Back to this again :(

[TheRedneckProfessor]

5 hours ago, Skittlebisquit said:

Love is. All is. All is All. All is Love. Love is All

Dafuq does thst mean?

[florduh]

11 hours ago, Myrkhoos said:

I think his issue is that while he does not believe it, it might be true.

No, it cannot be true any more than Santa can be real. Now, if you'd like to assert that there is a real chance, that it's just possible, that the fat man in a red suit comes down your chimney every Christmas Eve, then I'll be glad to watch that argument unfold.

[TheRedneckProfessor]

Love ain't pay my bills.

[florduh]

13 hours ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

18 hours ago, Skittlebisquit said:

Love is. All is. All is All. All is Love. Love is All

Dafuq does thst mean?

 

There's nothing you can do that can't be done
Nothing you can sing that can't be sung

[florduh]

3 minutes ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

Love ain't pay my bills.

Gimme money, honey.

[Myrkhoos]

8 hours ago, florduh said:

No, it cannot be true any more than Santa can be real. Now, if you'd like to assert that there is a real chance, that it's just possible, that the fat man in a red suit comes down your chimney every Christmas Eve, then I'll be glad to watch that argument unfold.

I think you misunderstand what I said. What I meant what was that he seems to want ultimate immediate certainty. He does not start with it is not real until I see an argument. He starts with , what if, against everything I have seen, Santa or anything else is actually real?what if I am missing something? And, granted we humans miss stuff all the time. Things can be real, even if we lack the evidence for it. So he seems disturbed by any remote possibility, however proven or unproven it might be. 

    It asks a very unreasonable and possibly unsustainable burden of proof. Like I have no evidence that a meteor is going to hit earth in the nect month but it might be true. 

     This is how many people stay in their groups for life, even though they are 99 percent sure it is false. The 1 percent is too risky. Normally 99 percent sure is more than our usual chance or certainty.

     Some ppl with OCD have this issue. You wash your hands 22 times bk it MIGHT be still a virus somewhere.

[tiredofwork]

I think most folks here will approach the question from a logical perspective. For me the biggest reassurance is not being alone. I'd recommend googling Winston Churchill and Abraham Lincoln's views of religions. Also George Washington (though it will be very limited). Another good one is Andrew Johnson (regardless of what he did as president, his views on religion make for interesting reading). Taft is another good presidential read in religion too. Nixon was very interesting as well. Basically - I'd recommend looking at world leaders or whoever you look up to, find the ones that also struggled, doubted, and found strength in the courage of their convictions. It helps to be not be alone, even if you feel alone without friends nearby.

[◊ Weezer ◊]

3 hours ago, tiredofwork said:

I think most folks here will approach the question from a logical perspective.

 

True.  I think most of us look at the facts, evidence, and lack of evidence.  And not depend on what others "think".   We believe in doing our own thinking.  The truth is more important than being part of the "in crowd".

[LostinParis]

On 4/24/2021 at 11:54 PM, fluffyapple said:

It's like this fear has been deeply ingrained inside of me. Ughhhh.

 

Bingo. An irrational fear, indoctrinated into you while you likely were too young to listen critically.

 

I wasn’t raised with the flames and torture type of hell, but rather a “separation from god”. This repackaging of hell to make it more palatable is in some ways worse because it’s not so abstract. We all know, whether we remember or not, what it felt like to be separated from a parent when we were very young. This fear of abandonment is an evolutionary survival mechanism. We are the product of thousands of generations of the most anxious children.

We trusted what our parents told us was true. Children are gullible. This has been exploited by religion. It’s so abusive. I’m too angry to be scared anymore.

[SemmelweisReflex]

On 4/24/2021 at 9:54 AM, fluffyapple said:

I managed to distract myself from the whole hell thing for a little while. Not that I didn't think about it at all, but I wasn't feeling as horrible as I did before. Now I'm back to where I started. I'm terrified of going to hell or sinning. After all these months, I'm getting so tired. I don't know how to convince myself that I'll be okay because there's a possibility that there may be eternal flames or some other torture waiting for me. I don't want to live the rest my life in fear, but I don't know how to help myself in this situation. It's like this fear has been deeply ingrained inside of me. Ughhhh.

