Guest JP Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 Hello everyone. Back in 1998 we visited a gift shop in Virginia City, Nevada. While we were there the owner let us go into the basement and look around, and we took pictures. She also showed us her pictures of the place, and in two of her pictures there was a doorway in the basement that seemed to have an apparition of a ghost in it. The positions of the 'ghost' were different in the two pictures, but you could plainly see what looked like a ghostly body in the doorway. We got our pictures developed, and in the pictures we took in front of the doorway, the same apparition appeared. In some of the pictures it wasn't there, but in a few it was. Again, it was in different positions in different pictures. Scared the crap out of me. Now, I want to believe it wasn't a ghost, but it seems kinda coincidental that my pictures had the exact same apparition in the exact same spot, in not every picture. What explanations can there be for this? I don't have the pictures available for scanning, but I'm not out to prove ghosts are real so that shouldn't be an issue. The woman who owned this store also had another of 'ghosts,' in which she said she invited the ghosts to come pose with the people she was taking the picture of, and in the picture there are three different foggy beings standing next to the people on either side of the picture. Supposedly it was a mortuary in the 1800s; they have a picture of the place taken from that era and there is the mortuary sign on the front of the building. In the basement, you can see the fireplace has since been filled with bricks, and the large doubledoors that opened up when the bodies were sent down are still down there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godlessgrrl Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 I'd have to see them before I could or would even begin to speculate on what they might be. But I am a diehard skeptic when it comes to dealing with the supernatural of any stripe. I firmly believe that the first thing to do is rule out as many mundane explanations as you possibly can, and that chances are that 99% (or some other high percentage) of supposed ghost or paranormal pics are something mundane. That isn't to say that nothing weird ever shows up on film - it does - and that isn't to say that nothing would ever show up that might be "paranormal" - it's a possibility. I just hate to see people looking at orb pictures, for instance, from their cheap low-res digital camera, and assume that they're ghosts when in fact they're probably digital artifacting. That said, weird shit does happen. People see weird things, hear weird things, take pictures of weird things. Weird things shouldn't be dismissed, imnsvho, if only for the reason that they're part of the human experience. Though, not being a believer that there is a truly supernatural realm (in the sense that anything exists beyond the natural world), I figure that perhaps weird shit like ghosts may just be some part of the natural world we don't understand yet. Not necessarily something scary and supernatural and some big freaky discarnate supernatural entity or something like that. Anyway. Thoughts from an open-minded skeptic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godlessgrrl Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 I don't know why this struck me as funny, it was just...you were plodding along there and you said "or some other high percentage" sorry, it's 2:30 am and i'm really goofy right now. Seriously I'm stoned on time. imnsvho, The fact that i knew IMMEDIATELY what this meant...is a sign I spend WAY too much time on the internet. Bedtime for Bonzo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizard Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 I used to believe all the shadowing, wispy images in photos were indeed "ghosts" or spirits or even demons.. In the old days, when I used film cameras, it seemed odd to see some "thing" in a photo. Then I got my first decent digicam. A black, paisley shape would appear on some photos. Looked really odd. Couldn't see it through the lens. (it was a through the lens viewfinder). Thing was, it only showed up in some pictures, but not all. Then it started showing up in all..turns out it was (most likely) a speck of dust on a sensor. I have a new camera now..it was more prudent to buy one than to send in the other to have it cleaned. One thing that bothers me about ghost pictures is that you can't see them with the naked eye. Why would a camera capture it, but yet you can't see it? My personal opinion is that its a trick of light. Light hitting the lens of the camera in a weird way that overlays the image. A few other thoughts...why would the "ghost" stay in the same place all the time? I mean, if I were a spirit with the ability to go wherever, I wouldn't hang around an old house in the same place to give fleshies a thrill... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjacksonRIAB Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 and that chances are that 99% (or some other high percentage) I don't know why this struck me as funny, it was just...you were plodding along there and you said "or some other high percentage" sorry, it's 2:30 am and i'm really goofy right now. Seriously I'm stoned on time. imnsvho, The fact that i knew IMMEDIATELY what this meant...is a sign I spend WAY too much time on the internet. Holy shit, I think I did the same thing. As for ghosts, I am a professional ghost buster and vampire slayer. In their cases I deal double-doses of STFULOLURSo.. gg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trashy Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 Cameras have lenses Eyes have lenses They both use available light and see what is there. Why would light from an apparition come through the camera lens but not the eye lens? Answer that question and you're on your way to reason! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyFeline Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 Cameras have lenses Eyes have lenses You forgot to mention that: Cameras process light differently from the human brain, which allows them to catch things at higher speeds then the human eye can see. and Everything humans see is on a quarter-second (if I'm remembering this correctly) time delay due to how we process light into visual images. I know that doesn't seem like a lot, but when you compare it to how quickly other parts of the body process stimuli, that's slow. There's any number of reasons why a camera might catch something that we didn't actually see (or thought that we didn't see). It might be shadows/smudges on the lens, might be a trick of the light, it might be something totally mundane that's just misinterpreted, it might just even be bad film (in the case of non-digital cameras). But sometimes weird things just happen that we don't have the answers for - and pretending that we do have answers for everything (just because "OMG Aw'm nawt a CHRAYSTYYYUN!!") doesn't make us any better than the spam-harfing Bible-thumpers that come around here "with all the answers". It's best to just say "I don't know right now", and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentLoner Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 Cameras have lensesEyes have lenses They both use available light and see what is there. Why would light from an apparition come through the camera lens but not the eye lens? Answer that question and you're on your way to reason! There are definite differences between how an eye and a camera works. Though it would be nice to be able to remember things picture-perfect. I have to admit I'm usually ready to belive in ghosts and stuff. I'd like to see the pictures before I state my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodsmoke Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 I think Carl Sagan said it best in The Demon Haunted World, I only wish I had the actual quote here. Was something to the effect of "Very little would please me more than to learn the existence of something as fascinating as spirits and an afterlife were real and could be studied and learned about. However, being as there is no such proof at current, the best I can do is continue to study whatever evidence and material that comes to me with skepticism, so as not to cheat the possibility of a real experience." (grossly inaccurate paraphrase, I'm sure) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Meadows Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 Cameras have lenses Eyes have lenses You forgot to mention that: Cameras process light differently from the human brain, which allows them to catch things at higher speeds then the human eye can see. TV/VCR technicians can quickly check if a remote control is working by pointing it at a video camera and observing the glow on the monitor screen when a button is held down. The eye cannot see anything because the remote control transmitts in the infra-red end of the the light spectrum but this is not so with the light sensitive device in the camera can see at infra-red wavelengths. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sage Nabooru Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 Ah, ghosts. One of my favorite subjects. Do I believe in them? Yes. But only very rarely. I'd have to see the pictures in order to know whether or not I'd believe in their ghostly images. As I delve farther and farther into ghosts, the more I believe they exist, yet the more skeptical I become about individual cases. If a ghost is truly the soul of a previously living human being (as I see it), then why would it spend all day rocking a rocking chair, or running up and down the same set of stairs? I believe there are such things as "residual hauntings", but I believe also that in a lot of cases strange noises and sights are just that, strange noises and sights. Houses get old and creepy, but that doesn't mean that they're haunted. I remember one building that was famous for the ghost that walked up and down an upstairs hallway, very quickly, with one normal foot and one wooden peg foot. Investigators peeled up the floorboards and discovered a track underneath the floor that wiring for lights hanging from the ceiling below was supposed to be installed in, but for some reason never was. The floor wasn't very well taken care of, and the wood had warped over time. When mice in the building ran down this empty wiring track on the warped boards, it created the distinctive "step-and-peg-leg" sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HadouKen24 Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 Hell, if I had pictures like that, I'd show them to all my friends. Can't say anything for sure, not having seen the pictures, but I wouldn't ignore the evidence, if I were you. If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck... Personally, I don't believe in the supernatural. Nor do I believe in the natural. Either is an unsustainable metaphysical claim. If I saw evidence of a ghost, though, I'd have to believe that there was a ghost. Cameras have lensesEyes have lenses They both use available light and see what is there. Why would light from an apparition come through the camera lens but not the eye lens? Answer that question and you're on your way to reason! Who knows? You'd have to figure out in scientific terms (since that's what you've laid out here) what the thing you see is, first. Not likely to happen, so I suppose we'll leave the question unanswered for now. Which is fine. If a ghost is truly the soul of a previously living human being (as I see it), then why would it spend all day rocking a rocking chair, or running up and down the same set of stairs? Boredom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodsmoke Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 If a ghost is truly the soul of a previously living human being (as I see it), then why would it spend all day rocking a rocking chair, or running up and down the same set of stairs? I don't know, I find the idea of haunting a place for cheap laughs rather appealing. ASSuming there is an afterlife and I have any kind of control over what I do with it, I could definitely see myself haunting a place or twelve for a few years simply for the easy entertainment value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedPillAddict Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 I took a photography class in High School. My teacher showed us how to make "ghost" photos. If its not