Spare the rod, spoil the child?

[whatifidontwantausername?]

Darkenmoon Posted Today, 02:08 AM

  It's interesting I think that kids are really the only group we can legally stil spank or whap. If you did this to criminals many people would be seriously protesting. Even with animals, there are many people who would consider reporting you to the authorities. Why do kids get the "honor" of being the only group for whom spanking is still permissible and even encouraged?

 

Because kids don't have rights and aren't as cute as animals.

 

Honestly though, I can say that I was never "Spanked" as a child. At the least I was paddled, at most I was thrown a beating.

 

So when I have kids I can say that I wont spank for fear of throwing them a beating instead.

 

-jake

[dogmatically_challenged]

I was spanked, but it didn't do me as much harm as my fundy mother who kept telling me that I was going straight to hell constantly.  I will never, ever berate my kids like that if I have any.  Never.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hell.

 

I wonder if a lota kids had panick attacks because of fear of hell? Its child abuse.

[Ouroboros]

It's interesting I think that kids are really the only group we can legally stil spank or whap.  If you did this to criminals many people would be seriously protesting.  Even with animals, there are many people who would consider reporting you to the authorities.  Why do kids get the "honor" of being the only group for whom spanking is still permissible and even encouraged?

Isn't it against the law in some states in US?

[Checkmate]

It's interesting I think that kids are really the only group we can legally stil spank or whap.  If you did this to criminals many people would be seriously protesting.  Even with animals, there are many people who would consider reporting you to the authorities.  Why do kids get the "honor" of being the only group for whom spanking is still permissible and even encouraged?

 

The answer in one word: PROPERTY.

 

We, as a race, have been culturally conditioned to believe that children are "property" of the parents. (Sometimes even "property" of the state.)

 

We see the same mentality when it comes to slavery. Human beings considered "property", and thus it's OK to do with them as YOU will.

 

To some extent men are trained to consider their FAMILY as their "property".

 

This whole mentality stems from the sick need/desire to be in CONTROL of another's life.

 

I don't know where this ideology started in human history, but can anyone deny that RELIGION keeps this particular fire going?

[Darkenmoon]

My mom and I were discussing spanking one day. We discuss a lot of things... and we've discussed spanking numerous times (she feels horrible for the handful of times she did it to me.) At any rate, she had mentioned that although there is enough information out there to show how spanking is bad for your kid people do continue to do it. She, being the social worker/counselor she is, mentioned that people tend to perpetuate it because otherwise they have to look at how it effected them when they were spanked. They might have to look at how that actually made them feel... and they aren't ready for that. I'm just waking up, so maybe I'm not explaining this as clearly as I'd like... but basically the feeling was it is easier to simply go with the status quo and believe spanking didn't do damage then face how it really made them feel and perhaps face the anger or whatever emotion they feel towards their parents for having done it.

 

But I think if we were considering should we whip prisoners, or should we torture the Iraqis in Gitmo, we wouldn't have people saying it was ok. Kids are far more delicate and extremely precious. I think spanking to make them behave is in some senses a very easy way out. I mean, it is easier to create fear in a person so they might not perform a particular act. Spanking will do that easily. I've noticed most people here who mentioned that they do or would spank their kids mention it works because the kid fears the spanking. But do we really want them just to obey out of fear? We've left Christianity who preached obeying God or choosing Christ out of fear of Hell.

 

Anyhow... that's my 2¢

[shy1680]

If I ever do have children, I will try everything else in the world before I hit. My parents used leather belts and later extention cords. Hitting didnt help me develop into a better person, it only taught me to fear my parents, hide belts, throw away cords, learn to lie to you while looking you in the eyes, and to hide notes from teachers lol. For my brother, he developed a phobia of reading, and is 24 and still cant read well because of the beatings he got for messing up while trying to learn how to read. My parents dont see that its their fault, they say he is "slow". My parents are big on the education stuff, my brother and I are the family failures but the last 3 kids didnt get beatings and are straight A students.

[Ouroboros]

My mom and I were discussing spanking one day.  We discuss a lot of things... and we've discussed spanking numerous times (she feels horrible for the handful of times she did it to me.)  At any rate, she had mentioned that although there is enough information out there to show how spanking is bad for your kid people do continue to do it.  She, being the social worker/counselor she is, mentioned that people tend to perpetuate it because otherwise they have to look at how it effected them when they were spanked.  They might have to look at how that actually made them feel... and they aren't ready for that.  I'm just waking up, so maybe I'm not explaining this as clearly as I'd like... but basically the feeling was it is easier to simply go with the status quo and believe spanking didn't do damage then face how it really made them feel and perhaps face the anger or whatever emotion they feel towards their parents for having done it.

Pretty much shows that people rather live in denial than have to change.

 

I've seen it many times, and in other areas, people rather live a lie, than face the truth. The demons and dragons that haunt them are scarier than hiding in the evil darkness.

