Deconverting; Need Support From Like-minded People

[Dakota]

My story is not all that interesting. Growing up my family was not at all religious, it was just a "known" thing when it came to god we were christians who believed in the bible and jesus. We did not attend church and I was not forced to go. Around the age of 10 a woman from the Baptist church (there was only 2 churches in my town, Methodist and Baptist) came to the park where my friends and i were playing and asked us if we liked horses, being young girls of course we loved horses. This woman lived in our town and had about 15 horses, she was rich and glamorous and we naturally envied her as most of us come from poorer backgrounds. The woman (named Bev) told us if we came to church with her we could go to her house and ride horses. She asked our parents (who knew her, very very small town) they didn't see any harm and off to church we went.

 

In all honesty I didn't pay much attention in church, it was boring. I got the whole concept though, I was an evil, sinful little girl and would go to hell if I didn't accept Jesus. We all were "saved" numerous times, because of our sinfullness we wanted to make sure it "took". We didn't normally deal with the Pastor or the "adult" part of church and were put in the basement with the Pastor's wife who taught Sunday School. I don't want to bore anyone with the details, so i'll gloss over most of the parts. The things that stand out in my mind was them (Bev and the pastors wife) making me feel bad because my parents had never been married and were now seperated. They told us it was a sin to dance, and basically do anything we thought was fun. This basically lasted the better part of 3 to 4 years. I will always remember the night she made all the girls sign "Virginity Contracts" stating we would not lose our virginities until marriage. I, being stubborn and wanting to argue, refused. This caused a fight and I was asked to leave the church and not come back. Later, I wondered why none of the boys in Sunday School were asked to sign these contracts. My mother was appalled when I told her about this later.

 

Despite all this I continued on being a christian, not realizing there was any other religions or beliefs or lack thereof. It never accured to me that Jesus was not real and the Bible was inerrant and true. From the age of 10 I would repeatedly as to be "saved" in my prayers because I would do something bad, such as lie or swear, or smoke cigarettes etc.. I was always scared I hadn't prayed it right the first time and it would not take effect. I had never and still haven't been baptized, until the age of 20 I always wondered if my previous prayers of salvation were null an void because of my not being baptized.

 

Then at 20 years old ( I am still 20, going on 21 soon) I happened to read The DaVinci Code by Dan Brown. I loved the book as i did Angels and Demons. It got me thinking about the "what if" of it all (for those of you who've read this I'm sure you understand). So I started looking things up online about Christianity, the Church, Jesus, Mary Magdalen etc etc etc. I started to get excited because I felt for once that Christianity would fit my beliefs in my heart if their was a such things as a feminine god or feminine aspect to god. This whole process took about 2 months of daily hour long research. Then, I happened across an Atheist website by mistake. The website spent a great deal of time on explaining why christianity just didn't ring true and couldn't possibly be true. I was skeptical, but continued reading. After spending days sifting through the information, the realization started to dawn on me that I didn't believe christianity to be true any longer. It was like being electrocuted. The truth finally hitting me, setting me free.

 

I have accepting christianity to be utterly false. I do however retain a belief in some sort of afterlife or divine being. Although anymore I believe that this is completely unknowable to us humans and any type of "god" would be beyond comprehension. I'm still feeling it out and trying to adjust. I'm surrounded by christianity and christians though. they seem to be everywhere! I am also mad as hell for some reason. Whenever i see a church i want to spit nails, I don't know why i am so angry. Is this normal to feel such rage? I have been coming to this website for a few weeks, reading posts and other peoples stories. I feel like I finally found a home, and all of the people seem to be so nice and caring, and accepting. I really need others (non xtians) to talk to, I'm sorry for such a LONG post, but I needed to finally write this down and get it out, I will greatly appreciate any and all comments.

[MeiPassion]

Hi Dakota welcome aboard.

 

I understand where you're coming from. Glad you found this place.

[narcissist]

Hi Dakota.

 

Thanks for sharing your story. It seems to be an all to familiar one around here.

 

I think most people experience anger at some point of their ex-c experience. I certainly did, and still do, but to a lesser extent. I'm even angry with your experience! This is understandable. You were lured in with horse rides, only to be told you were a sinner, etc... then they tried to take control your sex life - your own body! And then you discovered it was a sham a scam and a lie. Indeed, the church took half your life away, and you aint ever going to get it back. Of course you're angry.

