The Planned Parenthood Smear Is Bullshit

[SilentLoner]

Who's going to adopt the kids if they aren't aborted isn't much of an argument, is it? I don't have to pay someone's gasoline bill if I point out to them that doing a drive-off is bad, do I? Of course, driving off without paying for your gasoline is illegal and stirring around through baby body parts and talking about getting whole organs out without crunching them...including entire heads (excuse me, intact calvariums)...is legal, so maybe I don't have much to go on there. I mean, if it's legal, it must be OK, right? 

 

Am I gullible? Sometimes, but there is a lot of that to go around on both sides of this issue as well. I'm not so gullible that I'm only going to settle for four videos. I want to see them all. Of course, a judge blocked that because PP was concerned about the safety of their employees...presumably like the one in the video stuffing her face with salad and wine in a public restaurant while discussing these things with people that (as has been pointed out) weren't even vetted yet as being for real.  

 

Once again, you're going off an emotional rant rather than listening to the facts.

 

Yes, employee safety is a major issue. Do you have any idea what kind of harassment, death threats, etc, these people face every day? But then again you likely don't care.

 

All four of those videos have shown nothing illegal, all have been selectively edited, context removed, same old crap. Did you even bother to look at the full transcript? If you had, you would know the undoctored footage reveals staff at a Planned Parenthood affiliate simply discussing legal reimbursements for legal donations, also that the undercover actors admitted they were the "middlemen" who stood to potentially make a profit from selling tissue - not Planned Parenthood itself.

 

The Fourth Video Attacking Planned Parenthood Is Also Full Of Doctored Footage

 

http://mediamatters.org/research/2015/07/30/the-fourth-video-attacking-planned-parenthood-i/204693

 

 

As to emotional, excuse me for being emotional about an issue. Of course, my 'emotionalism' isn't in the same league as another's 'passion' is it. And there are no examples of people getting emotional on the other side of this issue, are there, so there's that.

 

Its fine to be emotional. It is not fine to disregard facts in favor of emotion, which one side (guess which) is notorious for.

 

In the end, I think any group that receives five hundred and forty million dollars of federal money should be looked into once in awhile

LOL, "once in a while." Planned Parenthood is audited and inspected like crazy (don't forget how many right wing politicians are always looking for an excuse to go after Planned Parenthood) and antis are always making allegations against individual clinics that rarely if ever hold any weight. 

 

As an aside, I wonder why so many abortions, be they legal or not, are necessary. Certainly there can't be that many rapes or incest issues or life-of-the-mother issues going on every single day. I think people on both sides need more education about the issue from all angles except political. 

 

 

So, you would appoint yourself the almighty moral authority on whether an abortion is necessary or not? You think or you know "there can't be that many"?

 

An abortion is necessary if the woman affected feels it is. Period. Abortion does not have to be justified by rape or incest or health conditions (as for numbers on rape, in 2012, approximately 346,830 women were raped. According to medical reports, the incidence of pregnancy for one-time unprotected sexual intercourse is 5%. By applying the pregnancy rate to 346,830 female survivors, RAINN estimates that there were 17,342 pregnancies as a result of rape in 2012. Would you tell each of those 17,342 women to their faces that they are statistically insignificant?)

 

If the procedure is so emotionally wrenching, shouldn't someone be teaching these kids that using abortion as birth control is much too expensive: i.e. it takes too big a toll to be a good idea?

 

 

 

Actually the most common emotion after an abortion is relief. On the second question, that's exactly what Planned Parenthood does! The vast majority of Planned Parenthood's work is providing affordable birth control and accurate sex education. Do you really not know this? Planned Parenthood prevents countless abortions every year by making birth control more easily available. 

 

Third, no one uses abortion as birth control (seriously, where are you getting these claims? You sound like my catholic school teachers with that). You really think people are strolling down to clinics every few months and spending hundreds of dollars, taking days off work, going under anesthesia, etc like its no big deal? Wake up.

 

If it's so readily available, and no objects to that, isn't there an even bigger problem in society in general?

 

 

 

No one objects to that? You do know the same side that objects to abortion also tends to object to birth control too, right? Have you not heard of the fight against accurate sex ed in schools in favor of abstinence-only propaganda? The fight against birth control coverage by insurance? Did you not hear of the IUD program in Colorado that cut the teen pregnancy and abortion rate dramatically, only to be discontinued by Republicans? Countless more examples out there.

 

I don't have all the answers. In fact I only have what I know...baby body parts of what was most likely a viable human on display in a petri dish because it was put there on purpose calls for a little more emotion than the killing of Cecil the lion. I'd hope everyone could agree with that, and hope that maybe we can find a better way.

This isn't even worth responding to. You are being irrational and melodramatic.

