Totallyatpeace Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 Just wondering where the line is between obeying man's laws and spreading the word. What is acceptable? As you know, Xtianity has killed, tortured, subverted governments, ect to further the spread of their religion. I was also wondering if people thought it ethical for Xtians to charge other Xtians for the priviladge of fellowship in worship. For example, Xtian's charging other Xtians for the pleasure of listening to hymns of praise. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Well, first of all, I'd say it was the individuals that killed to further their religion, it is not what the Gospels teach. And your second point........What are you referring to?? Charging for a concert where Christian music is on stage? For many, it is also their livelyhood. I'd pay to go to any kind of concert if I liked the music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vixentrox Posted May 7, 2005 Author Share Posted May 7, 2005 You don't find it hypocritical? Didn't Jesus go into a temple all pissed off at people doing business there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totallyatpeace Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 You don't find it hypocritical? Didn't Jesus go into a temple all pissed off at people doing business there? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Have you never been justifiably angry? I dare you to say "no". I've been having a long conversation with someone today who is justifiably angry and given opportunity, would knock over a few tables. I would never hold that against him. Anyway.....I think we are getting off topic. Stealing music is a crime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOIL Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 Just wondering where the line is between obeying man's laws and spreading the word. ...<{POST_SNAPBACK}> ...Also, what can IJM do when the law is not on their side? What can they do in a country where it is perfectly legal to stone a woman you think might be cheating on you, or burn female babies, sew their vaginas up, or use child labour? What can IJM do in a country where it is legal to sell your children in order to get food for your other children? Sell your own babies into prostitution otherwise they shall starve? What is casework going to do for these people? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> [To see Cerise's full post (in context in the thread where she posted it) you may, of course, click on the back-arrow in the little box at the bottom right of the above quote window]. Vixentrox, (oops sorry, I just noticed that I have probably been spelling your handle incorrectly sometimes - that was not on purpose - for some reason, I have been reading your handle as if the 'x' was a 'v' - I just noticed that is not the case though.) At any rate, you are asking an extremely good question, methinks. Various Christians answer your question in various ways. Gary Haugen, (of IJM) has dealt with this question I suspect. He wants to save people from injustice - (he thinks the way God does that is by helping his people do it) - but, like Cerise asks: How does Gary do that in countries where there is no law against unjust acts? (Unjust, that is, based on what he - and I, for that matter - think God considers to be "unjust"?) Does he pull out his six-shooter and charge in in an effort to save the day as one way of doing his part to "spread the word" concerning how God likes justice so much. Could that be justified even in cases where such action might be construed to be breaking some of man's (international) laws (not to mention what he - and I again - consider to be God's laws?) -Dennis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlinfmct87 Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 My view is that if you outlaw free P2P you should outlaw libraries. I can't BEGIN to tell you how many books, films, concerts, albums and T V Series I have seen--For Free--because of the thieves at the local Litchfield branch. After all. I didn't give Terry Goodkind ONE RED CENT in order to read Wizard's First Rule. I later bought Chainfire on the spot. Same for Sarah Brightman... if I had never seen her Eden concert I never would have gotten Harem.* No Arabian Nights!!! No Dive! No Captain Nemo! Merlin The concert was a DirecTV Freeview... no theft at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totallyatpeace Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 Merlin~ The point is that the books at the Library were purchased, not stolen. I can purchase a book and pass it to you to read. It is still a purchased copy. The music downloaded for free is stolen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlinfmct87 Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 Merlin~ The point is that the books at the Library were purchased, not stolen. I can purchase a book and pass it to you to read. It is still a purchased copy. The music downloaded for free is stolen. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> So when I rip a library CD I'm stealing? One other thought. It's called Peer to Peer sharing. You are also getting jipped out of the full CD audio quality... plus the liner notes(which I love). What is the difference between a person sharing his copy of Ziggy Stardust with me personally and sharing it over LimeWire? Merlin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totallyatpeace Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 So when I rip a library CD I'm stealing? One other thought. It's called Peer to Peer sharing. You are also getting jipped out of the full CD audio quality... plus the liner notes(which I love). What is the difference between a person sharing his copy of Ziggy Stardust with me personally and sharing it over LimeWire? Merlin <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Was Stardust purchased? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlinfmct87 Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 Was Stardust purchased? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Both people own their copies. Merlin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Japedo Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 Stealing music is a crime. I have a Question. What do you consider stealing? For example; What difference is there from say D/l a song over the internet, then recording a song off the radio on a Tape? If people even still use tapes? LOL Or how 'bout Recording a TV show? (Dvd or VHS) Would those also be construed as "stealing"? If not why ? I personally Like to buy my music for the most part, however I do burn Cd's from/for family and friends . I don't personally see that stealing (?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fallenleaf Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 Music is everybody's possession. It's only publishers who think that people own it You can't own a song but you can sell it. And you can sell the experience of you performing it. Obviously, this is an unpopular position legally... but John Lennon is the only authority I'm concerned with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlinfmct87 Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 Music is everybody's possession. It's only publishers who think that people own it You can't own a song but you can sell it. And you can sell the experience of you performing it. Obviously, this is an unpopular position legally... but John Lennon is the only authority I'm concerned with. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> That's an excellent thought... great idea. Several others share it... Brian Eno among them I think. Japedo: I still use tapes.... and LPs. Yes, I have a CD player . You also could rip the audio with your computer. Merlin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmallStone Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 The prophets at Negativland have spoken! COPYRIGHT INFRINGEMENT IS YOUR BEST ENTERTAINMENT VALUE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totallyatpeace Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 I have a Question. What do you consider stealing? For example; What difference is there from say D/l a song over the internet, then recording a song off the radio on a Tape? If people even still use tapes? LOL Or how 'bout Recording a TV show? (Dvd or VHS) Would those also be construed as "stealing"? If not why ? I personally Like to buy my music for the most part, however I do burn Cd's from/for family and friends . I don't personally see that stealing (?) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Japedo~ This has been a heated topic for years because the musicians feel their music is being stolen. On a personal note.................I prefer to buy my CD's, too for the quality among other reasons. However, I also have in my possession many burned CD's. The question was......."Is it wrong?" Is there a difference between burning for personal use and burning to mass distribute for a profit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Japedo Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 Japedo~ The question was......."Is it wrong?" Is there a difference between burning for personal use and burning to mass distribute for a profit? Yes It's wrong to make money off of someone else's work. Just like those people that pirate movies. It's not wrong, however burning for personal use if you make no profit. IMO However, what's the difference between burning someone's CD and going on a website and down loading? One could do it both reasons. Some could do it for personal use, others to pirate for profit . I don't think its the Down loading / Burning that's wrong/Problem. It's the selling something you have no business selling that makes it wrong. IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Japedo Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 That's an excellent thought... great idea. Several others share it... Brian Eno among them I think. Japedo: I still use tapes.... and LPs. Yes, I have a CD player . You also could rip the audio with your computer. Merlin Somehow my other comment got Lost in cyber space? My comment was I consider VHS and Tapes to be LOL I forgot the rest of what I said? I think it was along the lines of.. If you use VHS or Tapes to record TV or radio is that considered stealing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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