dust, smoke, or a dirty lens....then its the developer messing with you. All you have to do is lay any other random photo over the one you are developing to make it appear as if a ghost is in the photo. Lots of photo developing places do it on accident too...I've gotten a few from walgreens like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ped Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 general digital cameras cant see infrared. well the can but they all have built in UV/IR filters, if they didnt all pics would come out purple or a bland redish color. (some cameras may show a very little infra though if they have a generic IR cut filter that slopes off to slow on a graph) i have a dslr that i removed the ir filter to pick up 656.3 nm, also know as hydrogen alpha. (for shooting nebula) i can shoot a tv remote and see the red laser, but with an external ir cut filter i cant. i believe the eye has a sensitvity equal to 1/60 sec. @ISO400. i may be mistaken though. an eye can accommodate small changes in focus very quik where as a camera lens is infinite or not (focused or out). theses are some facts, im sure theres a reasonable explantion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rachelness Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 Don't believe in ghosts at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 I don't think that weird stuff is impossible, but when it comes to stuff like this, I'm highly skeptical. It could have been a reflection of some kind, or trick of the light. Or maybe whoever developed your pictures was playing a prank on you. Who knows? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted May 30, 2006 Share Posted May 30, 2006 If the 'ghost' image appears on just a few pictures on a roll (talking old fashion photography here), but it appear in different places, it's most likely something that messes up the developing procedure. Like the developer apparatus isn't cleaned up properly and have some trace chemicals on some of the feeder rolls etc. I also had some films and photographs messed up with a camera that didn't move the film correctly, and a had a few double exposures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted May 30, 2006 Share Posted May 30, 2006 Sorry! Will you feel better if I say the ghosts made the developing machine malfunction? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted May 30, 2006 Share Posted May 30, 2006 How come all of these "ghosts" in these pictures always have clothes on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted May 30, 2006 Share Posted May 30, 2006 your spirit wears the clothes you died in. So what's the moral of this story? Out of all of the times that I've asked this question, this is the second time that someone has attempted to explain it this way. Of course, it reminds me of piss-poor apologetics, but still. So, fabric has a "soul", huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted May 30, 2006 Share Posted May 30, 2006 How come all of these "ghosts" in these pictures always have clothes on? Reason 1: Because without them, they would be completely invisible. They need them so you can see them. Reason 2: They only show up naked at nudist camps Reason 3: They put on the nicest rugs they could find to pose for your picture, and you complain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizard Posted May 30, 2006 Share Posted May 30, 2006 There's a story of a young woman who died years ago on the beach during one of the hurricanes that hit the Texas coast. Legend has it that she walks the beach, looking for rescue that never came and her guardian angel looks down on her, trying to get her to perhaps "crossover". Its said if you get there before sunrise, you might catch a glimpse of her walking the beach..and even her angel. I was walking the beach one morning, waiting for sunrise...when I got this: Ok, poorly done, but I was in a hurry. I could post this in other places and pull it off though.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trashy Posted May 30, 2006 Share Posted May 30, 2006 But sometimes weird things just happen that we don't have the answers for - and pretending that we do have answers for everything (just because "OMG Aw'm nawt a CHRAYSTYYYUN!!") doesn't make us any better than the spam-harfing Bible-thumpers that come around here "with all the answers". It's best to just say "I don't know right now", and move on. I disagree. There were many things that led to my decision to deconvert. One of them was Houdini. I read his biography and was surprised to discover that, in addition to his own tricks, he spent a lot of time debunking and disproving mediums, palm readers, ghosts, hauntings and other such supposedly supernatural events. I also read similar material by others who were debunking and disproving modern-day healers and charlatans. The parallels were astonishing. Soon I realized that there really was no difference between someone who believed that Jesus had healed them and someone who believed that a palm-reader had just discerned a secret. They want to believe, therefore it is true to them. I believe the same thing about ghosts. James Randi has continued in Houdini's footsteps debunking people like Uri Geller and all things paranormal. Here is a little blurb from his website: "At JREF, we offer a one-million-dollar prize to anyone who can show, under proper observing conditions, evidence of any paranormal, supernatural, or occult power or event." Many have tried, none have come close to being able to claim it. Perhaps JP could split the money with the gift shop lady? After all, they've already duplicated the phenomenon........ Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentLoner Posted May 30, 2006 Share Posted May 30, 2006 How come all of these "ghosts" in these pictures always have clothes on? BECAUSE fwee, what if a kid saw a nekkid ghost. Could you imagine how much they would be scarred? no...your spirit wears the clothes you died in. So what's the moral of this story? Always wear something fashionable...yet tasteful and able to overcome years of being seen on you. I actually have heard accounts of naked ghosts. Not as common, but still. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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