Mental And Emotional Abuse

[Guest christianlongago]

I don't know if I consider myself to be totally ex-christian definitely ex-Church so these comments I make about what recently happened in my life my seem off center. For two years I dated a lady that was flag waving, card carrying ex-christian. She came this way through what was cases of abuse. That abuse was explained to me to physical as a very young girl then an abusive husband years later. There was also lots of emotional guilt passed to her over the years. Things like you can't dress that way, sex is dirty, why are you putting yourself first. She has a whole bunch of issues.

 

Now here is the problem. She started doing all those things to me. She started to make me feel guilty and dirty about sex. She became emotionally abusive by never following through on plans, she always was looking for validation that sometimes can't be given. She basically made me feel guilty about many things. I thought that was that Catholic church's job. She became obsessed with the idea that since she was wronged then she will wrong back. I loved this woman dearly and I still do. We are apart now and will be for ever. The hurt she inflected on me was emotionally cruel and totally abusive.

 

She blamed just about every action she took on her past and aimed directly at a Christian youth/Young adult. Yet she became what she ran away from. She used her terrible christian life to act like a really bad ex-christian. So I guess I am looking for my own validation here.

 

Did her experience really have anything to do with how she has behaved all these years or is it just the type of person she is. It is some Else's fault I act this way, look what was done to me, so I will do back.

 

Ex-Christians get a bad rap because of the few that blame their own errors in life on the christian life they once lived. I think she is one of them.

[Deva]

Reading this post I wonder if reading the testimonies on this site about how abusive Christianity has been to us will do you more harm than good. It seems like your experiences with this lady have colored your views of all ex-christians - correct me if I am wrong. You say you are looking for your own validation. What is that? Is it that some of the ex-christians on this site might blame christianity for every mistake they have made like your lady friend? Some of us might do that, but (speaking for myself only) I see that I must be responsible ultimately for the mistakes I have made in life. To say "Ex Christians get a bad rap" for the reason stated above is, I think, inaccurate and unfair. There are a great many of us who haven't even told our close family members we are no longer christians. When they find out we get the "bad rap" because we don't believe the same way the majority does, not because we blame chrisitanity for our mistakes. Please don't generalize, we are all different.

 

I'm not trying to be unsympathetic. What you have described above is very sad about the lady in question. Yet I have to wonder if you have asked yourself about your responsibility in this abusive relationship. No one can actually make someone else feel guilty and dirty. It is foolish and inaccurate to blame all one's errors in life on Christianity but it is undeniable that it instills attitudes and conditioning that can lead to making foolish decisions. Isn't that reasonable? I really don't understand why you would want to stay in a relationship with someone who made you feel guilty and dirty.

[Guest christianlongago]

This going to seem real rough but some of the ex-Christians that I know get pretty fanatical and are very hateful of their religious past. That is a reason I keep so close vested about my ex-beliefs. Good or bad analogy but it is like some alcoholics that blames everything on the booze.. This woman absolutely blamed everything on her religous upbringing, she even blames religion on why she has no contact with her own children and siblings. I don't actually think that all ex-christians are fanatics, heck I'm 95% one. But my batting average is pretty bad. Obsesive behavior what ever it is, is bad.

 

Boy, do I share some of the blame here. No Question. I had 3 chances in the past to walk away when she would breakup with me then beg me to take her back. I kept going back. Just like that fly to honey. That is why I feel dirty. She helped make it dirty. Each breakup got more about her not growing as a person not anything I had done. This last time I feel that a trap was set. She begged for my return, accepted me willingly then crashed with the vision of her past. Remembered experiences with the past bad people in her life and called and compared me them. She needed to bring her past abuse to present day. I think her stories of christian abuse and the way she was told to live needed fresh diaologe and I provided the cover story for new abuses.

 

Ex-christian, well I just think that is a hard word for me to handle. Are any of us really ex - anything. We are a sum of our experiences in life, good and bad.

 

Thank you for your input. Besides a therapist this is the first time I have spoken about my beliefs. Our relationship didn't discuss religion well. I saw too much fanatic thinking. There are certain things I don't discuss with friends I want to keep and religion is one of them.

[R. S. Martin]

This going to seem real rough but some of the ex-Christians that I know get pretty fanatical and are very hateful of their religious past. That is a reason I keep so close vested about my ex-beliefs. Good or bad analogy but it is like some alcoholics that blames everything on the booze.. This woman absolutely blamed everything on her religous upbringing, she even blames religion on why she has no contact with her own children

 

You also mention fanatical thinking or an inability to discuss things clearly with her. I think we're looking at a woman with a very real documented problem. The state cannot afford to just raise everybody's kids. Nor can her relatives just take them from her. There's a story here that isn't being told.