 

As I'm continually discovering, talking and writing about these things is a great way to get that anger out, assist you in and prepare you for fulfilling your true potential as a human being.

 

Welcome.

[KT45]

I am also mad as hell for some reason. Whenever i see a church i want to spit nails, I don't know why i am so angry. Is this normal to feel such rage? I have been coming to this website for a few weeks, reading posts and other peoples stories. I feel like I finally found a home, and all of the people seem to be so nice and caring, and accepting. I really need others (non xtians) to talk to, I'm sorry for such a LONG post, but I needed to finally write this down and get it out, I will greatly appreciate any and all comments.

It's very normal phase to go through. It's probably just you getting mad at the system you feel lied to you and mentally abused you (if you wish to call it that). It might be hard to get out of that phase. At the moment I'm in a phase where I still kinda amazed, angered, and against religion. I guess I can't help wanting to think about the thing that was such a strong part of my life a few months ago. At one point I do hope to move on from this phase and just be happy. I probably will leave the site soon but I have a few more issues I like to bring up. Anyway, Just stick around for a while and get everything off your chest. Ask questions, look through old post and the FAQ section. Know that you are welcome to stay and congrats on your deconversion.

[Jubilant]

Hi Dakota,

 

Thank you for sharing with us your eximony and please do not apologize for the length, this is a support site and you shouldn't feel inhibited in anyway.

 

It is very, very normal to have a phase of anger after realizing that you have been snowed and bigtime. Sometimes one will only go through a few months of it, others may take years however, I wish someone would have told me what I'm going to tell you when I deconverted(maybe it will help)..."Snowed" implies that people purposely know that they are doing wrong and are getting you to believe a lie. Most people in churches do not know, nor intentionally set out to hurt or lie to you. Because of fear and blind obedience to something they believe speaks for a loving deity (as we did at once too), they truly have their heart on seeing you in "heaven" and saving you from a "fiery" eternal torment.

 

My anger has subsided greatly after looking on those within the church with pity, feeling sorry for the children, etc. Do they piss me off? From time to time yes, but then I just sit and remember where I used to be which was a totally fundamentalist, legalistic woman. I was even more radical than some fundies in that I put a halt to Christmas, Easter and Sunday worship after delving into Messianic Judaism. From birth until age 35 (I'm almost 37), Christianity was all I ever knew and it is the same for the people that go there now. Most will question but squelch them by telling themselves "Who am I to question God?" or "Satan is messing with me and getting me to doubt" or "I'm just a laymen, not a scholar. Surely these intelligent people know more than me." From there they continue in the unknown lie.

 

You can heal so much quicker by being just a good human being, it will help you stay strong and true to who you are and it is so very EMPOWERING knowing that it is all without Jesus. About the afterlife and such, eh, I'm with you in that I don't know and I don't really care...but I know for sure that the one described in the NT (no afterlife taught in the entire OT, only life on earth) isn't going to happen.

 

Good luck to you!

[Dakota]

Thanks to all who replied. It's nice to have finally found a spot online where people actually THINK! I think the stupidity that most xtians show is what gets me the most. Whenever someone asks me what made me stop believing in the bible and jesus I just tell them I actually read the damn thing and that was enough for me. That seems to stun them into shock enough for me to get away from them. The hypocrisy of the people in the church I used to go to is stunning. I grew up in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan in an extremely small town ( pop. 100) so everyone knew everything about everyone.

 

The woman that bribed my friends and I into going to church is still alive and active in the same church. Although she's not quite as rich as she once was. Bev and her husband made their money operating a home for older men who were mentally challenged with no family and unable to live on their own. Years ago a blind 80 year old patient of their disappeared. It was well known in our town that Ken had locked him out of the house in the middle of winter because the old man had been to sick to attend church and Ken was angry about this. Ken and Bev required all their "patients" attend church with them. The old man was never found after that night until 6 years ago his bones were discovered in the woods by some hunters. Charges were never filed and our police did basically nothing to investigate this, as Ken and Bev were "church people" who denied locking the man out of the house. However, the state of Michigan caught wind of this and took the rest of their "patients" away from them and revoked their license to run this type of home. Without their only income they were forced to sell their home ( or have it forclosed on) and all their horses were removed from them.

