Roz Posted April 25, 2014 Author Share Posted April 25, 2014 When jesus specifically commanded the deaths of infants for one. Care to explain that to me? That's one big fucking warning sign that says "don't vote for that guy!" Remember, he and his father are "one." So that means he was there and he commanded that. Jesus and his father are one, yet Jesus sits at God's right hand, or sits at his own right hand.... Because god was EDIT: damn i was too slow... heh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 When jesus specifically commanded the deaths of infants for one. Care to explain that to me? That's one big fucking warning sign that says "don't vote for that guy!" Remember, he and his father are "one." So that means he was there and he commanded that. I've tried before to explain these difficult verses in the OT. If I gave you an explanation on those verses that you accepted, would you believe that Jesus is the Messiah? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roz Posted April 25, 2014 Author Share Posted April 25, 2014 How about you give me your explanation without anything else, let's hear it out. Right now. Go! Then I'll line it up with the answers other christians gave me to see if it's a consistent message or not. This is the way of science, to test things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest afireinside Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 Ironhorse we are not arguing your take on the Bible. We are exposing the Bible in it's entirety, it's not a good story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roz Posted April 25, 2014 Author Share Posted April 25, 2014 Let's see if Ironpony ever gets back with his 'explanation.' Something tells me no. No no, I'm really interested in Ironpony's explanation. I would compare it with the other explanations given to me by other christians. If god meant for his apologists to defend him, then their answers must correlate right? Time to see if god and Ironhorse is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest afireinside Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 I don't hold Ironhorses views against him. I've said that before, he's a nice guy and gives of his time to come here and get whipped. I just know he is hoodwinked by a book that can't even explain itself, let alone the bigger issues of life. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 When jesus specifically commanded the deaths of infants for one. Care to explain that to me? That's one big fucking warning sign that says "don't vote for that guy!" Remember, he and his father are "one." So that means he was there and he commanded that. http://www.reasonablefaith.org/slaughter-of-the-canaanites# Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roz Posted April 25, 2014 Author Share Posted April 25, 2014 I want his explanation on why his god ordered the killing of infants. I'm not going to hold his views against him, I'm going to hold those views against the other christian views I've collected. Whether or not they line up with each other will of course depend on their answers they've given in defense of the same god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest afireinside Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 They don't understand that you have to accept the WHOLE book in it's entirety. No explanations post penning should be necessary, God commands, God kills, God is one mean bastard! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roz Posted April 25, 2014 Author Share Posted April 25, 2014 How original of Ironpony, William Lane Craig. Ok, let's line that up against another christian, Paul Copan. WLC, Paul Copan, and Ironpony all believe they're genuine christians. Copan: He argues that only enemy combatants were killed, that it's metaphoric language. Those male children were not really killed, it's a language issue! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1K8pEB2xic Craig: Those kids WERE killed, but god is showing them mercy by having them killed! Those kids automatically went to heaven as 'a result of their earthly life terminated.'http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUMzYA3XSEc So we have 2 christians, genuine christians they tell us, that tell HUGELY DIFFERENT explanations about why their exact same god ordered kids be put to death. One is saying it's a language thing, the kids weren't really killed, only willing combatants were Another is saying that it's a good thing those kids died because god showed them mercy Where have I seen huge contradictions like that before... Oh yeah, the bible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midniterider Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 When jesus specifically commanded the deaths of infants for one. Care to explain that to me? That's one big fucking warning sign that says "don't vote for that guy!" Remember, he and his father are "one." So that means he was there and he commanded that. I've tried before to explain these difficult verses in the OT. If I gave you an explanation on those verses that you accepted, would you believe that Jesus is the Messiah? If I read something really cool from a Batman comic to you would you believe that Batman was a real person? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roz Posted April 25, 2014 Author Share Posted April 25, 2014 Batman was far more moral than jesus/yaweh/allah to boot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 How original of Ironpony, William Lane Craig. Ok, let's line that up against another christian, Paul Copan. WLC, Paul Copan, and Ironpony all believe they're genuine christians. Copan: He argues that only enemy combatants were killed, that it's metaphoric language. Those male children were not really killed, it's a language issue! