bornagainathiest Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 6 hours ago, bornagainathiest said: I gotta run now Jon, but I'll be back later. Please remember, these are you own questions that I've asked you to answer. If they aren't logical or rational, then you can't use logic to answer them. And if they aren't logical or rational, then you can't expect us to use logic to answer them, either. See you later. BAA. Jon, I'm going to assume that you're now focused on your debate with LB. So, our dialog is on hold, awaiting such time as you want to restart it. Thanks, BAA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midniterider Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 22 hours ago, Garry said: Animals seem to think and recall and I'm confident they do not have souls. I agree animals think. I don't know if they have souls or not. If I were confident that animals do have souls, should we flip a coin to determine the winner? Jon says that instinct is only the appearance of thought. Whether it is or isn't, my guess is that instinct is still a form of thought that uses brain power. Is religious belief an instinct? Being a Christian did not seem to require my use of higher cognitive skills. So Jon, could you ask Jesus to defend himself? Make his presence known to us? Or is Jesus merely your additional sub-personality? He supposedly showed himself to the 500 , back in the day. He could show himself to us..today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Moderator florduh Posted April 11, 2017 Super Moderator Share Posted April 11, 2017 I don't know if anything has a "soul" as it is commonly defined, but if you doubt that animals can think and reason just watch a squirrel outwit a cleverly booby trapped bird feeder. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castiel233 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 10 hours ago, Jon said: have you never heard of instinct? Animals will appear to think,but its instinct. The bible tells us we are the HEAD not the tail.The tail is the wagging bit,moved on emotion and animal instinct,but we are the HEAD (mind)-soul.......We think have choices etc God bestows great honor and responsibility on us humans,becauce we DO possess a soul,and indeed we do think?? You state that God bestows great honour, that we do have a soul. You make a statement as a fact, when it isn't one. Is there a God, is there a soul, I do not know, nor do I pretend to know, no one knows, but I do think that such things are articles of faith, not fact. The Bible says lots of things, some very lovely things, some very nasty things. Perhaps the vast vast majority of people who believe in Jesus quote Him when it suits them and ignore Him when it doesn't suit. Jesus say to give all that you have if it is asked of you, I assume this is a challenge you are not willing to meet. I say these things not to be unkind, or uncharitable, but you have a belief system that is not based on facts. The Bible has been shown to be false on so many matters one wonders where to begin. A google search, simple and quick will soon point you out to the horrors of the Christian faith. Quoting the Bible to prove your points on Christian dogma or thought is considered circular reasoning and will generally get you short shrift on here. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midniterider Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 On 4/9/2017 at 4:46 PM, Astreja said: Jon, our thoughts are completely dependent on our brains. If something happens to that brain, thoughts simply cease. There is no evidence that thoughts can exist apart from the brain, which is dependent on the body for its survival. Has science detected everything ? Can science detect everything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
disillusioned Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 11 hours ago, Jon said: You twist what i say. Do you get thoughts contrary to you? Are all thoughts your own? if so prove it? The bible says Gos is spirit,we have an enemy-your right again professor its satan Yes, my thoughts are my own. It seems to me that the assertion that they are not is the weightier claim, and hence the burden of proof lies with you. Also, how did I twist what you said? I quoted you. One of the posts that I quoted was not clearly worded, but I hardly think that I'm to blame for that... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator LogicalFallacy Posted April 11, 2017 Moderator Share Posted April 11, 2017 11 hours ago, Jon said: Also why have chimps stopped evolving? *Face palm, buries head in toilet, smashes cistern, has a good cry* @Jon This is why education and knowing your subject is important. Nothing 'stops' evolving. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Moderator florduh Posted April 12, 2017 Super Moderator Share Posted April 12, 2017 Quote Nothing 'stops' evolving. Are you sure? Nothing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Moderator TheRedneckProfessor Posted April 12, 2017 Super Moderator Share Posted April 12, 2017 Take note of #3: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/evolution/library/faq/cat05.html 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astreja Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 17 hours ago, midniterider said: Has science detected everything ? Can science detect everything? "Probably not," on both counts. It's still the best thing we've got for making sense of reality, 'tho. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator LogicalFallacy Posted April 12, 2017 Moderator Share Posted April 12, 2017 22 hours ago, florduh said: Are you sure? Nothing? In reference to the subject matter of animals, yes nothing. However, it is possible certain individuals within species devolve? This can be evidenced by looking at certain posts and reading youtube comments, and reading the letter in the paper claiming God is simultaneously saving us from drought, while punishing the country with a flood. (Seriously, in 2017, the same kind of thinking as ancient man - attributing natural events to some supernatural power) Yep, some things do stop evolving 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdelsolray Posted April 13, 2017 Share Posted April 13, 2017 3 hours ago, LogicalFallacy said: In reference to the subject matter of animals, yes nothing. However, it is possible certain individuals within species devolve? This can be evidenced by looking at certain posts and reading youtube comments, and reading the letter in the paper claiming God is simultaneously saving us from drought, while punishing the country with a flood. (Seriously, in 2017, the same kind of thinking as ancient man - attributing natural events to some supernatural power) Yep, some things do stop evolving Two thoughts: 1) Current biological evolutionary theory focuses on population genetics, not the genetics of individual organisms, So, although one or more individuals of a given population have genes which, when compared to the population overall, may have a smaller or higher chance of being replicated in the population, it is the change in different genes (i.e., allele frequency) in the population that counts. 2) A word that rhymes with "gene" is "meme". Much of what you are referring to involves memes and not genes. Current mememic theory deals with the replication and evolution of memes instead of genes. A meme is a cultural element that is passed by individuals or societal populations to individuals by methods other than genetic inheritance. There are many parallels between genes and memes. As to ceasing to evolve, I would think species that become extinct cease to evolve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
disillusioned Posted April 13, 2017 Share Posted April 13, 2017 7 hours ago, sdelsolray said: Two thoughts: Beware of satanic forces from the spirit realm! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted April 13, 2017 Author Share Posted April 13, 2017 dissilisioned , great comment,yes we wrestle not against flesh and blood........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator LogicalFallacy Posted April 13, 2017 Moderator Share Posted April 13, 2017 32 minutes ago, Jon said: dissilisioned , great comment,yes we wrestle not against flesh and blood........... *Face palm* Disillusioned you may need to explain your post to Jon. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travi Posted April 13, 2017 Share Posted April 13, 2017 1 hour ago, Jon said: dissilisioned , great comment,yes we wrestle not against flesh and blood........... Nnnnnnnrooooooammmmmm! *makes wooshing movement over his head* Have we found a match for ironhorse? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroTom Posted April 13, 2017 Share Posted April 13, 2017 4 hours ago, Jon said: dissilisioned , great comment,yes we wrestle not against flesh and blood........... Couldn't you at least have spelled his name right? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midniterider Posted April 13, 2017 Share Posted April 13, 2017 5 hours ago, Jon said: dissilisioned , great comment,yes we wrestle not against flesh and blood........... Before Christianity, I did not wrestle against Satan. During Christianity, I was told I needed to wrestle against Satan. After leaving Christianity, I did not wrestle against Satan. From this I deduce that Jesus isn't very helpful. Jesus ought to wrestle against Satan instead of me, eh? I also noticed that life was the same before , during and after my stint with Jesus. Man's greatest trick: To get you to believe that some imaginary being loves you and does stuff for you. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Moderator florduh Posted April 13, 2017 Super Moderator Share Posted April 13, 2017 Thoughts. Obviously some of them aren't worth having. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bornagainathiest Posted April 13, 2017 Share Posted April 13, 2017 Don't think! Just believe! That's what the Bible says. Proverbs 3 : 5. Trust in the Lord with all your heart, And lean not on your own understanding; 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
disillusioned Posted April 13, 2017 Share Posted April 13, 2017 10 hours ago, Jon said: dissilisioned , great comment,yes we wrestle not against flesh and blood........... 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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