 

This may sound evil but I was extremely satisfied at this little bit of Karma coming around to bite them in the ass!

[R. S. Martin]

Thanks to all who replied. It's nice to have finally found a spot online where people actually THINK! I think the stupidity that most xtians show is what gets me the most. Whenever someone asks me what made me stop believing in the bible and jesus I just tell them I actually read the damn thing and that was enough for me. That seems to stun them into shock enough for me to get away from them. The hypocrisy of the people in the church I used to go to is stunning. I grew up in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan in an extremely small town ( pop. 100) so everyone knew everything about everyone.

 

The woman that bribed my friends and I into going to church is still alive and active in the same church. Although she's not quite as rich as she once was. Bev and her husband made their money operating a home for older men who were mentally challenged with no family and unable to live on their own. Years ago a blind 80 year old patient of their disappeared. It was well known in our town that Ken had locked him out of the house in the middle of winter because the old man had been to sick to attend church and Ken was angry about this. Ken and Bev required all their "patients" attend church with them. The old man was never found after that night until 6 years ago his bones were discovered in the woods by some hunters. Charges were never filed and our police did basically nothing to investigate this, as Ken and Bev were "church people" who denied locking the man out of the house. However, the state of Michigan caught wind of this and took the rest of their "patients" away from them and revoked their license to run this type of home. Without their only income they were forced to sell their home ( or have it forclosed on) and all their horses were removed from them.

 

This may sound evil but I was extremely satisfied at this little bit of Karma coming around to bite them in the ass!

 

That is just plain horrible what Ken and Bev did. I'm glad the state intervened. But the reaction of the police is despictable! Church people above the law--that is just plain WRONG. Esp. when it comes to taking human life.

 

I'm with you in that I'm glad for the karma that is "biting them in the ass."

 

I'm glad you shared your story, also the part about feeling so angry. I think you got good answers.

[Star Stuff]

Hi Dakota,

 

Follow your heart. You should feel very fortunate to have seen through the nonsense. It grips most people due to the time-worn tools of FEAR, GUILT, & SHAME. These tools generally work on people, so be aware of them and recognise when it is being used on you.

 

Let your path, and decision to reject a silly belief in god.......be one of seeking to be a loving human being, and not one of anger or bitterness. Visualize placing your old baggage in a big ol' hot-air ballloon and just letting it float away. Persue the goodness that is inherently within you. We all know how to be decent to one another. Our morals do not come from religion as many think. We pick & choose the good stuff from religious viewpoints and discard the obviously terrible stuff - and this moral editing comes from within.

 

You sound wise beyond your years; you go girl.

 

 

www.godisimaginary.com

[Star Stuff]

In addition: do realize that "The Da Vinci Code" is Fiction. Entertaining and interesting, but fiction. Some good reading would be:

 

"The reason driven life" by Robert M. Price

 

"The end of Faith" by Sam Harris

 

 

and of course many others......

[riverbank]

Hey,

 

Yeah it can hit you hard when you come to the conclusion that Christianity is not true. But in the end you'll be wondering how and why you believed it for so long. I don't care what Christians say or think, their religion has got so many holes and untruths it's hard to believe.

 

I wish you all the best. This is a great forum and will help you.

 

Andy

[Guest halwes]

Welcome Dakota.

 

Religions are all man-made, having evolved over the centuries. Religions began back in primitive days when primitive man was ignorant, at the mercy of nature.

 

Organized religions dovetail with government, social traditions, and the powers that be. Most all religions make women and children into men's property. Physical and mental abuse can stem from that, along with adherence to backwardness and lack of civil rights.

 

Basically, religion is about having power through use of fear (namely, "god's" curses or eternal suffering if you fail to love whatever "god" they choose to believe in.)

 

Let's work to promote science and medicine. (Did you know Christian churches once fought science, even burned a woman at the stake because she had taken pain-killers during childbirth? That was in Scotland, 1591. And the witchcraft trials resulted in nearly 100,000 people tortured and killed -- all because Christian asshole clergymen believed some witch or goblin was out to get them).

