I Read a Long Script about Gaslighting a Former Church Member

[AnonSan]

Several years ago, a former, devout sister from my family's church of origin released a letter online. Her letter articulated about why she left the "church life" and of how much pain, convictions, and trauma she experienced growing up in the system. As expected, it caused an uproar among the brothers and sisters, though many people supported and validated her decision and grievances. In response to the letter, the leading cohort of the church institution held a "special meeting" with 900+ members who graduated from their training camp 2 years ago. Until recently, I found a transcript from this meeting, even though one of the leaders present in the meeting told everyone not to share this online yet proclaiming "We do not have anything to hide!"

 

To spare the details, the outcome and response to her grievances were infuriating . Throughout the seminar, the brothers kept gaslighting her experience saying that she was rubbish/poisoned/infected, thus discouraging everyone to read her letter. They kept on blaming the devil and instead of taking accountability, the brothers shared with doublespeak of their "unbiased" experience in the church that already favored them. The most they did was to claim that they're not perfect, but don't expect getting the 'Disneyland' experience. Instead of being proactive in addressing the issues, they were just given lip service the "lack of shepherding" was why there is corruption in the church. Instead of implementing actual preventive measures from issues going out of hand, they would rather pray and put them into God's hands because the church is their "hospital".

Easy for the leading brothers to say because their efforts, labor, and SHEPHERDING is very lackluster/minimal compared to the sisters in the church, while they lounged on the sidelines every week. A good portion of the author's letter also emphasized the lack of appreciation and importance towards the sisters supporting the church's backbone that without them, the church organization would even cease to exist. The leaders' only response to that is that the church doesn't hate and exclude the sisters, yet sisters were not allowed to attend this meeting and no one in the audience expressed gratitude and thankfulness to them. 

[TheRedneckProfessor]

How much of this do you reckon was just fundamentalist misogyny versus how much was just traditional Asian chauvinism?  This church must have felt like a double shot of hatred.

[☆ moxieflux66 ☆]

15 minutes ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

How much of this do you reckon was just fundamentalist misogyny versus how much was just traditional Asian chauvinism?  This church must have felt like a double shot of hatred.

I wondered about this too. What do you think AnonSan? 

[AnonSan]

1 hour ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

How much of this do you reckon was just fundamentalist misogyny versus how much was just traditional Asian chauvinism?  This church must have felt like a double shot of hatred.

 

They pretty much go hand in hand. Me and my former sisters in the church were held to much higher expectations and responsibility than our (biological and church) brothers. Sisters did the majority in conducting daycare, kitchen, filing, children/teen lectures, music, hospitality, and library services on top of their career/school outside of church. It was like taking care of two families as a single mom, or in place of their husbands who travel a lot for work. All decisions are made final by leading brothers despite having minimal first-hand experience in those services. The church organization very much enables and parallels Asian chauvinism by treating their men like emperors, while the women had to pick up their pieces and be 110% selflessly compliant. Otherwise, you risk being labeled as useless and problematic to the church's integrity -> losing face-> poor family reputation. Since my dad briefly served as one of my family's church leader/elder there in my youth, rebelling against the system from my end was not a light-hearted option. 

 

Even though my dad can cook and take care of house like my housewife mom, the responsibility automatically fell onto me while my older brother never once had lift his hands to help around the house. Their excuse being that he is clumsy or "bèn shǒu bèn jiǎo" (translates to stupid hands, stupid feet) when in reality he utilized weaponized incompetence to get away with responsibility. Growing up, I often heard and saw my mom's feedback to improve church services get shot down by my dad behind closed doors almost every evening. I do not know the fine details about my mom's constructive criticism, but my understanding was most of her proposed feedback were often shot down because they inconvenienced the brothers and/or they could care less believing the burden is a sisters' problem. The brothers' needs coming before their sisters' continued as they crank up the church's air conditioning to the max, leaving the sisters shivering and expecting to tolerate it.

 

The silver lining from doing those tasks made me a very efficient person in my studies, work, errands, and keeping up with the house. My husband always consistently expressed appreciation for them by always offering to help out whenever he can or treat me out for a nice trip/meal/treat. My church of origin, on the other hand, were ungrateful, complacent, and quick to nitpick and complain about the (arbitrary) traits and actions among the sisters to keep them in place, while jokingly proclaim that brothers only tend to act out under the pretense of "boys being boys." 