 

Your love for her, and the story about the break-up, all sound normal to me. I wasn't there to see and obviously I don't know you or her; all I have to go by is what you post here. It sounds legitimate to me, esp. if we consider that she may have a documented mental illness that she did not reveal to you. Mental illness could account for the abuse you experienced and it could also account for the reason she has no contact with her children--if indeed she doesn't.

 

I am not sure what your question is. Are you asking whether exChristians are as bad as they are made out to be in your part of the world? Normally, Christians think we're a bad lot by simple virture of having rejected their god. My observation of humanity is that religion or lack thereof has little or nothing to do with what kind of person one is. Some of the posts in the thread Does Christianity Make People Nice address this topic.

 

We on these forums are a very diverse group and hold to many different belief systems. The only thing we have in common is that once we were Christians but we no longer are Christians, hence the name exChristian. Not all members fit that category because some members have never been Christian and some remain Christian. Here you can get some idea of the variety of beliefs on these forums. Since there are a few thousand members and less than one hundred voted, you can be sure that many are not represented. That is why I say "some idea." It's a wide variety but I don't know how wide. In my observation, people are accepted so long as they respectfully accept us. It must be understood, however, that Christianity does not rule here.

 

Ex-christian, well I just think that is a hard word for me to handle. Are any of us really ex - anything. We are a sum of our experiences in life, good and bad.

 

Now THAT I've got a problem with. If you're not going to accept that I was a Christian and am no longer a Christian, then why are you here? There's other forums for emotionally abused people. We're not equipped to deal with that. By way of warning, in case you haven't noticed, we can be emotionally abusive of people who reject our status of exChristian. Being true to my innermost convictions has practically cost me my life and I will not take a rejection of my earned status lying down--not here in my own home. You can be sure I am not alone in this.

 

Thank you for your input. Besides a therapist this is the first time I have spoken about my beliefs. Our relationship didn't discuss religion well. I saw too much fanatic thinking. There are certain things I don't discuss with friends I want to keep and religion is one of them.

 

Sounds like a good idea. Better not marry, though, without knowing your partner's view on religion. That would be my suggestion because when there's kids in the equation things get really complicated. If you're remotely connected with Catholicism, according to the experiences of some people on these forums, it can start as early as baptizing the baby.

 

So I guess you're going to have to figure out whether or not this is the right place for you. We've told you a few things and you can look around and read for yourself. As stated, if you are respectful and accepting of us you can probably expect respect and acceptance in return. But we are not equipped to deal with mental illness or emotional abuse per se. Obviously, it's part of many of our lives but our focus is supporting exChristians. I think I speak for many when I say we insist on that.

 

I better add--but you can see this in my avatar and profile--that I'm just a regular member who's been here for a bit and seen how things are done. Better ask a mod if you need official information on something.

[Guest christianlongago]

You asked why am I here? I am trying to sort out the reasons for this abuse and why I put up with it. Her firm conviction that Christianity caused all her problems just made me want to look on this site. I agree that there could more mental illness involved but that was also blamed on her christian upbringing. I knew of this site because this woman use to post here but stopped and decided not to share any longer because she was not getting the support she wanted. She was using the site to find people to agree with her, I am using it to try to understand.

 

I blame none of my problems in life on being a former christian. I just drifted away from organized religion and the church going thing, sort of saw the foolishness of the whole establishment. Peace and harmony is my thing.

 

As far as the state taking care of her children. Thank you for that mind jogger!!! She throw both her daughters out when they each turned around 16 because she claimed they were abusive to her. They went to live with families but not sure how that happened whether it was state or private funding. She had no contact with either of the fathers of these two girls. A son she had in later years she gave up to the state because she claimed her husband abused the baby and the church and patrons that she belonged to down south did not believe her.

YOU HELPED ME! I was getting the abuse because I stuck around to get it. Each time she begged me to come back I went back. Her daughters, both in their 20's now refuse any contact because she was the abuser not them. I GOT IT!! Why should I have thought I would be treated any better than anyone else. If you disown all your brothers(3), through out your daughters(2), Give up an infant son and have limited conversation with your 80+ year old mother then why should I be treated ant better. I was only a boyfriend/lover for 2 years.

.

