Perhaps An Introduction Is Needed From An "extreme Leftist" Idealogists

[jensjam]

In my NASA post some accused me of being under the influence of extreme liberal ideas. and in another post that I may be overly concerned about the line seperating church and state is disappearing.

 

 

I am 30 + years old and was raised a Maronite catholic in a deeply democratic union supporting home!

 

My "De-catholiczing",if you would, is probably best left to that part of the board which deals with such issues but I will say my questioning of the bible and dogmatic beliefs of the church help mold to who I am today.

 

I will also say I was raped in my young life which has made me a fighter I am today AS WELL as almost dying early last year. I also have friends who live all over this world and I read and question a lot.

 

So yes I am a liberal who doesn't truly believes that the U.S. way of life is the BE ALL END ALL to this world. YES we have a lot of great things in our country and about this country BUT we are far from being perfect AND we are falling behind the rest of western societies in this world.

 

Examples:

 

In child infant mortality (2011 stats) we ranked 34th in the world.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_infant_mortality_rate

 

In a 2009 study American students ranked 25th out of 34 countries

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/11/state-education-rankings-_n_894528.html

 

Iife expectency rate the U.S. ranks 38th in the world--NOW this is a country in which the best doctors and medicine comes from as well as the "Latest breakthroughs" and we rank that low AND what is scarier is that U.S. Virgin Islands (21) and Puerto Rico (31) Ranked higher than the U.S.of A.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_life_expectancy

 

So facts like these help mold and shape my Ideology and view of the country and world.

 

I am a constitutionalist in most regards! YES, slavery was wrong the founding father's should have put an end to it from the get go BUT The Founding Fathers created the constitution as the smartest thinking of their time AND what people seem forget is that the Fathers believed Smarter generations would make this document better.

 

I remember that the Country was founded by those seeking religious freedom from countries that wanted to force a certain religion down another's throat. I am a deist when it comes to certain reguards to religion. IF it is your spiritual belief that on every leap year you walk out to a feild and dance semi- naked to footloose to fulfill your spirtual belief I WILL DEFEND YOUR RIGHT TO DO IT! I WILL ALSO RESPECT YOUR RIGHT AND YOUR VIEWS HOWEVER YOU START DEMANDING I DO THE SAME OR I"M NOT A GOOD AMERICAN THAN I WILL STAND UP AGAINST YOU! The wiccan belief of "Harm none do as ye will" is one of the philophies I live by.

 

I am extremely concern how one politicial party has basically wrapped themselves in some version of chrisitanity and has influence this country so that the seperation of Church and state is disappearing.

 

Look at politicians like Palin, Bachmann, Santorum etc. Look in the past year and a half throughout states that have limit my right to choose.

 

Just google recent bills from Virginia, PA, Arizona, Michigan We even have states like Mississippi, Alabama and South Carolina who are basically making miscarriage criminal offense

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/jun/24/america-pregnant-women-murder-charges

 

(end of part one)

[Guest Valk0010]

You get accused of liberal bias here, for alot of the same reason people like me do. You just think unconventionally. Don't worry about it.

[jensjam]

(part 2)

 

 

I believe in paying TAXES. I believe that if someday I am blessed/lucky enough to get extremely rich that it is THAN my duty to pay higher taxes to benefit those who do not have. I would hope I do not become so rude as to hide money in bank accounts.

 

I believe we need teachers and firefighters and police-who are better trained to weed out those who like to use "Power". I don't believe in the in the idea that only those who can afford it should be educated. I believe our education should be the best in the world AND HIGHER LEARNING SHOULD BE FREE TO EVERYONE!

 

 

I believe in a living wage and that yes, if you have made a success of your life you should be rewarded with money BUT to make sure poor get worse off while you get as much money as possible is wrong! I believe in the 99% and I believe for all the good Free market has done i.e computers, some medicine, cars, etc Free market has also become a evil that is destroying this country look at the Citizens United ruling! look at Bush v Gore ruling!

 

Look how we have two political parties that take money from Wall street and ignore the little guy. Yes, Democrats claim they are for "The average guy/gal" BUT money talks!

 

So I am very concern how corporations seem to get more powerful, more influence, and more countrol of this country.

 

So this is who I am and if I am a "nutcase" in your mind so be it have a good life and see you around but this is who I am and I won't back down or say I am sorry.

[jensjam]

You get accused of liberal bias here, for alot of the same reason people like me do. You just think unconventionally. Don't worry about it.

 

I won't. I just felt it needed to be said.

 

I will say I am sorry that my Grammar and spelling aren't he greatest. I try I will say I do have a learning disablity BUT I did get a BA in Travel and Tourism.