 

Isn't the modern secular world so much better ?!!

 

Let's spend our time promoting civil rights, feeding the hungry, working in battered women's shelters, etc.

 

Let us join with American Atheists and Freedom From Religion Foundation, to constantly expose the nonsense and injustice of religion.

 

Let us work to stop churches from being tax-exempt. (Always amazed me how folks built these gorgeous church buildings, stained glass, flowers, etc., just to honor a bloodthirsty psychopath god who burns babies in hell. How much better to convert such real estate into Red Cross shelters or clinics for the poor.)

 

Churches are not necessary. Nor are Mosques, where men learn to beat women and cut the throats of non-believers and hijack airplanes. (Sept. 11 was an example of faith-based cruelty to honor god).

[R. S. Martin]

Hey,

 

Yeah it can hit you hard when you come to the conclusion that Christianity is not true. But in the end you'll be wondering how and why you believed it for so long. I don't care what Christians say or think, their religion has got so many holes and untruths it's hard to believe.

 

I wish you all the best. This is a great forum and will help you.

 

Andy

 

It's more complicated than this! I questioned from the very first time I was told that Jesus died so we could get to heaven. They have ways to bind even those who ask the right/wrong questions. Everything from corporal punishment as a child and social ostracization all my life was used to keep me in line. The threat of hell for doubters and questioners was right there at the top. Somehow, I NEVER believed that asking questions was wrong. I literally had no one to ask these questions. Some questions were tabboo. Like: How do we know the Bible is true? I did ask: How do we know God exists? I don't remember asking the question but I do remember the answers. And the answers made absolutely no sense. However, like I said, there are horrible ways to keep even the questioner imprisoned. When people deny their own feelings and give wrong meaning to their feelings, there is practically nothing to stop them from doing what they feel like doing.

[Dakota]

In addition: do realize that "The Da Vinci Code" is Fiction. Entertaining and interesting, but fiction. Some good reading would be:

 

"The reason driven life" by Robert M. Price

 

"The end of Faith" by Sam Harris

 

 

and of course many others......

 

 

 

I forgot to add in my post, that I do realize The DaVinci Code is fiction. Sometimes it is a little embarrasing to admit that a fictional book brought about the demise of my Christianity. Even though I knew the book to be fictional, the points Dan Brown brought up in his book made me realize how little we actually know about Jesus (whether he existed or not). So, although slightly embarrasing, I felt the need to give Dan Brown some credit when it came to my deconversion. Plus the outrage by some Christians over his book made me wander why they were so offended and scared by it, if their "holy book" and its god were so "real".

 

I will definetly look into the two books you recommended though, I am something of a book nerd, love to read.

[Star Stuff]

Glad to hear you like to read. Here's some other titles:

 

Sense & Goodness without God - Richard Carrier

 

Holy Writ as Oral Lit - Alan Dundes

 

Letter to a Christian Nation - Sam Harris

 

The Incredible Shrinking Son of Man - Robert M. Price

 

The Amazing Collosal Apostle - Robert M. Price

 

Atheist Universe - David Mills

 

Losing Faith in Faith - Dan Barker

 

........anything by "Paul Kurtz"

 

and of course, "The God Delusion" by Richard Dawkins

 

 

You will find some brilliant audio interviews with some of the above (and others) on

www.pointofinquiry.org

 

You can even right-click on the mp3 links and download them to your hard drive. (Save Target As)

[Rafiki]

...This whole process took about 2 months of daily hour long research. Then, I happened across an Atheist website by mistake. The website spent a great deal of time on explaining why christianity just didn't ring true and couldn't possibly be true. I was skeptical, but continued reading. After spending days sifting through the information, the realization started to dawn on me that I didn't believe christianity to be true any longer. It was like being electrocuted. The truth finally hitting me, setting me free.

 

Looks like you're on the right track. Keep reading, studying, learning, opening your mind, and you'll be amazed at how much information there really is out there.

[Guest Tenryu Osho]

. They told us it was a sin to dance, and basically do anything we thought was fun.

