pandora Posted May 23, 2006 Share Posted May 23, 2006 I think I've said as much before on these forums, but I am half Finnish. My father's parents were immigrants from Finland. My grandparents and my father all spoke Finnish, but unfortunately I was not around my grandparents enough to learn it and my father died before he had a chance to teach me, as it was not the language we spoke at home, since my mom is an average American mutt. I know several of you have done a lot of research into your own cultural heritage. I am about to embark on a similar journey... and while I doubt I will come to believe in the gods and goddesses of the Kalevela, I am sure it will enrich my understanding of the world. How has this kind of research influenced those of you who have embarked on similar journeys? For those of you who don't know, here's some info in the Kalevala: (what I remember my father and grandpa telling me about it): It's a national epic, much like Homer's works. It played a key role in motivating Finns to fight for independence when Russia threatened to take them in as territory. My grandpa used to say, "Without Kalevala, Finland would not be." It is considered one of the world's cultural treasures, even though it is not widely known in the west. Although it was only recently (last couple of centuries, mid 1800s I think) compiled, it was the work of interviewing Finnish rune singers and story tellers, who kept the stories and poems alive by oral tradition. I also know that Tolkien used it for inspiration in some of his writings. So, if any of you have any experiences you want to share about discovering your cultural heritage, or any knowledge of Finnish lore and would like to point me to resources, I an all ears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taphophilia Posted May 23, 2006 Share Posted May 23, 2006 My mother's maternal grandparents were Finnish. My great-father died when my grandmother was nine so I never knew him. Athough, I'm told he was an orphan who ran away from several European orphanages, so he could speak several languages. No one was religious in my family, but I thought they were all Lutheran, or at least confirmed Lutheran. The Swede side of the family I know were. The Finns were kind of odd, but then that just could have been my family. There are a lot of Finns in Upper Peninsula Michigan. The Finnish langauge isn't Scandinavian in origin, it's Estonian. So, it's difficult to learn. My aunt who is from Sweden but grew up in Egypt speaks eleven languages and can pick up a language just by listening to it, but can't grasp Finnish. My great-grandmother came here before WW1. She said that her worst days here were better than her best days in Finland. I guess life was very hard there during the turn of the century. She said that people who were wealthy had metal pots and pans. She talked about the "blacks" which were the Laplanders. She said that the Russians would go to a village and burn down all the houses and leave one, so that it would cause problems for the family of the one that was left. Everyone would think they were informants or spys for the Russians, and that family would be hated by the village. Taph Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted May 23, 2006 Author Share Posted May 23, 2006 Thanks, Taph! That's very interesting. I wish I had gotten a chance to speak to my Finnish grandparents before they died so I could learn of their experiences. I know that Finnish is very difficult... professors always ask me if I can speak it, and they are disappointed to learn I can't (except a few words). I find the language really interesting, apparently it is quite the oddball as far as syntax, grammar, etc. go. And people, it's "sahow-nah," not "Sahna." (for sauna) I think being odd is a Finn thing... supposedly, they tend to be quiet and reserved in public, but opinionated in private. They also have "sisu," and I have yet to grasp exactly what this self-described quality means. My grandpa had quite the reputation in the town he lived in Minnesota... he gave local lake fishing tours, and was known for being rather opinionated and even harsh. All my Finnish relatives that are still alive all have unique personalities... me included. I remember going to my grandparents summer cabin... it was so nifty. It was very simple, skimpy on luxuries (no running water), and it seemed to effortlessly blend into the natural landscape... the Finns brought the "summer cabin" tradition to the states, as well as the sauna, but the sauna existed in Native American cultures, as well. I hear that today, Finland has come a long way and is among the top nations as far as human rights, wealth equality, government honesty, environmental protection, literacy, women's health, etc etc... as all Scandinavian countries tend to be. It makes me proud to be Finnish and at the same time, forlorn that I was not born there. If you ever go, Taph, contact me and I will try to make the trip with you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedPillAddict Posted May 23, 2006 Share Posted May 23, 2006 My Grandparents moved here from Norway when they were young. I remember my grandpa was unable to pronunce the letters "Th", lol. He would always say things like "I tink so". I dont know whether or not that is from him being Norwegian. I havent done very much research on my family history. I would love to go to Norway someday, though. Maybe after college. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigile Posted May 24, 2006 Share Posted May 24, 2006 My Grandparents moved here from Norway when they were young. I remember my grandpa was unable to pronunce the letters "Th", lol. He would always say things like "I tink so". I dont know whether or not that is from him being Norwegian. I havent done very much research on my family history. I would love to go to Norway someday, though. Maybe after college. My grandmother was 100% Norwegian, but was born in an immigrant community in Chicago. My wife still can't make the "th" sound either. I haven't met a Russian who can. Perhaps we develop those tongue muscles as children? Pandy, I'm going to Finland in a couple of months to renew my visa. Want me to pick you up a Suomi T-shirt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Shiva H. Vishnu Posted May 24, 2006 Share Posted May 24, 2006 My parents' names are Langdon and Durham so I know I'm English as hell. Beyond that it's never really occured to me to find out. Maybe I will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Faery Posted May 24, 2006 Share Posted May 24, 2006 Yup I grew up here since I was 9, half Russian and I can make the th sound perfectly. My mom can make it, though she has a hard time with it, sometimes she can and sometimes she can't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted May 24, 2006 Author Share Posted May 24, 2006 My Grandparents moved here from Norway when they were young. I remember my grandpa was unable to pronunce the letters "Th", lol. He would always say things like "I tink so". I dont know whether or not that is from him being Norwegian. I havent done very much research on my family history. I would love to go to Norway someday, though. Maybe after college. My grandmother was 100% Norwegian, but was born in an immigrant community in Chicago. My wife still can't make the "th" sound either. I haven't met a Russian who can. Perhaps we develop those tongue muscles as children? Pandy, I'm going to Finland in a couple of months to renew my visa. Want me to pick you up a Suomi T-shirt? Hell yeah! Can I make a small list of things for you to buy? Really, small, I promise... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sage Nabooru Posted May 24, 2006 Share Posted May 24, 2006 My dad's side of the family was originally German Jewish, and I really like Judaism. I would be a Jew if I didn't feel I'd be confining myself to one particular belief system. But then they were converted shortly after arrived in America, and now they're all evangelical fundie rednecks who talk about how Jesus loves them and how evil Democrats are for opposing creationism. My mom's side of the family is Eastern German Lutheran. I.e. - no love, all denial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted May 24, 2006 Share Posted May 24, 2006 Finnish joke: Finnish flat tire Antero is driving down the road when 'boom' he gets a flat tire. "Saatana" he says, and after discovering he doesn't have a jack, he decides to walk down the road and try to borrow one from someone. As he's walking, he's thinking "Damn, they probably won't have one." He walks a little further, and the growing suspicion increases... "I BET they don't have one". He walks further... "DAMN IT, I'm sure they won't have one, and if they did they wouldn't lend it to me anyway." Finally he reaches a cottage, picks up a rock and hurls it through the window, shouting "KEEP YOUR BLOODY JACK!!" --- How many Finns does it take to change a light bulb? Five. One to hold the bulb and four to drink enough Kosu (vodka) until the room starts spinning. --- The Finnish people are famous of not talking much and not being so social... which leads to this joke: Finnish Extroverts How can you tell the difference between a Finnish introvert and a Finnish extrovert? When he's talking to you a Finnish introvert looks at his feet. A Finnish extrovert looks at yours! --- And here's one about the Finnish weather... Finnish weather explained +15°C / 59°F This is as warm as it gets in Finland, so we'll start here. People in Spain wears winter-coats and gloves. The Finns are out in the sun, getting a tan. +10°C / 50°F The French are trying in vain to start their central heating. The Finns plant flowers in their gardens. +5°C / 41°F Italian cars won't start. The Finns are cruising in cabriolets. 0°C / 32°F Distilled water freezes. The water in the Vanda river (in Finland) gets a little thicker. -5°C / 23°F People in California almost freeze to death. The Finns have their final barbecue before winter. -10°C / 14°F The Brits start the heat in their houses. The Finns start using long sleeves. -20°C / -4°F The Aussies flee from Mallorca. The Finns end their Midsummer celebrations. Autumn is here. -30°C / -22°F People in Greece die from the cold and disappear from the face of the earth. The Finns start drying their laundry indoors. -40°C / -40°F Paris start cracking in the cold. The Finns stand in line at the "grilli-kioski". -50°C / -58°F Polar bears start evacuating the North Pole. The Finnish army postpones their winter survival training awaiting real winter weather. -60°C / -76°F Korvatunturi (the home for Santa Claus) freezes. The Finns rent a movie and stay indoors. -70°C / -94°F The false Santa moves south. The Finns get frustrated since they can't store their Kossu (Koskenkorva vodka) outdoors. The Finnish army goes out on winter survival training. -183°C / -297.4°F Microbes in food don't survive. The Finnish cows complain that the farmers' hands are cold. -273°C / -459.4°F All atom-based movent halts. The Finns start saying "Perkele, it's cold outside today." -300°C / -508°F Hell freezes over. Finland wins the Eurovision Song Contest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted May 24, 2006 Author Share Posted May 24, 2006 LOL Thanks, Hans. Those were great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted May 24, 2006 Share Posted May 24, 2006 It just seemed fitting to have some Finnish jokes... considering I'm a Swede and we have this "brotherly love" going... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted May 24, 2006 Author Share Posted May 24, 2006 It just seemed fitting to have some Finnish jokes... considering I'm a Swede and we have this "brotherly love" going... More like: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted May 24, 2006 Share Posted May 24, 2006 Looks like we're having a drinking contest! Like True Scandinavians! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted May 24, 2006 Author Share Posted May 24, 2006 So you guys like making fun of our accent too, eh? Saaaaaaaaaatana... Not that I have it, but I remember my grandpa and I've heard a fair amount of Finnish spoken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted May 24, 2006 Share Posted May 24, 2006 That's how it sounds when I finn says "Satan!", which is like the expression "What the Devil!" Swedes use it too. And it also sounds like Saaaatan. (It's very bad swear word btw, it's just as dirty as F**K) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigile Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 Finnish Extroverts How can you tell the difference between a Finnish introvert and a Finnish extrovert? When he's talking to you a Finnish introvert looks at his feet. A Finnish extrovert looks at yours! So true. Finnish weather explained +15°C / 59°F This is as warm as it gets in Finland, so we'll start here. People in Spain wears winter-coats and gloves. The Finns are out in the sun, getting a tan. The Russians have a similar joke: An African student spends a year in St Peterburg before returning home for a visit. Her family asked her "so how was Russia?" The student replied: "well, the green winter wasn't so bad but the rest of the year was unbearable." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exhihhuli Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 Hello from an actual Finn (who's at the moment an occasional lurker in the forum, not finding time to immerse myself to the discussions)! Glad to hear that the Finnish heritage is alive at the other side of the pond. I know several of you have done a lot of research into your own cultural heritage. I am about to embark on a similar journey... and while I doubt I will come to believe in the gods and goddesses of the Kalevela, I am sure it will enrich my understanding of the world. How has this kind of research influenced those of you who have embarked on similar journeys? Though I have lived in Finland for all of my life, Kalevala doesn't have any major importance for me. It's compulsory reading in the school, but due to "favourable" transition from one school to another, I've actually never read it. To me it's just another collection of pre-christian rural beliefs found in practically all countries. Sure, it has some merits from literary perspective, but not enough to get me reading it. After having de-converted (from Pentecostal/Word of Faith/"torontoism" background) I have been fully content in approaching life from purely naturalistic/humanistic perspective. But I can understand the interest in ones mythological roots, especially for someone less strictly rational than me. So, if any of you have any experiences you want to share about discovering your cultural heritage, or any knowledge of Finnish lore and would like to point me to resources, I an all ears. Well, here's an English translation of the text from Gutenberg project and here's Wikipedia with a lot of links. The Finns were kind of odd, but then that just could have been my family. There are a lot of Finns in Upper Peninsula Michigan. The Finnish langauge isn't Scandinavian in origin, it's Estonian. So, it's difficult to learn. My aunt who is from Sweden but grew up in Egypt speaks eleven languages and can pick up a language just by listening to it, but can't grasp Finnish. What, Finnish is not that difficult... Even the little kids over here speak it fluently... Actually I agree that it's quite hard. As a Fenno-Ugric language (only relatives are Estonian and Hungarian) it's quite different than the roman languages. For example we don't have any prepositions (to, in, from, ...), but they are expressed by suffixes that often change the word a bit. My great-grandmother came here before WW1. She said that her worst days here were better than her best days in Finland. I guess life was very hard there during the turn of the century. She said that people who were wealthy had metal pots and pans. She talked about the "blacks" which were the Laplanders. She said that the Russians would go to a village and burn down all the houses and leave one, so that it would cause problems for the family of the one that was left. Everyone would think they were informants or spys for the Russians, and that family would be hated by the village. Yes, before WW1 Finland was part of the Russian Empire, and it wasn't the best of times. A lot of people migrated to US or Canada around that time. I too have some distant relatives around Vancouver. I would actually guess that the "blacks" you refer to were gypsies, which were (and to some extent still are) held in similar low esteem as in many other countries. The relation between Laplanders (the native population pushed to the northern part of the country) and the Finns is more amicable. I think being odd is a Finn thing... supposedly, they tend to be quiet and reserved in public, but opinionated in private. They also have "sisu," and I have yet to grasp exactly what this self-described quality means. The simplest translation is "guts" and more complex "quiet fortitude". It refers to perseverance and calm determination when faced