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Is This Guy Nuts?


nightflight
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What in particular is the problem with this guy?

 

 

He's one of those ultra-leftists who blame America for terrorism. Essentially, he's an apologist for Islamic extremism. His stupidity comes from the fact that he doesn't think that Islamists would hate him; after all, he defends them! But he himself is not a muslim, he's a Marxist.

 

I saw him on C-SPAN tonight and looked him up on the net. I read some material and just stared at the screen in horrified astonishment.

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Is it the hair or the glasses that turn you off? :shrug:

 

Oh the long hair I think is the main problem. So very unattractive.

 

I will look into this dirty hippie......

 

btw happy b day fwee

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Is it the hair or the glasses that turn you off?

 

Maybe its his ideas? What a concept.

 

You know, I'm not entirely certain, but I'm pretty sure that that was supposed to be a sarcastic question. Jesus effin' Christ...

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You know, I'm not entirely certain, but I'm pretty sure that that was supposed to be a sarcastic question. Jesus effin' Christ...

 

Feel better?

 

I don't know. Do you feel smarter?

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He's one of those ultra-leftists who blame America for terrorism. Essentially, he's an apologist for Islamic extremism. His stupidity comes from the fact that he doesn't think that Islamists would hate him; after all, he defends them!

 

I cannot stand that bullshit, while I don't like to say that "all" Muslims hate Americans...the "radical" ones don't give a crap and they'll kill off that guy, just as soon as look at him. Religious Terrorism has been going on long before the USA was even a country.

 

 

Yep. I have no patience for idiots like LaVine, who say that religion is the least factor in terrorism. It is actually the deciding factor.

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Ok then, I will continue this conversation at a later time. When I know what I am talking about / what the ugly hippie is talking about. Do go getting this thread closed now.......

 

 

<tip-toes out of the room>

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What in particular is the problem with this guy?

 

 

He's one of those ultra-leftists who blame America for terrorism. Essentially, he's an apologist for Islamic extremism. His stupidity comes from the fact that he doesn't think that Islamists would hate him; after all, he defends them! But he himself is not a muslim, he's a Marxist.

 

I saw him on C-SPAN tonight and looked him up on the net. I read some material and just stared at the screen in horrified astonishment.

 

I don't blame Americans in general, but I do blame American X-tian fundies in part for fueling terrorism.

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Anyway, what do you all think about the causes of Muslim terrorism? Some people in the ex-xtian community will espouse the mainstream academic/media line that its economics, globalization, "humiliation" and support of dictators. While I do agreee that those things are definate factors, I still feel that religious faith is the impetus. Especially a faith which both promises paradise for obedience and eternal torment for disobedience. Christianity has been tamed over the centuries via its engagement with Enlightenment ideals and humanistic values. Islam is lagging behind,and certainly it too can be tamed, but what makes it dangerous now is modern technology thrown in the mix. Nuclear and biological weapons in the hands of those who think the Arbiter of the Universe demands they punish the unbelievers is frightening to say the least.

 

Do you all agree?

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Anyway, what do you all think about the causes of Muslim terrorism? Some people in the ex-xtian community will espouse the mainstream academic/media line that its economics, globalization, "humiliation" and support of dictators. While I do agreee that those things are definate factors, I still feel that religious faith is the impetus. Especially a faith which both promises paradise for obedience and eternal torment for disobedience. Christianity has been tamed over the centuries via its engagement with Enlightenment ideals and humanistic values. Islam is lagging behind,and certainly it too can be tamed, but what makes it dangerous now is modern technology thrown in the mix. Nuclear and biological weapons in the hands of those who think the Arbiter of the Universe demands they punish the unbelievers is frightening to say the least.

 

Do you all agree?

 

That is a very good analysis that I generally agree with Nightflight. Muslim extremism has to do with a variety of factors, with religious "faith" the key factor IMO.

 

However, I somewhat disagree with you about the taming of Christianity. I guarantee you that if the situation were reversed and we lived in a world dominated by Islam, with Christianity limited to mostly to America and Islamic nations pushing militarily into the heart of Christianity (the U.S.), good numbers of Christians would act out with extreme, even suicidal violence. Religion brings out the worst in people, and when hardcore fundies feel threatened, be they Muslim or Christian, they will act out in irrational ways.

 

Funny how ya don't see athiests and agnostics doing things of the sort. :grin:

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I think suicide bombing would be much less common without the whole 72 virgins business, but I have a harder time laying arbitrary attacks on civilians at the feet of fundamentalist Islam.

 

It takes a real us-against-the-world attitude and a sense of political hopelessness to fly planes into skyscrapers or plant bombs in subways.

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I certainly don't think that Islam is the main problem. It doesn't help Israeli relations, but I don't think that religion is the root of terrorism. Even in the Israeli/Palestinian situation, it has more to do with land and other problems. Religion in that example is a cop out. If P's were orange, and I's were blue, P's would be "those orange motherfuckers" and I's would share their epithet with a good drink. It's a simplistic vessel to spread hate to people who are not up to date with the real reason why there is conflict between two countries.

