where we could actually TALK without loud televisions and music going...

The next thing I know we're at HOOTERS. The ONLY reason we went there was to see if I was really gay.

He acts as if gay men have NO appreciation for beauty. I love women, and I think the hooters girls are drop dead gorgeous...But they don't make my troop salute, plain and simple.

 

Then my mom starting asking me if I think my sexual orientation is a medical problem...LOL. She basically thinks that maybe I don't have enough hormones or something to get aroused. So I told her I have no problem getting aroused around guys I like.

 

They'll eventually get over it. I don't plan on leading an "immoral" lifestyle, which could put my life in danger.

 

I'm still the same person....who happens to be gay.

 

And I realize how much the religion hurt me, emotionally, for making me surpress such a vital part of myself. And I really do feel pity for my family members for being enslaved to it. Life shouldn't be so hard. =0(

[Lorena Rodriguez]

LMR,

 

Wow! You rock. I just don't believe I would've had the courage to come out like that. And then have to face everybody.

 

I also admire you for not punching your brother on the nose when he started patronizing you, asuming that you didn't know the whole heaven and hell ordeal.

 

I just don't know how you did it. I wish I could have 25% of your courage and strenght.

 

It would be great if you kept this thread updated with the latest develpments. I'm sure it ain't over and more stuff will happen.

 

Thank you for posting and sharing your story.

 

Lorena

[Open_Minded]

Coming from an evangelical Baptist Christian family, in Texas, I knew it would not be well recieved. I'm in my mid 20's now and I've been struggling with my sexual orientation since I was around eight or nine years old. I only recently accepted as a natural part of myself(around 7 months ago).

Congratulations LosingMyReligion, I'm happy for you. You've reached this point much earlier than many do. It took my brother until his mid-thirties to reach the point you've reached now.

 

Moving on from that. I knew that my mom was having a hard time with my sexuality so I gave her permission to talk to my aunt(her son, my cousin, is also gay....and we have three other gay relatives also on that side of the family.) about it.

....And the abundance of gay males in your family doesn't give your mother, siblings and relatives a clue. (shaking head)

 

Oh well ... like you said ... they are "slaves to religion"

 

Then my mom starting asking me if I think my sexual orientation is a medical problem...LOL. She basically thinks that maybe I don't have enough hormones or something to get aroused. So I told her I have no problem getting aroused around guys I like.

Yes... one cousin "forgave" my brother for being gay and compared his sexual orientation as something akin to alcoholism. Anything but the facts, because the facts might mean we have to deal with reality.

 

Anyway, you're out and you're free - so congratulations.

[LosingMyReligion]

Here is an e-mail my brother sent me today...And he asked me to not be offended by it...

 

 

The Jezebel Spirit

by Os Hillman, April 9, 2006

 

Nevertheless, I have this against you: You tolerate that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess. By her teaching she misleads my servants into sexual immorality and the eating of food sacrificed to idols. - Revelation 2:20

 

One of the major ruling spirits opposing the Kingdom of God today is the spirit of Jezebel. It has dominion over many aspects of society including the workplace and the entertainment industry. It predominantly lives in females, but is not always gender specific.

 

The spirit of Jezebel seeks to destroy true worship, the family, morality, and the God-ordained leadership. It misleads and corrupts the Church and seeks to neutralize the lives of prophets, pastors, and other leadership.

 

The spirit of Jezebel is best seen in the story of Naboth's garden in First Kings 21. In this story King Ahab desires to purchase some land next to the king's palace. Naboth refuses to sell. When Jezebel hears of this, she embarrasses Ahab, telling him he should be ashamed because he is the king and has every right to the land. She promptly plots against Naboth to get the land for the king. This leads to Naboth's murder. Ahab does not know of this plot by his wife, but when the king shows up to claim the land, the prophet Elijah shows up too and pronounces judgment on Ahab and his wife. In this passage we see that God held Ahab ultimately responsible for the death of Naboth.

 

Jezebel's ultimate goal is always control. Jezebels cause fear, flight, and discouragement. They are often natural leaders. Often subtle and deceptive, they are proud, independent, and rebellious. Jezebels cannot live without Ahabs who allow them to be effective and operate unchallenged. Ahabs fail to operate as godly, loving leaders. Rather, they give in to pressure from the Jezebels, often due to their own insecurities and sexual needs.

 

The answer to defeating the Jezebel spirit for the person who is influenced by it is true repentance, humility, and brokenness before God. The person who is "Jezebeled" must firmly stand against the sexual exploitation of this spirit.