 

 

[☆ moxieflux66 ☆]

58 minutes ago, AnonSan said:

 

They pretty much go hand in hand. Me and my former sisters in the church were held to much higher expectations and responsibility than our (biological and church) brothers. Sisters did the majority in conducting daycare, kitchen, filing, children/teen lectures, music, hospitality, and library services on top of their career/school outside of church. It was like taking care of two families as a single mom, or in place of their husbands who travel a lot for work. All decisions are made final by leading brothers despite having minimal first-hand experience in those services. The church organization very much enables and parallels Asian chauvinism by treating their men like emperors, while the women had to pick up their pieces and be 110% selflessly compliant. Otherwise, you risk being labeled as useless and problematic to the church's integrity -> losing face-> poor family reputation. Since my dad briefly served as one of my family's church leader/elder there in my youth, rebelling against the system from my end was not a light-hearted option. 

 

Even though my dad can cook and take care of house like my housewife mom, the responsibility automatically fell onto me while my older brother never once had lift his hands to help around the house. Their excuse being that he is clumsy or "bèn shǒu bèn jiǎo" (translates to stupid hands, stupid feet) when in reality he utilized weaponized incompetence to get away with responsibility. Growing up, I often heard and saw my mom's feedback to improve church services get shot down by my dad behind closed doors almost every evening. I do not know the fine details about my mom's constructive criticism, but my understanding was most of her proposed feedback were often shot down because they inconvenienced the brothers and/or they could care less believing the burden is a sisters' problem. The brothers' needs coming before their sisters' continued as they crank up the church's air conditioning to the max, leaving the sisters shivering and expecting to tolerate it.

 

The silver lining from doing those tasks made me a very efficient person in my studies, work, errands, and keeping up with the house. My husband always consistently expressed appreciation for them by always offering to help out whenever he can or treat me out for a nice trip/meal/treat. My church of origin, on the other hand, were ungrateful, complacent, and quick to nitpick and complain about the (arbitrary) traits and actions among the sisters to keep them in place, while jokingly proclaim that brothers only tend to act out under the pretense of "boys being boys." 

 

 

Thank you for that very enlightening account of that issue. Again, had no idea but it makes sense that it would be/become that way in a church organization of that sort. 

And the SILVER LINING!!! It is awesome you recognize that at such an early age. And again I am grateful you have such an excellent role model and husband to support you in all your awakenings. 

 

[TheRedneckProfessor]

You deserve to be treated as more than a mere afterthought, little sister.  It sounds like you are realizing that now; and I'm proud of you for it.  I'm also proud of you for choosing a husband who realizes it as well.

[◊ Krowb ◊]

2 hours ago, AnonSan said:

My husband always consistently expressed appreciation for them by always offering to help out whenever he can or treat me out for a nice trip/meal/treat.

 

So you married a Shanghai husband? lol

[AnonSan]

9 minutes ago, Krowb said:

 

So you married a Shanghai husband? lol

 

Actually, he's Hispanic/Latino 

[◊ Weezer ◊]

6 hours ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

How much of this do you reckon was just fundamentalist misogyny versus how much was just traditional Asian chauvinism?  This church must have felt like a double shot of hatred.

Sounds like the Asian version is a little stronger than the USA version.   I am reminded of something my mother once said when someone asked her how she felt about having to go along with the male elders decision about something they were planning.  Mom replied with something like this.  "The men may be the head of the church, but their wives sometimes are the necks that turn the heads in the direction they need to go."   And she was right.  To an outsider at church, it looked like dad was the leader, but in the privacy of our home she was quite the influencer!  And it was usually for the good.  And one of the other 2 elders was in the same situation.

[☆ moxieflux66 ☆]

1 hour ago, Weezer said:

"The men may be the head of the church, but their wives sometimes are the necks that turn the heads in the direction they need to go." 

I heard this line in "My Big Fat Greek Wedding" by the bride's mother. I am pleased your mom was such a wise woman. Heard another saying of hers once...