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1K8pEB2xic Craig: Those kids WERE killed, but god is showing them mercy by having them killed! Those kids automatically went to heaven as 'a result of their earthly life terminated.' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUMzYA3XSEc So we have 2 christians, genuine christians they tell us, that tell HUGELY DIFFERENT explanations about why their exact same god ordered kids be put to death. One is saying it's a language thing, the kids weren't really killed, only willing combatants were Another is saying that it's a good thing those kids died because god showed them mercy Where have I seen huge contradictions like that before... Oh yeah, the bible. Again... I've tried before to explain these difficult verses in the OT. I've posted one explanation...you posted another. (thank you) As a believer in Jesus this does not bother me. The Bible a collection of books about God and people in history. God used people to write the story. I like that a lot better than gold plates falling from the sky. Back to the fray.... If I gave you an explanation on those difficult verses that you would accept, would you believe that Jesus is the Messiah? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roz Posted April 25, 2014 Author Share Posted April 25, 2014 How original of Ironpony, William Lane Craig. Ok, let's line that up against another christian, Paul Copan. WLC, Paul Copan, and Ironpony all believe they're genuine christians. Copan: He argues that only enemy combatants were killed, that it's metaphoric language. Those male children were not really killed, it's a language issue! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1K8pEB2xic Craig: Those kids WERE killed, but god is showing them mercy by having them killed! Those kids automatically went to heaven as 'a result of their earthly life terminated.' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUMzYA3XSEc So we have 2 christians, genuine christians they tell us, that tell HUGELY DIFFERENT explanations about why their exact same god ordered kids be put to death. One is saying it's a language thing, the kids weren't really killed, only willing combatants were Another is saying that it's a good thing those kids died because god showed them mercy Where have I seen huge contradictions like that before... Oh yeah, the bible. Again... I've tried before to explain these difficult verses in the OT. I've posted one explanation...you posted another. (thank you) As a believer in Jesus this does not bother me. The Bible a collection of books about God and people in history. God used people to write the story. I like that a lot better than gold plates falling from the sky. Back to the fray.... If I gave you an explanation on those difficult verses that you would accept, would you believe that Jesus is the Messiah? No, because your explanation is really another man's explanation, which is contradictory with other people's explanations about the direct command of god. 1 god 1 command to kill children 1 very shocked Roz about why god commanded that 1 repository of vastly different explanations from many christians about why their 1 god commanded that If I gave you an explanation on those difficult verses, would you believe that christianity is just bogus? I suspect not, because you believe what you want to believe, regardless of evidence that are contradictory. Good job, Ironpony, that's being a good religionist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roz Posted April 25, 2014 Author Share Posted April 25, 2014 I can't believe someone would actually use "If I gave you my explanation, would you believe it?" and then balk at me wanting to compare that explanation with other explanations to see if it stays consistent or not. It's just too hilarious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 How original of Ironpony, William Lane Craig. Ok, let's line that up against another christian, Paul Copan. WLC, Paul Copan, and Ironpony all believe they're genuine christians. Copan: He argues that only enemy combatants were killed, that it's metaphoric language. Those male children were not really killed, it's a language issue! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1K8pEB2xic Craig: Those kids WERE killed, but god is showing them mercy by having them killed! Those kids automatically went to heaven as 'a result of their earthly life terminated.' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUMzYA3XSEc So we have 2 christians, genuine christians they tell us, that tell HUGELY DIFFERENT explanations about why their exact same god ordered kids be put to death. One is saying it's a language thing, the kids weren't really killed, only willing combatants were Another is saying that it's a good thing those kids died because god showed them mercy Where have I seen huge contradictions like that before... Oh yeah, the bible. Again... I've tried before to explain these difficult verses in the OT. I've posted one explanation...you posted another. (thank you) As a believer in Jesus this does not bother me. The Bible a collection of books about God and people in history. God used people to write the story. I like that a lot better than gold plates falling from the sky. Back to the fray.... If I gave you an explanation on those difficult verses