Update After Coming Out Of The Closet With The Wife

[roadrunner]

Im sure she would like me to go public so someone somewhere can step up and convince me. She has exppressed that my attitude about it is very concieted I tought the tough part was going to be telling her but we talked and I explained how I dont have a plan anymore for this. I didnt expect it, I dont know the best way to move foward, this is all new to me. I dont know how to be an athiest, how to tell anyone , the best way to raise my kids, when to tell mom and dad (dad btw is an athiest so I may tell him but he's got a bog mouth). I explained to her that I am sane, Im not confused, I have all the answers I need for comfort (which btw I think why so many people embrace it, it gives them meaning and even the gaps are plugged with god putty. but if science has gaps its because its all wrong but thats another topic). I also explained that I didnt break easily, I put up a fight and I no longer belive. I'm treading lightly to minimize the damage. Since our talk she has been reading the bible and I still pray with her. She asked why. I told her that I dont think it serves any purpose but it tells me whats on her mind. if she thinks enough of it to tell god I need to know so I do everything to make her happy. Then she went on the guilt trip "if only I would have shown you the love of god more..." (which gets quickly into the sick twisted realm of why I hate christianity, the emotional firestorm). I then explained that its not her responsibility to do gods job for him. If God almighty who made the milky way cant convince me he's real then she certainly cant. I then brought up the barrage of religious literature designed to strengthen faith. Why would we need to have our faith strengthened. Once you start having enough doubts that you no longer afraind to peek at the world only then will she or anyine else come to reality. I slowly came to my view over 2 years or so. So I cant expect her to jump into my view overnight. I must have flooded her with all kinds of contradictions and tough questions...more than she was ready for. and my comments were all over the place anyway since so many thoughts were swarming through my head like bees and who knows which one will burst out first. Also, we used to joke after church all teh way home about how silly parts of the service were and this sunday was quiet. I asked her about parts of the service and she view my comments differently now. I dont blame her. What if you made racial jokes at work with a friend and then you found out he was REALLY a racist . its a tought spot to be in. I told her that since friday night, nothing has changed other than her perception of me. which perception is EVERYTHING and matters a lot. Perception is what makes us be a xian , athiest, agno, whatever...

 

Also, I knew I had this coming. the thinking athiest often talks about how xians are programmed to go into "rescue mode". I would have done the dsame thing. I would have tried to convince someone I loved they were wrong and doomed and tehn be sad about it. I am on pins and needles now to show her that I can still love.

[★ Citsonga ★]

She has exppressed that my attitude about it is very concieted

 

Typical Christian false accusation. They can't conceive of the possibility that their worldview could actually be wrong, so it's much easier to just assume that you're arrogantly rejecting it. If I were in that particular predicament, I think I would try my best to clarify that it's nothing more than an honest assessment of the evidence.

[roadrunner]

Since we had so many questions for each other I wrote a letter. I put it in my blog. I kept it fairly short and sweet

[TortillaLips]

It is not beneficial for ex-believers to act like brain washed believers when asked to prove their non-faith. Doing so makes you no better than the bibleGod lubbers. We must act different; better even.

 

Also, going over the believers books with them is a great way to help them see how stupid and idiotic their beliefs are.

 

It is sad that this site has a lot of ex-Christians that although no longer have faith, still are just as irrational as their believing family.

 

We ex-Christians should welcome a believers desire to bring their books into the discussion, I mean, what better way to show them just how full of shit their beliefs are?!?

[TortillaLips]

Roadrunner, not wanting to entertain discussion with a "power" beleiver at your wife's church only weakens your ideas and allows her to do the same thing should you ever want her to, for example go to a ex believers talk, etc... Why are you acting like a believer?!? Lol

[roadrunner]

Ive been logging everything in this process in the blog section but just to keep you up to date. its been 2 weeks and now my sister and wife know. my wife needed a shoulder to cry on so she called m sister who she is very close with. We visited not long ago and they ganged up on me with such weaak arguments. I have to shoot down their arguments lovingly because I dont want to seem like a seasoned bible basher or like I think they are stupid neanderthals. thats the tougest part. Theyd be scared i they saw how much I really know on the subject. They keep forgetting that I was a xian for 27 years. I know everything they are going to say. They kept pointing out "blessings" and kept saying you have to "feel it". hes real because I "feel it" I dont feel squat. If I everfelt anything it was in a church with sad music playing looking at touching stories...none of which point to a god. . My wife also pointed out that she feels like I think shes stupid in my head even though I dont show it. That kinda hurt. I dont think shes stupid, I dont know how I feel about my wife wasting her time and money and indoctrinating herself and our kids. I hate THAT but not her.

