When Parents Are Trying to Push My Family in Going Back to Church

[AnonSan]

Since I started dating my husband in 2016, my parents have been keen in trying to convert my husband and join the family church. The first time they met him at their home, my dad tried to intimidate my husband saying that we are Christian and expect family to be one with God. When I lived with my parents, my mom frequently tried providing subtle encouragement to bring my husband to my family's church in the long term as our relationship got more serious. My husband and I got married when the pandemic lockdown happened and still keep getting told/subtle messages to come back. Ever since we got married, I have experienced the following:

 

• Every 4-5 calls with my mom, she always tried to insert the need to pray or have him come back to church. 
• Keep praying for my husband to pass his PE (professional engineering) exam
• Pray for my husband to get his Masters' degree ASAP
• Being told to attend a local branch belonging to my family's church organization in a town we used to live in once the Covid restrictions started lifting away
• My mom starting to tear up when she saw my husband's KJV Bible he reads for violent God lore, thinking that there is hope that he will convert
• Wanting me to keep visiting my friend more often, who still goes to the church I grew up in, so that she can help me introduce my husband there
  • Also, my friend randomly invited me to a Friday evening church service 3 months ago and declined due to already having plans. Since then, I have not hear from her since. What's even weirder was a month later my mom asked whether my friend has asked me to attend a meeting with her...
• Expect me to drag my husband to attend Friday evening meetings over Him going to the gym (his gym time is sacred for his well-being and sanity)
• My mom visiting me in person and had a private conversation with me that it is a good idea to bring him to the weekend church meetings and have him connect with a brother. I told her "NO" and she laughed about it as my absence from church is "only a phase"
• Sent photos over the family group chat when I was in church doing kitchen duty, my mom replying how much she enjoyed this time and wishes that our family can go back to the way it was before. (I looked jaded in them).
•  My mom wishing that my husband and my brother's fiancé would become Christians-and yet again-join the family church.

 

Today, hence the rant, I got a text from my dad saying that he gave out my husband's contact info to one of the leaders at my childhood church without our permission. He said that the brother will give my husband a call soon "to make friends with him." I let my husband know and he assured me he will not pick it up. I trust he has other strategies in mind following this matter. I'm just really pissed off right now that my parents put this matter into their own hands when I have indicated many times, that my new family has no interest. I AM SO EXHAUSTED! 

[TheRedneckProfessor]

I put boundaries up with my parents about 10 years ago.  I told them I would not discuss religion with them, unless they first brought it up.  Mom brought it up soon afterward and immediately regretted it.  They have respected my boundaries since then.  But when Ms. Professor and I got married in 2019, Mom decided to test the boundaries again.  I think she wanted to test Ms. Professor to see how receptive she might be toward the christian religion.  Mom told me that the only gift she wanted for Christmas that year was for us to attend the church service with her as a family.  I told her we would be happy to; and, in return, she could attend the service at the Buddhist temple with us.  Ms. Professor is Vietnamese and, although she is not religious, she still enjoys the cultural and philosophical aspects of her country's version of Buddhism.  We sat through an hour of Christmas Carols and a short Nativity play.  Mom endured over three hours of chanting while sitting criss-cross on the floor.  She's never invited us back to church since then.  I'm not sure why...

[AnonSan]

7 minutes ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

I put boundaries up with my parents about 10 years ago.  I told them I would not discuss religion with them, unless they first brought it up.  Mom brought it up soon afterward and immediately regretted it.  They have respected my boundaries since then.  But when Ms. Professor and I got married in 2019, Mom decided to test the boundaries again.  I think she wanted to test Ms. Professor to see if how receptive she might be toward the christian religion.  Mom told me that the only gift she wanted for Christmas that year was for us to attend the church service with her as a family.  I told her we would be happy to; and, in return, she could attend the service at the Buddhist temple with us.  Ms. Professor is Vietnamese and, although she is not religious, she still enjoys the cultural and philosophical aspects of her country's version of Buddhism.  We sat through an hour of Christmas Carols and a short Nativity play.  Mom endured over three hours of chanting while sitting criss-cross on the floor.  She's never invited us back to church since then.  I'm not sure why...