[ConureDelSol]

Actually, most of the people on this site think like you do. There are only a few here that will bash leftists (Legion, BurnedOut, Payne...) and they're not even conservative republicans. They're libertarians or in some cases, independents with conservative leanings.

 

Me? Voted Obama, probably going to vote Obama again. Social liberal and I have no idea what I am fiscally because, frankly, I don't know a thing about how the economy works.

[Guest Valk0010]

You get accused of liberal bias here, for alot of the same reason people like me do. You just think unconventionally. Don't worry about it.

 

I won't. I just felt it needed to be said.

 

I will say I am sorry that my Grammar and spelling aren't he greatest. I try I will say I do have a learning disablity BUT I did get a BA in Travel and Tourism.

My grammer sucks, and my spelling is okay, so don't worry about that.

[3DollarBill]

In my NASA post some accused me of being under the influence of extreme liberal ideas. and in another post that I may be overly concerned about the line seperating church and state is disappearing.

No, no...you don't get to claim both of those under your "leftist" umbrella. I disagree wholeheartedly with your stance on the nasa issue and even with the very thought process behind it, and I would pursue the exact opposite policy you would. But I too am extremely concerned about the growing integration of religion and politics.

 

 

!

I believe for all the good Free market has done i.e computers, some medicine, cars, etc Free market has also become a evil that is destroying this country look at the Citizens United ruling! look at Bush v Gore ruling!

And what, pray tell, do either court rulings have to do with free market capitalism? Frankly, I don't think you understand what that means.

[jensjam]

In my NASA post some accused me of being under the influence of extreme liberal ideas. and in another post that I may be overly concerned about the line seperating church and state is disappearing.

No, no...you don't get to claim both of those under your "leftist" umbrella. I disagree wholeheartedly with your stance on the nasa issue and even with the very thought process behind it, and I would pursue the exact opposite policy you would. But I too am extremely concerned about the growing integration of religion and politics.

 

I don't claim those view points under a "leftist umbrella" I came to my views being a leftist!

 

 

!

I believe for all the good Free market has done i.e computers, some medicine, cars, etc Free market has also become a evil that is destroying this country look at the Citizens United ruling! look at Bush v Gore ruling!

And what, pray tell, do either court rulings have to do with free market capitalism? Frankly, I don't think you understand what that means.

 

I do know what Free Market Capitalism and I see destroying our election system! There is the idea of free markets which Canada and Western europe enjoys and we people get rich and successful WITHOUT crushing the middle class. Thanks to citizens united which made "money"=to "Free Speech" we are seeing this country fall apart and the working poor/middle class be crushed. We are seeing people struggling to put food on the table clothes on their back and buy medicine forget about having money to enjoy life-i.e. vacations, entertainment etc.

 

Look at how much people are willing to spend this election to win.

[Guest wester]

I believe for all the good Free market has done i.e computers (rape of The Congo),

 

some medicine (mutation of super viruses (there is no escape!), genetic engineering, GMOs, Mad Cow, ad infinitum) ,

 

cars (Global Waring - just be glad you're not being bit in the ass every effing day like the Marianas or Bangladesh),

____________________________________________________

The Free market sucks a$$. It's not free and it's not a market.

FYI 'Conservative' in America = "Don't bust my bubble", it has nothing to do with Edmund Burke or fiscal responsibility

[raoul]

I believe for all the good Free market has done i.e computers (rape of The Congo),

 

some medicine (mutation of super viruses (there is no escape!), genetic engineering, GMOs, Mad Cow, ad infinitum) ,

 

cars (Global Waring - just be glad you're not being bit in the ass every effing day like the Marianas or Bangladesh),

____________________________________________________

The Free market sucks a$$. It's not free and it's not a market.

FYI 'Conservative' in America = "Don't bust my bubble", it has nothing to do with Edmund Burke or fiscal responsibility

I am delighted to see someone else posit the same thing I've been screaming about for years regarding the American version of conservatism which has NOTHING to do with real conservatism as was proposed by Burke. The neocons in this country are a pathetic shell of what used to be real conservatism - the kind that Barry Goldwater and others expoused. The kind that would be appalled at the way the neocons sell out our country day after day.

[raoul]

In my NASA post some accused me of being under the influence of extreme liberal ideas. and in another post that I may be overly concerned about the line seperating church and state is disappearing.

No, no...you don't get to claim both of those under your "leftist" umbrella. I disagree wholeheartedly with your stance on the nasa issue and even with the very thought process behind it, and I would pursue the exact opposite policy you would. But I too am extremely concerned about the growing integration of religion and politics.

 

 

!

I believe for all the good Free market has done i.e computers, some medicine, cars, etc Free market has also become a evil that is destroying this country look at the Citizens United ruling! look at Bush v Gore ruling!

