Did The Devil Make Me Do It Or Was It God?

[Mister Pappy]

When I was a child I remember asking my Mother a simple question about God. "Mom how do I know if God is talking to me." I had already been instructed regarding "how" God talks to humans - still small voice inside etc..., but I had all kinds of thoughts in my head. Which ones were God talking to me? Which ones were the Devil? The shit was down right confusing to a tot like me. Of course at this age, my questions were answered quickly and easily by my dear Mother, who knew everything there was to know about God, and I believed whatever she would come up with - like all good little boys should. To this question she replied, "Son, God will never tell you to do something bad, thats how you know." Wow, that was easy. However, these days, my Mother doesn't like answering my questions as much. I still like asking them though - most of the time just for fun - for me, not her. I know its not very nice, but sometimes I can't help myself.

 

Not long ago, we were speaking on the phone - she still lives in Mississippi and I in Wyoming, so we have long weekly conversations. The subject turned to religion, as it so often does. I was making a case about how everyone with an agenda seems to promote that agenda by way of the "God told me" disclaimer. The idiots who flew airplanes into the world trade center were doing what God told them to do. The bombers of abortion clinics are only carrying out God's direct orders and on and on the tales of God speaking to mankind to do this thing or the other goes. Of course her answer was still the same, "God doesn't tell people to do bad things son. Surely you know that."

 

So, I unpacked the Abraham / Issac story on her. You know the one - God tells Abraham to take his son up the mountain and cut his throat - kill him dead, as a sacrifice. Abraham must not have had a Mom like mine to have warned him that God doesn't tell folks to do bad things, because as the story goes, he took the bait - hook, line, and sinker! I got an unusual response from my Mother, after presenting that bit of wisdom - no response at all. She suddenly had to go, and we haven't taken the subject back up. I think I will leave it alone.

 

Yes, I know the answer, but find it amazing that Christians use such easily unraveled "antilogic" to self-delude, for their entire lives. There is no rational explanation for Christians not to auto-assume that anyone, telling any tale whatsoever, is within their right to claim it comes from God, regardless of how obviously screwed up it may be. The line is non-existent - it can't be crossed, because its not there. There simply is NO test of an authentic "Godly order". All things are permissible, and all things are possibly "of GOD". Who said "God is not the author of confusion"?

 

WTF?

[lunaticheathen]

In my reading of the bible, Abraham's god LOVES to order all kinds of unseemly things. Cutting foreskins of enemies and stacking them to the tops of tent-poles, smashing babies' heads on rocks, slaughtering whole cities - sometimes he does these things himself. He had his own son killed by Romans to save people from the very rules he made up.

Anyone who says this god wouldn't order anyone to do something "bad" has a very odd view of good and evil.

[oddbird1963]

God is just a Rorschach test with people projecting their own wishes and desires onto a nebulous conceptual entity called "God."

 

Many trillions of words have been published to try to make the concept of god something more profound than that.

 

To try to find order within all that projection is maddening.

[Vomit Comet]

I kind of have borderline OCD tendencies. Could just be a symptom of Asperger's. So then they told me that the devil is constantly trying to put thoughts in my fucking head. Good Christ that was the recipe for yet another nervous breakdown. I must have been led to believe that 55% of the thoughts that occurred in my consciousness were demonic implants. Okay, so you're a 15 year old boy and a pair of titties pops up in your mind's eye, as it does about once every ten seconds. "Ack! A demon is trying to rape my neo-cortex! Out out out!!!"

 

I'm just glad I wasn't schizophrenic on top of that, or else I would've stuck a screwdriver up my eye socket and scraped for dear life.

[par4dcourse]

It was the devil obviously. Flip Wilson had a bout with him too.

 

 

[Mister Pappy]

Okay, so you're a 15 year old boy and a pair of titties pops up in your mind's eye, as it does about once every ten seconds. "Ack! A demon is trying to rape my neo-cortex! Out out out!!!"

Comet,

 

Thanks so much for this! I haven't laughed this hard in a long time!