with difficulties. It somehow also encompasses the introvert character mentioned in this thread. Here's the wikipedia entry on sisu I hear that today, Finland has come a long way and is among the top nations as far as human rights, wealth equality, government honesty, environmental protection, literacy, women's health, etc etc... as all Scandinavian countries tend to be. It makes me proud to be Finnish and at the same time, forlorn that I was not born there. Well, to increase your pride you may want to add to your list least corrupt, top 3 in competitiveness (as corporate location) and top 3 in IT usage (big thanks to Nokia, which is a Finnish company). In case this makes you want to jump to the next plane, maybe I should mention one Finnish joke that has more than a grain of truth. "Finland is a great place to live. We may have low salaries, but at least we have high taxes and high cost of living. And while the Finnish summer is rather short, it usually doesn't snow that much" Finnish weather explained -300°C / -508°F Hell freezes over. Finland wins the Eurovision Song Contest. This joke now needs to be updated. Or then it has just gotten quite chilly in Hades since last Saturday. As you may guess, the fundamental christians are having a collective heart attack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 Finnish weather explained -300°C / -508°F Hell freezes over. Finland wins the Eurovision Song Contest. This joke now needs to be updated. Or then it has just gotten quite chilly in Hades since last Saturday. Yup, it did. You can tell the musicians just came from there. So, Ex, you came out from WoF movement too? You had affiliation with Livets ord too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exhihhuli Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 So, Ex, you came out from WoF movement too? You had affiliation with Livets ord too? Sure Han, name it and claim it. That's some twisted theology (in practise. In theory it's quite sound fundamentalism)! I was in churches that had quite active co-operation with Livets Ord (though not in the one in Turku/Åbo that is most tightly linked), and have listened and read Ulf Ekman countless times. I never actually got to visit Uppsala, which I regretted then, though not now anymore. But after the "Toronto Blessing" in '95 the LO influence lessened. How about you, how tightly were you linked with it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 How about you, how tightly were you linked with it? I had very strong connections to it. My family personally knew several teachers when it started. One of my brothers went to the bible school the first year it started. I went there 86/87, my wife two years later. (I met Ulf personally once or twice, but never were any close person to his family) We were members there until 96, when we moved to US. (We had a visit from Aaron Ekman) I worked in Sunday school, meeting prayer groups, workship leader in our cell group, and I also was teaching computer tech in their school (gymnasium). I helped as usher during several conferences. Went on a mission trip... I also worked on the software and IT stuff for the congregation and school... etc. So yes, I was very involved. I probably could keep on listing stuff the rest of the day. I was hard core, out in the city evangelizing and knocking doors. And now I'm here. What a ironic twist to life! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exhihhuli Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 So yes, I was very involved. I probably could keep on listing stuff the rest of the day. I was hard core, out in the city evangelizing and knocking doors. And now I'm here. What a ironic twist to life! Wow. Considering the work I have had to do (and am still doing) to get the twists caused by growing up with that teaching out of my head, all I can say is: Great that you're here and good recovery! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 5 years ago, I would never have thought I'd become what I am today. I had made my decision to always "love Jesus"... the one that got most chocked is probably me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted May 25, 2006 Author Share Posted May 25, 2006 Thanks, exhihhuli!! It's nice to hear from a real Finn. I want to read the Kalevala because I think it will be interesting, and it has historical and literary value (although I wish I could read Finnish). I do not plan on believing in the worldview presented... I am a pretty strong agnostic. However, one thing I have read this far that I find cute and interesting, is that birds were highly revered in the endigenous religions of Finland. Maybe that explains my love of parrots. Maybe not. But it's a cool thought.... if there is such thing as "racial memory," perhaps there's something to it (but I doubt it). There are some on here who left Christianity only to fully subscribe to another belief system, like Asatru. I don't want to offend those people, so I tried to say what I was going a little less um... forcefully. I totally respect what they did, and I even want to hear them describe what it was like for them. but they haven't yet shown up on my thread to tell me. It's so hard to connect to other Finns in Indianapolis.... there aren't any organizations. I almost went to summer institute thingie in Helsinki several years ago, but that fell through because I had to work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kastor Posted May 31, 2006 Share Posted May 31, 2006 Here's one Finn more. I don't write much, just check topics mostly. Can't say I know Kalevala too well either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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