 

I've talked to a friend of mine who is a pastor and told him about my doubt and the lack of evidence. Though he responded confidently I cant help but think I planted a seed. Anyway we talked and for a minute i gave it the time of day and was considering being agnostic but then I snapped out of it. It was just the certainty in his talking that made me this way but then I thought you can say anything confidently and it will sound good but under the surface the true colors show. His arguments were based on the bible and Ive already dismiissed the bible as false. though its a wonderful piece of literature full of great priciples to live by, it has scientlfic inaccuracies and socially unacceptable practices that I consider immoral. as poetic as the book is, its NOT the inerrant word of god since as shermer say " you have to track the hits AND the misses" to get a true picture. Also xian will spin any verse anywhere to fit their argument.

My wife has goes in and out of phases where she blasts xian music and prays a lot. I dont blame her since she feels that she is instilling the xian values in them on her own. its still a little tense here. She likes to pray and I pray with her still even though shes knows Im not a believer. Its a good way to spend time together and know whats on her mind. Itold her its pointless to me and serves no purpose but we still do it. Also, she keeps raising her hand in church for prayer becuase she is among the "anyone here that is going through a tough time" group now. That suck because shes talking about me. this is not a tough time. its a happy time for me we are still taking it day by day but things are getting better. Ill keep u up to date

[Positivist]

Theyd be scared if they saw how much I really know on the subject.

 

Also, she keeps raising her hand in church for prayer becuase she is among the "anyone here that is going through a tough time" group now. That suck because shes talking about me.

Thanks for the update, rr! Gosh, it's rough. I really admire how you are handling this: praying, loving rebuttal, etc. And wow, it must suck to be in that situation re: your wife getting prayer.

[roadrunner]

OK so today was not a good day. She saw me eating without saying grace (as I have for the past 2 months) and asked why....are we having amnesia or something then later comes up to me out of the blue and says this is getting tough to do. Evidently this is starting to take its toll on her. now what i feared would happenen had happened.....every little thing i do now is because my belief system is compromised. She eve said that she no longer respects me and I am not the man of god that I once was. I have fallen in her eyes. Its tough knowing that she feels this way and I was in the closet but now that I've said something its justification for everything wrong in our marriage. The problem is the invisible man in the sky holds thetopspot in my wife's heart not me. Tough being second place to Santa.

[Thought2Much]

Ouch, roadrunner. I don't even know what to say that could help you with this.

[jblueep]

now what i feared would happenen had happened.....every little thing i do now is because my belief system is compromised.

 

I feel for you roadrunner. Perhaps you can start doing things that you don't normally do for her, like flowers for no reason, etc. Then maybe she will see some positive things now that you are free to love her without god standing in between. I know it sounds ridiculous but it seems that she is focusing only on the shallow things at the moment.

 

Just a thought

 

Wishing you the best.

[roadrunner]

yeah its definately getting to a tipping point. @jblu i tried and she says its not the same since the whole basis for doing it is different than it once was. Love is never enough....god has to be in there somewhere. nevermind 6 wonderful years and 2 beautiful kids, it has to be based on god or its all superficial. Its so frustrating. We still laugh and joke like we always do but in the dark hours for her this is too much...... no god, no peace. Its like nothing good matters anymore because I no longer believe. She did bring up that i took the journey alone for 3 years or so and that she felt ditched. In my defense Im not gonna say. "hey lets look at some athiest stuff it'll be fun"

[freeasabird]

yeah its definately getting to a tipping point. @jblu i tried and she says its not the same since the whole basis for doing it is different than it once was. Love is never enough....god has to be in there somewhere. nevermind 6 wonderful years and 2 beautiful kids, it has to be based on god or its all superficial. Its so frustrating. We still laugh and joke like we always do but in the dark hours for her this is too much...... no god, no peace. Its like nothing good matters anymore because I no longer believe. She did bring up that i took the journey alone for 3 years or so and that she felt ditched. In my defense Im not gonna say. "hey lets look at some athiest stuff it'll be fun"

 

There at the end it almost sounds like she's jealous or something, like she knows this is going to happen to her also and she's mad that she didn't get to experience deconversion with you. I'm sure that's not it, just what it sounds like.

