Is Christianity inheritly abusive to children?

[TheRedneckProfessor]

Ms. Professor pointed out to me last night that the Khmer representations of the Buddha are not very well accepted by the Vietnamese, even in her part of Vietnam which hosts large populations of Khmer people.  It reinforced the truth that, whatever the religion, people create gods in their own image.  There is definitely, then, a correlation between abusive people and abusive gods.  But I think the question of causality might never be satisfactorily resolved.  Did the abuse transfer from the people to their god or vice versa?

 

I can say, from my own experience, that my mother is an abusive person; and that her religion only made her worse.  She is mentally unstable, often unhinged, emotionally stunted... add religion on top and she is a complete disaster as a person.  I can equally say that my father is one of the kindest people I've ever known; and that his religion has made him better.  He is extremely wise, compassionate, sincere, and dependable. 

 

Neither of them "spared the rod", though, when I was a kid.

[ag_NO_stic]

3 hours ago, TheRedneckProfessor said:

Ms. Professor pointed out to me last night that the Khmer representations of the Buddha are not very well accepted by the Vietnamese, even in her part of Vietnam which hosts large populations of Khmer people.  It reinforced the truth that, whatever the religion, people create gods in their own image.  There is definitely, then, a correlation between abusive people and abusive gods.  But I think the question of causality might never be satisfactorily resolved.  Did the abuse transfer from the people to their god or vice versa?

 

I can say, from my own experience, that my mother is an abusive person; and that her religion only made her worse.  She is mentally unstable, often unhinged, emotionally stunted... add religion on top and she is a complete disaster as a person.  I can equally say that my father is one of the kindest people I've ever known; and that his religion has made him better.  He is extremely wise, compassionate, sincere, and dependable. 

 

Neither of them "spared the rod", though, when I was a kid.

 

You just illustrated what I was trying to say so much better than me lol, thank you.  

 

In the interest of intellectual integrity oh shit are there any English majors in here? Was that normal alliteration or is there a word for TWO letters?! Wow total nerd moment, I did not do that on purpose and don't have the heart to delete it.), I know SO MANY Christians who are kind, compassionate, genuine people and who do not focus on the same aspects of Christianity that the abusive ones do. A lot of Christians I know have this sort of, "Yeah I mess up sometimes, that's what Jesus is for, and I sing to him on Sundays" and they are good people. 

 

So, @Joshpantera, do you believe it's the sincerity with which people take it literally that Christianity becomes the problem? One could argue that the message of "loving others" paired with the commandments on which the US were founded has caused more good than harm overall right? Is this even measurable, can we even know?

[◊ Weezer ◊]

5 hours ago, ag_NO_stic said:

 

Out of curiosity, does anyone know Christians like this who aren't well off? I've seen it so correlated with money and image that it seems causative.

 

"Well off" is a relative term, but off the top of my head I haven't noticed a difference.

 

5 hours ago, Joshpantera said:

 

I think it can be argued that it's christianity itself behind mentally abusive beliefs. 

 

I was going to argue that abuse and control FAR predate Christianity (and other religions) and the writers simply used the ages old mechanisms  to their advantage. They didn't "invent" it.  Remember that humans created religion.

 

Another observation about the influences that effect people as they grow up.  I have seen hundreds of cases where people attended cult like churches, and I argue that influential family members have the greatest effect on children.   Children who attend these churches, but have at least one adult family member who is half way rational, usually come out of the situation okay.  It is the children of totally brainwashed and irrational adults, with no rational example to follow, that suffer the most.  In other words, the family carries the biggest influence.  The church is a tool used to perpetuate the problem.  

Edit:

I feel sorry for children who live in isolation from regular society, and are home schooled.  Several decades ago I attended a workshop on the moral development of mankind, and remembered a comment the researcher made.  He said that children need at least one positive role model in life, even if it is someone in extended family, or a teacher at school, that has paid attention to them, accepted them for who they were, and encouraged them.  They will likely have struggles in life, but are the ones who seem to have the ability to pull through.  And that has been my observation.  The lesson here.   Be kind to children.