 

Well, it's probably a sin to dance as badly as I do... Thanks for the post, I can relate. There was a time for me too when I realized it doesn't make sense they way they (the Church) tells you it does. I started researching myself, and it does get easier as you go. It's definitely tough at first- maybe because it's kind of a shocker that you were misled, and to some extent believed it. It's a normal reaction, and it takes a strong mind to accept that and move on. As for being angry at the church, I agree. I wish I had better advice in that regard other than just steer clear, it's really not worth the aggravation. Arguing with Christians is kind of like herding cats, I've found- "you just don't get it" and circular, self-referencing logic is considered acceptable rhetoric in their circles. But you're doing something a great many church-goers either cannot or will not do- you're thinking for yourself, and using the mind and intelligence you have. And that makes you definitely doing the right thing in my book.

[Lycorth]

Welcome, Dakota. You've found a good place

 

I've assembled a little website of my own, and of course included a page of links to other websites full of handy information that can help you further deconstruct the Xian cult. Just click on the "Anti Xianity" link on the left. Behold: In Nomini Lupi

 

(I hate geocities )

[brad_religion]

Hi Dakota, welcome to the forum (I'm sure others have already greeted you like that lol). But, we all know how you feel and are going through. Kind of like no matter where someone lives or what social level they are at, if they all use a really bad drug like heroin, in spite of the differences, they can all be on the same level in regard to heroin. Same goes for religion and christianity in general. Anyway, your experience sounds a little like my own. The guilt of doing something to piss off the biblegod always crossed my mind when I was a young Christian. I trusted my church and pastor, because I felt like they were sincere and had no reason to lie. This was before I began to notice they have "tithes and offerings" and every 3rd sunday was called "Sacrificial Sunday" where people would give even MORE money than their normal tithes and offerings.

 

Anyway, I think many of us have anger about our Christian experience. I think the further you get from the time you leave the faith, the less angry you get. But, initially, you have every right to be pissed at christianity and its priestcraft who deceived and lied to you. It is a natural reaction to be angry about being lied to (especially for many years). I think that is why the longer a person is involved in Christianity and then they leave it, the angrier they get. I know this is the case with me. I was so angry, I bought a bunch of anti-christian t-shirts and bumper stickers. I wanted everyone to know how much I despised Jesus and his asshole followers. I thought maybe if I make a person pissed off at me, they might try to "prove" me wrong by examining christianity to prove it, and come to the same conclusions I got. But, I don't remember coming to my ex-christian view because of an atheist pissing me off when I was a christian. It was when people took the time to explain the problems of christian doctrine and the lack of historical and valid evidence for its claims.

 

Although, I think it is fun to make a Christian angry, because they end up showing they don't give a flying fuck what the bible says. They only say they obey the bible for appearances. But, don't agree with them on even 1 christian doctrine and see the formality disappear. They will look at you as an enemy of God and treat you badly. I always point out to that type of Christian that such behavior is disobedience to the bible they claim to believe. I also say that if THEY (a christian) won't obey or believe the bible, why should I?

 

The anger will settle eventually, but give it time. Leaving Christianity is like having a close loved one die. What I mean is that in spite of the bad things Jesus and the biblegod do according to Christians and the bible, I still believed that somehow they were there for me when I prayed. But when you realize they never existed at all, it is like they died. You are in mourning and angry and it is okay. Another way it is like a death (or many deaths) is because every person you previously thought was enjoying eternal life in heaven dies all over again in your mind (since they were alive and they died again because they are truly dead). I know that I think about my dad who died back in 1999. Christianity convinced me my dad was in some sort of afterlife (usually a good one). Then, the reality of no afterlife hit me and made me realize that for the 6 years I believed my dad was still alive was bullshit.

 

Also, the longer you have been involved in the Christian cult, the longer it takes to rid yourself of the fear and guilt it provided (at least in my case). I wasted an 18 year chunk of my short life on this fraud. Imagine if you only lived 60 years, that is 1/3 of your life wasted which you could have used to do something beneficial for yourself and others.

 

Anyway, I hope this response helps and if you ever want to chat sometime, please add me on yahoo messenger as "brad_religion". Just remind me of who you are when you do add me so I will add you.