that you would accept, would you believe that Jesus is the Messiah? No, because your explanation is really another man's explanation, which is contradictory with other people's explanations about the direct command of god. 1 god 1 command to kill children 1 very shocked Roz about why god commanded that 1 repository of vastly different explanations from many christians about why their 1 god commanded that If I gave you an explanation on those difficult verses, would you believe that christianity is just bogus? I suspect not, because you believe what you want to believe, regardless of evidence that are contradictory. Good job, Ironpony, that's being a good religionist. I believe Jesus was God. I believe what is recorded about him in the Gospels. To me, it's that simple. As far as dissecting the scriptures to make them all line up in perfect harmony, I enjoy reading and studying them, but my faith is in Christ, not in my human understanding of all the mysteries of God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest afireinside Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 I love The Lions Den! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roz Posted April 25, 2014 Author Share Posted April 25, 2014 How original of Ironpony, William Lane Craig. Ok, let's line that up against another christian, Paul Copan. WLC, Paul Copan, and Ironpony all believe they're genuine christians. Copan: He argues that only enemy combatants were killed, that it's metaphoric language. Those male children were not really killed, it's a language issue! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1K8pEB2xic Craig: Those kids WERE killed, but god is showing them mercy by having them killed! Those kids automatically went to heaven as 'a result of their earthly life terminated.' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUMzYA3XSEc So we have 2 christians, genuine christians they tell us, that tell HUGELY DIFFERENT explanations about why their exact same god ordered kids be put to death. One is saying it's a language thing, the kids weren't really killed, only willing combatants were Another is saying that it's a good thing those kids died because god showed them mercy Where have I seen huge contradictions like that before... Oh yeah, the bible. Again... I've tried before to explain these difficult verses in the OT. I've posted one explanation...you posted another. (thank you) As a believer in Jesus this does not bother me. The Bible a collection of books about God and people in history. God used people to write the story. I like that a lot better than gold plates falling from the sky. Back to the fray.... If I gave you an explanation on those difficult verses that you would accept, would you believe that Jesus is the Messiah? No, because your explanation is really another man's explanation, which is contradictory with other people's explanations about the direct command of god. 1 god 1 command to kill children 1 very shocked Roz about why god commanded that 1 repository of vastly different explanations from many christians about why their 1 god commanded that If I gave you an explanation on those difficult verses, would you believe that christianity is just bogus? I suspect not, because you believe what you want to believe, regardless of evidence that are contradictory. Good job, Ironpony, that's being a good religionist. I believe Jesus was God. I believe what is recorded about him in the Gospels. To me, it's that simple. As far as dissecting the scriptures to make them all line up in perfect harmony, I enjoy reading and studying them, but my faith is in Christ, not in my human understanding of all the mysteries of God. From christianese to English: I believe in someone that once ordered humans just like me to kill infants and toddlers. I don't understand why, but I believed him when he said he loves me and seeks to rescue me. Amazingly, this is, in my opinion, the exact line of reasoning "values voters" and "moral majority" members use when they vote "bible." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreeThinkerNZ Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 How original of Ironpony, William Lane Craig. Ok, let's line that up against another christian, Paul Copan. WLC, Paul Copan, and Ironpony all believe they're genuine christians. Copan: He argues that only enemy combatants were killed, that it's metaphoric language. Those male children were not really killed, it's a language issue! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1K8pEB2xic Craig: Those kids WERE killed, but god is showing them mercy by having them killed! Those kids automatically went to heaven as 'a result of their earthly life terminated.' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUMzYA3XSEc So we have 2 christians, genuine christians they tell us, that tell HUGELY DIFFERENT explanations about why their exact same god ordered kids be put to death. One is saying it's a language thing, the kids weren't really killed, only willing combatants were Another is saying that it's a good thing those kids died because god showed them mercy Where have I seen huge contradictions like that before... Oh yeah, the bible. Again... I've tried before to explain these difficult verses in the OT. I've posted one explanation...you posted another. (thank you) As a believer in Jesus this does not bother me. The Bible a collection of books about God and people in history. God used people to write the story. I like that a lot better than gold plates falling from the sky. Back to the fray.... If I gave you an