2PhiloVoid Posted April 8, 2015 Share Posted April 8, 2015 Yes, as I reflect over the past quarter century of my attempt to walk the talk, I do blame myself for some of the lack of success I've experienced in my Christian life. At various times, I've been a double-minded sinner. Moreover, I made a rash vow early on in my Christian life that I neglected to fulfill. Need I say more? The sooner you leave Christianity the sooner you can start healing from what it has done to you. And my response to you is....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted April 8, 2015 Share Posted April 8, 2015 Yes, as I reflect over the past quarter century of my attempt to walk the talk, I do blame myself for some of the lack of success I've experienced in my Christian life. At various times, I've been a double-minded sinner. Moreover, I made a rash vow early on in my Christian life that I neglected to fulfill. Need I say more? The sooner you leave Christianity the sooner you can start healing from what it has done to you. I understand. I was scared to death for over 30 years. However when the day comes when you can't hold onto the delusion anymore it feels natural. It doesn't feel like you quit a religion. Instead it feels like you learned something. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StJeffTheIncomprehensible Posted April 8, 2015 Share Posted April 8, 2015 You're welcome for the previous course of banter. I enjoyed it, along with the black-eyes that attended the banter. You may be right about your second point, Jeff. If the Biblical record is correct, it seems God has always had a terrible time dealing with his "minions," what with their being stiff-necked and all. From what I hear, He's got another reboot in the making, even as we speak... (I'm trying to decide which is the most appropriate smiley for my comment. I'm thinking, either: or . You decide.) 2PhiloVoid Philo, that's a big IF. The biblical record also indicates that the reboot would be "soon," before "this generation" passes away. But anyway . . . I think you should use this smiley: . He looks like he's doing some Rapture Practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdelsolray Posted April 8, 2015 Share Posted April 8, 2015 Calvinist wannabe. If you look close, you won't find a full grown T.U.L.I.P. in my garden. Hence the "wannabe" designation. The battle between your frontal cortex and your limbic system continues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2PhiloVoid Posted April 8, 2015 Share Posted April 8, 2015 You're welcome for the previous course of banter. I enjoyed it, along with the black-eyes that attended the banter. You may be right about your second point, Jeff. If the Biblical record is correct, it seems God has always had a terrible time dealing with his "minions," what with their being stiff-necked and all. From what I hear, He's got another reboot in the making, even as we speak... (I'm trying to decide which is the most appropriate smiley for my comment. I'm thinking, either: or . You decide.) 2PhiloVoid Philo, that's a big IF. The biblical record also indicates that the reboot would be "soon," before "this generation" passes away. But anyway . . . I think you should use this smiley: . He looks like he's doing some Rapture Practice. I'm glad I never, ever subscribed to Rapture Think. And I'm glad I didn't, because this looks exhausting.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 I'm glad I never, ever subscribed to Rapture Think. I wish I could say the same. And I'm glad I didn't, because this looks exhausting.... Mostly it generated anxiety and waste. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duderonomy Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 Philo, you seem to be saying that God has left the church with no power, for no good reason, and then He blames the church for having no power. Sure sounds like the God I believed in, and back in my Christian days I did what you are doing Philo...I blamed myself for not being good enough ("of course, it's not your fault that we Christians aren't towing God's line; it is ours") It was easier at the time than admitting that it was all bovine excrement. Hiya Dude, As I mentioned before about when dealing with a written text, there is what we think an author has said, and what that author actually intended to say... In this case, it's my writing we're talking about, and I haven't intended to imply that God has left the church without power. In fact, as I was focusing on the verses you cited from James, I was merely attempting to explicate what James meant and not get into a full exposition as to the application his verses may or may not have for us today. But, since you're bringing us into the issue at a personal level....... Yes, as I reflect over the past quarter century of my attempt to walk the talk, I do blame myself for some of the lack of success I've experienced in my Christian life. At various times, I've been a double-minded sinner. Moreover, I made a rash vow early on in my Christian life that I neglected to fulfill. Need I say more? 2PhiloVoid Well Philo, you don't need to say more, but now I'm curious. What was this rash vow, and do you feel that your God has something against you because you failed to fulfill it? The same chapter of James that promises healing also promises forgiveness of sins if any have been committed. Is it the fault of the sinful sick then that these promises are unfulfilled, or is it that God has left himself without a super-believer qualified to pray? If you don't want to use the book of James any longer, we can use any of the other promises Biblegod made to answer the prayers of the saints and heal them and forgive them. Christians are