[SilentLoner]

The Fourth Video Attacking Planned Parenthood Is Also Full Of Doctored FootageTranscript Reveals

 

Undercover Actors Admitting PPFA Doesn't Sell Tissue

 

 

http://mediamatters.org/research/2015/07/30/the-fourth-video-attacking-planned-parenthood-i/204693

[duderonomy]

Just found this, great read:

 

Unspinning the Planned Parenthood Video

 

Several Republican presidential candidates have claimed that Planned Parenthood is “profiting” from abortions. But the full, unedited video they cite as evidence shows a Planned Parenthood executive repeatedly saying its clinics want to cover their costs, not make money, when donating fetal tissue from abortions for scientific research.

 

Four experts in the field of human tissue procurement told us the price range discussed in the video — $30 to $100 per patient — represents a reasonable fee. “There’s no way there’s a profit at that price,” said Sherilyn J. Sawyer, the director of Harvard University and Brigham and Women’s Hospital’s “biorepository.”

 

Republicans made their claims following the release of a secretly recorded video showing Deborah Nucatola, the senior director of medical services at Planned Parenthood, discussing the procurement of fetal tissues when conducting abortions. The edited video, released July 14 by an anti-abortion group called the Center for Medical Progress, leaves the impression that Nucatola is talking about Planned Parenthood affiliates making money from fetal tissue. But the edited video ignores other things Nucatola said that contradict that idea.

 

 

 

http://www.factcheck.org/2015/07/unspinning-the-planned-parenthood-video/

 

 

http://www.breitbart.com/big-journalism/2015/07/31/fact-checking-factcheck-orgs-look-at-the-planned-parenthood-videos/

[Lilith666]

Thanks for the compliment, duderonomy.

 

So what if Nucatola said PP can't be perceived as making money from organs? That's because they can't be perceived as making money from organs. If the bit about doing more than breaking even was so important, why isn't it in the edited sting video that's being passed around? This doesn't call for an investigation.

[SilentLoner]

 

Just found this, great read:

 

Unspinning the Planned Parenthood Video

 

Several Republican presidential candidates have claimed that Planned Parenthood is “profiting” from abortions. But the full, unedited video they cite as evidence shows a Planned Parenthood executive repeatedly saying its clinics want to cover their costs, not make money, when donating fetal tissue from abortions for scientific research.

 

Four experts in the field of human tissue procurement told us the price range discussed in the video — $30 to $100 per patient — represents a reasonable fee. “There’s no way there’s a profit at that price,” said Sherilyn J. Sawyer, the director of Harvard University and Brigham and Women’s Hospital’s “biorepository.”

 

Republicans made their claims following the release of a secretly recorded video showing Deborah Nucatola, the senior director of medical services at Planned Parenthood, discussing the procurement of fetal tissues when conducting abortions. The edited video, released July 14 by an anti-abortion group called the Center for Medical Progress, leaves the impression that Nucatola is talking about Planned Parenthood affiliates making money from fetal tissue. But the edited video ignores other things Nucatola said that contradict that idea.

 

 

http://www.factcheck.org/2015/07/unspinning-the-planned-parenthood-video/

 

http://www.breitbart.com/big-journalism/2015/07/31/fact-checking-factcheck-orgs-look-at-the-planned-parenthood-videos/

Breitbart? That's just embarassing.

[duderonomy]

 

 

Just found this, great read:

Unspinning the Planned Parenthood Video

 

Several Republican presidential candidates have claimed that Planned Parenthood is “profiting” from abortions. But the full, unedited video they cite as evidence shows a Planned Parenthood executive repeatedly saying its clinics want to cover their costs, not make money, when donating fetal tissue from abortions for scientific research.

 

Four experts in the field of human tissue procurement told us the price range discussed in the video — $30 to $100 per patient — represents a reasonable fee. “There’s no way there’s a profit at that price,” said Sherilyn J. Sawyer, the director of Harvard University and Brigham and Women’s Hospital’s “biorepository.”

 

Republicans made their claims following the release of a secretly recorded

showing Deborah Nucatola, the senior director of medical services at Planned Parenthood, discussing the procurement of fetal tissues when conducting abortions. The edited video, released July 14 by an anti-abortion group called the Center for Medical Progress, leaves the impression that Nucatola is talking about Planned Parenthood affiliates making money from fetal tissue. But the edited video ignores other things Nucatola said that contradict that idea.

 

 

http://www.factcheck.org/2015/07/unspinning-the-planned-parenthood-video/

 

http://www.breitbart.com/big-journalism/2015/07/31/fact-checking-factcheck-orgs-look-at-the-planned-parenthood-videos/

Breitbart? That's just embarassing.

 

 

Did you read it, or are you shooting the messenger just because?

[SilentLoner]

 

 

 

Just found this, great read:

Unspinning the Planned Parenthood Video

 

Several Republican presidential candidates have claimed that Planned Parenthood is “profiting” from abortions. But the full, unedited video they cite as evidence shows a Planned Parenthood executive repeatedly saying its clinics want to cover their costs, not make money, when donating fetal tissue from abortions for scientific research.