[LeiaBryant]

6 hours ago, Joshpantera said:

 

I noticed this growing up. The basic fact that our religious leaders now had reverted back to many of the very things jesus was railing against the religious leaders in the stories. The blind leading the blind further along into darkness and all of it. Of course I was often disciplined for speaking out and accusing them of such things. That's just made me all the more angry, though. And continued to solidify my growing anti-theistic views. I was pretty mad about it for the first few decades after leaving. Then eventually toned down, somewhat....

That's one of the reasons instead of anti-theistic views I started searching for spirituality. I want to find a faith like what Christianity was at the beginning before it was corrupted

[◊ DestinyTurtle ◊]

1 hour ago, Weezer said:

Several decades ago I attended a workshop on the moral development of mankind, and remembered a comment the researcher made.  He said that children need at least one positive role model in life, even if it is someone in extended family, or a teacher at school, that has paid attention to them, accepted them for who they were, and encouraged them. 

I think I had some good teachers that were great role models for me. Maybe that's part of the reason I prevailed despite everything. So grateful for them!

[ag_NO_stic]

7 minutes ago, LeiaBryant said:

That's one of the reasons instead of anti-theistic views I started searching for spirituality. I want to find a faith like what Christianity was at the beginning before it was corrupted

 

It's intellectually honest to acknowledge the human capacity for spirituality AND the phenomena that cannot be measured with the empirical senses. I find it fascinating that people seem to have these "spiritual experiences" with other people. The brain lights up similarly at church or at a football game.

[Joshpantera]

On 3/23/2020 at 3:29 PM, ag_NO_stic said:

So, @Joshpantera, do you believe it's the sincerity with which people take it literally that Christianity becomes the problem? One could argue that the message of "loving others" paired with the commandments on which the US were founded has caused more good than harm overall right? Is this even measurable, can we even know?

 

The writings read a certain way. The love issues are always accompanied with bi-polar jerks the other way. You read the bible and you're hearing love one another. But then anyone who disagrees with the writers is railed against and threatened by the writers. The bits about love don't wash out all of the hate speech and vise versa. Contradictory content exists. The writers appear to have bipolar type episodes depending on their moods. And of course one writer will contradict themselves and then go further and contradict other writers.  

 

So then various personalities read or hear the bible read. 

 

The narcissistic people tend to gravitate towards the narcissism. That more often than not includes literal readings in fundamentalist settings. I don't see as many liberals focused on the hate. Their focus often tends to turn a blind eye to the hate speech and pick through the love speech. Just as a general observation, for instance, we kept the 7th day sabbath as per a literal reading. The argument was that Sunday worship is catholic tradition, not scripture sanctioned. And so kids were beaten for things like breaking the 4th commandment because narcissistic personalities who read the bible literally used that interpretation to beat and discipline kids. 

[DarkLordPhil]

Just my experience: I tried some more liberal churches when I was still trying to make Christianity work. The ministers tended to approach the Bible stories more as folklore or mythology, so not nearly as much literalism. But there was still an us-vs-them mentality, with "us" being liberal Christians who supported liberal causes and accepted those of other religions, and "them" being the conservative fundamentalists and evangelicals. If you were with "us," you were a good Christian following in Jesus' footsteps; if you let yourself consider "their" perspective too seriously, you were in danger of becoming one of "them." So I don't think the mentality of "with us or against us" is restricted to just one political persuasion. 

 

PS: Not trying to make any kind of political statement. Just sharing what I've noticed. 

[Guest freedwoman]

Yes!!!

Poor children. So many parents don't deserve children.

[Wertbag]

It seems there are different responses to having been abused. Some people get angry at the world and their lack of control, so lash out and become bullies and abusers in turn. Others flee from the harm, becoming scared of the world and cutting themselves off. The most inspiring ones are those who recognise the harm done and say they want to stop anyone from having to experience what they did. Those people make great parents, wanting to pass on feelings of love and safety to their kids.