supposed to do stuff, and God is supposed to do stuff. God said what Christians should do and what he would do. I see Christians doing the stuff they are supposed to do all the time but I never see God do any stuff he is supposed to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2PhiloVoid Posted April 14, 2015 Share Posted April 14, 2015 Philo, you seem to be saying that God has left the church with no power, for no good reason, and then He blames the church for having no power. Sure sounds like the God I believed in, and back in my Christian days I did what you are doing Philo...I blamed myself for not being good enough ("of course, it's not your fault that we Christians aren't towing God's line; it is ours") It was easier at the time than admitting that it was all bovine excrement. Hiya Dude, As I mentioned before about when dealing with a written text, there is what we think an author has said, and what that author actually intended to say... In this case, it's my writing we're talking about, and I haven't intended to imply that God has left the church without power. In fact, as I was focusing on the verses you cited from James, I was merely attempting to explicate what James meant and not get into a full exposition as to the application his verses may or may not have for us today. But, since you're bringing us into the issue at a personal level....... Yes, as I reflect over the past quarter century of my attempt to walk the talk, I do blame myself for some of the lack of success I've experienced in my Christian life. At various times, I've been a double-minded sinner. Moreover, I made a rash vow early on in my Christian life that I neglected to fulfill. Need I say more? 2PhiloVoid Well Philo, you don't need to say more, but now I'm curious. What was this rash vow, and do you feel that your God has something against you because you failed to fulfill it? What was my rash vow? Oh....the usual one. Yes, I think that God "had something against me" for a while, but like many of you, my thinking went through some permutations over time. Hopefully, I ended up with the right interpretation. Maybe. Maybe? The same chapter of James that promises healing also promises forgiveness of sins if any have been committed. Is it the fault of the sinful sick then that these promises are unfulfilled, or is it that God has left himself without a super-believer qualified to pray? Good question, Dude! I don't think I've ever met someone who qualifies as being a "super-believer." Then again, I'm not sure what a "super-believer" would look like these days, and even if we follow James in citing Elijah as an example of a "super-believer," we'll end up with some alien notion that doesn't look ....very American. If you don't want to use the book of James any longer, we can use any of the other promises Biblegod made to answer the prayers of the saints and heal them and forgive them. ...which text do you have in mind? Christians are supposed to do stuff, and God is supposed to do stuff. God said what Christians should do and what he would do. I see Christians doing the stuff they are supposed to do all the time but I never see God do any stuff he is supposed to do. You see Christians doing the stuff they're supposed to do!? Dang, you must live in an awesome community! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duderonomy Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 You just don't know for sure, do you Philo. Don't worry, heathens like us can't be right, can we be? You much funny, Philo-san. You choose the text where God promises to heal and forgive His people, and explain how it doesn't come true because the people don't have three PHD's, and if they did, they wouldn't be all angry at Him and everything, because they could explain it away while still believing it and still explain away explaining away. Can you do that much, Philo? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2PhiloVoid Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 You just don't know for sure, do you Philo. Don't worry, heathens like us can't be right, can we be? You much funny, Philo-san. You choose the text where God promises to heal and forgive His people, and explain how it doesn't come true because the people don't have three PHD's, and if they did, they wouldn't be all angry at Him and everything, because they could explain it away while still believing it and still explain away explaining away. Can you do that much, Philo? Hi Dude, Oh, you could be right, although I don't think that "being a heathen" (as you say, not as I would say) necessarily makes you an unbeliever. As far as my "knowing" is concerned. Well.....ya got me there, Dude!. I don't 'know' that there is a God, but then, see, it will depend on what we specifically mean by the term 'knowledge.' This may sound like obfuscation, but as you study philosophy, it will become apparent as to why I say this, and you won't need a PhD (or three) to understand this stuff. Just an open mind that wants to learn. (You already have the knack for being philosophical. Why not just plunge into philosophy feet first, Dude?) No, I won't choose any texts to demonstrate "healing and forgiveness." You've already done the Lion's share by citing James chapter 5, and.... remember, I already expressed that I am a Quasi-Cessationist. But, if you want to find texts that focus on forgiveness, I'll be more than happy to oblige you. By the way, could you explain to me what "explain it away" means to you? Peace 2PhiloVoid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duderonomy Posted April 19, 2015 Share Posted April 19, 2015 Philo, have you seen Colossians 2:8 in the Bible (NIV, I think)? "See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the