[☆ moxieflux66 ☆]

3 hours ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

I put boundaries up with my parents about 10 years ago.  I told them I would not discuss religion with them, unless they first brought it up.  Mom brought it up soon afterward and immediately regretted it.  They have respected my boundaries since then.  But when Ms. Professor and I got married in 2019, Mom decided to test the boundaries again.  I think she wanted to test Ms. Professor to see if how receptive she might be toward the christian religion.  Mom told me that the only gift she wanted for Christmas that year was for us to attend the church service with her as a family.  I told her we would be happy to; and, in return, she could attend the service at the Buddhist temple with us.  Ms. Professor is Vietnamese and, although she is not religious, she still enjoys the cultural and philosophical aspects of her country's version of Buddhism.  We sat through an hour of Christmas Carols and a short Nativity play.  Mom endured over three hours of chanting while sitting criss-cross on the floor.  She's never invited us back to church since then.  I'm not sure why...

This totally made me laugh. I would LOVE to meet your wife. Bring her here!!! 

[☆ moxieflux66 ☆]

3 hours ago, AnonSan said:

Since I started dating my husband in 2016, my parents have been keen in trying to convert my husband and join the family church. The first time they met him at their home, my dad tried to intimidate my husband saying that we are Christian and expect family to be one with God. When I lived with my parents, my mom frequently tried providing subtle encouragement to bring my husband to my family's church in the long term as our relationship got more serious. My husband and I got married when the pandemic lockdown happened and still keep getting told/subtle messages to come back. Ever since we got married, I have experienced the following:

 

• Every 4-5 calls with my mom, she always tried to insert the need to pray or have him come back to church. 
• Keep praying for my husband to pass his PE (professional engineering) exam
• Pray for my husband to get his Masters' degree ASAP
• Being told to attend a local branch belonging to my family's church organization in a town we used to live in once the Covid restrictions started lifting away
• My mom starting to tear up when she saw my husband's KJV Bible he reads for violent God lore, thinking that there is hope that he will convert
• Wanting me to keep visiting my friend more often, who still goes to the church I grew up in, so that she can help me introduce my husband there
  • Also, my friend randomly invited me to a Friday evening church service 3 months ago and declined due to already having plans. Since then, I have not hear from her since. What's even weirder was a month later my mom asked whether my friend has asked me to attend a meeting with her...
• Expect me to drag my husband to attend Friday evening meetings over Him going to the gym (his gym time is sacred for his well-being and sanity)
• My mom visiting me in person and had a private conversation with me that it is a good idea to bring him to the weekend church meetings and have him connect with a brother. I told her "NO" and she laughed about it as my absence from church is "only a phase"
• Sent photos over the family group chat when I was in church doing kitchen duty, my mom replying how much she enjoyed this time and wishes that our family can go back to the way it was before. (I looked jaded in them).
•  My mom wishing that my husband and my brother's fiancé would become Christians-and yet again-join the family church.

 

Today, hence the rant, I got a text from my dad saying that he gave out my husband's contact info to one of the leaders at my childhood church without our permission. He said that the brother will give my husband a call soon "to make friends with him." I let my husband know and he assured me he will not pick it up. I trust he has other strategies in mind following this matter. I'm just really pissed off right now that my parents put this matter into their own hands when I have indicated many times, that my new family has no interest. I AM SO EXHAUSTED! 

...........as you have a right to be! Anger brought me here too. It's good to get it out. And THANK YOU for your emoji!! 

[older]

Perhaps it's time to set a firm boundary? What if you said that you were not going to discuss or listen to anything about religion in any way or form and if they bring it up that will be the end of the conversation, and that if it is in person you will leave?

