Does The Christian God, Make Logical Sense.

[Shyone]

Back to my first point. Gods ways are higher than ours. Therefore, we can never reconcile our brain with what goes on in the world. My only advice for when you are in the midst of darkness and a pain so consuming it takes your breath away, is to just trust in God. It has worked for me in my life. When I came out the other side, I had become a far stronger person, a new person, a shaped and worked over person. I was not the same person as I was going in and through it. I had come to the other side losing me, laying down my rights to answers, demanding answers, and eventually just trusting God. Trusting that whatever was going on was for my good, even when I couldn't SEE it.

I'm not wanting to pick on you, honestly! As someone else said, though, you think we are made in God's image, whatever that means. Isn't the way you know what to do found in the bible? Isn't that supposed to be some kind of coherent message or set of instructions that communicates the basics of what this is supposed to be all about?

 

To say that God's ways are unfathomable means that God's message is incoherent. It implies that we don't understand the message because it isn't understandable at all.

 

Your personal experiences notwithstanding, believing in something that doesn't exist may make you feel better, but it does nothing outside of your mind. You are saying that you trust that your mind is capable of understanding the mind and will of God? That seems rather presumptuous.

 

Trusting in something that isn't real can lead you down some really dark alleys, and straight into walls. Even you know you can't really trust this concept. Ask it for a favor? Oh, ho, that wouldn't be right, but if I did, it wouldn't happen anyway.

 

How much trust can you afford? No medical visits? No seatbelt? Wear a blindfold while driving?

 

Please don't let this blind trust keep you from using your "god-given" common sense.

[NotBlinded]

His thoughts and Ways are far higher than our ways.

I have no problem with believers saying this. I would expect nothing less, as that statement actually makes sense (in its context).

 

After all, what's the point of having a god at all if he doesn't possess unimaginably superior and ineffable qualities. Wouldn't be much of a deity if he was just like us.

Yes, but the problem is is that after they say that, they go on to describe the qualities of God in human terms as Kathlene did here:

 

If you believe that God is the creator, and we the created, then of course His wisdom and ways are going to be different to ours. He is the one above, we below. He wants to see people come to Him in faith, and when they do, He goes about refining them by life's experiences and other people to mold them and shape them into people more like His son Jesus. How does he do that? Well certainly not by any logical way that I can see. He uses people that aggravate the living daylights out of me to shape me to have more patience, more kindness, more love, even when I dont want to!! He uses pain and suffering to shape us to trust more in Him in those times. To draw closer to Him.

 

Here God desires (people to come to him) and God is a teacher. Those seem to be human qualities.

[Shyone]

His thoughts and Ways are far higher than our ways.

I have no problem with believers saying this. I would expect nothing less, as that statement actually makes sense (in its context).

 

After all, what's the point of having a god at all if he doesn't possess unimaginably superior and ineffable qualities. Wouldn't be much of a deity if he was just like us.

Yes, but the problem is is that after they say that, they go on to describe the qualities of God in human terms as Kathlene did here:

 

If you believe that God is the creator, and we the created, then of course His wisdom and ways are going to be different to ours. He is the one above, we below. He wants to see people come to Him in faith, and when they do, He goes about refining them by life's experiences and other people to mold them and shape them into people more like His son Jesus. How does he do that? Well certainly not by any logical way that I can see. He uses people that aggravate the living daylights out of me to shape me to have more patience, more kindness, more love, even when I dont want to!! He uses pain and suffering to shape us to trust more in Him in those times. To draw closer to Him.

 

Here God desires (people to come to him) and God is a teacher. Those seem to be human qualities.

And God uses people. He uses them to teach others lessons. All of those people that taught Kathleen are just tools, empty headed bits of carbon and other elements that have no will or purpose.

 

And just like a good father, he uses pain and suffering to make his children trust him more.

 

Father knows best.

[florduh]

All of those people that taught Kathleen are just tools

Hey! I resent that, as I have been called a tool on many occasions!

[par4dcourse]

Christian God/Common Sense. That's an oxymoron. Is this a trick question?

[Guest Babylonian Dream]

there is the great flood

Then he says he'll never destroy mankind again, and that the earth will never end (not his words? the bible is his word), but then he has to have armegeddon because he changed his mind, his promises he'll always keep (when convenient)

 

and Sodom and Gomorrah.

well homosexuality is a sin against him, they deserved it. King David was a perfect king, complete with Jonathan, his boyfriend.

 

Another: Why is it, that if we are supposed to have free will, in heaven, that God, couldn't just decide to apply the same concept, to planet earth, so where people like you and me would have free will, and yet like in "heaven" not sin.

The only places the bible is ever consistant, is gods nature (tyrannical, hateful, malevolent, spiteful, genocidal, homocidal, etc....)

[OnceConvinced]

 

 

Another: Why is it, that if we are supposed to have free will, in heaven, that God, couldn't just decide to apply the same concept, to planet earth, so where people like you and me would have free will, and yet like in "heaven" not sin.

 

This is an argument I have used in the past and one that Christians cannot really come up with a logical or reasoned response to. It really is silly and illogical to claim that for God to get rid of sin on Earth would mean violating our freewill if sin can be vanquished in Heaven without violation of freewill. If it's possible in Heaven without assimilating us all into some kind of heavenly Borg collective, then it's also possible on Earth without all the silly rigmarole that mankind has to go through.

 

But really if all comes down to why create a being like the devil when you know full well he's gonna mess up your creation. And why knowingly create your creation with so many fatal flaws in it that it all falls apart as soon as one of your creation sins? God clearly had no clue what he was doing or otherwise was malevolent in his actions.

 

It's all very well for a Christian to come along and insist that we can't be expected to understand God's ways. But that's just a cheap cop out to avoid having to explain the ridiculous absurdities and contradictions in the bible. It's a way to be able to switch off your brain, block your ears and avoid thinking for yourself. Of course it's a defense mechanism. You don't want to have to use your brain, because if you do you'll realise just how ridiculous it all is.

[Guest Babylonian Dream]

You would create a devil because you want many of your creation to fail because your evil like that. Duh!

[Vixentrox]

You would create a devil because you want many of your creation to fail because your evil like that. Duh!

Yeah, he needs to have an excuse to torture his children for eternity. Maybe it helps Jesus' guilt factor to claim that hey "You had your chance to avoid me torturing you forever! Now lay down in that brimstone while you burn my child!"

[Deva]

Christianity is the elevation of pain and suffering into something holy. I guess some people buy that.

 

Does the Christian god make sense? No. How much better to think that things just are the way they are due to innumerable circumstances and conditions. Then you don't have to figure out how come God is supposed to love you and yet x, y and z happens to you.

[Ouroboros]

Is the christian God logical? No, possibly not. Why? because His thoughts and Ways are far higher than our ways.

There's a difference between the logic which ties to someone's/something's existence and attributes versus the logic relating to the thoughts and actions of the same.

 

So the question is: are we talking about the logic of God's supposed actions, or are we talking about the logic regarding God's existence? In the former we have to presuppose the position of God actually existing--why else reason about God's actions--while in the latter the question presupposes an ability to allow one's mind to accept the possibility that God doesn't even exists.