Denyoz Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 If the essence of my being is consciousness, how is it possible to lose consciousness (faint)? Where does my "soul" go while I'm unconscious? Even people who have near death experiences become aware of something while dead, they don't lose consciousness. So how can something as trivial as fainting make you lose consciousness completely? It doesn't make sense. Apparently, a coma is the total loss of consciousness and it can last days or months! Is it possible to lose consciousness forever? If not, why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Margee Posted May 7, 2012 Moderator Share Posted May 7, 2012 If the essence of my being is consciousness, how is it possible to lose consciousness (faint)? Where does my "soul" go while I'm unconscious? Even people who have near death experiences become aware of something while dead, they don't lose consciousness. So how can something as trivial as fainting make you lose consciousness completely? It doesn't make sense. Apparently, a coma is the total loss of consciousness and it can last days or months! Is it possible to lose consciousness forever? If not, why not? you ask the best questions....... Waiting for the answer...................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asanerman Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 If the essence of my being is consciousness, how is it possible to lose consciousness (faint)? Where does my "soul" go while I'm unconscious? Even people who have near death experiences become aware of something while dead, they don't lose consciousness. So how can something as trivial as fainting make you lose consciousness completely? It doesn't make sense. Apparently, a coma is the total loss of consciousness and it can last days or months! Is it possible to lose consciousness forever? If not, why not? "Contrary to popular writers on the subject, the influential philosophers addressing the mind-body problem are more convinced than ever of its unyielding nature." There is no agreed-upon solution. "If non-dualism could be genuinely grasped in rational terms then the great materialist and dualist philosophers (many who are acknowledged geniuses) would have figured this out long ago." Ken Wilber Integral Psychology pp. 174 and 181. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dhampir Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Hell, sleeping amounts to a nearly total cessation of consciousness, during the periods where you aren't in REM sleep. I take careful note of the feeling I get when I first wake up, that I really didn't exist for the few hours that I was asleep. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Babylonian Dream Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Consciousness is a toughie, but its seeming more and more like consciousness is just the brain regions talking to eachother, and the brain being aware of this chatter. How it happens, we're still figuring it out. There are times when we just aren't conscious. Also, while in NDE's, before you do come back awake, you do enter sleep, and while coming back into consciousness or while waking up, there are probably alot of reasons there might be to explain exactly what's going on. I saw a documentary, and while I hate TV for science, it did explain them pretty well. I'll have to find it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 I'll have to find it. It may have been the National Geographic documentary "Moment of Death." This one isn't that but it's pretty good and there is one part really relevant to the OP that deals with sleep and loss of consciousness. It starts at about 17:55. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 I mean relevant to the original post, not the "OP" (which I just read means Original Poster). I'm a noob. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Babylonian Dream Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 I mean relevant to the original post, not the "OP" (which I just read means Original Poster). I'm a noob. To be honest, I always thought it meant original post, never knew that it meant original poster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denyoz Posted May 7, 2012 Author Share Posted May 7, 2012 I'll have to find it. It may have been the National Geographic documentary "Moment of Death." This one isn't that but it's pretty good and there is one part really relevant to the OP that deals with sleep and loss of consciousness. It starts at about 17:55. Oh goodie! I love documentaries. I don't think I have seen this one. Thanks nebula. Margee, get the popcorn! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Margee Posted May 7, 2012 Moderator Share Posted May 7, 2012 I'll have to find it. It may have been the National Geographic documentary "Moment of Death." This one isn't that but it's pretty good and there is one part really relevant to the OP that deals with sleep and loss of consciousness. It starts at about 17:55. Oh goodie! I love documentaries. I don't think I have seen this one. Thanks nebula. Margee, get the popcorn! I'm right here!! I'm on it! Can't wait to watch it!! I'm going to pop a bag right now!