And what, pray tell, do either court rulings have to do with free market capitalism? Frankly, I don't think you understand what that means.

the citizens united ruling and other things mentioned have everything to do with the philosophy expoused by the darwinian free marketeers as I call them. Many rulings by the court have either a direct or indirect bearing on this failed economic system that is artifically propped up by courts, politicians, etc. If you can't see the nexus then I am not about to give you a history lesson regarding the decades old war waged against the middle class, unions, etc. in this country.

[raoul]

In my NASA post some accused me of being under the influence of extreme liberal ideas. and in another post that I may be overly concerned about the line seperating church and state is disappearing.

No, no...you don't get to claim both of those under your "leftist" umbrella. I disagree wholeheartedly with your stance on the nasa issue and even with the very thought process behind it, and I would pursue the exact opposite policy you would. But I too am extremely concerned about the growing integration of religion and politics.

 

I don't claim those view points under a "leftist umbrella" I came to my views being a leftist!

 

 

!

I believe for all the good Free market has done i.e computers, some medicine, cars, etc Free market has also become a evil that is destroying this country look at the Citizens United ruling! look at Bush v Gore ruling!

And what, pray tell, do either court rulings have to do with free market capitalism? Frankly, I don't think you understand what that means.

 

I do know what Free Market Capitalism and I see destroying our election system! There is the idea of free markets which Canada and Western europe enjoys and we people get rich and successful WITHOUT crushing the middle class. Thanks to citizens united which made "money"=to "Free Speech" we are seeing this country fall apart and the working poor/middle class be crushed. We are seeing people struggling to put food on the table clothes on their back and buy medicine forget about having money to enjoy life-i.e. vacations, entertainment etc.

 

Look at how much people are willing to spend this election to win.

You have to realize something assuming you haven't seen it yet. Just because people over here are ex xtians, it doesn't mean squat regarding their political leanings. A rabid and/or blind neocon is still a rabit and/or blind neocon regardless of theological/religious leanings.

[jensjam]

In my NASA post some accused me of being under the influence of extreme liberal ideas. and in another post that I may be overly concerned about the line seperating church and state is disappearing.

No, no...you don't get to claim both of those under your "leftist" umbrella. I disagree wholeheartedly with your stance on the nasa issue and even with the very thought process behind it, and I would pursue the exact opposite policy you would. But I too am extremely concerned about the growing integration of religion and politics.

 

I don't claim those view points under a "leftist umbrella" I came to my views being a leftist!

 

 

!

I believe for all the good Free market has done i.e computers, some medicine, cars, etc Free market has also become a evil that is destroying this country look at the Citizens United ruling! look at Bush v Gore ruling!

And what, pray tell, do either court rulings have to do with free market capitalism? Frankly, I don't think you understand what that means.

 

I do know what Free Market Capitalism and I see destroying our election system! There is the idea of free markets which Canada and Western europe enjoys and we people get rich and successful WITHOUT crushing the middle class. Thanks to citizens united which made "money"=to "Free Speech" we are seeing this country fall apart and the working poor/middle class be crushed. We are seeing people struggling to put food on the table clothes on their back and buy medicine forget about having money to enjoy life-i.e. vacations, entertainment etc.

 

Look at how much people are willing to spend this election to win.

You have to realize something assuming you haven't seen it yet. Just because people over here are ex xtians, it doesn't mean squat regarding their political leanings. A rabid and/or blind neocon is still a rabit and/or blind neocon regardless of theological/religious leanings.

 

That's true. I just thought... You know the old joke about assumeing you make an ASS out of U and ME. My bad for thinking one could have a diverse thought and be able to state it without all this.

[3DollarBill]

I do know what Free Market Capitalism and I see destroying our election system! There is the idea of free markets which Canada and Western europe enjoys and we people get rich and successful WITHOUT crushing the middle class. Thanks to citizens united which made "money"=to "Free Speech" we are seeing this country fall apart and the working poor/middle class be crushed. We are seeing people struggling to put food on the table clothes on their back and buy medicine forget about having money to enjoy life-i.e. vacations, entertainment etc.

 

Look at how much people are willing to spend this election to win.

 

Apparently you don't, else you wouldn't be whining about "free markets" and "citizens united" in the same sentence. One is an economic system (and also the natural state when you leave out the government) and one was poor judgment on the part of the Supreme Court.

 

I do understand how the issues become muddied though..."free markets" is often the talking point when somebody is trying to push any right wing agenda. Those people don't really know what it means either. An actual free market system is actually pretty tough on those corporations you so despise. The bailouts which occurred in the auto and banking industries were not market capitalism, that was socialism. Market capitalism would have allowed companies which are inefficient and incompetently run to die so that new people with new ideas could have a shot.