 

But I think if we were considering should we whip prisoners, or should we torture the Iraqis in Gitmo, we wouldn't have people saying it was ok.  Kids are far more delicate and extremely precious.  I think spanking to make them behave is in some senses a very easy way out.  I mean, it is easier to create fear in a person so they might not perform a particular act.  Spanking will do that easily.  I've noticed most people here who mentioned that they do or would spank their kids mention it works because the kid fears the spanking.  But do we really want them just to obey out of fear?  We've left Christianity who preached obeying God or choosing Christ out of fear of Hell.

One of the reasons I stopped spanking my first son, was that he hardened his attitude, so first one spank was enough, but later you had to spank him several times to get the same effect, and later he didn't care.

 

So I realized that I was raising a person that would be hard on the outside, and introvert, and unable to show feelings or talk about them. That's not the kind of person I wanted him to be, so I changed my ways because I saw it was destructive and not constructive.

 

[BeccasStillSeeking]

You're father sounds like a good man.  Im slightly jealous that you had such a level headed father.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

The "just walk away for a minute" is an important skill to learn in both parenting and relationships, IMO. If you lose it and say or do something out of anger, you can't take it back afterward.

[Aaryn101]

Chrisitans: do you or would you hit your children?  If you do, is this due to the directions given biblically and are you working from the angle that the bible is inerrant? Are there any guidelines on the size of said rod?  If you wouldn’t or don’t advocate hitting a child, how do get around these clear, unambiguous and ‘moral’ instructions given in the bible?

 

 

"Hit" implies slapping and smacking them around, generally being abusive. In that sense no, i would not "Hit" my children.

 

But i would have no problem spanking them, as i have seen that this can have only positive effects. It shows that the parents have control, and the kids know that. If a kid knows that he/she will only get sent to their room, that kid is willing to try to get away with a lot more. Mental punishments (Grounding, room-banishment, etc..) are only useful with older kids, like teens and such. Physical punishments like spanking, are much more effective with kids under 10. I have seen families that flat out refuse to spank their kids, and their kids are rotten spoiled messes.

 

I would spank my kids even if i wasnt a Christian.

[TruthWarrior]

But would you spank them for all eternity?

[Checkmate]

actually Tk4 I've seen a lot of "nonspankers" who HAVE children. and COME ON...you couldn't outwit a 3-11 year old?  YOU COULDN'T?  If I were you, I wouldn't give up that easily.

 

See...what we have here is a failure to communicate.

 

People say "spank", or "discipline", and mental images come forth of "constant pummeling".

 

I am speaking of a simple "swat" on the behind, coupled with a judiciously spoken "NO!", just to teach them that BAD consequences accompany BAD behavior.

 

How else will they learn that it is BAD to stick a fork into a light socket, or not to play with matches, or put the cat into the microwave? Should we let them hurt themselves to learn?

 

I most definitely have "outwitted" my kids, because I NEVER have had to wear myself out physically dealing with them. I can't even remember the last time I "laid hands on them". And NEITHER can they!

 

Time outs and removal of privileges have been the standard "punishments" in my home.

 

You guys have got me wrong: I DON'T believe in BEATING children. Yet I DO believe in DISCIPLINE. There IS a world of difference. OK?

[Sensitive_Flower]

Isn't it against the law in some states in US?

 

Thats an interesting question. Does anyone know the answer to that one? Its not against the law here in the UK, but I believe spanking was outlawed in Sweden if I remember correctly.

[Amethyst]

How else will they learn that it is BAD to stick a fork into a light socket, or not to play with matches, or put the cat into the microwave? Should we let them hurt themselves to learn?

 

When they are younger, you can keep dangerous things away from the kids by putting them in places they won't reach, and they do have safety plug covers for kids that young these days. I myself would just not purchase matches. I don't like them myself because I'm always afraid I would drop them. so I use those butane lighters. Those are childproofed so young children can't use them, anyway. I'm sure older kids could easily figure them out, but by that age, they should know that fire = bad. (At least, mine will, because they'll have heard my RL horror story and seen the photographs of what fire can do.)

 

When they are above toddler age and can understand English, then you can start teaching them that those things are bad using English and time outs/denying them favorite toys or TV time/etc.

 

I have babysat very young kids and never felt a need to spank them, which would have been against their parents' wishes anyway. Yes, I did have to give a few time outs.

[TruthWarrior]

I'm sure both ways of discipline are effective, provided you do it right. Both can be bad if you abuse the use of discipline.

 

I tried the spanking thing on my kid and found the time out thing to be more effective. Probably because I was never good at spanking. I do think it's good to find ways to get one's point across without using physical force. This is good for both children and adults.

 

I dont think spanking is as bad as people make it out to be though. It doesnt cause any long term harm. I say use whatever works best.