 

Most people are not up to date on forign realtions unless there are bombs exploding in their backyard, so it's dumbed down to an explanation that will be spread to lot's of people. Religion is a convenient link for their hate. It is effective because the more you hate the Christians, the more devoted you are to Islam.

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It takes a real us-against-the-world attitude and a sense of political hopelessness to fly planes into skyscrapers or plant bombs in subways.

 

But Bin Laden and the 19 hijackers were all from well-to-do backgrounds.

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There is no question that religious fundamentalist extremism is the driving force behind all of the lunacy in the middle east. The more fundamental the Muslim society, the more outrageous the atrocities that are performed there.

 

I would never be one to say that America is blameless in exacerbating the problem over there. But, religious extremism is the root cause. Period. Anyone who says that religion is not the root of the problem is not very familiar with the Koran.

 

Here is a little exerpt from "The End of Faith", by Sam Harris:

 

Let us imagine that peace one day comes to the Middle East. What will Muslims say of the suicide bombings that they so widely endorsed? Will they say "We were driven mad by the Israeli occupation"? Will they say "We were a generation of sociopaths"? How will they account for the celebrations that followed these "sacred explosions" ? A young man, born into relative privelege, packs his clothing with explosives and ball bearings and unmakes himself along with a score of children in a discotheque, and his mother is promptly congratulated by hundreds of her neighbors. What will the Palestinians think about such behavior once peace has been established? If they still are devout Muslims, here is what they must think. "Our boys are in paradise, and they have prepared the way for us to follow. Hell has been prepared for the infidels." It seems to me to be an almost axiomatic truth of human nature that no peace, should it ever be established, will survive beliefs of this sort for very long.

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Anyway, what do you all think about the causes of Muslim terrorism?

Islam. Muslims worship an angry jealous god and have every incentive to punish infidels on his behalf, so they use terrorism as the way of doing it. I think politics, economics, etc. serve as a catalyst for the "punishment", but I do believe Islamic doctrine is the root of the problem. There are other regions of the world that are just as religious and poor and destitute and politically charged as the middle east, yet you don't see them flying planes into buildings and blowing up scores and scores of people almost daily. Actually I think it's always been like that with Islam really, from what I have read Islam has a long history of aggression against "enemies of Islam" and so I don't really see why that would change now or ever. I really fear for the future of humanity as Islam continues to grow, slaying any infidels that cross its path.

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There is no question that religious fundamentalist extremism is the driving force behind all of the lunacy in the middle east. The more fundamental the Muslim society, the more outrageous the atrocities that are performed there.

 

I would never be one to say that America is blameless in exacerbating the problem over there. But, religious extremism is the root cause. Period.

 

 

If religion is the root of terrorism, wouldn't Muslim hate and terrorism transcend borders? Now we can say that Sept. 11th would be a good illustration of that, but the hijackers were not American citizens, and they didn't mean to live here. Religion is not the root cause of terrorism. If that were so, Islamic citizens of America would be killing Christian citizens.

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I'm reading Harris's book now, though I thought long before I picked it up that the religion of Islam itself is the driving force of muslim terror.

 

 

 

If religion is the root of terrorism, wouldn't Muslim hate and terrorism transcend borders? Now we can say that Sept. 11th would be a good illustration of that, but the hijackers were not American citizens, and they didn't mean to live here. Religion is not the root cause of terrorism. If that were so, Islamic citizens of America would be killing Christian citizens.

 

Muslims in the U.S. are very much a minority and they know it. It wouldn't be feasible to begin attacking the kafir now. But you can be sure that they are capable and willing if the situation would allow it. The many madrass schools in the U.S. are notorious for preaching anti-Americanism to their students. Look at Europe now. Not too long ago we wouldn't have imagined the things that are happening there (and its only just beginning). As more Muslims immigrate and are born there, the more problems there are going to be.

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Islam. Muslims worship an angry jealous god and have every incentive to punish infidels on his behalf, so they use terrorism as the way of doing it. I think politics, economics, etc. serve as a catalyst for the "punishment", but I do believe Islamic doctrine is the root of the problem. There are other regions of the world that are just as religious and poor and destitute and politically charged as the middle east, yet you don't see them flying planes into buildings and blowing up scores and scores of people almost daily. Actually I think it's always been like that with Islam really, from what I have read Islam has a long history of aggression against "enemies of Islam" and so I don't really see why that would change now or ever. I really fear for the future of humanity as Islam continues to grow, slaying any infidels that cross its path.

 

Ok so basically you are arguing the exact opposite of what I said. I don't see how Islam had more to do with terrorism than forign intervention and then disertion, or politically backed coups, or abuse of war prisoners. It's a cycle. The reasons for hating America are cloaked by religious intolerance, and then we interpret the reason for terrorism on religious intolerance.

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