 

If you find yourself confronting this spirit, ask the Lord to give you discernment and wisdom. You will need fasting and prayer to win this battle. Men should not use this knowledge as a license to lord over or control women, but understand that this spirit opposes God's design of the two equal but distinct roles for men and women

 

 

My big fat overzealous evangelical Family...

 

I am getting sick and tired of this. Does he not know how much I was into religion trying to change my sexuality? I really could slug him for this.

But, whatever...He can't scare me out of being gay. I just am and I have no intention of being an immoral person.

[thunderbolt]

My big fat overzealous evangelical Family...

 

I am getting sick and tired of this. Does he not know how much I was into religion trying to change my sexuality? I really could slug him for this.

But, whatever...He can't scare me out of being gay. I just am and I have no intention of being an immoral person.

Sweet jeeezuz - he's playing the jezebel spirit now? Ugh. You know, even by their own theological definitions, sexuality is not a spirit, but of the flesh, and you pretty much can't drive out the “flesh” with an exorcism prayer, now can you?

Hahaha, let’s see:

Q: Why are you gay?

A: The devil made me do it.

 

Do they even read what they think?

 

But I see your skin is growing thicker – kudos!

;-)

[Saviourmachine]

Hi LMR. It's very difficult to do, but I think it's best to just ignore them for a couple of weeks. (I found it difficult, because I still think each time again that they would argue in a reasonable way.) Stabilize a bit after your "confession". Make sure you're really, really not an exception to the rule, but they are. That you are reasoning in a sound way, and they are not. That you have higher morals than they. And you will find yourself one day busy with things that are really more important than these issues that should actually not even being part of a culture (and neither racism, nazism, etc).

However, I feel sometimes so alone in trying to give sense to my own life. I enjoy life, and I don't envy the dead, but I'm always searching for that hidden treasure behind the mirror. That scar of my past never fades.

[Vigile]

Here is an e-mail my brother sent me today...And he asked me to not be offended by it...

 

Now this just pisses me off. This is the reason I hate, loathe xtianity. I don't hate xtians, but it really does piss me off that they can't see the hypocracy here. He takes you to Hooters tells you to live a double life and then sends you this letter? What the fuck. I will say that your coming out is likely going to go a lot further towards moving your family away from fundementalism than their stupid evangelical efforts will ever move you towards returning to the fold. Bravo for you. Your attitude in this is much better than mine would have been. And I really do empathize with your family. I know what it's like to think like they do. It's the meme that pisses me off, not them.

[LosingMyReligion]

Thanks Vigil, Thunderbolt, and Saviour...

 

It is really hard. This is precisely why I didn't want to come out to anyone else(and my bitch of an aunt took away my choice to do so on my own terms). I knew this would happen.

I am probably the first, in several generations of my family, to absolutely reject the Christian God. There is no one that I can turn to within my familial line to talk about this with...

 

They are so indoctorinated in this crap that they goto the bible to get a better understanding of the bible. All my brother reads is that Christian crap from Christian authors(who churn out books because they know there is a market, and it espouses the same bullshit)...And he somehow tries to apply it to his life.

Presently, he has been fired from his second job...AFTER losing his house and apartment. Now he has to live with his daughter and son-in-law...And he believes that god is trying to send him a message.

 

Now he believes that God has put him back into my life so he can pray and convert me to being sexually attracted to girls.

 

I believe I need distance from them all. Because I'm finally at the point where I feel peace and tranquility in my life and I don't need him to bring conflict into it.

 

They'll eventually get over it but I am sure as hell not going to wait on them to do so.

[Gnosis of Disbelief]

Thanks Vigil, Thunderbolt, and Saviour...

 

It is really hard. This is precisely why I didn't want to come out to anyone else(and my bitch of an aunt took away my choice to do so on my own terms). I knew this would happen.

I am probably the first, in several generations of my family, to absolutely reject the Christian God. There is no one that I can turn to within my familial line to talk about this with...

 

They are so indoctorinated in this crap that they goto the bible to get a better understanding of the bible. All my brother reads is that Christian crap from Christian authors(who churn out books because they know there is a market, and it espouses the same bullshit)...And he somehow tries to apply it to his life.

Presently, he has been fired from his second job...AFTER losing his house and apartment. Now he has to live with his daughter and son-in-law...And he believes that god is trying to send him a message.

 

Now he believes that God has put him back into my life so he can pray and convert me to being sexually attracted to girls.

 

I believe I need distance from them all. Because I'm finally at the point where I feel peace and tranquility in my life and I don't need him to bring conflict into it.