This is sort off what I meant, she is hiding behind a christian upbringing that continued on until she finally left a church in the south some 7 or 8 years ago. BEING AN EX-CHRISTIAN HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT!

 

Also my belief that ex-Christians are fanatics also comes from the postings that she would have me to read from this site. the replies seemed to be very fanatical. I guess I was only getting the replies or the people that agreed with her. Like I mentioned she stopped posting when she wasn't getting support.

 

.

[Guest Marty]

I think I remember a woman posting about how her daughters won't talk to her anymore, and using the abuse card alot. Maybe a year ago? I don't think it was that long ago...

[Emme]

.

This is sort off what I meant, she is hiding behind a christian upbringing that continued on until she finally left a church in the south some 7 or 8 years ago. BEING AN EX-CHRISTIAN HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT!

 

 

.

 

Maybe you got it there. She appears to be using christianity as an excuse for her problems instead of taking responsibility for her actions. That's sad, but I hope this won't cause you to think that every ex-christian behaves this way. As Deva said, we are all different.

[gradstu09]

Hi there. I'm really sorry to hear that this woman abused you. Here are some of my thoughts:

 

I do think the Church is responsible for the vast majority of the habits, ingrained beliefs, and self-destructive behaviors I have.

 

When I entered my relationship, I realized this. I promised myself that MY problems were not going to be the cause of the failure of the relationship (4.5 yrs now and counting).

 

It is impossible to be an adult without taking responsibility for how one's actions affect others. Was it my fault that I was baptized into the Church and learned a lot of bad things that have compromised ability to interact successfully in the world? No. I was a child. I had no choice in the matter. But as an adult, I can't sit and cry and blame my bad behavior on the Church and just expect people to put up with it. The only way I will get satisfaction from life is to be honest about what needs changing and accept that I am the only one who can do it. Is that fair? No! It's a raw fucking deal and a big pain in my ass. But that's life.

 

Your ex was being a child. She was refusing to take responsibility for her life and expecting the whole world to just accommodate her. That's unacceptable. However, it is also atypical of ex-christians I have known. It has been more my experience that when people leave the Church, they put some real effort into changing things about themselves that remind them of their former faith.

[gradstu09]

You know also, it's more common for abused people to become abusers than it is for them to break the cycle. I have read more about this in a child/parent dynamic, but there is no reason to believe that it couldn't have worked that way with your ex, especially as she appears to blame a youth pastor who may have been a parental figure in her life.

[Crackalackish]

You can "blame" your behavior on many things. The thing is, that once you become an adult, you make the choice of how you will behave. You can rise above or wallow. You can blame whatever or whoever you want, but in the long run it is your choice on how you are going to deal with your life and your decisions. To blame it on anything is a cop-out. Can't fix it? Get help. But nothing excuses bad behavior once you are an adult.

[Evelyn]

All I can add is, that woman is mentally ill and also has repeated the pattern of abuse that she grew up with. And she manipulated you and you fell for it. Regardless of why you fell for it, at least you now recognize what happened and have split up with her for good. Just be aware of why and how you were manipulated and be careful in future relationships.

[SWIM]

Ex-Christians get a bad rap because of the few that blame their own errors in life on the christian life they once lived. I think she is one of them.

 

 

Sorry to hear about your troubles. Being religious, non-religious, or ex-religious "should" come from rational thinking, not as a result, or reaction to abuse. Ex, or athiest mindsets are aquired rarely because of "the reputations" of those of similar mindsets, but I suppose it could be in some cases. I also suppose it is possible the person became ex in an "I'll show them!" revenge type mindest, if so it is just as much delusion as being actively religious.

 

Anyway, welcome to the boards!

[Guest christianlongago]

The way this conversation has taken off is amazing to me. I have never been part of anything like this. You are correct I did listen an awful lot, I just could not comment because I didn't agree. You know where I said I didn't talk religion with her, that is why. I could not support her decision in the past just listen to her stoies.

 

The woman told me she stopped posting here so that is a reason I checked the site out. The abuse I have gotten so far even after we broke up has been outrageous so I could only imagine what could be next. I feel weeks ago I had to go to court because the woman claimed she was in physical danger from me. The court throught it out almost immediately and for the next 7 days I was treated for depression/emotion breakdown in a treatment facility. Who became to abuser then? That is how far this abuse has gone. I am a total wreck. She sought to destroy my good reputation in this small New England Town. Just because I wouldn't take her back for a fourth time on her terms. Judging from the comments so far this is not the behavior of any normal ex-christian. We are adults and accept what we need to do to move on.