 

Four experts in the field of human tissue procurement told us the price range discussed in the video — $30 to $100 per patient — represents a reasonable fee. “There’s no way there’s a profit at that price,” said Sherilyn J. Sawyer, the director of Harvard University and Brigham and Women’s Hospital’s “biorepository.”

 

Republicans made their claims following the release of a secretly recorded video showing Deborah Nucatola, the senior director of medical services at Planned Parenthood, discussing the procurement of fetal tissues when conducting abortions. The edited video, released July 14 by an anti-abortion group called the Center for Medical Progress, leaves the impression that Nucatola is talking about Planned Parenthood affiliates making money from fetal tissue. But the edited video ignores other things Nucatola said that contradict that idea.

http://www.factcheck.org/2015/07/unspinning-the-planned-parenthood-video/

http://www.breitbart.com/big-journalism/2015/07/31/fact-checking-factcheck-orgs-look-at-the-planned-parenthood-videos/

Breitbart? That's just embarassing.

Did you read it, or are you shooting the messenger just because?

You have to be quite desperate to turn to Breitbart. Thats the same site that smeared ACORN.

[StillLooking]

 

 

As an aside, I wonder why so many abortions, be they legal or not, are necessary. Certainly there can't be that many rapes or incest issues or life-of-the-mother issues going on every single day. I think people on both sides need more education about the issue from all angles except political. If the procedure is so emotionally wrenching, shouldn't someone be teaching these kids that using abortion as birth control is much too expensive: i.e. it takes too big a toll to be a good idea?

If it's so readily available, and no objects to that, isn't there an even bigger problem in society in general?

 

I don't have all the answers. In fact I only have what I know...baby body parts of what was most likely a viable human on display in a petri dish because it was put there on purpose calls for a little more emotion than the killing of Cecil the lion. I'd hope everyone could agree with that, and hope that maybe we can find a better way.

 

 

 

duderonomy,

 

What is your position on abortion? Do you think all abortion should be illegal or do you think some abortion should be legal?

If you think some abortion should be legal, why? What are the factors that made you think those abortion should be legal?

What do you think about these cases:

- rapes / incests

- Fetuses with birth defects who have less than 10% chance to live outside womb

- Fetuses with chromosomal abnormalities, genetic abnormalities

- Healthy fetuses that lethal for the mother if carried to term

- under 14 year old pregnant girls

[duderonomy]

http://www.factcheck.org/2015/07/unspinning-the-planned-parenthood-video/

http://www.breitbart.com/big-journalism/2015/07/31/fact-checking-factcheck-orgs-look-at-the-planned-parenthood-videos/

Breitbart? That's just embarassing.

Did you read it, or are you shooting the messenger just because?

You have to be quite desperate to turn to Breitbart. Thats the same site that smeared ACORN.

 

 

But did you read it, or are you shooting the messenger just because?  

[duderonomy]

 

 

 

As an aside, I wonder why so many abortions, be they legal or not, are necessary. Certainly there can't be that many rapes or incest issues or life-of-the-mother issues going on every single day. I think people on both sides need more education about the issue from all angles except political. If the procedure is so emotionally wrenching, shouldn't someone be teaching these kids that using abortion as birth control is much too expensive: i.e. it takes too big a toll to be a good idea?

If it's so readily available, and no objects to that, isn't there an even bigger problem in society in general?

 

I don't have all the answers. In fact I only have what I know...baby body parts of what was most likely a viable human on display in a petri dish because it was put there on purpose calls for a little more emotion than the killing of Cecil the lion. I'd hope everyone could agree with that, and hope that maybe we can find a better way.

 

 

 

duderonomy,

 

What is your position on abortion? Do you think all abortion should be illegal or do you think some abortion should be legal?

If you think some abortion should be legal, why? What are the factors that made you think those abortion should be legal?

What do you think about these cases:

- rapes / incests

- Fetuses with birth defects who have less than 10% chance to live outside womb

- Fetuses with chromosomal abnormalities, genetic abnormalities

- Healthy fetuses that lethal for the mother if carried to term

- under 14 year old pregnant girls

 

 

I think abortion is a sad, horrible thing because I believe it ends the life of an innocent child. I find the procedure repugnant.  

I think that people who blindly and gleefully support, and in fact push abortion as an option of birth control or convenience are someone akin to the Yahweh of old that drowned an entire planet because he had repented that he made man, or the Hebrews that took glee in dashing the little one's heads against the rocks in the book of Psalms. 

Crunch crunch crunch. Snap, crackle, pop.  Here, (I watched the fifth selectively edited video) I have a bag full of dead babies...we keep 'em in the fridge!  Yeah,  that's repugnant to me unless such a thing is absolutely medically needed.