 

Okay, well, have a wonderful day, Matt

[mick]

I'm with you Dakota. You were practically abducted in my opinion. I'm incredibly mad at all things Christian too. -Mick

 

My story is not all that interesting. Growing up my family was not at all religious, it was just a "known" thing when it came to god we were christians who believed in the bible and jesus. We did not attend church and I was not forced to go. Around the age of 10 a woman from the Baptist church (there was only 2 churches in my town, Methodist and Baptist) came to the park where my friends and i were playing and asked us if we liked horses, being young girls of course we loved horses. This woman lived in our town and had about 15 horses, she was rich and glamorous and we naturally envied her as most of us come from poorer backgrounds. The woman (named Bev) told us if we came to church with her we could go to her house and ride horses. She asked our parents (who knew her, very very small town) they didn't see any harm and off to church we went.

 

In all honesty I didn't pay much attention in church, it was boring. I got the whole concept though, I was an evil, sinful little girl and would go to hell if I didn't accept Jesus. We all were "saved" numerous times, because of our sinfullness we wanted to make sure it "took". We didn't normally deal with the Pastor or the "adult" part of church and were put in the basement with the Pastor's wife who taught Sunday School. I don't want to bore anyone with the details, so i'll gloss over most of the parts. The things that stand out in my mind was them (Bev and the pastors wife) making me feel bad because my parents had never been married and were now seperated. They told us it was a sin to dance, and basically do anything we thought was fun. This basically lasted the better part of 3 to 4 years. I will always remember the night she made all the girls sign "Virginity Contracts" stating we would not lose our virginities until marriage. I, being stubborn and wanting to argue, refused. This caused a fight and I was asked to leave the church and not come back. Later, I wondered why none of the boys in Sunday School were asked to sign these contracts. My mother was appalled when I told her about this later.

 

Despite all this I continued on being a christian, not realizing there was any other religions or beliefs or lack thereof. It never accured to me that Jesus was not real and the Bible was inerrant and true. From the age of 10 I would repeatedly as to be "saved" in my prayers because I would do something bad, such as lie or swear, or smoke cigarettes etc.. I was always scared I hadn't prayed it right the first time and it would not take effect. I had never and still haven't been baptized, until the age of 20 I always wondered if my previous prayers of salvation were null an void because of my not being baptized.

 

Then at 20 years old ( I am still 20, going on 21 soon) I happened to read The DaVinci Code by Dan Brown. I loved the book as i did Angels and Demons. It got me thinking about the "what if" of it all (for those of you who've read this I'm sure you understand). So I started looking things up online about Christianity, the Church, Jesus, Mary Magdalen etc etc etc. I started to get excited because I felt for once that Christianity would fit my beliefs in my heart if their was a such things as a feminine god or feminine aspect to god. This whole process took about 2 months of daily hour long research. Then, I happened across an Atheist website by mistake. The website spent a great deal of time on explaining why christianity just didn't ring true and couldn't possibly be true. I was skeptical, but continued reading. After spending days sifting through the information, the realization started to dawn on me that I didn't believe christianity to be true any longer. It was like being electrocuted. The truth finally hitting me, setting me free.

 

I have accepting christianity to be utterly false. I do however retain a belief in some sort of afterlife or divine being. Although anymore I believe that this is completely unknowable to us humans and any type of "god" would be beyond comprehension. I'm still feeling it out and trying to adjust. I'm surrounded by christianity and christians though. they seem to be everywhere! I am also mad as hell for some reason. Whenever i see a church i want to spit nails, I don't know why i am so angry. Is this normal to feel such rage? I have been coming to this website for a few weeks, reading posts and other peoples stories. I feel like I finally found a home, and all of the people seem to be so nice and caring, and accepting. I really need others (non xtians) to talk to, I'm sorry for such a LONG post, but I needed to finally write this down and get it out, I will greatly appreciate any and all comments.

[Dakota]

Even though my Christian beliefs are totally down the drain. I still believe in some sort of afterlife. But I am also open to the fact that there may not be anything after we die. There are just some personal instances and family "happenings" that lead me to the conclusion that "something" is out there for us when we die. Although, if science one day proves me wrong, I will except it. I guess I am more of a Deist now, if anything. There may or may not be a "higher power" in my opinion there is, but I highly doubt it gives a crap about what goes on in our day to day life. And I respect the opinions of others who believe there is nothing. I will respect anybodies beliefs unless I feel they are harmful, abusive, or take the "humanity" out of it.