I am trying.

[SWIM]

Judging from the comments so far this is not the behavior of any normal ex-christian. We are adults and accept what we need to do to move on.

I am trying.

 

It's also not the behavior of any NORMAL person period...

 

Best of luck to you my friend, hope you post more often!

[R. S. Martin]

My experience here has been that exChristians are normal people. As to how to protect yourself from further abuse, can you get a restraining order on her? Change your telephone number? Block her email? Move to another town and "disappear"? I understand the court is on your side so there should be something you can do. Though I don't know the details of your life so I don't know what your options are.

[GraphicsGuy]

Now here is the problem. She started doing all those things to me. She started to make me feel guilty and dirty about sex. She became emotionally abusive by never following through on plans, she always was looking for validation that sometimes can't be given. She basically made me feel guilty about many things. I thought that was that Catholic church's job. She became obsessed with the idea that since she was wronged then she will wrong back. I loved this woman dearly and I still do. We are apart now and will be for ever. The hurt she inflected on me was emotionally cruel and totally abusive.

 

Damn...sounds like my ex (who is a Xian)...

 

My sympathies man.

[Mongo]

CLAG,

 

That's a hell of a story and you have my sympathy - it must be heartwrenching.

 

From my personal experiences, insight and curiousity of human behaviour here is what I would add...

 

Every time there is an abuser, there is someone who takes it.

 

Abusive people are unconsciously or consciously seeking out people who are susceptible to their ploys. If this happened to you once... it is possible that you are at risk of falling into the same trap.

 

What I suggest is that you go to a website Troubles Catbox http://www.drirene.com/catbox/index.php?act=idx

and read up on Verbal Abuse. If you find others or better ones, please let me know. Really.

 

During a period of time when my wife was in a very pissy mood, I found many resources here and people that could at least sympathize with my experience. I noticed that imperfect people hung out there and were learning from each other. There were few men when I last checked it out but enough to establish that verbal abuse is clearly not a single gender issue.

 

Learn how to avoid these women and to defend yourself emotionally. You are making good progress from what I can read.

 

BTW - congratulations on getting out!

 

Comments on specific items:

-Correct, this has nothing to do with religion. Christianity is merely the venue, abuse is the game.

-Telling the courts/police that they are afraid of you is not rare. Blaming the victim is job #1 for these abusers and by the way... they are damn good at it.

- You said, "Peace and harmony is my thing". You may need help changing that thinking. "Peace at any price" is the victim's motto. Educate yourself about this mindset.

 

Mongo

[Eponymic]

Who became to abuser then?

 

She is a perpetrator of the saddest aspect of abuse. She has become what she hates in order to survive it. It's always baffling to me how people do this, but it happens all the time. She is an abusive personality now. And until she comes to grips with it and acknowledges that she is no longer the victim, but the abuser, she will go on doing it. It really has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with sociology & psychology.

 

In her heart, I'm sure she wants to be with you because you offer many good and positive things to help her out. But she is so far gone right now that she doesn't know how to handle what you are offering.

 

The important thing for you to realize, and it seems like you are, is that it's not religion by itself that has made her this way. It's the accumulation of a variety of things. We are all subject to stereotypes, but neither ex-christians or current christians are all bad or all good. We are just people dealing with different obstacles and challenges that have shaped our individual lives. What matters is whether we take responsibility and action to do something about or circumstances. If we don't it's the blame train/victim mentality that takes over and rules our existence. Because something has to justify our current state of being.

[Amethyst]

Christianlongago,

 

Those who have been abused often become abusers. While not always the case, it happens and is not uncommon. Is it an excuse? No. But it's an explanation.

 

I would highly suggest going to get professional counseling if you have not done so already. With the emotional trauma you have been through, you need healing.

 

Also Ex-Christian is simply a word for one who was once a Christian and no longer holds Christian beliefs, just as Atheist is a word for someone who has no god beliefs. Not all Ex-Christians are Atheists. It is only the Christians who make those words socially unacceptable, since we do live in a society that places a high value on being Christian. Of course, it's up to you to if you want to remain in the Ex-Christian closet, so to speak. Many of us are due to family and other social situations.

 

If some Ex-Christians seem hateful of their past, it's because they are angry about what happened to them. Deconversion is like grief in that there are stages a person goes through. Not everyone goes through the same stages, but most go through more than one. Anger is a natural part of the deconversion process, and for many it can take months or years to get through it.