 

Now, having said that and alienated 7/8's of Ex-C from myself, I should point out that for some reason I was a lot more "meh" about abortion when I was a Christian. It was after my de-conversion, when I realized that life won't go on forever and the big people really do have to look out for the little people, and when I studied a bit about the science of life that I really began to be against indiscriminate infanticide. Call me old fashioned if you must.

 

I do know and understand that some medical procedures are necessary, no matter whether I like them or not. I believe that if an abortion is necessary it should be done the same as any other medical procedure​, and of course those should be legal. They have to be.  I'm not expert enough to comment on specifics like the ones you brought up.

 

My beef was over the OP and if the videos are showing PP selling body parts or performing illegal abortions or using illegal means. I'm not totally convinced that they were a 'smear' as opposed to a 'sting'.  All of the vids aren't out, and I'm sure this will be ongoing.

 

The abortion issue has come up on Ex-C before, and I'm sure it will again. Though it's doubtful, maybe a year from now I'll feel differently about abortion.   For right now, though, that's where I am on this.

 

I want to finish by pointing out that I was not only answering you StillLooking, but in a way everyone else too.  The reason I say that is because unless something jaw-dropping comes along, or until a thread pops up that discusses abortion from some other angle, I'm done with the issue, and thus this thread.

 

Thanks. 

[Lilith666]

Duderonomy, I don't think there's evidence to support that PP is actually making money off the abortions. That Dr. Gatter suggested $50 and the unseen spy with CFMP kept trying to increase it, to try to expose Gatter as greedy, was the biggest sign to me that the video is not what it purports to be.

 

I think that the morality of an abortion becomes more questionable as the pregnancy continues. This is why clinics that perform abortions need to be widely available, so that the zygote or early fetus can be terminated as soon as possible. Do you believe that a fertilized egg is a person, duderonomy?

[mymistake]

 

I think abortion is a sad, horrible thing because I believe it ends the life of an innocent child. I find the procedure repugnant.  

I think that people who blindly and gleefully support, and in fact push abortion as an option of birth control or convenience are someone akin to the Yahweh of old that drowned an entire planet because he had repented that he made man, or the Hebrews that took glee in dashing the little one's heads against the rocks in the book of Psalms. 

Crunch crunch crunch. Snap, crackle, pop.  Here, (I watched the fifth selectively edited video) I have a bag full of dead babies...we keep 'em in the fridge!  Yeah,  that's repugnant to me unless such a thing is absolutely medically needed.

 

Now, having said that and alienated 7/8's of Ex-C from myself, I should point out that for some reason I was a lot more "meh" about abortion when I was a Christian. It was after my de-conversion, when I realized that life won't go on forever and the big people really do have to look out for the little people, and when I studied a bit about the science of life that I really began to be against indiscriminate infanticide. Call me old fashioned if you must.

 

 

 

Well you don't alienate me even though my views are very different.  I'm glad you answered.  I think this

 

sheds light on where you are coming from regarding the PP vids.  I prefer getting an answer as opposed

 

to those who just laugh at a source and then let the conversation die.  A few years ago my views on 

 

abortion were closer to yours and the PP vids would have bothered me much more back then.  Today

 

I see the vids as a non-issue and I think the difference comes directly from the different opinion on abortion.

[StillLooking]

 

 

 

 

As an aside, I wonder why so many abortions, be they legal or not, are necessary. Certainly there can't be that many rapes or incest issues or life-of-the-mother issues going on every single day. I think people on both sides need more education about the issue from all angles except political. If the procedure is so emotionally wrenching, shouldn't someone be teaching these kids that using abortion as birth control is much too expensive: i.e. it takes too big a toll to be a good idea?

If it's so readily available, and no objects to that, isn't there an even bigger problem in society in general?

 

I don't have all the answers. In fact I only have what I know...baby body parts of what was most likely a viable human on display in a petri dish because it was put there on purpose calls for a little more emotion than the killing of Cecil the lion. I'd hope everyone could agree with that, and hope that maybe we can find a better way.

 

 

 

duderonomy,

 

What is your position on abortion? Do you think all abortion should be illegal or do you think some abortion should be legal?

If you think some abortion should be legal, why? What are the factors that made you think those abortion should be legal?

What do you think about these cases:

- rapes / incests

- Fetuses with birth defects who have less than 10% chance to live outside womb

- Fetuses with chromosomal abnormalities, genetic abnormalities

- Healthy fetuses that lethal for the mother if carried to term

- under 14 year old pregnant girls

 

 

I think abortion is a sad, horrible thing because I believe it ends the life of an innocent child. I find the procedure repugnant.  

I think that people who blindly and gleefully support, and in fact push abortion as an option of birth control or convenience are someone akin to the Yahweh of old that drowned an entire planet because he had repented that he made man, or the Hebrews that took glee in dashing the little one's heads against the rocks in the book of Psalms. 