 

I always thought tithing was absurd. Although, at the church I went to as a child I wasn't allowed to tithe, they told me my money was "dirty" because my grandmother owned the only bar in town and my mother worked for her. My mom was a single mother to 3 kids and busted her ass to make sure we never went without, so anyone who thought her money was "dirty" was off their rocker in my eyes. I did notice that whoever tithed the most was treated with more respect and seemed to be favored by the pastor. I never went to the pastor or his wife with any "issues" as I did not trust them. I think I stayed in church as long as I did simply to be a pain in the ass to the people that brought me there! I was and still am a smartass and liked to show people their stupidity threw humor. I could never bring myself to act the way a "christian" woman should act. Especially when I got married (at 18). My husband didn't expect me to bow down to him but we were both Christian at the time and looked to the bible for answers. The whole "submissive, dumb, woman" thing was so insane to me no matter how hard I tried I just couldn't be one. I am naturally assertive, outspoken, and dominate. My mother taught me never to submit to a man and never to "need" one. Thankfully, my husband deconverted at the same time I did.

 

Did anyone have to "go to the alter" when they were christians? I'm wondering if they do this in all churches or just the one I used to go to.

 

Matt--I don't have yahoo messenger but I do have msn.

Varokhar- I'm checking out your website after I post this

Mick- Thats how I feel to, they basically conned my friends and I into going by dangling ponies in front of nine year old girls faces! How twisted is that?

Tenryu- They always hit us hard with the "Dancing=Sin" thing because our school held "fun nights" where they hired a DJ and we danced and hung out with our friends, as a way to keep us off the streets and away from drugs. Apparently the church thought this behavior is worthy of hell. They tried to get the school to shut down the fun nights. Didn't work.

Star Stuff--I looked up alot of the books you posted on my library's web page, They don't even have any of them except for maybe two! Is it just me or does it seem hard to find books that go against the Christian mainstream?

 

Welcome, Dakota. You've found a good place

 

I've assembled a little website of my own, and of course included a page of links to other websites full of handy information that can help you further deconstruct the Xian cult. Just click on the "Anti Xianity" link on the left. Behold: In Nomini Lupi

 

(I hate geocities )

 

 

 

Very Cool Website!!!

[Dakota]

Varokhar,

 

I checked out the Wolf section on your page, I loved it. I have had a fascination with wolves for as far back as I can remember. Where I grew up we had a large pack of wolves that roamed around and at night I would lay in bed and listen to them howl at the moon. It was beautiful. I also copied and pasted the middle picture on your wolf page. The one where the wolf is howling at the moon. I hope you don't mind, but I want to get a tattoo of it. Nice to see I'm not alone in my awe of the wolf!

[mick]

Dakota,

 

Thanks for sharing. I think there is some really positive elements to your experience. For one, you are only 20. You are not married to a fundamenalist. (I am 39, married to a believer who is convinced I am now in the Devil's hands)

 

Your future can be incredibly bright. You no longer have to wrongfully divide the world into 2 sections that are at spiritual war. You no longer have to look around a crowded bus station and think that 95 % of all these people are going to eternal torture and torment without the possibility of mercy and salvation. You don't have to believe in rediculous absurd things, that have already been proven false through reason, rationality and science. And best of all, you do not have little children that are already being taught these things by their other parent, church, and private Christian school they attend.

 

The world is in front of you. I do want to add, I am agnostic toward the existence of a god. I am only ATHEISTIC toward the god of the Bible. (Though I will admit, that the problem of evil and suffering in the world, makes me think that if there is a god, what good is he to us? He does not stop the unspeakable horrors, both on minute and mass scales, that occur to the poor humans who inhabit this planet. -Geez, that sounded kid of negative. )

 

Other than all that I have no strong feelings on the matter. -just kidding

 

Hey, think positively Dakota. Think of the possibilities!!! I am going to!!