 

 

[par4dcourse]

Okay, so you're a 15 year old boy and a pair of titties pops up in your mind's eye, as it does about once every ten seconds. "Ack! A demon is trying to rape my neo-cortex! Out out out!!!"

Comet,

 

Thanks so much for this! I haven't laughed this hard in a long time!

 

 

 

+1

 

ten seconds? I remember it being much more frequently.

 

 

 

[Guest end3]

When I was a child I remember asking my Mother a simple question about God. "Mom how do I know if God is talking to me." I had already been instructed regarding "how" God talks to humans - still small voice inside etc..., but I had all kinds of thoughts in my head. Which ones were God talking to me? Which ones were the Devil? The shit was down right confusing to a tot like me. Of course at this age, my questions were answered quickly and easily by my dear Mother, who knew everything there was to know about God, and I believed whatever she would come up with - like all good little boys should. To this question she replied, "Son, God will never tell you to do something bad, thats how you know." Wow, that was easy. However, these days, my Mother doesn't like answering my questions much. I still like asking them though - most of the time just for fun - for me, not her. I know its not very nice, but sometimes I can't help myself.

 

Not long ago, we were speaking on the phone - she still lives in Mississippi and I in Wyoming, so we have long weekly conversations. The subject turned to religion, as it so often does. I was making a case about how everyone with an agenda seems to promote that agenda by way of the "God told me" disclaimer. The idiots who flew airplanes into the world trade center were doing what God told them to do. The bombers of abortion clinics are only carrying out God's direct orders and on and on the tales of God speaking to mankind to do this thing or the other goes. Of course her answer was still the same, "God doesn't tell people to do bad things son. Surely you know that."

 

So, I unpacked the Abraham / Issac story on her. You know the one - God tells Abraham to take his son up the mountain and cut his throat - kill him dead, as a sacrifice. Abraham must not have had a Mom like mine to have warned him that God doesn't tell folks to do bad things, because as the story goes, he took the bait - hook, line, and sinker! I got an unusual response from my Mother, after presenting that bit of wisdom - no response at all. She suddenly had to go, and we haven't taken the subject back up. I think I will leave it alone.

 

Yes, I know the answer, but find it amazing that Christians use such easily unraveled "antilogic" to self-delude, for their entire lives. There is no rational explanation for Christians not to auto-assume that anyone, telling any tale whatsoever, is within their right to claim it comes from God, regardless of how obviously screwed up it may be. The line is non-existent - it can't be crossed, because its not there. There simply is NO test of an authentic "Godly order". All things are permissible, and all things are possibly "of GOD". Who said "God is not the author of confusion"?

 

WTF?

 

 

Something must have made you treat your mother this way......It is hard for me to imagine an adult male treating his mother like this......maybe confronting a father when they are still big enough to kick your ass would be a fair fight....but pinning mom down is just being an ass.

 

BTW......perhaps you should shut your piehole and listen to your mother more often....she sounds like a nice woman. And if that is you in your characture (sp), shutting your piehole looks like a priority.

[oddbird1963]

Something must have made you treat your mother this way......It is hard for me to imagine an adult male treating his mother like this......maybe confronting a father when they are still big enough to kick your ass would be a fair fight....but pinning mom down is just being an ass.

 

BTW......perhaps you should shut your piehole and listen to your mother more often....she sounds like a nice woman. And if that is you in your characture (sp), shutting your piehole looks like a priority.

 

I think you're making a snap judgment based on your previous discussions with Pappy. He talks with his mom a lot. They have a history of talking religion. She said the "god doesn't tell people to do bad things" line. He brought up the Abraham tale as a counter example.

 

You may have gotten an ass kicking in your house for discussing such heavy issues in a thoughtful manner. If so, I am sorry for that. But many functional families have lively discussions and still love one another.

 

Pappy said nothing here to deserve an ass kicking. It all depends on the nature of their relationship, something which you have no insight to or knowledge of.

 

Why don't you shut your mouth, End, and let Pappy and his mom deal with their own relationship?