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denyoz Posted May 8, 2012 Author Share Posted May 8, 2012 I watched the video "Through the Wormhole". It looks like consciousness can be "created" in a laboratory! Sheesh... if we can create consciousness, then we can also destroy it. I think we have more than one consciousness. The one we lose when we sleep or faint. The one you find when you have a near death experience. And possibly (hopefully) one you find when you're really dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Margee Posted May 9, 2012 Moderator Share Posted May 9, 2012 I watched the video "Through the Wormhole". It looks like consciousness can be "created" in a laboratory! Sheesh... if we can create consciousness, then we can also destroy it. I think we have more than one consciousness. The one we lose when we sleep or faint. The one you find when you have a near death experience. And possibly (hopefully) one you find when you're really dead. Deny, I thought the exact same thing, but I question these facts....... The 'medicine man' puts 'conscious' to 'sleep' by inducing drugs. That conciousness would eventually wake up after the drugs wore off. This drug induced state would be needed to properly 'fix' the body with the knife so one would not feel anything. (which I am very glad because I have had a couple of nasty surgeries) The next would be natural sleep which it seems that the 'conscious' is taking a bit of a 'break' of all the 'clatter' of the day, so the neurons aren't 'speaking' to each other for a few hours, which would keep the whole body quiet for awhile to do all it's repairs. The third is after death which we can't really know for sure. So why couldn't there be different 'levels' of the 'conscious' state? Maybe, we need them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deva Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Interesting video nebula, thanks for posting. The part about the rat brain cells growing in a petri dish and hooked with electrodes to a machine was a bit disturbing. Maybe its the idea of someone being reincarnated into something like that - sort of a hell situation. Reminded me of a Lovecraft story. The guy who was talking about the quantum brain - I have seen him before on a different program, but I don't know enough about quantum theory to judge if his idea has any scientific merit. Still, I believe that consciousness survives death and is incarnated again in some other body elsewhere in this universe or even another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 The guy who was taking about the quantum brain - I have seen him before on a different program, but I don't know enough about quantum theory to judge if his idea has any scientific merit. Still, I believe that consciousness survives death and is incarnated again in some other body elsewhere in this universe or even another. Yeah, that's Stuart Hameroff. He's in this video too, at 38:41. His and Roger Penrose's idea is called "Orch-OR." http://en.wikipedia....ki/Quantum_mind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Margee Posted May 9, 2012 Moderator Share Posted May 9, 2012 I'm going to post this for anyone interested... on 'conciousness'. The sound quality is not as good as I would wish, but there's a LOT of content in this that interests me. Start's off kinda slow....but gets real good.....I like it! I'm still listening to it cause it's quite long. Let me know if you watch it....and what you think? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RDJEz_Iero&feature=related Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YellowJacket Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 I've twice been put under anesthesia so deep that they stopped my breathing. Believe it or not, this was quickie outpatient surgery. they inserted a breathing tube into the lungs so that the surgeon could operate on my vocal cords without any air passing thru to vibrate them. There was nothing there while I was under. Nothing at all. no visions. no NDE. just like before I was born. No slow wake up. Just boom - awake, dreamless 6 hrs had past. like being dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Babylonian Dream Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Margee and Nebula, interesting. I'll be watching them after I respond to all the posts I'm responding to on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitzer Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Yep, the vids look very interesting. Thanks for posting them, nebula and Margee. I wish I had more time so I could watch. I will as soon as I DO have time...! And Deny, I gotta tell ya, bud...you really are a thinker...that's a thought stirring, wonderful question! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deva Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Nebula - that was a very interesting video on NDE's. The case in Georgia, and the one with the blind lady were particularly interesting. Blind from birth, how is it she saw stuff? These are unexplainable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antlerman Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 They key is understanding states of consciousness. The unconscious does not mean the absence of consciousness. It is consciousness, unaware to your waking conscious mind. It is still there. We can and do access the unconscious mind all the time, as well as the subconscious mind. The problem is people in colloquial speach equate consciousness with being awake and cognitively aware. There's a hell of a lot more to it than that. Edit to add: I found this article speaking about the unconscious in a quick search you may find helpful: The Unconscious contains the fundamental survival drives and primitive urges (including genetic and race memories) that empower the functioning of the mind as a whole. It contains the entire kinaesthetic recordings of the body (all of its feelings, sensations and pains) and is integrally linked with the body (which it co-ordinates and controls) - it is the "body-mind". It also contains the deepest level of Self: the fundamental (primal) experiences, imprints and decisions of this lifetime, from the womb onwards. These only normally surface consciously in symbolic form, in the context of dreams and behaviour patterns recognised in retrospect. The deepest forms of psycho-analytic work aim to uncover