Guest Posted May 7, 2006 Share Posted May 7, 2006 Hello all. I’m new here, though I’ve lurked around for a few weeks. I just recently posted my anti-testimony over on ex-christian.net, http://www.exchristian.net/testimonies/200...for-myself.html that’s how I found this place. I can’t describe how much this site has helped me, and I de-converted over almost 15 years ago! What really gets me is the smugness of certain fundies like thegoodbook, who ask for specific scientific answers that have not to date been scientifically answered yet. An example is goodbook’s post here: http://www.ex-christian.net/index.php?showtopic=8377 asking for a description of the mechanism of the origins of life without a creator god. Well, one of the biggest unanswered questions I had growing up in the church was the exact mechanism of how a blood sacrifice washes away sin. Now, I’m talking about all blood sacrifice found in the bible. From the human sacrifice of the first born (Genesis 22:1-14) to the Mosaic laws of animal sacrifice (Leviticus) to the god-man sacrifice of xtianity, how, exactly does this blood forgive sins? And, if one was OK way back in the begining, why did have to change not once, but twice? I have my own ideas on this, but I’m sure no fundie would agree with me. All Pagan nature religions were based on the observation that all life must rely on something else dying in order to survive. Even vegetarians must eat dead plants in order to gain energy. Human sacrifice was recognition of this observation, and the thought was that by offering the most valuable commodity known, a human life, the gods would spare the rest of the community. As humanity matured and civilization evolved, this morphed into animal sacrifice and finally the sacrifice of an imaginary god. Yet, no one has ever been able to address HOW shed blood forgives sins, or enables god to forgive sin. I’d like a step by step explanation akin to a description of how detergent removes dirt and stains from my clothes. How would the blood of a god-man remove the “stain” of “sin” from my “soul”? Thank you in advance, Marty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theunraveler Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 i dont think anyone can answer that qn...ur qn it seems is more about the mechanism of the supernatural than the natural world Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 i dont think anyone can answer that qn...ur qn it seems is more about the mechanism of the supernatural than the natural world Well, that's my point, they can't. They get so smug when they point out something that science can't explain yet, and ask for specific descriptions of things that can not as yet be described, like how life could start without a creator god or how a cell could evolve, yet if I were to ask the same question about some of their doctirnal issues, they could equally not answer them. Yet they have all the correct answers to life. They love to tell me that "christ's sacrifice has paid the price for your sin". I hear it countless times by any xtian I've met, yet when I ask "How?" the deer in the headlights look come into play. So, I'm asking in all sincerity, if you xtians believe so strongly that blood sacrifice washes away sin, can you explain to me WHY blood has these properties? I can explain HOW blood carries oxygen any many other properties of blood, but I'd like to know HOW it cleanses sin. Any takers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted May 8, 2006 Share Posted May 8, 2006 The old pagan religions had blood sacrifice way before the Jews. Since the common conception was that the soul or life was in the blood, it would be the ultimate sacrifice to the gods. You can see this already in the Abel and Cain story. It's interesting though that Christians can't see the connection between pagan religion and the crucifixion. Because that's what it really is. A pagan blood sacrifice to appease the gods. The concept of "wash away sins" is just what follows from it. If the gods are angry with you because of your misbehavior, then putting them at ease with blood sacrifice, you have in a sense "washed away" your error to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theunraveler Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 i dont think anyone can answer that qn...ur qn it seems is more about the mechanism of the supernatural than the natural world Well, that's my point, they can't. They get so smug when they point out something that science can't explain yet, and ask for specific descriptions of things that can not as yet be described, like how life could start without a creator god or how a cell could evolve, yet if I were to ask the same question about some of their doctirnal issues, they could equally not answer them. Yet they have all the correct answers to life. They love to tell me that "christ's sacrifice has paid the price for your sin". I hear it countless times by any xtian I've met, yet when I ask "How?" the deer in the headlights look come into play. So, I'm asking in all sincerity, if you xtians believe so strongly that blood sacrifice washes away sin, can you explain to me WHY blood has these properties? I can explain HOW blood carries oxygen any many other properties of blood, but I'd like to know HOW it cleanses sin. Any takers? Typical Christian response: now now young son, ur thinking too much. have faith and keep ye trust in the lord...the lord has all the answers... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 LOL, yes, I've heard that alot too. I went to a xtian school up untill high school, and I have never been good at math, despite tutors and math summer camps. I always had good grades in religion tho, and would always ask these kinds of questions as well. My deconversion started when I was around 10, but I didn't really figure out the scam untill I was almost 15. One of my favorite lines I was ever told when I asked a question that was too hard: "Be careful Marty, because the devil can fool you with logic." I KNEW there was a reason to stay away from math, it is SATANIC!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigile Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 Hi Marty, It works like this. You see we humans are such disgusting creatures that god can't stand our stench. When he dumps blood on us he sees Jesus and not filthy rotten us. We are but worms in his eyes. Welcome to the board. I deconverted around 15 years ago as well. It's weird how many issues you carry around with you unnoticed all those years huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 9, 2006 Share Posted May 9, 2006 It's weird how many issues you carry around with you unnoticed all those years huh? My Jupiter, you are so right. I wonder sometimes if the meme ever really dies, or if it just sleeps. I had this shit drummed into my head for a LONG time, and I really wanted to believe, and for a long time thought there was something wrong with me, because I couldn't be as pious as those around me. I think I've nicked most of the brainwashing, but I have alot of rage and anger still inside, and I think it is connected to my upbringing. I am a creative musician/artist and emotionally sensitive to alot of things. I was raised in a very opressive church/school enviroment for all of my formative years and was told throughout that everything that was "me" (the music I liked, clothes I wore, even the questions I was asking) was evil and from the devil. I never felt evil or bad, and have always tried to be nice to people. In many ways though, I'm glad I went through all that, although now I have to deal with the scars. At least I know I've been immunized and can never catch this mind virus again. Unless, of course, I hit my head really hard and lose my memory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Open_Minded Posted May 10, 2006 Share Posted May 10, 2006 Well, one of the biggest unanswered questions I had growing up in the church was the exact mechanism of how a blood sacrifice washes away sin. Now, I’m talking about all blood sacrifice found in the bible. From the human sacrifice of the first born (Genesis 22:1-14) to the Mosaic laws of animal sacrifice (Leviticus) to the god-man sacrifice of xtianity, how, exactly does this blood forgive sins? And, if one was OK way back in the begining, why did have to change not once, but twice? Marty ... I think you need to ask Deacon Dave this question. I'm sure he would have a very appropriate answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts