That Verrrrrry First Moment Of Doubt

[freeasabird]

Like others here, I always had doubts in the back of my head. Not the type of doubt like "I wonder if there really is a god or not". To me that was an abvious given which I never questioned. My doubts were more like "this shit just doesn't make sense". Here were some memorable primers though from early in life.

 

What about people from other countries that aren't Christians?

 

Why are we even here if god wants us in heaven?

 

Why would Catholic priests molest little boys when they know they'd go to hell for it?

[Thackerie]

... Why would Catholic priests molest little boys when they know they'd go to hell for it?

 

Nope. To the best of my knowledge, neither the Catholic nor the Protestant versions of the Bible say anything against child abuse or sexual molestation of children. Oh sure, there are a couple of verses declaring it an abomination for a man to lay with another man as with a woman, but since there's no room to actually lay down in a confessional and boys aren't men, the priests know this doesn't apply to them.

[Jds22]

For me it was healings. My mother was a big believer in people like Benny Hinn and other faith healers and we had quite a few heated disagreements over the years about them. During one argument I pointed out that these people never heal anything like a spinal cord or brain damage. They never remove the scars of a burn victim or heal somebody born with a genetic disorder like down's syndrome or cerebral palsy. The list of course goes on and on.

 

Almost as soon as those words left my mouth it hit me that god never heals any of these either. It was a very unsettling feeling that came over me and it kept nagging me for about a month or so until I finally decided that I needed to start investigating.

 

Long story short, after learning more about science, astronomy, geology, evolution, anthropology, here I am happy as a clam.

[3DollarBill]

I thought heaven would be boring, around the age of 9.

That. I tried real hard not to think about it but I had realized as early as 4 or 5 that living forever actually sounded horrible. The only reason I even cared that I went to heaven to worship gawd all day is not that heaven sounds awesome, but that hell sounded so much worse. One thing for sure...the afterlife would be long and boring. Seriously how is it any fucking surprise I was a depressed kid?

[freeasabird]

... Why would Catholic priests molest little boys when they know they'd go to hell for it?

 

Nope. To the best of my knowledge, neither the Catholic nor the Protestant versions of the Bible say anything against child abuse or sexual molestation of children. Oh sure, there are a couple of verses declaring it an abomination for a man to lay with another man as with a woman, but since there's no room to actually lay down in a confessional and boys aren't men, the priests know this doesn't apply to them.

 

Very true, but at the time like 90+% of Christians I had never read the bible and had no idea what was in it.

[Kaiser01]

Another i had that really started me on the path to doubt was when i asked my father what would happen to King Cyrus for letting the jews leave Babylon. My father said he would go to hell because he didn't put his faith in the coming messiah, i was kinda appalled because Cyrus had even said (in the bible not in real life) that the God of the Jews was the one true God, yet he was still going to hell?

[TrailBlazer]

Hmm

When I began googling about abnormal psychology in high school, particularly various religious neuroses and then started seeing the signs of mental disorders in biblical people, including Jesus.

[stryper]

I was about 7. I saw mom and dad put the presents under the tree and I found a present label Santa in their closet while playing hide and seek.

 

After that I began take what was taught to me with a grain of salt unless it could be proven.

 

A few years later I was playing with some kids across the street from the church. A cute girl did a variation on you got something on your shirt and reference male anatomy, and I was shocked that she didn't burst into flames.

 

After that the church became a building and nothing more.

[LifeCycle]

My whole life I struggled with why God would start me out in this world abandoned. Deserted, unwanted, unloved... All these emotions I experienced early on in childhood. I was too young to be exposed to something like that. I couldn't make sense of it... Started church at the age of 8 and really dug in and made myself at home... I had direction, leadership, male influence and a sense of feeling somewhat special. Anyway, these circumstances made me view Christianity differently... But I put these questions in the back of my mind and never addressed them. I just couldn't gain the courage to do so. But to answer the question... I've always had issue... But the things the Christian community offered me left me uninterested in seeking out answers.

 

It wasn't until I grew up and was not attending church that I could finally address my problems because I was getting nothing in return. It was rather fortunate, really. But I don't know when it really started.... I don't remember that first time I had questions... I always felt like an outsider to begin with. God certainly didn't bless me the way he blessed my friends. Inside I was dejected, angry and jealous. But now I know why I was dealt a shitty deck and others were not... Because there is no fucking god. He can't give a shit because the mother fucker doesn't even exist.

 

I've always had issues with God, but I always believed anyway. Then I grew a pair and faced my fears. This was only a year and a half ago. But yeah, I wish I could point to a spot on my time line and say that's where it all started but I can't.

[Mike D]

I think when I was a teenager, I pretty much just wondered, "how do I know this (Christianity) is true"? There was no answer.

 

I could see that everything that was talked about in the Bible had no connection with reality. It was like "back in the old days" all of these magical things happened like animals talked, seas parted, angels and demons were everywhere, god regularly visited and interacted with humans. But not anymore.

 

What changed?