[TheRedneckProfessor]

24 minutes ago, older said:

Perhaps it's time to set a firm boundary? What if you said that you were not going to discuss or listen to anything about religion in any way or form and if they bring it up that will be the end of the conversation, and that if it is in person you will leave?

This is a good approach to take, as you and your husband are both grown adults and free moral agents.  You are entitled to make your own decisions and have your own personal space.  If others, including family, cannot respect your decisions, then they shouldn't expect to be allowed in your personal space.

 

I have to admit, though, this is not the approach I took in the early stages of my boundaries.  The approach I took was when mom would mention religion I would go full counter-apologist and start tearing her beliefs apart with logic and reasoning.  This made her not want to discuss religion with me anymore.  It was necessary for me to do it this way because my mom is a narcissist and quite fond of gaslighting.  Had I just walked away, or quit talking to her, it would have given her the opportunity to play the victim.

[AnonSan]

2 hours ago, older said:

Perhaps it's time to set a firm boundary? What if you said that you were not going to discuss or listen to anything about religion in any way or form and if they bring it up that will be the end of the conversation, and that if it is in person you will leave?

 

I will tell parents soon that I no longer follow the Christian path- what they are doing right now crossed major boundaries and all too common for nonconfrontational families to use a third party to not experience pushback. When I told my parents about my agnosticism, they were only okay with it simply because to them I may have a chance to return back (like my mom did during her youth). My husband and I are tired. 

[◊ Weezer ◊]

I had the advantage of being 200 miles from my parents.  And back then we had no texting, email, or FaceBook.  And it was a long distance phone call.  Remember those??   Most of my discussions were via snail mail.  

 

On a visit my mother tried the gullt trip of throwing herself on the bed, crying, and saying,  "where did we go wrong"?  What I finally told them was that I appreciated their concern for my soul, and they had NOT gone wrong.  They taught me to be a moral person, and that was still intact.   It was my own study of the bible and religion that led me away from church.  It was interesting that they did not want to hear my arguments for why.  

 

I agree with what the others are saying.  You may have to eventually warn them that further attempts to discuss religion will be met with stopping  the visits for a period of time.  Whether in person or other means.  And be sure to follow through if they attempt to violate your rule.  And do it as many times as you need too.  If you do all this in a respectful manner, I can almost guarantee you they will respect you and back off.  But any semblance of giving in, or caving to the quilt, will encourage them to try again.

 

In other words, treat them as equal adults.  You are no longer a child.  After my mother finally saw she could no longer manipulate me, we had a good relationship.

[AnonSan]

10 hours ago, Weezer said:

I had the advantage of being 200 miles from my parents.  And back then we had no texting, email, or FaceBook.  And it was a long distance phone call.  Remember those??   Most of my discussions were via snail mail.  

 

On a visit my mother tried the gullt trip of throwing herself on the bed, crying, and saying,  "where did we go wrong"?  What I finally told them was that I appreciated their concern for my soul, and they had NOT gone wrong.  They taught me to be a moral person, and that was still intact.   It was my own study of the bible and religion that led me away from church.  It was interesting that they did not want to hear my arguments for why.  

 

I agree with what the others are saying.  You may have to eventually warn them that further attempts to discuss religion will be met with stopping  the visits for a period of time.  Whether in person or other means.  And be sure to follow through if they attempt to violate your rule.  And do it as many times as you need too.  If you do all this in a respectful manner, I can almost guarantee you they will respect you and back off.  But any semblance of giving in, or caving to the quilt, will encourage them to try again.

 

In other words, treat them as equal adults.  You are no longer a child.  After my mother finally saw she could no longer manipulate me, we had a good relationship.

 

I was thinking of visiting them during the Christmas/New Years' holiday vacation, but they lost this year's privilege after what they just did. They should know this by now as I have skipped Christmas before when my parents tried to interject a different church brother into developing my career. My parents also live near Anaheim where a yearly global conference event from my family's church organization takes place during that time; so, they will most attend and proselytize even more. Being with my parents becomes more suffocating every year. 