explanation on those difficult verses that you would accept, would you believe that Jesus is the Messiah? Please show me your evidence that anything in the bible's story happened in "history". Oh that's right, you don't need any evidence to believe that Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, David, Solomon and Jesus were actual people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Moderator TheRedneckProfessor Posted April 25, 2014 Super Moderator Share Posted April 25, 2014 And yet Passover and Jesus are a-okay...?The story of Noah The story of Sodom & Gomorrah The story of Passover The story of Job The story of Abraham and Isaac Why celebrate stories of God killing or willing the deaths of innocent people? It's fucked up. True justice is God going to hell forever in our place. Your sentence, "True justice is God going to hell forever in our place." is close to what happened. True justice would be us going to hell. Instead Jesus took our place. One writer I read put it this way....six hours of eternity on a cross. Fuck that, TinPony. In what kind of parallel universe does six hours equate to eternity? And jesus didn't really die and go to hell; he rose again after a whopping three days. How is that anything at all like an individual suffering eternal conscious torment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Moderator TheRedneckProfessor Posted April 25, 2014 Super Moderator Share Posted April 25, 2014 What did Jesus say that is unclear to you? "For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future." Jeremiah 29:11 This is unclear to me because, if you were to take the time to read my testimony you'd see that every time I launched out into "god's plan for my life" I ended up getting my teeth kicked in. So clearly, in my experience, god's plans don't work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Moderator TheRedneckProfessor Posted April 25, 2014 Super Moderator Share Posted April 25, 2014 When jesus specifically commanded the deaths of infants for one. Care to explain that to me? That's one big fucking warning sign that says "don't vote for that guy!" Remember, he and his father are "one." So that means he was there and he commanded that. I've tried before to explain these difficult verses in the OT. If I gave you an explanation on those verses that you accepted, would you believe that Jesus is the Messiah? No, because you still haven't sufficiently explained the contradictions in the four gospels that tell us about jesus' supposed life and ministry. You simply say, "These contradictions are minor discrepancies that prove jesus is real." Trust me, TinPony; I've come up against far more intelligent appall-ogists than you in my day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bornagainathiest Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 And yet Passover and Jesus are a-okay...?The story of Noah The story of Sodom & Gomorrah The story of Passover The story of Job The story of Abraham and Isaac Why celebrate stories of God killing or willing the deaths of innocent people? It's fucked up. True justice is God going to hell forever in our place. Your sentence, "True justice is God going to hell forever in our place." is close to what happened. True justice would be us going to hell. Instead Jesus took our place. One writer I read put it this way....six hours of eternity on a cross. Ironhorse, Why have you started a fresh dialog in this thread when you gave me your word you'd answer the questions put to you? (That was a rhetorical question, btw. Please don't answer it. Instead, live up to you promise and answer the outstanding questions.) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bornagainathiest Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 This is the god who could encapsulate fucking ETERNITY of hell on six hours on a cross, but yet can't make a square circle or make his bible without contradictions. He can bend space and time, but yet can't make his book free from error. God works in mysterious ways. And I'm glad If we could figure it all out...what fun would that be Your definition of fun has killed your fellow christians by fellow christians, has killed those who follow a different religion or no religion by fellow christians. If god is a king, and he has given free choice if humans would choose his rule or not, then the kindest thing he can do is to make it impeccably clear to every human his rule and government. This is what we demand of our elected officials, this is why 'lying politician' is a common pejorative. You would rather humans be confused, because that would be fun for you. How arrogant of you, but expected. What did Jesus say that is unclear to you? JESUS SAID... ANSWER THE QUESTIONS PUT TO YOU IRONHORSE! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bornagainathiest Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 When jesus specifically commanded the deaths of infants for one. Care to explain that to me? That's one big fucking warning sign that says "don't vote for that guy!" Remember, he and his father are "one." So that means he was there and he commanded that. I've tried before to explain these difficult verses in the OT. If I gave you an explanation on those verses that you accepted, would you believe that Jesus is the Messiah? Ironhorse, Please apologize to Roz and tell her that you cannot continue this dialog, because you gave BAA your word that you'd answer the backlog of questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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