Crunch crunch crunch. Snap, crackle, pop.  Here, (I watched the fifth selectively edited video) I have a bag full of dead babies...we keep 'em in the fridge!  Yeah,  that's repugnant to me unless such a thing is absolutely medically needed.

 

Now, having said that and alienated 7/8's of Ex-C from myself, I should point out that for some reason I was a lot more "meh" about abortion when I was a Christian. It was after my de-conversion, when I realized that life won't go on forever and the big people really do have to look out for the little people, and when I studied a bit about the science of life that I really began to be against indiscriminate infanticide. Call me old fashioned if you must.

 

I do know and understand that some medical procedures are necessary, no matter whether I like them or not. I believe that if an abortion is necessary it should be done the same as any other medical procedure​, and of course those should be legal. They have to be.  I'm not expert enough to comment on specifics like the ones you brought up.

 

My beef was over the OP and if the videos are showing PP selling body parts or performing illegal abortions or using illegal means. I'm not totally convinced that they were a 'smear' as opposed to a 'sting'.  All of the vids aren't out, and I'm sure this will be ongoing.

 

The abortion issue has come up on Ex-C before, and I'm sure it will again. Though it's doubtful, maybe a year from now I'll feel differently about abortion.   For right now, though, that's where I am on this.

 

I want to finish by pointing out that I was not only answering you StillLooking, but in a way everyone else too.  The reason I say that is because unless something jaw-dropping comes along, or until a thread pops up that discusses abortion from some other angle, I'm done with the issue, and thus this thread.

 

Thanks. 

 

 

Thank you for your honest answer. I appreciate it. About the video, I think the other members gave sufficient rebuttals to your issues.

I think (this is totally my projection so I might be wrong) you already oppose abortion because you equate it as killing babies thus you don't see PP videos as a simple matter of tissue donation.

 

For the record, my position is different from yours but not total opposite. I support the position that abortion should be safe, legal and rare.

I used to think abortion is killing babies (I am an ex-Catholic) but it all changed strangely when I was pregnant. I had pre partum depression and it didn't help that genetic screening gave positive results. Our financial were not good and the most important our marriage was very rocky. For the live of me I couldn't imagine taking care of mentally disabled kid without income and still had to take care a normal child on the side.

Another thing that firmly put me in the pro-choice camp is the recent non-fiction book "Far from the Tree" by Andrew Solomon. I always tell people how valuable that book is for me. I highly suggest that book to people who have idealistic ideas that parents must love and do everything in their power for their kids.

[StillLooking]

Duderonomy, I don't think there's evidence to support that PP is actually making money off the abortions. That Dr. Gatter suggested $50 and the unseen spy with CFMP kept trying to increase it, to try to expose Gatter as greedy, was the biggest sign to me that the video is not what it purports to be.

 

I think that the morality of an abortion becomes more questionable as the pregnancy continues. This is why clinics that perform abortions need to be widely available, so that the zygote or early fetus can be terminated as soon as possible. Do you believe that a fertilized egg is a person, duderonomy?

 

I agree 100% with the bolded part above.

[SilentLoner]

I think abortion is a sad, horrible thing because I believe it ends the life of an innocent child. I find the procedure repugnant.  

 

Some people find colonoscopies or heart surgery repugnant. Can they make it illegal on that basis? 

 

I think that people who blindly and gleefully support, and in fact push abortion as an option of birth control or convenience

Again with the imaginary people who supposedly do this. Once again, as I asked before, do you honestly believe there are people who waltz into clinics on a whim every few months or so, spending hundreds if not thousands of dollars and taking multiple days off work to go under anesthesia and other medical pleasantries? Yeah, that's a hot trend all the kids are doing nowadays.

 

And there's the word, "convenience." Can you define convenience? Is it "convenience" to not want to lose your job? Not have to drop out of school and work minimum wage jobs? Not wanting to be tied forever to an abusive ex or rapist? Not want to sink further into poverty? Wanting to care for the children you already have? 

 

  

Now, having said that and alienated 7/8's of Ex-C from myself, I should point out that for some reason I was a lot more "meh" about abortion when I was a Christian. It was after my de-conversion, when I realized that life won't go on forever and the big people really do have to look out for the little people, and when I studied a bit about the science of life that I really began to be against indiscriminate infanticide. Call me old fashioned if you must.

 

Isn't it funny, for me seeing the science was what made me realize a blob =/= a living baby as the religious people in my life had always insisted.  

 

My beef was over the OP and if the videos are showing PP selling body parts or performing illegal abortions or using illegal means. I'm not totally convinced that they were a 'smear' as opposed to a 'sting'.  All of the vids aren't out, and I'm sure this will be ongoing.