[Guest end3]

Something must have made you treat your mother this way......It is hard for me to imagine an adult male treating his mother like this......maybe confronting a father when they are still big enough to kick your ass would be a fair fight....but pinning mom down is just being an ass.

 

BTW......perhaps you should shut your piehole and listen to your mother more often....she sounds like a nice woman. And if that is you in your characture (sp), shutting your piehole looks like a priority.

 

I think you're making a snap judgment based on your previous discussions with Pappy. He talks with his mom a lot. They have a history of talking religion. She said the "god doesn't tell people to do bad things" line. He brought up the Abraham tale as a counter example.

 

You may have gotten an ass kicking in your house for discussing such heavy issues in a thoughtful manner. If so, I am sorry for that. But many functional families have lively discussions and still love one another.

 

Pappy said nothing here to deserve an ass kicking. It all depends on the nature of their relationship, something which you have no insight to or knowledge of.

 

Why don't you shut your mouth, End, and let Pappy and his mom deal with their own relationship?

 

 

That it had anything to do with different beliefs....I disagree. He is looking for acknowledgment that it was ok to do. Gheez

[oddbird1963]

End3,

 

Nowhere in his post does Pappy ask our advice about how he treats his mother.

 

He is soliciting opinions about how to justify, according to christian theology, whether God is telling you to do something since so many contradictory and evil things have been done in the name of god by many groups and individuals.

 

None of the other responses to him but yours mentions his mother.

 

If that is what you got from his post, then I sincerely advise you to reread his post.

 

If I am wrong about his intentions, then I apologize.

 

But, as it stands, I don't think it was appropriate of you to try to engage in shaming behavior in regards to Pappy and his mother.

[Sconnor]

Something must have made you treat your mother this way......It is hard for me to imagine an adult male treating his mother like this......maybe confronting a father when they are still big enough to kick your ass would be a fair fight....but pinning mom down is just being an ass.

 

BTW......perhaps you should shut your piehole and listen to your mother more often....she sounds like a nice woman. And if that is you in your characture (sp), shutting your piehole looks like a priority.

 

I think you're making a snap judgment based on your previous discussions with Pappy. He talks with his mom a lot. They have a history of talking religion. She said the "god doesn't tell people to do bad things" line. He brought up the Abraham tale as a counter example.

 

You may have gotten an ass kicking in your house for discussing such heavy issues in a thoughtful manner. If so, I am sorry for that. But many functional families have lively discussions and still love one another.

 

Pappy said nothing here to deserve an ass kicking. It all depends on the nature of their relationship, something which you have no insight to or knowledge of.

 

Why don't you shut your mouth, End, and let Pappy and his mom deal with their own relationship?

 

 

That it had anything to do with different beliefs....I disagree. He is looking for acknowledgment that it was ok to do. Gheez

 

Ahhhhhh, yes -- dick-head is still offering grossly unqualified psychological diagnoses over the internet based solely on conjecture.

 

Notice how he can NOT address the specifics of Pappy’s post?

 

Oh and BTW end, you are still a christian fuck-tard who makes bullshit claims about god’s will and character, which you can NOT substantiate.

 

Now you’re a christian fuck-tard who makes unqualified bullshit accusations about peoples behaviors toward their mom, which has NOTHING to do with anything. You have to be in a constant state of diverging in order to protect your pathetic god-beliefs.

 

Instead of questioning Pappy’s character (a fallacious tactic of diversion to be sure) why don’t you provide some objective evidence for ALL the unsubstantiated vomit you spew here every day -- you unmitigated delusional, bull-shitter.

 

Additionally, a person posting here could be the most uncompassionate mean-spirited asshole toward his mother but it doesn’t make ANY of your unsubstantiated horse-shit god-claims anymore true.

 

--S.

[Guest end3]

Something must have made you treat your mother this way......It is hard for me to imagine an adult male treating his mother like this......maybe confronting a father when they are still big enough to kick your ass would be a fair fight....but pinning mom down is just being an ass.

