The Cult Test

[Sissi71]

For me the most difficult right now is this anger. The smallest feeling of hold over me and I can be like a volcano. The magma is not far away. Some fundamentalist christians try these last days to have contact with me and I am just taking my distance. I could be very very mad.....this is this anger

I kept in me so many years when I realized incoherences and I had to trust the Lord anyway. I fuck him

[Sunny49]

 

 

I think some people recover from the bulk of it faster. But everyone has a moment or two many years later when it's a terrible flash back to the negative events in the past. The human mind "holds" things in the dark when we cannot deal with it properly. When those things surface it creates distress. But that's just our mind letting it out, purging it. And everyone is different in how they cope. Take it one day at a time. Admit to yourself that you are having a bad day, it really helps. And remember that tomorrow is another clean slate to work with. If you feel like it's all too much, talk to a therapist or a help line. No one needs to be alone in dealing with the aftermath of the cult. We all heal differently. Remember, the end goal is to be healthy, however long it takes.

 

Thanks, London! I really appreciate this When I was 17 and it all happend, I expereinced enourmous fear, guilt and depression, I've never experenced something like this in my whole life, I couldn't deal with it because it was overwhelming me, so I suppressed it all and ran away from it. A couple of years later, when I thought I forgot about it, it all came back, but evan worse. I had a horrible panick attack and I ended up on psychiatry. I was dreaming that God was coming to take me and that I was gonna die. I woke up shaking. I had a feeling my soul is going out of my body. Crazy! Christianity is really VERY harmful to me. I've been to a therapist and it helped me a lot. She told me that the stories about Satan and exorcism are non sense just like stories about vampires. Now, I'm going through it little by little, day by day and it's getting better slowly

 

"For me the most difficult right now is this anger."

 

Me too, but mostly I'm angry at myself for being that stupid and believing them.

[Sissi71]

I'm angry but I also notice I'm changing step by step and try to figure out that god and jesus do not exist and there is no reason to be angry. It help

me to find peace again. However when a fundamentist christian try to accuse me or say for example that I've never been a christian, or feel the right to judge me like if he were able to read my past, this abuse upset me and I just refuse all contact. Yesterday I received a greeting card from a christian women which is fundamentalist and I just keep silence because I know if I inform her I left christianity I would receive a big letter full of verse warning me I'm going to hell, etc....it is not in my character to keep silence but I need to protect me and I have no other choice. Her mother if very accusative I remember I was in her house some years ago and her son with wife came (they are not believers) and she said : "here is my house you have no right to criticize the bible !!"....these people are so indoctrined and think they are so true, that all dialog is impossible. Trying to argue and you will waste a lot of time for nothing....They want we resect their beliefs but they don't toward yourself....they are so disrespectful that you have no choice to cut all ties with them. They are so obsessed about your salvation and reconverting you. I had this experience with a baptist woman in my family....I just had to erase her in my facebook friends and blocked the access to my profile. As soon I confronted her with reason and no answers to my prayers, she became more aggressive while she tried "love bombing" 2 minutes ago....her answer was something like " you must accept God's will and that he does not answer to your prayers", "I dont believe in deconverting but I think that a person has never been a christian"....etc....When the dialog just stopped I said my self "she is really ready for a psychatric hospital"....

[Sunny49]

I'm also afraid of fundamentalist christians, when I say I'm not a christian or that I deconverted they try to reconvert me telling me how "God" is wonderful, how he loves me, how I don't understand it correctly, that I should go to their pastor cause he is good at explaining it to people...they make me feel so guilty again. I start feeling like a bad person again. They are so self assured, they think they are wonderful and the smartest people on earth. Then I start to doubt: "what if I really understood it all wrong?" "Maybe I was just immature back then?" "Maybe if I look at it from a different perspective it will all make sense?"

Do you have these doubts? How do you fight them?

 

P.S. I read at some christian web page:

 

Q. What is the right attitude towards non christians?

A. We should pity them.

 

Disgusting.

[VacuumFlux]

@badpuppy: But, do you think it harms everyone? I always thought there are some people who are ok with it....who are maybe not so sensitive or I don't know. What do you think?

 

I think everybody psychologically responds to their environments in different ways. Like I can step back and watch my brother and *I* feel there is empirical harm being done to him being inside literalistic Christianity. However, he may not feel that way. At least not at this time. If he ever deconverts he may feel "permission" to think those unthinkable thoughts. But if he remains forever in Christianity (which seems fairly likely to me), he may never see himself as a "victim" of Christianity as a faith. He doesn't have the proper reference point to see it that way.

 

So can I stand back and say he's been harmed? I don't know. From my perspective he has been, but from his perspective the religion itself isn't abusive. Do I have the right to categorize "other people's" experiences? I don't think that I do. Only the experiencer can really determine how something has affected them or not affected them. It is the victim's right to determine the level of harm they feel they've suffered. I think a therapist or other type of support system can help someone to see and deal with how something may have affected them, but I think we have to be careful not to project our own feelings and reactions onto other people, "creating" a trauma or upset they didn't feel until we manufactured it for them. (A good example of this is extreme feminists who have successfully put "oppressed and victimized" feelings into women who never would have thought men were out to oppress them otherwise.)

 

In Christianity, clearly not everyone is equally harmed. Whether that's because they can't logically think through the situation or they are more emotionally resilient or some other factor I'm not thinking of, I'm not sure.

 

Then there's the issue of people who've been so abused their whole lives that they don't know that anything different is possible or that the way they have been treated is unjust. For years I let people walk all over me, never stood up for myself, apologised when other people hurt me... because I didn't know there was any other option. I didn't know I had any right to defend myself. I never saw the harm done to me by christianity as unjust because all sinners deserve hell. I was taught that being nice is the good and right thing to do, and that your parents and other authorities are there to look out for me, that when they did things that I found hurtful I thought there was something wrong with me, not with them. I never even went through the teen rebellion stage properly (I sorta did in my mid-20s) because every time I had a "dishonoring" thought towards my parents I would feel guilty and try to make it go away. I was confused and scared when my friends would side with me instead of telling me I was wrong, so I quit discussing it with them.

 

I suppose in all that I did have the sense that something was wrong, but I thought there was something wrong with me. I hid it well, too, so most people had no idea how much pain I was in. I'd guess that people like me are a small percentage of those who seem to be ok with the whole christianity thing. But no one, from the outside, can tell who is who. So I wouldn't necessarily feel right telling someone that because I was traumatised by it that they must be as well, but I also consider it important to let potentially victimized people know that there other options out there that they can choose. Because a huge part of abuse is making the victim feel guilty and worthless so that they feel trapped.

 

On the other hand, christians sure think that we are being harmed by not being part of their religion, and I certainly don't appreciate attempts to be saved from something I don't find harmful.

[Sunny49]

"You are so right.

It has always been my opinion that the more religious a person is indicates just how depressed they are. I think that christianity is a substitute for medication. And a cult will only pray on those who are functioning at less than 100% of their normal functioning.

christianity is like advertising, it makes you think the product is amazing, until you get it home and it breaks. But christianity makes all the right excuses to trick you into believing that your life will be empty and sad without it. The very thing you were trying to avoid in the first place. You wanted to belong and be happy.

Medication can help that better than a cult that promises all these good things but abuses you mentally by saying that you are not good enough and tries to turn you into sheep.

 

So for the many of us who have left the cult there is double damage here. A personal search for happiness was taken away and smashed into a worse form of abuse. The original issue of unhappiness was not ever addressed, then the xian abuse commenced. People are not just recovering from a cult, they are also recovering from the original issue that led them to the cult. It's like twice baked potatos, except the potatos are tasty, the cult is just a bad taste that keeps returning like untreated acid reflux times 1000.

 

For me personally, whenever I try to really rationalize what people are thinking by being a part of xianity, I just remind myself that it's a cult, they do not control their mind. I step away and move on with my life. Let them be obsessed with death, I prefer to be obsessed with LIFE! "

 

I just saw this post! I definately agree with you, but also they mess up healthy people with making them feel gulity and worthless and then say that they are depressed cause they are not "connected to God". Yet, there's still much more lonely, depressed people who are attracted to religion. Also, ex addicts, what are they exchanging one addiction to other? I don't think they really cure them...Here's a great link:

 

http://people.howstuffworks.com/brainwashing.htm

 

 

@VacuumFlux Yeah, doesn't christianity teach us to accept abuse? Don't they teach as that we should sacrifize ourselves to be good? What does actually "turn the other cheek" mean?

[London]

I've been to a therapist and it helped me a lot. She told me that the stories about Satan and exorcism are non sense just like stories about vampires.

 

"For me the most difficult right now is this anger."

 

Me too, but mostly I'm angry at myself for being that stupid and believing them.

 

I just remind myself that the bible is a book of mythology, and a bad one at that. I love greek mythology, way more fun. The bible is like a bad action movie, all blood and explosions.

 

Let the anger out in a healthy way, but don't beat yourself up. You were conned into that cult. You know better now. Hating yourself is the xian way to deal with things. We all make judgement errors in our lives, we are human. Respecting and loving yourself is the best way to rid yourself of the cults effects.

[MultifariousBirdLady]

For me the most difficult right now is this anger.

The anger was hard for me, too. Over time and with greater understanding I found I could let that go more and more.

[MultifariousBirdLady]

Hating yourself is the xian way to deal with things.

 

It seems that I learned this so well that I keep falling back into it even though I've been out for a long time. I'd like to hear more about what you think about this issue and what your experience letting go of that has been. Perhaps this might even warrant a different thread...?

[London]

I'm angry but I also notice I'm changing step by step and try to figure out that god and jesus do not exist and there is no reason to be angry. It help

me to find peace again. However when a fundamentist christian try to accuse me or say for example that I've never been a christian,

If you never treated people badly, and you were kind and giving, then you never were a xian. Xians are mean, judgemental, hypocrites. I would say to that person, "You're right, I've never been a christian, I am a nice person, not a hate monger."

or feel the right to judge me like if he were able to read my past,

but they think they get to judge like god does, they don't read their bible, only their god gets to judge.

this abuse upset me and I just refuse all contact.

perfect! you do not have to be around toxic people. this is the best way to deal with them.

Yesterday I received a greeting card from a christian women which is fundamentalist and I just keep silence because I know if I inform her I left christianity I would receive a big letter full of verse warning me I'm going to hell, etc....it is not in my character to keep silence but I need to protect me and I have no other choice.

Silence can actually be a very powerful weapon if you know when to use it. It makes most people uncomfortable.

Her mother if very accusative I remember I was in her house some years ago and her son with wife came (they are not believers) and she said : "here is my house you have no right to criticize the bible !!"....these people are so indoctrined and think they are so true, that all dialog is impossible. Trying to argue and you will waste a lot of time for nothing....They want we resect their beliefs but they don't toward yourself....they are so disrespectful that you have no choice to cut all ties with them.

Again you are correct, delete all toxic people from your life. Listen to how you feel, the answers are inside you.

They are so obsessed about your salvation and reconverting you. I had this experience with a baptist woman in my family....I just had to erase her in my facebook friends and blocked the access to my profile. As soon I confronted her with reason and no answers to my prayers, she became more aggressive while she tried "love bombing" 2 minutes ago....her answer was something like " you must accept God's will and that he does not answer to your prayers", "I dont believe in deconverting but I think that a person has never been a christian"....etc....When the dialog just stopped I said my self "she is really ready for a psychatric hospital"....

Yes she is! Just tell her, "god told me that he wants you to pray for me." Everytime she tries to communicate with you, post that same thing. Just keep sending her off to pray.

 

When you cut them out of your life you prevent them from trying to manipulate you. Eventually when you have healed more, you can easily deal with them in person. It takes a while.

[London]

I'm also afraid of fundamentalist christians, when I say I'm not a christian or that I deconverted they try to reconvert me telling me how "God" is wonderful, how he loves me, how I don't understand it correctly, that I should go to their pastor cause he is good at explaining it to people...they make me feel so guilty again. I start feeling like a bad person again. They are so self assured, they think they are wonderful and the smartest people on earth. Then I start to doubt: "what if I really understood it all wrong?" "Maybe I was just immature back then?" "Maybe if I look at it from a different perspective it will all make sense?"

Do you have these doubts? How do you fight them?

 

P.S. I read at some christian web page:

 

Q. What is the right attitude towards non christians?

A. We should pity them.

 

Disgusting.

 

You see, they have no respect for humanity.

 

I never doubt them, ever. I am 1,000,000% positive they are fools.

 

The bible is full of contradictions, and the bibles out there are all different and there are books of the bible hidden in the basement of the vatican, not printed in any bible.

If the bible were the word of god, it would be in 1 language that all creatures could read. There would be only 1 religion that uses only 1 bible. A real god would make sure we knew what the rules are and he would be able to predict how we evolve because he made us.

There is no such book, it is a cult, made to control the masses. Not just fun mythology, but a cult based on the very evil that it warns us about.

I never doubt. I always look around me at the world. Watch the plants grow, know the science of why they grow, that is almost god-like to me. Yet it CAN be explained. Religion can NEVER be explained.

Happiness is not something you get after you die. It's something humans should experience throughout their entire lives.

Once I deleted the cult from my life, the walls blocking happiness were torn down forever. Kind of like the Berlin wall.

[London]

What does actually "turn the other cheek" mean?

 

I have always been taught that it means, Don't stoop to the other person's level, choose to be better than the negative behavior.

[London]

Hating yourself is the xian way to deal with things.

 

It seems that I learned this so well that I keep falling back into it even though I've been out for a long time. I'd like to hear more about what you think about this issue and what your experience letting go of that has been. Perhaps this might even warrant a different thread...?

 

My personal mantra is, "Humans First." Everything else comes second. In other words, you are speaking to a human first before all the other factors evolve, like age, gender, color, income, blah, blah, blah. Most people see it in reverse. The reality is that, only the humanity matters. Remove all the other factors. Break it down to Zero.

 

You are a human first.

 

However you would treat another human, is how you should treat yourself. No excuses, no exceptions.

 

example:

Let's say you spend time helping a friend repair their home. You are giving of yourself and your time. You are doing something good to help another person. And it is an exhausting task that you know, in the end, will really help your friend to live a better life.

 

But you come home exhausted every day to a home that needs more repair than the home you are helping to fix. You actually needed more help with your home than your friend needs with their home. Your quality of life needs repair.

 

 

If you treated yourself with respect, you would have repaired your home first, then helped your friend. You could have even had your friend stay with you while their home was being repaired. Remember this is just an example to illustrate a point.

 

So I will repeat,

However you would treat another human, is how you should treat yourself. No excuses, no exceptions.

 

I always think of the airline safety speech, "Put your oxygen mask on first, then help others who need assistance" Because the reality is, if we loose oxygen, it's all over, we're done, end of story.

I think of it like basic survival. Take care of me first, then help others when I can. Xians teach you that this is selfish and you should sacrifice your whole life for others. Guilt mind control in action. OBEY me!

 

No!

 

Having respect for yourself is not wrong. It's your life and you get to choose everything about it. You are the only person who gets to decide, not any of the other 7 billion people, just you.

[badpuppy]

I'm also afraid of fundamentalist christians, when I say I'm not a christian or that I deconverted they try to reconvert me telling me how "God" is wonderful, how he loves me, how I don't understand it correctly, that I should go to their pastor cause he is good at explaining it to people...they make me feel so guilty again. I start feeling like a bad person again. They are so self assured, they think they are wonderful and the smartest people on earth. Then I start to doubt: "what if I really understood it all wrong?" "Maybe I was just immature back then?" "Maybe if I look at it from a different perspective it will all make sense?"