their content to the light of consciousness. Jung's work on dreams and mythological symbology was instrumental in opening up the incredible world of the unconscious, and the existence of "archetypes" - ways of being that are inherently programmed in the unconscious, making up the substance of the core Self - all the aspects of living that the individual works throughout his life to "actualise," or bring into existence at their fullest potential. His work also exposed the transpersonal dimension which lays beyond the racial stereotypes, but also the necessity of working through the primal and archetypal material, to differentiate and individuate the Higher Self - the spiritual, non-genetic, meta-self. From here: http://www.trans4min...ransform2.2.htm P.S. I don't necessarily agree with everything he says in equating this with the body-mind, but that's another discussion. But the general use of the unconscious is pretty agreed upon in studies of consciousness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denyoz Posted May 10, 2012 Author Share Posted May 10, 2012 I'm going to post this for anyone interested... on 'conciousness'. The sound quality is not as good as I would wish, but there's a LOT of content in this that interests me. Start's off kinda slow....but gets real good.....I like it! I'm still listening to it cause it's quite long. Let me know if you watch it....and what you think? [Mind Science Kept Secret Documentary (video)] Ok Margee, I just finished watching the video. I was glued to the screen, it was so interesting. If what they are saying is true, Wow! It explains all of the spiritual experiences I had, including the part about meeting your soul mate, I totally agree with that part. It also explains your experience with seeing auras. Sounds almost too good to be true. But everything makes sense. It's funny because just yesterday I wrote on another thread: "Language sucks. I wish we could find a better way to communicate." And this documentary gives the answer. Exactly what I was wishing for! Thank you Jeeeeeezus! Shoom bala koura moola bong-bong! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denyoz Posted May 10, 2012 Author Share Posted May 10, 2012 They key is understanding states of consciousness. The unconscious does not mean the absence of consciousness. It is consciousness, unaware to your waking conscious mind. It is still there. We can and do access the unconscious mind all the time, as well as the subconscious mind. The problem is people in colloquial speach equate consciousness with being awake and cognitively aware. There's a hell of a lot more to it than that. Thanks Antlerman, I knew you would have the answer to my question (as usual). So when I'm unconscious, it's only my waking conscious mind that is turned off. The other levels are still on, but my thinking brain has no access to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitzer Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 Still haven't had time to view the vids. But one quick thought: If the physical rests, why not the conscience, too? (This is a very interesting thread. Thanks again, Deny!) I vividly remember the joy of feeling "completeness" or "wholeness" in my experience (although I don't remember what it felt like)...wonder if that might have something to do with this...? In my research I did find some who say when we incarnate, our entire consciousness doesn't incarnate. Our physical bodies couldn't take it. This thought just kinda popped into my mind and I wonder if it might be relavant in some way. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denyoz Posted May 10, 2012 Author Share Posted May 10, 2012 My 21-year-old daughter created this painting and gave it to me last month for my birthday. When I first saw it I thought it looked like a dead guy who had lost his mind (me). Then last night, after I finished watching all these amazing videos on consciousness, I went upstairs and saw the painting and I stopped. This is not a dead guy who lost his mind, it's a man who's consciousness has been blown open by the spirit, his brain has been replaced by a sphere (planet, universe, electron), and look: rays of light are coming out of his heart Chakra, just like in the video! Incredible. As far as I know, my daughter is not into this stuff. She was inspired to draw this and to give it to me, weeks before I decided to re-open my heart to deep consciousness. Pretty cool, eh? I feel like the universe is happy about my decision. I think you can click to enlarge. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Margee Posted May 10, 2012 Moderator Share Posted May 10, 2012 My 21-year-old daughter created this painting and gave it to me last month for my birthday. When I first saw it I thought it looked like a dead guy who had lost his mind (me). Then last night, after I finished watching all these amazing videos on consciousness, I went upstairs and saw the painting and I stopped. This is not a dead guy who lost his mind, it's a man who's consciousness has been blown open by the spirit, his brain has been replaced by a sphere (planet, universe, electron), and look: rays of light are coming out of his heart Chakra, just like in the video! Incredible. As far as I know, my daughter is not into this stuff. She was inspired to draw this and to give it to me, weeks before I decided to re-open my heart to deep consciousness. Pretty cool, eh? I feel like the universe is happy about my decision. I think you can click to enlarge. That is amazing Deny!! What talent she has!! You should be very proud. I noticed that his head is now 'empty space'. A sign to start all over and reprogram yourself with all new healthy information!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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