 

BTW......perhaps you should shut your piehole and listen to your mother more often....she sounds like a nice woman. And if that is you in your characture (sp), shutting your piehole looks like a priority.

 

I think you're making a snap judgment based on your previous discussions with Pappy. He talks with his mom a lot. They have a history of talking religion. She said the "god doesn't tell people to do bad things" line. He brought up the Abraham tale as a counter example.

 

You may have gotten an ass kicking in your house for discussing such heavy issues in a thoughtful manner. If so, I am sorry for that. But many functional families have lively discussions and still love one another.

 

Pappy said nothing here to deserve an ass kicking. It all depends on the nature of their relationship, something which you have no insight to or knowledge of.

 

Why don't you shut your mouth, End, and let Pappy and his mom deal with their own relationship?

 

 

That it had anything to do with different beliefs....I disagree. He is looking for acknowledgment that it was ok to do. Gheez

 

Ahhhhhh, yes -- dick-head is still offering grossly unqualified psychological diagnoses over the internet based solely on conjecture.

 

Notice how he can NOT address the specifics of Pappy’s post?

 

Oh and BTW end, you are still a christian fuck-tard who makes bullshit claims about god’s will and character, which you can NOT substantiate.

 

Now you’re a christian fuck-tard who makes unqualified bullshit accusations about peoples behaviors toward their mom, which has NOTHING to do with anything. You have to be in a constant state of diverging in order to protect your pathetic god-beliefs.

 

Instead of questioning Pappy’s character (a fallacious tactic of diversion to be sure) why don’t you provide some objective evidence for ALL the unsubstantiated vomit you spew here every day -- you unmitigated delusional, bull-shitter.

 

Additionally, a person posting here could be the most uncompassionate mean-spirited asshole toward his mother but it doesn’t make ANY of your unsubstantiated horse-shit god-claims anymore true.

 

--S.

 

 

There you go Pappy, another asshole that thinks it's OK to be graceless to their mother.

[Sconnor]

Something must have made you treat your mother this way......It is hard for me to imagine an adult male treating his mother like this......maybe confronting a father when they are still big enough to kick your ass would be a fair fight....but pinning mom down is just being an ass.

 

BTW......perhaps you should shut your piehole and listen to your mother more often....she sounds like a nice woman. And if that is you in your characture (sp), shutting your piehole looks like a priority.

 

I think you're making a snap judgment based on your previous discussions with Pappy. He talks with his mom a lot. They have a history of talking religion. She said the "god doesn't tell people to do bad things" line. He brought up the Abraham tale as a counter example.

 

You may have gotten an ass kicking in your house for discussing such heavy issues in a thoughtful manner. If so, I am sorry for that. But many functional families have lively discussions and still love one another.

 

Pappy said nothing here to deserve an ass kicking. It all depends on the nature of their relationship, something which you have no insight to or knowledge of.

 

Why don't you shut your mouth, End, and let Pappy and his mom deal with their own relationship?

 

 

That it had anything to do with different beliefs....I disagree. He is looking for acknowledgment that it was ok to do. Gheez

 

Ahhhhhh, yes -- dick-head is still offering grossly unqualified psychological diagnoses over the internet based solely on conjecture.

 

Notice how he can NOT address the specifics of Pappy’s post?

 

Oh and BTW end, you are still a christian fuck-tard who makes bullshit claims about god’s will and character, which you can NOT substantiate.

 

Now you’re a christian fuck-tard who makes unqualified bullshit accusations about peoples behaviors toward their mom, which has NOTHING to do with anything. You have to be in a constant state of diverging in order to protect your pathetic god-beliefs.

 

Instead of questioning Pappy’s character (a fallacious tactic of diversion to be sure) why don’t you provide some objective evidence for ALL the unsubstantiated vomit you spew here every day -- you unmitigated delusional, bull-shitter.

 

Additionally, a person posting here could be the most uncompassionate mean-spirited asshole toward his mother but it doesn’t make ANY of your unsubstantiated horse-shit god-claims anymore true.

 

--S.

 

 

There you go Pappy, another asshole that thinks it's OK to be graceless to their mother.