[◊ Weezer ◊]

40 minutes ago, AnonSan said:

 but they lost this year's privilege after what they just did. They should know this by now as I have skipped Christmas before

Wow.  They really are intent.  That must be sad and frustrating. 

[older]

23 hours ago, AnonSan said:

will tell parents soon that I no longer follow the Christian path- what they are doing right now crossed major boundaries and all too common for nonconfrontational families to use a third party to not experience pushback. When I told my parents about my agnosticism, they were only okay with it simply because to them I may have a chance to return back (like my mom did during her youth). My husband and I are tired. 

  

While you will tell your folks that you no longer follow their path, be sure to make it clear that their proselytizing is not welcome. Be firm. Tell them that what they are doing after you have asked them to stop disrespects you and your husband, and that you will not continue to suffer such disrespect if they do not stop. And then be prepared to follow through. Hang up, leave, or whatever. No grace periods, arguments or push-backs. If they say a single word about you and your husband and religion, just calmly say goodbye and end the interaction.

[AnonSan]

On 11/8/2023 at 7:22 AM, Weezer said:

Wow.  They really are intent.  That must be sad and frustrating. 

 

It is- especially coming from a culture that encompasses filial piety. "Honor thy parents" commandment doubles down this virtue, which from personal experience causes more harm than good. Absolute compliance, playing your "assigned" role in the family/church, and facilitating a fear-based environment is typical behind closed doors. There was no way for me to seek help and guidance while being raised in my family's church because members shared the same oppressive sentiment or were tiger parents. All I could do at the time is pretending to conform, which inadvertently brainwashed myself in high school, but hoping for the best that through aging and time will they become more relaxed.

 

Really though, they learned to become more manipulative and passive-aggressive with the least resistance over the years. I am starting to see their patterns of generosity as weaseling their way into getting what they want in return. My mom's intent to drag us back to church became more apparent once I started to establish more healthy boundaries in the past few months, as if boundaries were manifests of Satan's work. 

[AnonSan]

17 hours ago, older said:

  

While you will tell your folks that you no longer follow their path, be sure to make it clear that their proselytizing is not welcome. Be firm. Tell them that what they are doing after you have asked them to stop disrespects you and your husband, and that you will not continue to suffer such disrespect if they do not stop. And then be prepared to follow through. Hang up, leave, or whatever. No grace periods, arguments or push-backs. If they say a single word about you and your husband and religion, just calmly say goodbye and end the interaction.

 

I agree everything you have said. My husband and I have been preparing in the last few days. He did think about ignoring the phone call, but decided to talk to the brother so that the brother can relay the message to my parents. I will also briefly and clearly tell my parents that I HATED being raised in the "church-life," they call it, and the Christian faith itself is incompatible with my lifestyle and core beliefs without explaining my reasons. At minimum, will tell them that no one has permission to tell me and my husband how to live our lives the way we want whether they like it or not. 

[◊ Weezer ◊]

Even though my parents (especially my mother) was manipulative, they(and probably your parents) thought they were doing me a favor.  They honestly believed they were saving my soul from eternal Hell.  And thy felt like they had failed as parents, and I might become some depraved being without "God".  Be sure to tell them they passed on some good morals to you, and you will not abandon them.  But through study and rational reasoning (or for other reasons you may have) you no longer can agree with their religious beliefs.  Thank them for standing by and helping you get an education. (if they did)    But I was also honest with my mother and told her I did not appreciate her emotional attempts at manipulation.  (actually those just drove me further away)

I beleive your husband was wise to talk to the church leader rather than not answering the phone.  He establish closure with the leader, and with your dad.  In my way of thinking, both of you are handling things in a very respectful and responsible manner.

 

And by the way.  I am old enough that my memory is getting bad, so forgive me if I am repeating some things.  HANG IN THERE!

[older]

Please do let us know how all this works out. We hope it is without too much stress.