How many times do we need to tell you that PP is doing nothing illegal? Anti abortion fanatics have been doing similar "stings" for years that virtually never add up to anything damning. All they ever produce are heavily edited videos that lose their shock value when taken into context.

[SilentLoner]

Another good article:

 

Here are 6 things to say to your conservative relatives buying the anti-Planned Parenthood propaganda

 

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/08/here-are-6-things-to-say-to-your-conservative-relatives-buying-the-anti-planned-parenthood-propaganda/

[duderonomy]

 

I think abortion is a sad, horrible thing because I believe it ends the life of an innocent child. I find the procedure repugnant.  

 

Some people find colonoscopies or heart surgery repugnant. Can they make it illegal on that basis? 

 

I think that people who blindly and gleefully support, and in fact push abortion as an option of birth control or convenience

Again with the imaginary people who supposedly do this. Once again, as I asked before, do you honestly believe there are people who waltz into clinics on a whim every few months or so, spending hundreds if not thousands of dollars and taking multiple days off work to go under anesthesia and other medical pleasantries? Yeah, that's a hot trend all the kids are doing nowadays.

 

And there's the word, "convenience." Can you define convenience? Is it "convenience" to not want to lose your job? Not have to drop out of school and work minimum wage jobs? Not wanting to be tied forever to an abusive ex or rapist? Not want to sink further into poverty? Wanting to care for the children you already have? 

 

  

Now, having said that and alienated 7/8's of Ex-C from myself, I should point out that for some reason I was a lot more "meh" about abortion when I was a Christian. It was after my de-conversion, when I realized that life won't go on forever and the big people really do have to look out for the little people, and when I studied a bit about the science of life that I really began to be against indiscriminate infanticide. Call me old fashioned if you must.

 

Isn't it funny, for me seeing the science was what made me realize a blob =/= a living baby as the religious people in my life had always insisted.  

 

My beef was over the OP and if the videos are showing PP selling body parts or performing illegal abortions or using illegal means. I'm not totally convinced that they were a 'smear' as opposed to a 'sting'.  All of the vids aren't out, and I'm sure this will be ongoing.

How many times do we need to tell you that PP is doing nothing illegal? Anti abortion fanatics have been doing similar "stings" for years that virtually never add up to anything damning. All they ever produce are heavily edited videos that lose their shock value when taken into context.

 

 

Since you won't answer me about if you've read the article, or if you are just grousing about the source, I have to ask; Are you a part of a cult that can't think for itself? Just asking. Get back to me if you can.

[duderonomy]

I'm supposed to be done with this thread. 

[Blood]

https://dragonsember.wordpress.com/2015/07/28/the-baby-market-saga-a-little-research-never-hurts/

 

Sorry I can't figure out how to paste the article on my mobile, but click the link and you can comment on Wordpress if you so desire, no account needed.

 

This whole thing is such garbage. Fox is STILL hyping it: "Even Hillary said the videos are disturbing!" and they have not made the most feeble attempt as far as I have seen to analyze the videos.

 

Thoughts?

 

P.S. If you liked my article, or disagreed and think my blog posts are worth reading (I do stuff besides abortion), would you share them? I just got started about two weeks ago and am trying to establish a readership. Thanks so much!

 

 

https://dragonsember.wordpress.com/2015/07/28/the-baby-market-saga-a-little-research-never-hurts/

 

Sorry I can't figure out how to paste the article on my mobile, but click the link and you can comment on Wordpress if you so desire, no account needed.

 

This whole thing is such garbage. Fox is STILL hyping it: "Even Hillary said the videos are disturbing!" and they have not made the most feeble attempt as far as I have seen to analyze the videos.

 

Thoughts?

 

P.S. If you liked my article, or disagreed and think my blog posts are worth reading (I do stuff besides abortion), would you share them? I just got started about two weeks ago and am trying to establish a readership. Thanks so much!

 

 

The Conservative Brain Trust decided that they needed to create a new fake "controversy" to fire up the base since the fake Obamacare controversy and gay marriage outrage are getting kind of stale. They probably could have completely shut down Planned Parenthood during the Bush years, but you don't kill the golden goose that gets your brain-dead Christian voters to the polls every election cycle. So you continue to run on abortion, and when you get elected, you don't do anything about abortion, and instead fight for tax cuts for the 1% and off-shoring jobs -- the only two things the GOP really cares about.  

[SilentLoner]

 

 

I think abortion is a sad, horrible thing because I believe it ends the life of an innocent child. I find the procedure repugnant.  

 

Some people find colonoscopies or heart surgery repugnant. Can they make it illegal on that basis? 

 

I think that people who blindly and gleefully support, and in fact push abortion as an option of birth control or convenience

Again with the imaginary people who supposedly do this. Once again, as I asked before, do you honestly believe there are people who waltz into clinics on a whim every few months or so, spending hundreds if not thousands of dollars and taking multiple days off work to go under anesthesia and other medical pleasantries? Yeah, that's a hot trend all the kids are doing nowadays.