 

I never argued that, it’s OK to be graceless to their mother.

 

Obviously, you have a difficult time digesting information and my response, above, completely escapes you.

 

And, oh yeah -- you’re still a deranged christian lunatic asshole, with ZERO CREDIBILITY, who makes up unsubstantiated shit and passes it off as holy writ from gods mind to yours.

Cuckoo, cuckoo, cuckoo............

 

[Guest end3]

 

That your wife? I'm sorry, my mistake, your wife comes with a air compressor.

 

You're right though, I give your posts such a cursory reading because they always say the same thing.

 

"You have NO objective evidence!!!" blah blah, "idosyncratic" blah blah, "deluded Christian", blah blah "NO CREDIBILITY" blah de blah blah. See, mind memory already.....lol, idiot.

[Phanta]

Cutting foreskins of enemies and stacking them to the tops of tent-poles,

 

That's in the Bible?

[Mister Pappy]

Something must have made you treat your mother this way......It is hard for me to imagine an adult male treating his mother like this......maybe confronting a father when they are still big enough to kick your ass would be a fair fight....but pinning mom down is just being an ass.

 

BTW......perhaps you should shut your piehole and listen to your mother more often....she sounds like a nice woman. And if that is you in your characture (sp), shutting your piehole looks like a priority.

Ahhh, end ..... Under normal conditions, I haven't been a member here long enough to find ANYONE hopelessly ignorant. Not that I haven't encountered a few people who fit that description in the past, but I am typically very slow to place an individual into that category. You are the one and only exception. I read your post earlier, not long after you posted it, and have waited until now to respond, in hopes that I could think of a way to put this constructively. Only now, after counting to 11,000,017, I will try to respond. I don't think there is anything I can say to you that's going to change your blackened heart, but here goes nothing.

 

Aside from my wife, my Mother is my best friend. We talk about everything under the sun - always have. I am 43 years old now, but never go more than 3 or 4 days without having a long phone conversation with her. We are unusually close, especially considering the fact that she is as fundy as they come. I began my deconversion from Christianity between the ages of 16 and 17. Aside from the first year or two of that awful period, I have never had cross words with my Mother when discussing religion and our opposing views - never. In fact, our relationship has become one where we pick at each other regularly. It is part of our relationship and something I cherish. She sends me "infidel or heathen" jokes that belittle my position. I will return a "sick Christian" joke back to her. It is always funny for both of us. She doesn't try to convert me, and I don't try to convert her. We just talk, and play a game called "Who can get the high ground today?".

 

The conversation in question ended up being less "funny" than most of our talks - probably because she had nothing real smart, like she usually does, to come back with. It made her think. In the original post, I stated that "I have decided to leave it alone". Why do you think I would do that if my mission was to "pin my Mother down", as you have suggested in your blubbering post above? If there is one Christian on the planet that I have total respect for, it is her. She is the one and only Christian, who I have contact with, that accepts who I am, while not agreeing with me, in any way, on the subject of religion.

 

You are a fool sir. You should be realizing that about right now, but probably not. You will likely want to argue with me about my Mother for the next 20 pages or so, but that's just one of the things that makes you a fool. I am not much into the whole name calling dialog with people online. I don't see the point in it, so I want you to understand that when I call you a fool, I'm not retaliating or trying to hurt your feelings. I am identifying you as accurately as I can, and you sir, are a bumbling fool.

 

But, as it stands, I don't think it was appropriate of you to try to engage in shaming behavior in regards to Pappy and his mother.

Thank you for coming to my defense oddbird. I am sure that end intended his reprimand to be "shaming". It was not. I am stupefied by this guy.

[Mister Pappy]

That your wife? I'm sorry, my mistake, your wife comes with a air compressor.

Is this an example of the respect that you show to women? Do you realize that you are speaking to a gentleman, whom you have never met, about his wife? Dude, I think you are a cowardly little person, who has become as vile as you are online, because you find yourself so intimidated in you interactions with people face to face. You really shouldn't talk to people that way. Do you honestly desire for everyone to despise you? This type of behavior is only going to make you feel like less of a man that you already feel. You can't hide from YOURSELF simply because you have anonymity with us.