[TheRedneckProfessor]

Also, if they won't listen to you, force them to listen to Mysterain.  \m/

 

 

[◊ Weezer ◊]

AnonSan, be sure to see WebDaves post in RANTS AND REPLIES.   "How to comeout to your parents."  That is the best summary of the process I have seen.

[AnonSan]

Update: The brother (Derek-fake name) who got my husband's info was supposed to call last weekend, but he never did. We went off to the beach and had a great time there, enjoying ourselves. 

 

Yesterday, we get a text from my dad saying he and my mom will come visit during Thanksgiving weekend last minute. We let my parents know that they are welcome to stay over, but we already have plans so could only hang out for dinner on Black Friday. Coincidentally, Derek called my husband today at 2PM during work. He left a generic text message saying that he is Brother Derek and asked how has he been. My husband tried to call him after work, but he didn't pick up.

 

My gut feeling tells me that he intended for my husband to converse with him via text not only to be nonconfrontational, but also perhaps to use it against my husband as he will report back to my parents. I feel like they are using the Thanksgiving holiday as a cover up and take advantage of our vacation as means to make us come back...

[◊ Weezer ◊]

37 minutes ago, AnonSan said:

. He left a generic text message saying that he is Brother Derek and asked how has he been.

 

Is it possible Derek is being pushed to do something he really does not want to do?  

 

Your parents are doing something my demanding mother used to do.  Calling to TELL you they are coming, instead of asking if it would be okay.  Once we had bought expensive tickets to a concert the evening they wanted to arrive at our house, and mom insisted we not go to the concert.  I told her we were going to the concert, and they could sit at our house and  watch TV until we got home.  But that had nothing to so with religion.  It was just my mother demanding to get her way.

 

37 minutes ago, AnonSan said:

. I feel like they are using the Thanksgiving holiday as a cover up and take advantage of our vacation as means to make us come back...

 

How do you plan to handle it if they start with the religious stuff?

[☆ moxieflux66 ☆]

1 hour ago, AnonSan said:

Update: The brother (Derek-fake name) who got my husband's info was supposed to call last weekend, but he never did. We went off to the beach and had a great time there, enjoying ourselves. 

 

Yesterday, we get a text from my dad saying he and my mom will come visit during Thanksgiving weekend last minute. We let my parents know that they are welcome to stay over, but we already have plans so could only hang out for dinner on Black Friday. Coincidentally, Derek called my husband today at 2PM during work. He left a generic text message saying that he is Brother Derek and asked how has he been. My husband tried to call him after work, but he didn't pick up.

 

My gut feeling tells me that he intended for my husband to converse with him via text not only to be nonconfrontational, but also perhaps to use it against my husband as he will report back to my parents. I feel like they are using the Thanksgiving holiday as a cover up and take advantage of our vacation as means to make us come back...

That's quite a tactic. And since the org is now known for being underhanded, your gut feeling is probably right. 

[TheRedneckProfessor]

I agree with Weezer on this.  Your parents have absolutely no right to simply announce that they are coming to your home for a visit.  That is your home--your personal space--where you make the rules and where you are in charge.  They are welcome to come only if you invite them.  It may be tricky to avoid the visit now, so close to Thanksgiving, especially if you have already agreed to it; but, while they are visiting, you and your husband need to make it clear that in the future they need to ask, rather than tell.  This is a healthy boundary; and they can either respect it, or they can't come visit anymore. 

 

I would also strongly suggest that you set this boundary and make it clear before there are any children involved; because, if you think your parents are controlling and manipulative now, it will only get worse when you start having kids of your own.  They will assume the right to come visit any time they want to see the grandkids; and it won't be long before they start using the kids as a means to manipulate you.  Move far away, if you need to; but never, never let your parents try to turn the kids against you.  That's the kind of toxicity that will stay with all of you for many years to come.