 

Even though my Christian beliefs are totally down the drain. I still believe in some sort of afterlife. But I am also open to the fact that there may not be anything after we die. There are just some personal instances and family "happenings" that lead me to the conclusion that "something" is out there for us when we die. Although, if science one day proves me wrong, I will except it. I guess I am more of a Deist now, if anything. There may or may not be a "higher power" in my opinion there is, but I highly doubt it gives a crap about what goes on in our day to day life. And I respect the opinions of others who believe there is nothing. I will respect anybodies beliefs unless I feel they are harmful, abusive, or take the "humanity" out of it.

 

I always thought tithing was absurd. Although, at the church I went to as a child I wasn't allowed to tithe, they told me my money was "dirty" because my grandmother owned the only bar in town and my mother worked for her. My mom was a single mother to 3 kids and busted her ass to make sure we never went without, so anyone who thought her money was "dirty" was off their rocker in my eyes. I did notice that whoever tithed the most was treated with more respect and seemed to be favored by the pastor. I never went to the pastor or his wife with any "issues" as I did not trust them. I think I stayed in church as long as I did simply to be a pain in the ass to the people that brought me there! I was and still am a smartass and liked to show people their stupidity threw humor. I could never bring myself to act the way a "christian" woman should act. Especially when I got married (at 18). My husband didn't expect me to bow down to him but we were both Christian at the time and looked to the bible for answers. The whole "submissive, dumb, woman" thing was so insane to me no matter how hard I tried I just couldn't be one. I am naturally assertive, outspoken, and dominate. My mother taught me never to submit to a man and never to "need" one. Thankfully, my husband deconverted at the same time I did.

 

Did anyone have to "go to the alter" when they were christians? I'm wondering if they do this in all churches or just the one I used to go to.

 

Matt--I don't have yahoo messenger but I do have msn.

Varokhar- I'm checking out your website after I post this

Mick- Thats how I feel to, they basically conned my friends and I into going by dangling ponies in front of nine year old girls faces! How twisted is that?

Tenryu- They always hit us hard with the "Dancing=Sin" thing because our school held "fun nights" where they hired a DJ and we danced and hung out with our friends, as a way to keep us off the streets and away from drugs. Apparently the church thought this behavior is worthy of hell. They tried to get the school to shut down the fun nights. Didn't work.

Star Stuff--I looked up alot of the books you posted on my library's web page, They don't even have any of them except for maybe two! Is it just me or does it seem hard to find books that go against the Christian mainstream?

 

Welcome, Dakota. You've found a good place

 

I've assembled a little website of my own, and of course included a page of links to other websites full of handy information that can help you further deconstruct the Xian cult. Just click on the "Anti Xianity" link on the left. Behold: In Nomini Lupi

 

(I hate geocities )

 

 

 

Very Cool Website!!!

[Lycorth]

Varokhar,

 

I checked out the Wolf section on your page, I loved it. I have had a fascination with wolves for as far back as I can remember. Where I grew up we had a large pack of wolves that roamed around and at night I would lay in bed and listen to them howl at the moon. It was beautiful. I also copied and pasted the middle picture on your wolf page. The one where the wolf is howling at the moon. I hope you don't mind, but I want to get a tattoo of it. Nice to see I'm not alone in my awe of the wolf!

 

Thanks for the support, Dakota

 

Keep checking back as I update the site now and then. Currently, I'm doing a lot of work on it, especially as my beliefs continue to develop and evolve.

 

I don't mind at all about the wolf image - it's not like it's mine or anything. I don't remember where I got half the shit I've put up on that site. I'm thinking about getting that actual wolf image tattooed also, btw. That and the White Tree are at least as sacred to me as the cross is to a Jebus freak, so I'll be inked with those in time - when I can afford it

[Mythra]

I forgot to add in my post, that I do realize The DaVinci Code is fiction.

 

Hi Dakota. Mick is right - you should consider yourself fortunate to see through christianity at such an early age. It took some of us a lot longer.

 

About the DaVinci Code: Maybe you should take a look at This book

 

I haven't read it, but it seemed appropriate. And, there are an awful lot of Robert Price fans on this site. I have a couple of his books, and The Reason Driven Life looks like it will be my next.

[Lycorth]

Edit: my anti-Xian page begins here with my anti-testimony. My anti-Xian links are at the bottom of the page.

 

It took me forever to publish that?