 

Now I know nothing changed because nothing was ever different - reality was the same 2000 years ago as it is now.

[Habiba]

I honestly don't remember which came first, I think I was 10 on both occasions.

1. Imagine being full of joy on your birthday morning and getting the present you've spent months wishing for. I finally got a Tamagotchi (a keychain-sized virtual pet simulation game for children that was all the rage in the mid 90s). It was barely out of the wrapping paper when my mother snatched it from my hands and later threw it in the bin. The reason? “We (Christians), don’t agree with them, they’re evil!” I asked why, desperate to have my toy back. My mum was unable to give a straight or convincing answer. The horror, anger and disgust I felt was a real turning point for me. It was the first time I ever questioned what I was hearing, and the first time I realised something was BS outright.

..and more spiritually...

 

2. Asking where heaven and hell were. I felt I had a vested interest as loved ones were allegedly cooling their heels in both places.I was told that heaven was "north" and hell was "south". After I bit of confusion, it was specified that heaven was in the stratosphere and hell was under the earth's crust. I asked why astronauts hadn't seen heaven. I was impatiently told it "wasn't like that". All kids are pretty good lie detectors and mine was clanging at this.

Seeing this diagram pretty much wiped out my belief in hell:

Unsurprisingly, there was no flashing Vegas type sign labelling hell. Several years on, similar diagrams of the sky and space debunked the heaven malarkey too.

[mcdaddy]

Tamagotchis ARE evil. If by "evil", you mean, "cute and fun".

[LifeCycle]

The unnecessary and illogical torment Christians put their own children through is ridiculous. That situation you touched on, Habiba made me hurt for you.

[Habiba]

I suppose they are evil in that they started the cogs in my brain turning that lead to my deconversion! I had other presents binned too that weren't deemed suitable (make up, nail varnish etc), but none were as painful as that! I was also made to miss out birthday parties of close friends as the venues were "not suitable for Christian testimony" - pubs and cinemas. When I asked for biblical proof of all this I was just yelled at.

[LifeCycle]

I suppose they are evil in that they started the cogs in my brain turning that lead to my deconversion! I had other presents binned too that weren't deemed suitable (make up, nail varnish etc), but none were as painful as that! I was also made to miss out birthday parties of close friends as the venues were "not suitable for Christian testimony" - pubs and cinemas. When I asked for biblical proof of all this I was just yelled at.

 

Geeeeezzzussss. That's a level of fanaticism I didn't have to deal with. I've seen that before in videos, it's horrible. I'm sorry. =(

 

And yes, now you're de-converted and more enlightened. Both are good things. =)

[Droptail]

2. Asking where heaven and hell were. I felt I had a vested interest as loved ones were allegedly cooling their heels in both places.I was told that heaven was "north" and hell was "south". After I bit of confusion, it was specified that heaven was in the stratosphere and hell was under the earth's crust. I asked why astronauts hadn't seen heaven. I was impatiently told it "wasn't like that". All kids are pretty good lie detectors and mine was clanging at this.

Seeing this diagram pretty much wiped out my belief in hell:

Unsurprisingly, there was no flashing Vegas type sign labelling hell. Several years on, similar diagrams of the sky and space debunked the heaven malarkey too.

 

I had similar thoughts from an early age, trying to figure out the exact sites of heaven and hell. I'd point up at a cloud in the sky and ask my parents if heaven was perched up there! The concept of hell also made little sense; I assumed it would be a chamber, and yet the inner core was basically compressed molten metal with no hollow spaces.

 

I'd also ask them what about all the people who died before Jesus and was told they were waiting to be judged. Well, how would they be judged? On their works. Okay, so why did two different ways for judging people exist? Just believe it! Ha. Unfortunately, I just assumed that Christianity was true and that as I got older, there would be other, more sensible explanations of the theology, doctrines, etc.. I never thought then that it all sounded like non-sense because it was non-sense.

 

My first inkling of doubt happened in my first semester at a Christian university when my professor directly contradicted what I had been taught up until then. She told the class that it was a mistake to take the Genesis creation stories as literal, that the Hebrews had no scientific understanding and the author had probably intended those passages as poetic. At that time I would have dismissed such a statement from a non-Christian source, so hearing her say that made a world of difference for me as I began re-examining my beliefs from that point on.

[Vigile]

I'd also ask them what about all the people who died before Jesus and was told they were waiting to be judged. Well, how would they be judged? On their works. Okay, so why did two different ways for judging people exist? Just believe it! Ha. Unfortunately, I just assumed that Christianity was true and that as I got older, there would be other, more sensible explanations of the theology, doctrines, etc.. I never thought then that it all sounded like non-sense because it was non-sense.

 

I had the exact same questions and rationalized it the same way you did. As I got older the questions just got louder as opposed to solving themselves. I don't think I was ever satisfied with the answers I was given regarding the judgement of those who predated christ or those who had never heard of him since the first millenia began. The fairness, or lack, was a huge sticking point.