 

That's true. I just thought... You know the old joke about assumeing you make an ASS out of U and ME. My bad for thinking one could have a diverse thought and be able to state it without all this.

You come on here talking public policy, then lets do it. As you said in your intro, you're a fighter. So don't get all pissy when somebody wants to give you a run for your money.

[jackbauer]

I can no longer take anyone seriously when they start complaining about a "leftist" agenda. People who do usually end up on FSTDT.

[Ouroboros]

That's true. I just thought... You know the old joke about assumeing you make an ASS out of U and ME. My bad for thinking one could have a diverse thought and be able to state it without all this.

You come on here talking public policy, then lets do it. As you said in your intro, you're a fighter. So don't get all pissy when somebody wants to give you a run for your money.

So true.

 

Having the freedom to express an opinion includes the freedom of others to express their opinion too. There's no freedom of opinion if only one side is allowed to express them.

[raoul]

I do know what Free Market Capitalism and I see destroying our election system! There is the idea of free markets which Canada and Western europe enjoys and we people get rich and successful WITHOUT crushing the middle class. Thanks to citizens united which made "money"=to "Free Speech" we are seeing this country fall apart and the working poor/middle class be crushed. We are seeing people struggling to put food on the table clothes on their back and buy medicine forget about having money to enjoy life-i.e. vacations, entertainment etc.

 

Look at how much people are willing to spend this election to win.

 

Apparently you don't, else you wouldn't be whining about "free markets" and "citizens united" in the same sentence. One is an economic system (and also the natural state when you leave out the government) and one was poor judgment on the part of the Supreme Court.

 

I do understand how the issues become muddied though..."free markets" is often the talking point when somebody is trying to push any right wing agenda. Those people don't really know what it means either. An actual free market system is actually pretty tough on those corporations you so despise. The bailouts which occurred in the auto and banking industries were not market capitalism, that was socialism. Market capitalism would have allowed companies which are inefficient and incompetently run to die so that new people with new ideas could have a shot.

 

That's true. I just thought... You know the old joke about assumeing you make an ASS out of U and ME. My bad for thinking one could have a diverse thought and be able to state it without all this.

You come on here talking public policy, then lets do it. As you said in your intro, you're a fighter. So don't get all pissy when somebody wants to give you a run for your money.

A run for her money? Sorry but no cigar. Challenging a FACT is not giving anyone a run but shows something else which is the reason for the apathy in this country and a reason why corporatists get away with anything. She began by citing what should be obvious to everyone regarding the decline of our middle class. But she is immediately challenged about things that are staring all of us in the face. The fundy takeover of this country is not a dream, it is a freaking fact. Maybe you should read Chris Hedges' books about this. They will not be happy until we've become a Theocracy.

[raoul]

That's true. I just thought... You know the old joke about assumeing you make an ASS out of U and ME. My bad for thinking one could have a diverse thought and be able to state it without all this.

You come on here talking public policy, then lets do it. As you said in your intro, you're a fighter. So don't get all pissy when somebody wants to give you a run for your money.

So true.

 

Having the freedom to express an opinion includes the freedom of others to express their opinion too. There's no freedom of opinion if only one side is allowed to express them.

Yeah but I remember that line from Platoon - 'opinions are like assholes, everyone has one'... Yes, everyone can express whatever opinion he/she wants to say. However, treating ALL opinions as though they are equal in weight points to intellectual arrogance at its highest.

[qadeshet]

Some of us are Liberals and proud of it. Today even Nixon couldn't get elected. Too Liberal.

[Legion]

Jensjam, you're a tool. Like a shovel.

 

For you to call yourself a "liberal" is to sully the meaning of the word.

[raoul]

Jensjam, you're a tool. Like a shovel.

 

For you to call yourself a "liberal" is to sully the meaning of the word.

Care to define the term in order to educate us on what it means? I'm ALL eyes. LOL

[Guest Valk0010]

Jensjam, you're a tool. Like a shovel.

 

For you to call yourself a "liberal" is to sully the meaning of the word.

And you know your doing something right jensjam if you got legion mad at you over politics.

[Legion]

I'm not mad. I'm tired.

[Guest Valk0010]

I'm not mad. I'm tired.

You give new meaning to the word misanthrope. I say that caringly. Not every fucking person who says they are a liberal or voted for obama is your enemy. People are people.

[Legion]

For you to call yourself a "liberal" is to sully the meaning of the word.

Care to define the term in order to educate us on what it means? I'm ALL eyes. LOL

 

A liberal believes in individual freedom.

A liberal believes people are capable of handling the responsibilities of life.

 

That's a start I suppose.