[TrueFreedom]

I feel for ya, RR. It's bound to be difficult for a while. Hopefully it will improve eventually if you continue to be honest and try to connect with her on an emotional level. She's bound to have stress-enduced reactions to the bomb that you dropped on her. We went through some of that as well. I wish I'd involved her more earlier on. It's not always easy to do.

[TheBluegrassSkeptic]

yeah its definately getting to a tipping point. @jblu i tried and she says its not the same since the whole basis for doing it is different than it once was. Love is never enough....god has to be in there somewhere. nevermind 6 wonderful years and 2 beautiful kids, it has to be based on god or its all superficial. Its so frustrating. We still laugh and joke like we always do but in the dark hours for her this is too much...... no god, no peace. Its like nothing good matters anymore because I no longer believe. She did bring up that i took the journey alone for 3 years or so and that she felt ditched. In my defense Im not gonna say. "hey lets look at some athiest stuff it'll be fun"

I would ask her point blank if she is sleeping with God because she made a VOW to you, not God when it came to marriage. Let her know that what she feels isn't wrong, but how she PERCEIVES things IS wrong. Just because you don't share the same beliefs doesn't lessen your morals or your love. I'm sure you've made this clear to her on many levels. It's like beating your head against a wall. Shit, i would point out to her that even if you had remained "saved" and then when arriving in Heaven, you still both would be married to GOD then and not each other. Your marriage would be over anyhow right? So why not loosen up and enjoy the marriage to each other here on Earth whilst you can? You are replaced in the after life anyhow....

[LivingLife]

I would ask her point blank if she is sleeping with God because she made a VOW to you, not God when it came to marriage. Let her know that what she feels isn't wrong, but how she PERCEIVES things IS wrong. Just because you don't share the same beliefs doesn't lessen your morals or your love. I'm sure you've made this clear to her on many levels. It's like beating your head against a wall. Shit, i would point out to her that even if you had remained "saved" and then when arriving in Heaven, you still both would be married to GOD then and not each other. Your marriage would be over anyhow right? So why not loosen up and enjoy the marriage to each other here on Earth whilst you can? You are replaced in the after life anyhow....

There is a nun joke in that post

 

 

A unidentified man finds himself in the care of a RC hospital after an accident. A nun comes to him and asks, "How are you going to pay for this, do you have medical?"

 

"Nope, no medical" he replies

 

"Do you have family that can help pay?" she asks

 

"No" he replies, "Only a spinster sister who is a nun"

 

"Nuns are not spinsters" she retorts, "They are married to Jesus"

 

"Ok then" he replies, "Give the bill to my brother in law"

[roadrunner]

tgeh whole premise of Xianity is to belive with all your heart even in the face of adversity. Its not quite as simple as her just bending over and accepting that. There has to be a process to happen in here. I see it starting. I caught her reading a book that talked about doubt and I shoulder surfed and said "lets do that". the book has you to put all doubts on paper and one by one address them. this is a greatoppotunity to introduce the concept of free thought to her. As dineshd'sousa puts it, its like being a "mosquito in a nudist colony...where do I begin" lol. I think Ill just make a really long list and reason will work its magic.

[Akheia]

I hope things go well with that discussion.

[roadrunner]

Update: I chose a basic approach to dig into Genesis. I brought up the creation timeline and the discrepancies on Genesis 1 and2. BTW This is not my forte. I didnt stop believing because the bible had flaws. I stopped because it was stupid and irrational. Then after I had my eyes opened I learned about the flaws. I have xian glasses on when reading so I wasnt looking for them whan i read the bible. this part of it is all new to me. So picking through genesis was not the best approach. She did catch the contradiction before stupid me caught it and the footnotes gave some off the wall explanation for the discrepancy so today was useless. The problem is the deconversion works on its own when you get a neutral perspective with no bias. I say things like "dont you have ANY doubts or HAVE you EVER" and she doesnt have any..... an effin' puppet if you ask me. I brought up a book by frank turek which talks about why we should have faith and this is something that never crossed her mind. I asked why she believes the bible and shes a christian and she doesnt have an answer but the crap answer I get it you can "feel" it. from my sister too. then they talked about how they had been in wrecks and walked away. pure chance if you ask me but its god to them....and they "feel" him. UGGGHHHH. I'll try again tomorrow.