Do you have these doubts? How do you fight them?

 

P.S. I read at some christian web page:

 

Q. What is the right attitude towards non christians?

A. We should pity them.

 

Disgusting.

 

You are not a bad person and they have no idea what they are talking about. Ask them how many books they've read by atheists. Ask how many books written NOT by Christians, but by believers in other faiths they've read. Ask how many other people's holy books they've read. Ask how many jews, buddhist monks, whatever hindu holy men are called, etc. they have personally spoken with. Ask. They will say "none". It's easy to think you have the one true truth when you've only been exposed to one option. Wheaties is the ONLY cereal when it's the only one you've personally eaten, but saying it's more awesome than Lucky Charms when you've never even held a box of Lucky Charms in your hands is foolish. People who have looked into many options are the only ones qualified to have an informed opinion.

 

Additionally... three year olds will tell you very seriously that Santa Claus is real. And a five year old who still believes may be able to point you to other five year olds who can tell you their reasons for believing. It doesnt' make them right. They're three and five. So are your Christian friends.

 

Re: pity... I think it's perfectly fair and fine for them to feel that way. After all, I pity them. I know that's condescending and self-righteous of me but it's still how I feel about it. I pity them their lack of expanded worldview. I pity them for all the ways they are restricted and constricted and made to live in terror and fear of imaginary things and the fake veneer that becomes their life. It's incredibly sad. And sure, that's pompous of me to say and I will cop to that, but holy hell... how can you not feel pity for grown adults who are so stunted?

[badpuppy]

@VacuumFlux, I agree. There are likely a lot of Christians who don't see themselves as victims for whatever weird psychological reason but who are victims. And I also agree that we can't know who is who to do anything about it. If someone insists over and over that they are fine and happy, then what can you do but respect their right to live that way? And I'm sorry for all the crap you went through, but it's good that you're out now.

[London]

 

They're three and five. So are your Christian friends.

 

It's incredibly sad.

 

... how can you not feel pity for grown adults who are so stunted?

 

Exactly, exactly, exactly, and thankfully we are not them!

[Sissi71]

I'm angry but I also notice I'm changing step by step and try to figure out that god and jesus do not exist and there is no reason to be angry. It help

me to find peace again. However when a fundamentist christian try to accuse me or say for example that I've never been a christian,

If you never treated people badly, and you were kind and giving, then you never were a xian. Xians are mean, judgemental, hypocrites. I would say to that person, "You're right, I've never been a christian, I am a nice person, not a hate monger."

or feel the right to judge me like if he were able to read my past,

but they think they get to judge like god does, they don't read their bible, only their god gets to judge.

this abuse upset me and I just refuse all contact.

perfect! you do not have to be around toxic people. this is the best way to deal with them.

Yesterday I received a greeting card from a christian women which is fundamentalist and I just keep silence because I know if I inform her I left christianity I would receive a big letter full of verse warning me I'm going to hell, etc....it is not in my character to keep silence but I need to protect me and I have no other choice.

Silence can actually be a very powerful weapon if you know when to use it. It makes most people uncomfortable.

Her mother if very accusative I remember I was in her house some years ago and her son with wife came (they are not believers) and she said : "here is my house you have no right to criticize the bible !!"....these people are so indoctrined and think they are so true, that all dialog is impossible. Trying to argue and you will waste a lot of time for nothing....They want we resect their beliefs but they don't toward yourself....they are so disrespectful that you have no choice to cut all ties with them.

Again you are correct, delete all toxic people from your life. Listen to how you feel, the answers are inside you.

They are so obsessed about your salvation and reconverting you. I had this experience with a baptist woman in my family....I just had to erase her in my facebook friends and blocked the access to my profile. As soon I confronted her with reason and no answers to my prayers, she became more aggressive while she tried "love bombing" 2 minutes ago....her answer was something like " you must accept God's will and that he does not answer to your prayers", "I dont believe in deconverting but I think that a person has never been a christian"....etc....When the dialog just stopped I said my self "she is really ready for a psychatric hospital"....