 

As a side note: It doesn't appear that your religion is working very well to help you become a better person. Perhaps you should try Atheism. It could help you to realize the importance of having peace and happiness on earth, as opposed to putting it off till your life after death idea. I really think it would work better for you than the current faith in Jesus Christ thing you've got going on there bro.

[Mister Pappy]

maybe confronting a father when they are still big enough to kick your ass would be a fair fight....

Is this the kind of response that you deem appropriate when asked a tough question? If this is how you were responded to by your parents as you went through stages of questioning, maybe I understand better why you still claim to believe the crap.

[Sconnor]

 

That your wife? I'm sorry, my mistake, your wife comes with a air compressor.

 

Brilliant comeback end, that took you all of two seconds to come up with – that’s your wife…… air compressor? Very christian of ya’. You’re wittier than Mark Twain -- you’re a fucking comic genius. (massive sarcasm for the sarcastically-challenged)

 

You should bag the whole religious nut-job act and take your show on the road.

 

Considering you have NO credibility and can NOT substantiate ANY of your bullshit god-claims – the only thing you’re left with are infantile retorts and making false accusations about people’s character.

 

Go figure? That’s what you’re good at – making shit up about people’s and god’s character. Can’t blame you really – it ALL comes from your diseased mind.

 

Either substantiate your inane god-claims or fuck off.

 

--S.

[Mister Pappy]

Either substantiate your inane god-claims or fuck off.

With critical thinking skills like this guy has, don't you think your asking a bit much Sconnor?

[Guest end3]

However, these days, my Mother doesn't like answering my questions as much. I still like asking them though - most of the time just for fun - for me, not her. I know its not very nice, but sometimes I can't help myself.

 

I got an unusual response from my Mother, after presenting that bit of wisdom - no response at all. She suddenly had to go, and we haven't taken the subject back up. I think I will leave it alone.

 

Yes, I know the answer, ..... Who said "God is not the author of confusion"?

 

WTF?

 

Here's what I read.....you convicted yourself....and hurt your mother to boot. At least she has the grace to be quiet.

 

I was just confirming your own guilt and voicing my opinion that only an incredible moronic stupid fuck jackass would do such.....but that's just me. Have a nice day.

[Guest end3]

maybe confronting a father when they are still big enough to kick your ass would be a fair fight....

Is this the kind of response that you deem appropriate when asked a tough question? If this is how you were responded to by your parents as you went through stages of questioning, maybe I understand better why you still claim to believe the crap.

 

You are a 43 year old man....not some 16 year old boy that needs to continually prove his mother incorrect. In other words, get over it already. One would think by now that you should be at some peace with your position after all these years of contemplation. I would think that you should now act as a mature person and not berate your mother with these type questions.....for HER sake, not yours.

[Guest end3]

The conversation in question ended up being less "funny" than most of our talks - probably because she had nothing real smart, like she usually does, to come back with. It made her think. In the original post, I stated that "I have decided to leave it alone". Why do you think I would do that if my mission was to "pin my Mother down", as you have suggested in your blubbering post above? If there is one Christian on the planet that I have total respect for, it is her. She is the one and only Christian, who I have contact with, that accepts who I am, while not agreeing with me, in any way, on the subject of religion.

 

Yeah, whatever, if you truly had respect for your mother, you would have considered it beforehand. You admitted to choosing this course. And by the context of your sentence, this isn't the first time you are realizing such. Quit trying to worm out of being a worm.

 

However, these days, my Mother doesn't like answering my questions as much. I still like asking them though - most of the time just for fun - for me, not her. I know its not very nice, but sometimes I can't help myself.

[Ouroboros]

Cutting foreskins of enemies and stacking them to the tops of tent-poles,

 

That's in the Bible?

I think it's part of one of the Bible stories about Sampson, and there's some story about David too. They really had a penis fixation back then.