elemental spiritual forces of this world rather than on Christ." You think I should jump feet first into philosophy? You little devil, you! You don't 'know' that there is a God, but that depends on what we mean by the term 'knowledge'? First it depends on what the meaning of "is" is, right? Yawn. I've heard cops on the radio say "subjects name is Hubarrstinskiemabalderdashbaloneywtf; common spelling". I mean, it's not that complicated, you know? Of course, the dispatcher is going to ask for the cop to be more clear, and the cop is going to have to spell it out letter by letter. One would think that at least an all knowing (whatever that means!) God could do the same in the first place, if that God really wanted us to know him. Like Paul said, "that we may know him..." But what do I know, you know? Texts on forgiveness? Sure, let's do it. You must already know that I'm going to point out that the forgiveness you mean and the promises of healing all come from the same book. If the one is spotty at best, quasi-sensationalist (I remember the post), maybe the other one is too. It's the Word of God. It's true or it isn't. It works or it doesn't. If you try to explain what it says by telling me everything it says doesn't really mean what it says, you are explaining it away. Choose a bajillion other reasons and excuses to explain why Biblegod says "I'm going to to do thus and so" and doesn't do it. That's what explaining it away means to me. By the way, we can know God by his fruits. All knowing, all powerful, loves us, gives us this shit. Do you worship him and his forgiveness Philo? How very superstitious of you if you do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2PhiloVoid Posted April 19, 2015 Share Posted April 19, 2015 Philo, have you seen Colossians 2:8 in the Bible (NIV, I think)? "See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the elemental spiritual forces of this world rather than on Christ." You think I should jump feet first into philosophy? You little devil, you! You don't 'know' that there is a God, but that depends on what we mean by the term 'knowledge'? First it depends on what the meaning of "is" is, right? Yawn. I've heard cops on the radio say "subjects name is Hubarrstinskiemabalderdashbaloneywtf; common spelling". I mean, it's not that complicated, you know? Of course, the dispatcher is going to ask for the cop to be more clear, and the cop is going to have to spell it out letter by letter. One would think that at least an all knowing (whatever that means!) God could do the same in the first place, if that God really wanted us to know him. Like Paul said, "that we may know him..." But what do I know, you know? Texts on forgiveness? Sure, let's do it. You must already know that I'm going to point out that the forgiveness you mean and the promises of healing all come from the same book. If the one is spotty at best, quasi-sensationalist (I remember the post), maybe the other one is too. It's the Word of God. It's true or it isn't. It works or it doesn't. If you try to explain what it says by telling me everything it says doesn't really mean what it says, you are explaining it away. Choose a bajillion other reasons and excuses to explain why Biblegod says "I'm going to to do thus and so" and doesn't do it. That's what explaining it away means to me. By the way, we can know God by his fruits. All knowing, all powerful, loves us, gives us this shit. Do you worship him and his forgiveness Philo? How very superstitious of you if you do. "I mean, it's not that complicated, you know? " Ok. Dude, I think I see where you and I are differing-----I actually do think that all of life is complicated, complex, and convoluted....every bit of it. You don't. I see that we probably can't have a discussion about much of anything, let alone about religion. Mainly because we each start with a completely different praxis from the other person. Which, from a practical standpoint is fine, it is simply human. You have your approach, and I have mine. Yes, you're right. It does seem ironic that I, a Christian, would suggest to you to take up philosophy. Based on the passage you've cited from Colossians, I can see how that seems almost contradictory. The truth is, I earned a philosophy degree because I felt that it would enable me to understand better the very passage that you cited from Colossians; and that was my own subjective, personal way of approaching the complexity I already faced with issues of the mind, society, politics, metaphysics, epistemology, axiology, and even faith. If this kind of think doesn't resonate with you, I understand. That's probably normal; I'm not so sure that my approach and thinking is a typical or 'normal' way of assessing life, but it's my style, nevertheless, and I can't expect anyone else to follow suite. I think we should end here. It isn't just Christianity that we would get stymied with in any of our attempts at further discussion. Thank you, Dude, for taking the time to chat with me at various times these past several weeks. From that exchange, I can see that you're an intelligent guy, stubborn maybe, but intelligent, and I respect that. Best wishes to you, Dude. Peace 2PhiloVoid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duderonomy Posted April 19, 2015 Share Posted April 19, 2015 Philo, thank you too for the discussions. It was fun. I hope my stuff made you think as much as your stuff made me think. If you are leaving the site (as I saw in another thread), you should know that as far as I'm concerned you are welcome to come back anytime. Peace out and I hope you always find happiness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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