Yes she is! Just tell her, "god told me that he wants you to pray for me." Everytime she tries to communicate with you, post that same thing. Just keep sending her off to pray.

 

When you cut them out of your life you prevent them from trying to manipulate you. Eventually when you have healed more, you can easily deal with them in person. It takes a while.

 

Thank you London

 

Indeed, silence is also used as a weapon in order to manipulate rather than having a clearly adult-adult dialogue and resolve disagreements. I also saw a person newly converted to hurt me and still be supported by other Christians. This is where the hypocrisy of the Christian world is revealed in the open (instead of being neutral). This has also contributed to my decision to leave the "born again" and was the last straw already with all the accumulation of anger to feel manipulated. There is nothing worse than the evil in a polished appearance and even Christian people who make you believe they are so spiritual ... and have so little courage when it comes to apologize. With normal people which are not indoctrinated I find that relationships are so much spontaneous and simple. Of course there will always be jerks everywhere, but with Christians like it's crazy everything seems bizarre, this lack of spontaneity and indoctrination give me a strange feeling and even unreal.

 

Well I guess when God did not answer to my prayers and gave me silence treatment was also manipulation. How wonderful God I had... and the world must see how God is good....is it true for starving people ???

[Sunny49]

What does actually "turn the other cheek" mean?

 

I have always been taught that it means, Don't stoop to the other person's level, choose to be better than the negative behavior.

 

Yes, I agree with this, but isn't it cult-language? They interpret it this way, but I think it means:" Let other people abuse you, cause that's how you show you are a good person.You are a bad person it you fight for yourself. Maybe you will suffer in this life, but in other you will have great rewards." That's what it means to me.

[Sissi71]

"You are so right.

It has always been my opinion that the more religious a person is indicates just how depressed they are. I think that christianity is a substitute for medication. And a cult will only pray on those who are functioning at less than 100% of their normal functioning.

christianity is like advertising, it makes you think the product is amazing, until you get it home and it breaks. But christianity makes all the right excuses to trick you into believing that your life will be empty and sad without it. The very thing you were trying to avoid in the first place. You wanted to belong and be happy.

Medication can help that better than a cult that promises all these good things but abuses you mentally by saying that you are not good enough and tries to turn you into sheep.

 

So for the many of us who have left the cult there is double damage here. A personal search for happiness was taken away and smashed into a worse form of abuse. The original issue of unhappiness was not ever addressed, then the xian abuse commenced. People are not just recovering from a cult, they are also recovering from the original issue that led them to the cult. It's like twice baked potatos, except the potatos are tasty, the cult is just a bad taste that keeps returning like untreated acid reflux times 1000.

 

For me personally, whenever I try to really rationalize what people are thinking by being a part of xianity, I just remind myself that it's a cult, they do not control their mind. I step away and move on with my life. Let them be obsessed with death, I prefer to be obsessed with LIFE! "

 

I just saw this post! I definately agree with you, but also they mess up healthy people with making them feel gulity and worthless and then say that they are depressed cause they are not "connected to God". Yet, there's still much more lonely, depressed people who are attracted to religion. Also, ex addicts, what are they exchanging one addiction to other? I don't think they really cure them...Here's a great link:

 

http://people.howstu...rainwashing.htm

 

 

@VacuumFlux Yeah, doesn't christianity teach us to accept abuse? Don't they teach as that we should sacrifize ourselves to be good? What does actually "turn the other cheek" mean?

 

 

It explains WHY some people are so easily attracted because the group with his lovebombing look so warm. They offer firstly understanding. When I have been in touched the first time with christians, I was 16. They used to be frequent disputes between my parents, my sister looked more important than me and I just felt alone trying to show to my parents that I had skills. Then the group was an opportunity with me everyone came unto me with "a big smile". Then even if some years later I realized bizarre things and no answers to some of my prayers, in fact I was afraid to leave the group and be alone again. So I found all excuse to stay with them, and step by step I have received a brainwashing, my critical mind just was like in a block of ice of my brain. And I soon I left, I've been depressed for a while like I was when I was a teenager.