 

They'll eventually get over it but I am sure as hell not going to wait on them to do so.

 

 

Oh, great, he's screwed up his life, so now he's got a divine mission to screw

up yours? You're right, keping distance right now is probably the best thing

for you. And that email of his highlighted many of the things I hate about

christianity.

 

 

 

 

I don't get the spirit of Jezebel thing, though. Jezebel died and is supposedly

burning in hell, according to typical fundy xtian beliefs. Is he saying that she

died and turned into a demon? He's got issues if he feels that burning in

hell forever isn't torment enough, now you've got to turn into a demon, too.

[Guest Fallen Angel]

Well done for taking the brave decision to come out to your Christian family. My brother came out to my very Christian parents (and I was a Christian too at the time) in the early 80s. There was much wailing and gnashing of teeth. My father made some comment about men who hang around toilet blocks which really upset my brother. I just didn't understand it. I thought it was some affectation or stage he was going through.

 

I don't know what will happen with your family, but with mine, my brother coming out was a huge blessing (if you'll pardon the word). My parents had to reexamine their beliefs. They had to reconcile their love for my brother with their faith. They are both still believers but their faith is now much less fundamental. My mum even has doubts about the virgin birth and so on, but she is contented with whatever it is that she now believes. And both my parents are very proud of my brother, who now has a PhD and is a university lecturer. They stand up against people in their church and community who criticise gay people. They accepted and loved my brother's long-term partner.

 

Without any of this there is a good chance they'd still be living their closetted, narrow-minded lives.

 

Just be who you are and give them time to come to terms with this (and if they can't it's their loss). It will hopefully be as liberating for them as it was for my parents - and eventually - me too.

[LosingMyReligion]

Thanks for your comment Fallen Angel, I really needed it.

 

I am in a really bad state right now. The last two days have been the worst of my life, and today is no better.

 

Everyone surrounding me is a fundamentalist Christian. And I truly believe that I am in hell right now. It feels like I am doing the whole wailing and gnashing of teeth thing right here on Earth.

 

Day by day it gets worse and worse.

 

No one wants to believe I am gay, simply because I don't fit any of the stereotypes(I am a masculine guy)..They believe it is a phase and that god can take it away from me, "In his own set time..."

and afterwards I just have to deal with it until god decides to relieve me of my sexual orientation...

I've had endless debates with all of my brothers, my mother(who is trying to help me...I, admittedly, need to be a bit more patient), and NOW a "friend" who is also a Christian...

Now my friend is gay too(Because he and I made out about three times when I slept over my house for the weekend), but he won't admit it. He believes that homosexuality is something that we struggle with and that god put it in our lives to make us stronger or whatever the fuck that jibber jabber means...

Anyway, the one person that I think I can turn to, sans any judgement, starts getting on a pedestal and "witnessing" to me about how God has his own set time...

That I could be 80-years-old and on my death bed when the "change" comes....Yes, not only will I not have a libido but I'll be dead too, waiting for a "change."

 

Then he had the audacity to say that I have no faith if I just accept my sexuality...That GOD can't work that way.

 

Just typing this makes me so angry and sad all at once. I have to get out of here and I am seriously considering dropping out of school, for the time being, to do so...

I keep wondering whether or not my sanity is more important than this.

 

I don't want to lead an immoral lifestyle. I would just like the oppurtunity to love and be loved in the way that I am truly capable of. I don't want to drag someone else into a lie just to impress everyone else.

 

Needless to say I would rather have my fingernails pulled out with a pair of rusty plyers than go through this.

 

 

My mom is talking about getting us therapy together and I obliged.

 

I don't know who to trust anymore...I have no one to turn to. =0(

[All Gods Fail]

Everyone surrounding me is a fundamentalist Christian. And I truly believe that I am in hell right now. It feels like I am doing the whole wailing and gnashing of teeth thing right here on Earth.

 

Day by day it gets worse and worse.

 

Man - talk about ignoring the beam in your own eye. Your brother sounds like a mess, but he's going to be your moral compass?

 

Dude, I think you might do well to get the hell out of there. Surrounded by fundies is no way to go through life. Cruel as it sounds, you might have to just start cutting people out of your life - temporarily, till you get things sorted out.

 

There is so much wrong with the fundie's perception of homosexuality, and you will probably never be able to change their thinking. You've gotta remember these people are cultists, and have been brainwashed but good. You have too, but you were actually lucky you turned out to be gay - it gave you a good reason to rethink the cult and decide it was crap.