[Guest christianlongago]

Right this minute I am at this town's public library. The woman in question came in over one hour ago and almost sat next to me. I said. "are you sure you want to sit there". She walked away and has been sitting only 50 feet away for the last hour. I made it perfectly clear to the library personal what the situation is but they can't make her leave. The woman over heard my request but has not left. This is the same one the accused me of abuse. This whole time at this library has been very emotional for me but I refuse to give in. What she is doing right this minute is absulutely mean, abusive and just damn wrong.

[webmdave]

Please do not name names or make information public that has been shared in confidence. Two posts have been deleted and another edited to remove the name and the information shared in confidence.

[Guest christianlongago]

Please do not name names or make information public that has been shared in confidence. Two posts have been deleted and another edited to remove the name and the information shared in confidence.

 

Thankyou for deleting the woman's name from this discussion. If she was to deside to return to these forums I probably would have been blamed for trashing her and turning the web-site against her. I really appreciate your decision but I would also like to thank the forum posters for there support and information. I reviewed her previous posts and was quite surprised what she said about me.. This conversion has been very helpful.

[mwc]

My comments aren't really directed at Mongo but it's easier to just reply...

 

Every time there is an abuser, there is someone who takes it.

 

Abusive people are unconsciously or consciously seeking out people who are susceptible to their ploys. If this happened to you once... it is possible that you are at risk of falling into the same trap.

True. The problem is when trying to not "take it" things can get ugly real quick. A person needs to be very careful in a situation like this (perspective is usually the first thing to go).

 

What I suggest is that you go to a website Troubles Catbox http://www.drirene.com/catbox/index.php?act=idx

and read up on Verbal Abuse. If you find others or better ones, please let me know. Really.

It's a good site. It's heavy on the xian for my tastes though. It's also heavy on the "man hating" so if you happen to start off on the wrong foot you can just go ahead and resign yourself to get thoroughly slammed. Tread lightly if you're a man and you're going to say a woman is abusing you. It's a tough sale (and if you're a typical "guy" you'll use "aggressive" type words to describe things which immediately throws the red flags and paints you as the abuser instead of the victim looking for help...I learned this the hard way but by the time it was actually explained to me, so I understood, I'd had quite enough of their "abuse" and religious crap).

 

-Telling the courts/police that they are afraid of you is not rare. Blaming the victim is job #1 for these abusers and by the way... they are damn good at it.

- You said, "Peace and harmony is my thing". You may need help changing that thinking. "Peace at any price" is the victim's motto. Educate yourself about this mindset.

Agreed. The first one, if played correctly, is devastating if you're male. The system is geared to watch for abusive males (we can all agree it doesn't work all the time but that's not the point). If you're made to be one then all she need to do is ask and you're screwed. The reverse, however, does not work so well. There are really no resources for the "abused" male (unless something quite severe happens). So you're on your own, unless she does something over the top, and your hands are tied from the start.

 

For example, the story about the library. Police would likely respond if called if the posted was female but since it's a male and nothing at all happened he basically has to endure this "torture." "Man up." It's not right.

 

mwc

[Guest christianlongago]

Here I go again but I need to comment on what has been going on with Mental and Emotional abuse. For the second evening in a row this woman has come to the public library fully aware that I would be here. She at this very moment is sitting across from me using one of the four computers available here. This I believe has developed into stalking. Each time we broke up before she would follow me around.

I know when I started this discussion I was asking or searching out whether ex-christians acted in this manner. It became apparent through all the postings that was not so. But maybe now many will understand what I was dealing with. She seems to be fanatical and I took that as ex-christain fanatic because she just could never see the other side of things or was always blaming things on her religous past. Now she apparently does not see, understand or care about the pain I suffer when she shows up where I am and does not leave. This is almost maddening to me. The abuse continues but will any law or court understand.

[mwc]

Now she apparently does not see, understand or care about the pain I suffer when she shows up where I am and does not leave. This is almost maddening to me. The abuse continues but will any law or court understand.

She does have the right to be at the public library. Does she show up at places she shouldn't really be? Like does she hang around outside when you're at friends, family or work? You could try getting a restraining order to keep her some distance from you.

 

Also, I have heard that the book Emotional Vampires is helpful. I've only looked over the (linked) preview but I can say that I've encountered them and lived to regret it. They are a creature most evil. Just like "real" vampires trying to fight them using regular tactics fails miserably and you suffer greatly.

 

mwc