[Paine]

@ zomberina

 

"I find watching religious services fascinating. It is like being transported back to earlier ages that we can only READ about in mythology. I'm more appreciative thanks to the crap religious belief had put me through, and I guess on some levels, it did enhance my life more now."

 

I find it funny to drive by a church on Sunday now, the Frozen Chosen all waddling like ducks into the front door to see and be seen, pay their fee for using the church gym and going on those cool tax-deductible "mission" trips to exotic locales tithe and I always find it liberating to fly right by, on my way to have a MEANINGFUL, IN THE MOMENT EXPERIENCE with the ones I love most IN THIS WORLD.

 

"Fascinating", indeed.

 

Well stated.

[roadrunner]

Update: One the whole, things are a lot better. We have have one sad day out of the week and the others are awesome. The sad days are brought on by her bringing up my disbelief. In those sad times, I want so bad to tell her "I'm back! I got saved! I believe again!" but I can't. It would be a lie, an impluse in the heat of an emotionally vulnerable moment. And knowing what I know now I could never believe again. I feel in my heart that the critical thinking process (that is so dangerous to christians) has begun in her. I dont want to rush it or force it. I'm just being patient.

[TrueFreedom]

Great to hear, RR!

[Akheia]

I'm glad to hear it! I think you're right-- once seen, a lot of these facts cannot be unseen.

[LivingLife]

Huzzah!

[roadrunner]

another bad night last night. I feel like the microscope came out when I told her and now every move I make is being scrutinized to find "the link". Basically, I m not supposed to be nice, love, care. Im supposed to be different and I and keep getting all these exaggerated examples of changes in my behavior. Remember that this was never the case before I said anything. I dont blame her. We were taught in church that athiest are different. I am secretly trying to be more loving more caring since I know that the filter is turned on to catch all the BAD stuff and filter out the GOOD. Its pretty sad to watch her desperately try to link changes in my behavior to my disbelief. Changes that arent there. I explained time and time again taht I care about them MORE now since they arent some divine puppets that I was lended to play with while Im here on earth. She told me that Satan has crept in. I replied that I dont think Satan exists. This was earthshaking to her and led into tearful discussion. To doubt god is one thing but to doubt satan too. OMG!. I explained that when I discounted God as real, so did I discount everything that went with that belief, hell heaven, angels, demons, and yes even satan. Just when you start to think criticle thinking i ssetting in you get that. Its a parlor trick. If you start thinking freely then SATAN is working. This is crazy but Im hanging on.

[LivingLife]

When you tell them satan is a myth then you are fully deluded by stan the man.

 

Point out to her that the word satan is a transliteration of the word sawtan or sawtawn. You may need a strongs concordance. In translation, they lost the "w's" and that is the origin of the name. The Hebrew word simply means adversary. You can point out the census of David (two versions), where the same story uses satan and adversary as the reasons and in fact show that is was god that allowed this.

 

The lucifer myth is also a deliberate mistranslation and is the only place this word comes up and mistranslated compared to the other root words in Hebrew.

 

Because the NT was tacked onto the Hebrew bible, there was a lot of editing that took place to sell the concept of the invented hell and satan.

 

They do not teach this in the churches and folk do not delve into the concordances and take the bible on face value alone. It seems what you may lack is this detail.

 

I did a search but it looks like you will have to download and install eSword, it is free (I don't have it loaded any more or else I would give you all the ammo you need) The few hits I got don't share the eSword info as far as the word satan goes so you do not see the original words sawtawn or sawtan.

 

In the eSword program which comes with the Strong's and KJV as standard, it is easy to navigate, you get the word satan, look up the number, click it and see all verses that use that number and then look up the detail of the Hebrew word.

 

That said, you have no adversary other than using your brain to reason this shit out. Using the bible to convince her it is BS, may help as opposed to atheist counter apologetics sites.