 

Going to counseling may help your mom, as long as it's not religious-based and tries to 'cure' you.

 

Also, take a look to see if there are any gay/lesbian support groups in your area. Learning from others who've been in your shoes could help quite a bit.

 

It's your life, not theirs. Gently remind them that your beliefs have no affect on theirs. And hang in there!

[Gnosis of Disbelief]

Thanks for your comment Fallen Angel, I really needed it.

 

I am in a really bad state right now. The last two days have been the worst of my life, and today is no better.

 

Everyone surrounding me is a fundamentalist Christian. And I truly believe that I am in hell right now. It feels like I am doing the whole wailing and gnashing of teeth thing right here on Earth.

 

Day by day it gets worse and worse.

 

No one wants to believe I am gay, simply because I don't fit any of the stereotypes(I am a masculine guy)..They believe it is a phase and that god can take it away from me, "In his own set time..."

and afterwards I just have to deal with it until god decides to relieve me of my sexual orientation...

I've had endless debates with all of my brothers, my mother(who is trying to help me...I, admittedly, need to be a bit more patient), and NOW a "friend" who is also a Christian...

Now my friend is gay too(Because he and I made out about three times when I slept over my house for the weekend), but he won't admit it. He believes that homosexuality is something that we struggle with and that god put it in our lives to make us stronger or whatever the fuck that jibber jabber means...

Anyway, the one person that I think I can turn to, sans any judgement, starts getting on a pedestal and "witnessing" to me about how God has his own set time...

That I could be 80-years-old and on my death bed when the "change" comes....Yes, not only will I not have a libido but I'll be dead too, waiting for a "change."

 

Then he had the audacity to say that I have no faith if I just accept my sexuality...That GOD can't work that way.

 

Just typing this makes me so angry and sad all at once. I have to get out of here and I am seriously considering dropping out of school, for the time being, to do so...

I keep wondering whether or not my sanity is more important than this.

 

I don't want to lead an immoral lifestyle. I would just like the oppurtunity to love and be loved in the way that I am truly capable of. I don't want to drag someone else into a lie just to impress everyone else.

 

Needless to say I would rather have my fingernails pulled out with a pair of rusty plyers than go through this.

 

 

My mom is talking about getting us therapy together and I obliged.

 

I don't know who to trust anymore...I have no one to turn to. =0(

 

 

 

Oh, man.....that's rough.....maybe you can transfer to a different school,

preferrably one out of state? It would be a big move, but it sounds like

you need to get the hell out of there, before the Jeebus cultists suck the

life out of you.

 

(((LosingMyReligion)))

[LosingMyReligion]

Updated...

 

What a difference a day makes....

 

1.) My "friend" called me up on the phone last night and I ended our friendship. I told him that when I needed him the most he started preaching....I don't need a friend like that. So I got one fundie nut out of my life.

 

2.) One of my brothers comes over and tries to preach to me and etc etc....When I didn't relent in my position this fool tries to impress me by, literally, wiping his hands in my face...Like he is Pontius fucking Pilate, releasing me to the wolves. He told my mom he wasn't going to bother me anymore. Whatever....One less fundie nut out of my life.

 

3.) Even though I don't like lying to my mom I lied and told her I still believe Jesus is the son of god...So she is really happy. Since the lie doesn't hurt either of us it's cool...Hey, she lied to me about Santa Claus and The Tooth Fairy.

 

Overall, there are some good days and bad ones. I am having a good one today. I can make it through this for three more semesters.

[Gnosis of Disbelief]

That's good news....best of luck!

[Guest Fallen Angel]

It sounds really rough. What sort of therapy does your mum want to get? If it's fundy - forget it. It needs to be about her accepting you, not about you miraculously becoming heterosexual. It might be worthwhile if it's with a non-religious family counsellor.

 

You might also want to see if there's a confidential gay and lesbian counselling service in your area that you could call for advice and support. You should be able to find something on Google. I'm in Australia or I'd see if I could find something for you!

 

And be true to yourself. You are not immoral; you are not bad and you are not wrong. You are you. You are being who you are, and that is a lot healthier than trying to deny your true self like your friend is doing.

 

All the best - hugs. Keep posting if it helps.

[LosingMyReligion]

Thanks Fallen.

 

Thankfully, the counselor isn't a fundy. All the counselors at this particular hospital are impartial. So it should be good for me.

 

My mom pretty much accepts that this is the way it is. If there is even the slightest inclination that I'm with a covert conversion therapist that will be the first and last session.