[jensjam]

The story of Abraham asked to sacrified his son to god.

 

I'm 10 years old and I'm thinking What the fucked up type deity demands you kill your son to prove your devotion to him.

[LifeCycle]

I'd also ask them what about all the people who died before Jesus and was told they were waiting to be judged. Well, how would they be judged? On their works. Okay, so why did two different ways for judging people exist? Just believe it! Ha. Unfortunately, I just assumed that Christianity was true and that as I got older, there would be other, more sensible explanations of the theology, doctrines, etc.. I never thought then that it all sounded like non-sense because it was non-sense.

 

I had the exact same questions and rationalized it the same way you did. As I got older the questions just got louder as opposed to solving themselves. I don't think I was ever satisfied with the answers I was given regarding the judgement of those who predated christ or those who had never heard of him since the first millenia began. The fairness, or lack, was a huge sticking point.

 

I had the same problem with the belief-based-salvation model as a mechanism for determining a person's eternal well-being. It clearly is unfair and it became a huge barrier for me with my theology. I started a thread on it in the Christian Theology forum. It's a good one tactic to use against believers.

[TristanJay]

Hello, I'm new here, but I wanted to respond to this topic. I've tried writing out my ex-testimony but it gets so long and unwieldy, and causes emotional disruption (makes the average day more difficult).

 

When I first learned about God in early and middle school, I hated and resented him, and everything that was said about him. He never struck me as loving or caring or personal, and that was not part of the teaching at the churches my parents took myself and my brother to. I privately always hated and resented him, or the idea of him.

 

In high school I was invited into the fold by a long-time friend, and he depicted the loving, caring, personal version of God. I was skeptical, but I tried to give god a chance, although there was always something buried deep that suggested something was wrong. I gave god about 10 or so years.

 

One day, a few years on from becoming a Christian, another friend of mine (who was also a Christian) and I were talking about the doubts that we couldn't quite figure out. And he mentioned something that he had idle confusion about: the god-sanctioned (ordered!) genocidal campaigns he sent the Israelites on. I found the references my friend had mentioned, and we debated about the problems of it back and forth. But it took hold in my mind, god's role in needless killing.

 

Many other factors were involved in the eventual breakdown of my faith. But it was never a matter of deconverting from Christianity to atheism or agnosticism. I don't know or remember if I was ever those things. In the time that I knew about the idea of god, before and after I was a Christian, he was a thing to regard with contempt, hatred, and outrage.

 

I am aware that my strange belief is rooted in a character flaw within myself. Yet the belief persists. I believe that god exists. But he cannot be remotely good. Now outside of Christian thought pathways again, I regard him as stupid, incompetent, lazy, neglectful, selfish, vain, tyrannical, bullying, retarded, homicidally and genocidally psychotic, narcissistic and sociopathic.

[stryper]

....... Now outside of Christian thought pathways again, I regard him as stupid, incompetent, lazy, neglectful, selfish, vain, tyrannical, bullying, retarded, homicidally and genocidally psychotic, narcissistic and sociopathic.

 

Don't hold back now. Tell us how you really feel.

[TristanJay]

....... Now outside of Christian thought pathways again, I regard him as stupid, incompetent, lazy, neglectful, selfish, vain, tyrannical, bullying, retarded, homicidally and genocidally psychotic, narcissistic and sociopathic.

 

Don't hold back now. Tell us how you really feel.

 

I forgot to mention hypocritical, boring, incapable of articulate and coherent communication, worthless and useless.

[♦ ficino ♦]

My first serious moment of doubt came when a bunch of us, even little kids, were praying for the healing of one of the guys in our campus IVF group. He died anyway. I couldn't understand why God would reject even childrens' prayers.

[jackbauer]

I probably had some doubts before this, but I remember having a discussion in one of those church youth groups. Someone said they occasionally wondered if the whole thing was just a huge conspiracy and that the preists were just pawns. Since I always had trouble making sense of God/Jesus, that theory actually made more sense to me. Months later, I started questioning my conservative morality and came to the conclusion that if it doesn't hurt anyone, than it shouldn't be bad. I applied this to drugs, homosexuality, sex, truency, and many other things which only affect the consenting parties and started to change my morality.

 

Well I would have if I didn't go searching for scary fundamentalist websites that had me thinking I was going to hell in a handbasket, but that was just the final big obsticle to my theory.

[antix]

The story of Abraham asked to sacrified his son to god.

 

I'm 10 years old and I'm thinking What the fucked up type deity demands you kill your son to prove your devotion to him.

 

I am not doubting the existance of a god or higher power, I am doubting some major issues with christianity. My first reality hit was how christians act and I no longer have any contact with my christian friends. Back in 99 I was getting personal training and the guy doing it was a "christian" . He had a Mr. Universe physique and would tell me how he was nailing a bunch of married women, but would get on my case about drinking being a sin. Also, I really have to ask why the healing prayers do not work. Again, my father passed away in early May: if this christian God loves me so much, why will he not let my dad say a word to me?