People are vulnerable when they come from a family which is insecure, and instead of facing the reality they just believe everything that can be a relief for them. I never heard about brainwashing as soon as I left christianity and I started being interested about the characteristic of a cult.

 

Unfortunately christianity can be a medication that gives bad side effects. The fruit of Spirit are : desillusion, lies, abuse, manipulation...

[London]

What does actually "turn the other cheek" mean?

 

I have always been taught that it means, Don't stoop to the other person's level, choose to be better than the negative behavior.

 

Yes, I agree with this, but isn't it cult-language? They interpret it this way, but I think it means:" Let other people abuse you, cause that's how you show you are a good person.You are a bad person it you fight for yourself. Maybe you will suffer in this life, but in other you will have great rewards." That's what it means to me.

 

I agree it is cult language. I used to be amazed at how the priest could invent meanings for scripture that had no logical connection. It was as though he read "Apples turn red in summer." And then he would explain that phrase by saying something like. "Gods love changes colors because he loves you and wants you to be ripe with his fruit, only then can you understand how the world was created. Physical things have no meaning and that is why god wants you to have many children."

It begins to make sense but it leads you to a different end. It's a "confusion logic", my term for it. Cult language is always peppered with the beginning of logic, or what seems like logic, and ends with manipulation.

[badpuppy]

@London "confusion logic" I like that!

[Sunny49]

 

I agree it is cult language. I used to be amazed at how the priest could invent meanings for scripture that had no logical connection. It was as though he read "Apples turn red in summer." And then he would explain that phrase by saying something like. "Gods love changes colors because he loves you and wants you to be ripe with his fruit, only then can you understand how the world was created. Physical things have no meaning and that is why god wants you to have many children."

It begins to make sense but it leads you to a different end. It's a "confusion logic", my term for it. Cult language is always peppered with the beginning of logic, or what seems like logic, and ends with manipulation.

 

Yeah, and it's very subtle,that's why it's so dangerous. Especially to children who cannot figure out manipulation. Actually, I had no idea what manipulation is until I was 21. Then I read it in a book. It opened my eyes.

In their logic it all kind of makes sense, but still doesn't feel right.

[London]

It has always annoyed me when people use the "hate the sin, not the sinner" line.

That's like saying:

You are my best friend in the whole world and I totally love you but... I cannot stand anything you say or do. Your opinions are wrong, you're not funny, or good looking and frankly no one really likes you. But that's ok because god loves you and so do I.

 

That makes zero sense to me. And it just proves to me that they want people in the cult in large numbers. It's ok if no one likes them, because abuse is common practice and lies are favored over truth.

[Sunny49]

Yeah, and they don't hate homosexuals! Yeah right!

 

I never understood this " You must love everyone just like God does" I mean, how can I love everyone? There are certainly people who I can't stand cause I dont like their character or they are totally different from me. Why do I have to like them? If I like everyone that means that I have no character and no personality. Their answer will be: " You have to pray to God to like them!" Ridiculous.

[ConureDelSol]

Yeah, and they don't hate homosexuals! Yeah right!

 

I never understood this " You must love everyone just like God does" I mean, how can I love everyone? There are certainly people who I can't stand cause I dont like their character or they are totally different from me. Why do I have to like them? If I like everyone that means that I have no character and no personality. Their answer will be: " You have to pray to God to like them!" Ridiculous.

 

I love how Christians justify their hatred by saying that the Bible calls it an "abomination." If this is the case, they should be treating most of the people on earth the same way they treat homosexuals. Mostly this includes lying and justifying that which is wicked (which already sounds exactly like Christians) and a whole list of food included in Leviticus 11. Abomination is a word used to describe several things apart from homosexuality.

 

I just watched a documentary yesterday about how Fundies misinterpret the Bible and use it for their own means to alienate groups they dislike:

 

http://topdocumentar...le-tells-me-so/