 

And there's the word, "convenience." Can you define convenience? Is it "convenience" to not want to lose your job? Not have to drop out of school and work minimum wage jobs? Not wanting to be tied forever to an abusive ex or rapist? Not want to sink further into poverty? Wanting to care for the children you already have? 

 

  

Now, having said that and alienated 7/8's of Ex-C from myself, I should point out that for some reason I was a lot more "meh" about abortion when I was a Christian. It was after my de-conversion, when I realized that life won't go on forever and the big people really do have to look out for the little people, and when I studied a bit about the science of life that I really began to be against indiscriminate infanticide. Call me old fashioned if you must.

 

Isn't it funny, for me seeing the science was what made me realize a blob =/= a living baby as the religious people in my life had always insisted.  

 

My beef was over the OP and if the videos are showing PP selling body parts or performing illegal abortions or using illegal means. I'm not totally convinced that they were a 'smear' as opposed to a 'sting'.  All of the vids aren't out, and I'm sure this will be ongoing.

How many times do we need to tell you that PP is doing nothing illegal? Anti abortion fanatics have been doing similar "stings" for years that virtually never add up to anything damning. All they ever produce are heavily edited videos that lose their shock value when taken into context.

 

 

Since you won't answer me about if you've read the article, or if you are just grousing about the source, I have to ask; Are you a part of a cult that can't think for itself? Just asking. Get back to me if you can.

 

 

LOL, that sure was desperate on your part. Not to mention you're being pretty hypocritical since I've asked you a ton of questions that you have pretty much run away from.

 

But then again you've been pretty much acting immune to reason (and simple facts) throughout this debate, which is pretty typical of your crowd. I'm not surprised.

[Lilith666]

Hey SL, thanks for the link. I try to find something to watch in the mornings to discourage a Fox News session, but if I'm unlucky, I have to sit through more fear-mongering and thus another of my dad's rants about PP. Unfortunately, it doesn't matter to him whether they are actually selling tissue, because he already thinks they're killing babies. >.>

 

I'm fed up with the "Just give the baby up for adoption" argument. Why should parents or a mother have to choose between caring for a child they can't afford or didn't want because the father was a rapist or abusive partner, and going through the ordeal of giving that child up once s/he is born? Pro-choicers are not the heartless ones.

[duderonomy]

 

 

 

I think abortion is a sad, horrible thing because I believe it ends the life of an innocent child. I find the procedure repugnant.  

 

Some people find colonoscopies or heart surgery repugnant. Can they make it illegal on that basis? 

 

I think that people who blindly and gleefully support, and in fact push abortion as an option of birth control or convenience

Again with the imaginary people who supposedly do this. Once again, as I asked before, do you honestly believe there are people who waltz into clinics on a whim every few months or so, spending hundreds if not thousands of dollars and taking multiple days off work to go under anesthesia and other medical pleasantries? Yeah, that's a hot trend all the kids are doing nowadays.

 

And there's the word, "convenience." Can you define convenience? Is it "convenience" to not want to lose your job? Not have to drop out of school and work minimum wage jobs? Not wanting to be tied forever to an abusive ex or rapist? Not want to sink further into poverty? Wanting to care for the children you already have? 

 

  

Now, having said that and alienated 7/8's of Ex-C from myself, I should point out that for some reason I was a lot more "meh" about abortion when I was a Christian. It was after my de-conversion, when I realized that life won't go on forever and the big people really do have to look out for the little people, and when I studied a bit about the science of life that I really began to be against indiscriminate infanticide. Call me old fashioned if you must.

 

Isn't it funny, for me seeing the science was what made me realize a blob =/= a living baby as the religious people in my life had always insisted.  

 

My beef was over the OP and if the videos are showing PP selling body parts or performing illegal abortions or using illegal means. I'm not totally convinced that they were a 'smear' as opposed to a 'sting'.  All of the vids aren't out, and I'm sure this will be ongoing.

How many times do we need to tell you that PP is doing nothing illegal? Anti abortion fanatics have been doing similar "stings" for years that virtually never add up to anything damning. All they ever produce are heavily edited videos that lose their shock value when taken into context.

 

 

Since you won't answer me about if you've read the article, or if you are just grousing about the source, I have to ask; Are you a part of a cult that can't think for itself? Just asking. Get back to me if you can.

 

 

LOL, that sure was desperate on your part. Not to mention you're being pretty hypocritical since I've asked you a ton of questions that you have pretty much run away from.

 

But then again you've been pretty much acting immune to reason (and simple facts) throughout this debate, which is pretty typical of your crowd. I'm not surprised.

 

So did you read it?

[SilentLoner]

 

 

 

 

I think abortion is a sad, horrible thing because I believe it ends the life of an innocent child. I find the procedure repugnant.  

 

Some people find colonoscopies or heart surgery repugnant. Can they make it illegal on that basis? 

 

I think that people who blindly and gleefully support, and in fact push abortion as an option of birth control or convenience

Again with the imaginary people who supposedly do this. Once again, as I asked before, do you honestly believe there are people who waltz into clinics on a whim every few months or so, spending hundreds if not thousands of dollars and taking multiple days off work to go under anesthesia and other medical pleasantries? Yeah, that's a hot trend all the kids are doing nowadays.

 

And there's the word, "convenience." Can you define convenience? Is it "convenience" to not want to lose your job? Not have to drop out of school and work minimum wage jobs? Not wanting to be tied forever to an abusive ex or rapist? Not want to sink further into poverty? Wanting to care for the children you already have? 

 

  

Now, having said that and alienated 7/8's of Ex-C from myself, I should point out that for some reason I was a lot more "meh" about abortion when I was a Christian. It was after my de-conversion, when I realized that life won't go on forever and the big people really do have to look out for the little people, and when I studied a bit about the science of life that I really began to be against indiscriminate infanticide. Call me old fashioned if you must.

 

Isn't it funny, for me seeing the science was what made me realize a blob =/= a living baby as the religious people in my life had always insisted.  

 

My beef was over the OP and if the videos are showing PP selling body parts or performing illegal abortions or using illegal means. I'm not totally convinced that they were a 'smear' as opposed to a 'sting'.  All of the vids aren't out, and I'm sure this will be ongoing.

How many times do we need to tell you that PP is doing nothing illegal? Anti abortion fanatics have been doing similar "stings" for years that virtually never add up to anything damning. All they ever produce are heavily edited videos that lose their shock value when taken into context.

 

 

Since you won't answer me about if you've read the article, or if you are just grousing about the source, I have to ask; Are you a part of a cult that can't think for itself? Just asking. Get back to me if you can.

 

 

LOL, that sure was desperate on your part. Not to mention you're being pretty hypocritical since I've asked you a ton of questions that you have pretty much run away from.

 

But then again you've been pretty much acting immune to reason (and simple facts) throughout this debate, which is pretty typical of your crowd. I'm not surprised.

 

So did you read it?

 

 

There you go again.  Anything to avoid the hard questions eh?

[duderonomy]

 

 

 

 

 

I think abortion is a sad, horrible thing because I believe it ends the life of an innocent child. I find the procedure repugnant.  

 

Some people find colonoscopies or heart surgery repugnant. Can they make it illegal on that basis? 

 

I think that people who blindly and gleefully support, and in fact push abortion as an option of birth control or convenience

Again with the imaginary people who supposedly do this. Once again, as I asked before, do you honestly believe there are people who waltz into clinics on a whim every few months or so, spending hundreds if not thousands of dollars and taking multiple days off work to go under anesthesia and other medical pleasantries? Yeah, that's a hot trend all the kids are doing nowadays.

 

And there's the word, "convenience." Can you define convenience? Is it "convenience" to not want to lose your job? Not have to drop out of school and work minimum wage jobs? Not wanting to be tied forever to an abusive ex or rapist? Not want to sink further into poverty? Wanting to care for the children you already have? 

 

  

Now, having said that and alienated 7/8's of Ex-C from myself, I should point out that for some reason I was a lot more "meh" about abortion when I was a Christian. It was after my de-conversion, when I realized that life won't go on forever and the big people really do have to look out for the little people, and when I studied a bit about the science of life that I really began to be against indiscriminate infanticide. Call me old fashioned if you must.

 

Isn't it funny, for me seeing the science was what made me realize a blob =/= a living baby as the religious people in my life had always insisted.  

 

My beef was over the OP and if the videos are showing PP selling body parts or performing illegal abortions or using illegal means. I'm not totally convinced that they were a 'smear' as opposed to a 'sting'.  All of the vids aren't out, and I'm sure this will be ongoing.

How many times do we need to tell you that PP is doing nothing illegal? Anti abortion fanatics have been doing similar "stings" for years that virtually never add up to anything damning. All they ever produce are heavily edited videos that lose their shock value when taken into context.

 

 

Since you won't answer me about if you've read the article, or if you are just grousing about the source, I have to ask; Are you a part of a cult that can't think for itself? Just asking. Get back to me if you can.

 

 

LOL, that sure was desperate on your part. Not to mention you're being pretty hypocritical since I've asked you a ton of questions that you have pretty much run away from.

 

But then again you've been pretty much acting immune to reason (and simple facts) throughout this debate, which is pretty typical of your crowd. I'm not surprised.

 

So did you read it?

 

 

There you go again.  Anything to avoid the hard questions eh?

 

So did you read it?

[Lilith666]

I read it and don't believe it made a case for defunding PP.