 

That is a shame. Such an ugly tradition. I hope you can quickly dispense with it. If it's a case of religious tradition it will be difficult because it would be a belief system and those are hard to deal with, but if it comes from misunderstanding the Bible all you need is to educate yourself. Sin is a Hebrew word that means to miss the mark. It was used for archers, those using sling shots or throwing spears. If they missed the target it meant they sinned. If your boss says to be at work at 9:00 AM and you don't show up until 9:20 that is a sin against your boss. Our inheritance of sin from Adam an Eve brings death. Not a literal torment in fire. If we accept Jesus as savior we have the everlasting life promised to Adam because he removes our sin upon death. This means that those rejecting Jesus' salvation suffer only torment in a figurative way. Eternal destruction. Death. It isn't painful. Since we all sin, we all die and we are either resurrected to live forever or we remain dead.  

 

There isn't anything to fear. 

[TheRedneckProfessor]

1 hour ago, SemmelweisReflex said:

 

That is a shame. Such an ugly tradition. I hope you can quickly dispense with it. If it's a case of religious tradition it will be difficult because it would be a belief system and those are hard to deal with, but if it comes from misunderstanding the Bible all you need is to educate yourself. Sin is a Hebrew word that means to miss the mark. It was used for archers, those using sling shots or throwing spears. If they missed the target it meant they sinned. If your boss says to be at work at 9:00 AM and you don't show up until 9:20 that is a sin against your boss. Our inheritance of sin from Adam an Eve brings death. Not a literal torment in fire. If we accept Jesus as savior we have the everlasting life promised to Adam because he removes our sin upon death. This means that those rejecting Jesus' salvation suffer only torment in a figurative way. Eternal destruction. Death. It isn't painful. Since we all sin, we all die and we are either resurrected to live forever or we remain dead.  

 

There isn't anything to fear. 

This kind of proselytizing is only allowed in the Lion's Den.  You have sinned against this community and against the Prof thy Mod.  Repent and sin no more. 

 

This will be your only warning.  

[freshstart]

5 hours ago, SemmelweisReflex said:

Since we all sin, we all die and we are either resurrected to live forever or we remain dead.  

Yeah, so atheists will cease to exist while believers live forever  . . .without any idea of what that will be like.   Sounds pretty risky to me.   I don't recall any sort of suffering or missing anything at all when I did not exist before I was born.   So it doesn't frighten me to "remain dead" (i.e. not exist)  because there will be no pain, no suffering, no worrying, no disease, no having to fight for survival, no missing anything at all when I'm dead .  Hmmmm. . . kind of sounds like heaven! 

 

[SuperBigV]

On 4/24/2021 at 8:54 AM, fluffyapple said:

I managed to distract myself from the whole hell thing for a little while. Not that I didn't think about it at all, but I wasn't feeling as horrible as I did before. Now I'm back to where I started. I'm terrified of going to hell or sinning. After all these months, I'm getting so tired. I don't know how to convince myself that I'll be okay because there's a possibility that there may be eternal flames or some other torture waiting for me. I don't want to live the rest of my life in fear, but I don't know how to help myself in this situation. It's like this fear has been deeply ingrained inside of me. Ughhhh.

Let’s approach your fear from a different angle.  What exactly scares you about hell?  How do you imagine it?  In my imagination, if there is a hell, then it’s a place of fire.  Fire burning everywhere.  If it exists, I’ll burn in this fire forever.  But for this to happen, I need to have a body or a soul, or anything else that will be able to feel the pain from fire.  Our current bodies feel the pain as a survival mechanism, to prevent more damage.  If we burn too much, we actually pass out and stop feeling pain.  So, what will happen in hell?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congenital_insensitivity_to_pain

 

notice the wiki article says that people who do not feel pain do not live as long as those who feel pain, as pain helps us live longer and healthier lives.  But what about pain in Hell?  If we survive either way, I think we’ll just learn to tolerate it and perhaps even enjoy it.  Similar to what athletes experience during training.

 

I think this may be a good excercise to think about as many of these fears stem from childhood indoctrination and we have not (could not) thought them through well enough .

 

for instance, I fear hell sometimes too, but strangely, I don’t fear hell if I “know “ that my (currently religious) family will be there also.  Hell loses its sting then.  What about you?  What would make hell bearable for you?