[AnonSan]

2 hours ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

I agree with Weezer on this.  Your parents have absolutely no right to simply announce that they are coming to your home for a visit.  That is your home--your personal space--where you make the rules and where you are in charge.  They are welcome to come only if you invite them.  It may be tricky to avoid the visit now, so close to Thanksgiving, especially if you have already agreed to it; but, while they are visiting, you and your husband need to make it clear that in the future they need to ask, rather than tell.  This is a healthy boundary; and they can either respect it, or they can't come visit anymore. 

 

I would also strongly suggest that you set this boundary and make it clear before there are any children involved; because, if you think your parents are controlling and manipulative now, it will only get worse when you start having kids of your own.  They will assume the right to come visit any time they want to see the grandkids; and it won't be long before they start using the kids as a means to manipulate you.  Move far away, if you need to; but never, never let your parents try to turn the kids against you.  That's the kind of toxicity that will stay with all of you for many years to come.

 

Before my parents moved away, they told my husband they will come back during the holidays. However, they did not specify whether it will be on Thanksgiving/Xmas/New Years. So they caught us off guard they they decide to come back soon a month after they moved, let alone being last minute. Unfortunately we cannot outright refuse as we currently rent out their family house. I know it is not ideal, but necessary for our job sites and school to get our (masters'/certification) education. Whereas, rent elsewhere in the area is 3X more than we can afford right now, unless we live 2hrs away from everything we need. 

 

Kids wont be an issue as I refuse to have any. My parents' passive aggressive retaliation began when I started making  boundaries recently. This is because my mom kept on giving me unsolicited advice, nitpicking our lifestyle every time we shared something on the family app, and trying to pry into my health records. I guess in their view, having boundaries is correlated being straying away from the Christian lifestyle hence dragged Brother Derek into this conflict they made up..

[TheRedneckProfessor]

7 minutes ago, AnonSan said:

Unfortunately we cannot outright refuse as we currently rent out their family house. I know it is not ideal, but necessary for our job sites and school to get our (masters'/certification) education. Whereas, rent elsewhere in the area is 3X more than we can afford right now, unless we live 2hrs away from everything we need. 

Whether you rent from them or not, as long as you live there, you have a reasonable expectation of privacy.  That's not just a boundary; it's the law.  This is why a landlord has to give notice to a tenant before they show up to visit or inspect the property.  You have to do what is right for you; so it's completely understandable if you'd rather not rock the boat while you're still inside of it.  But you should not be pushed around simply because your parents are having a hard time letting you grow up and become your own person.

[AnonSan]

11 hours ago, Weezer said:

 

Is it possible Derek is being pushed to do something he really does not want to do?  

 

Your parents are doing something my demanding mother used to do.  Calling to TELL you they are coming, instead of asking if it would be okay.  Once we had bought expensive tickets to a concert the evening they wanted to arrive at our house, and mom insisted we not go to the concert.  I told her we were going to the concert, and they could sit at our house and  watch TV until we got home.  But that had nothing to so with religion.  It was just my mother demanding to get her way.

 

 

How do you plan to handle it if they start with the religious stuff?

 

I knew Derek since I was a teen. My dad's hierarchy outranks Derek due to family legacy and elder position, whether or not they see each other in person. The main shortfall from my dad's end is his limited English related "to preaching the gospel." Otherwise, my dad would already have aggressively pushed the Christian agenda onto my husband when we first started dating in 2016.

 

Derek is currently one of the church leaders I the church I grew up in, fully bilingual (English/Chinese), and an alumnus from the church organization's training boot camp that teaches their students/followers to proselytize. He is the suitable "flying monkey" for dad to reach out to for indirectly influencing my husband to join the church. My husband and I have been strategizing throughout the week in dealing with the possible hypothetical scenarios by the time he gets a hold of Derek and when my parents visit. 

 

My husband and therapist emphasize the importance of being calm if I have to come out to my parents and be in control of the conversation. This is the best route, though very difficult as I will re-experience trauma on top of my mom's unstable emotional reaction that have always broken all efforts in effective, constructive communication. If my mom (and dad) could not get her emotions together and/or keeps pressing on my decision to leave my Christian path, then we plan to just walk away from the conversation.