Apologists

[crazy-tiger]

So, maybe you folks may need to learn to just be content with relatively uneducated wanna be types of "apologists" like myself, for instance. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Heh... Where's the fun in that?

However, as I have mentioned before - my type of wanna be apologist - has served your causes very well (..... as a strawman, that is)

I think you do yourself a dis-service... You are better at defending Christianity and making others think that those educated "quality" apologists will ever be. (you lack their arrogance too, which is a good thing )

[SOIL]

Thanks CT,

 

(I'll get your check in the mail ASAP <grin>)

 

-Dennis

[I Broke Free]

Soil (Dennis)

 

I really like your new avatar. Someone did a great job of capturing the real you. What a friendly face, you look like the kind of person a kid would want to climb on to their lap.

 

The other Dennis, IBF

[Caretaker]

I think a good quality in a debater is that the debater is willing to find out what his/her opponent will accept as axiom instead of throwing a fit and accusing the opponent of stupidity when the first argument fails to move the opponent.

 

But I think the best quality in a debater is the ability to completely remove emotion from debate altogether.

[Amethyst]

I am having trouble understanding why christians think they have to be told what morals are as well.....you don't have to read the bible or any other book to KNOW inside what is right and what is wrong.

 

It's called brainwashing. It takes away one's ability to think for oneself, so one only reads the cult materials (in this case, the Bible), listens to cult music, reads cult books, talks to only fellow cultists, etc. Fundamental Christianity isn't any different.

[Cerise]

Why would anyone expect to be able to attract much in the way of "quality" apologists - at a site which sports such (original) titles in threads located in a "Debating with Christians" type of discussion forum?

 

... e.g. I wouldn't expect to find "quality" atheist thinkers actively seeking out threads titled in a similar fashion (where the 'f' word is used as an adjective prior to 'atheist' .... or would I)?

 

If you can be scared away by the "f" word in the title of a thread then one minute spent in conversation with me will probably decimate you anyway. When the "f" word instills more fear then the shameful cowardly way people have been toyed with by invisible figments of religious imagination, it's a sad sad world.

[Cerise]

Who would be making the standard?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

God would be making the standard himself. Remember the whole adam and eve thing? "Now man has become like us, knowing good and evil."

 

Well if I have become like God, knowing good and evil, shouldn't I be able to tell whether or not a God is good or evil? Your God, by his own definitions, labels himself evil. You worship a tyrant.

 

Good luck with that.

[SOIL]

If you can be scared away by the "f" word in the title of a thread then one minute spent in conversation with me will probably decimate you anyway.  When the "f" word instills more fear then the shameful cowardly way people have been toyed with by invisible figments of religious imagination, it's a sad sad world.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Cerise,

It's not so much "fear" which I suspect might keep someone away from such a thread - rather simply, why would I (or an atheist) be attracted to 'debate' (or maybe, as I normally think - 'discuss') with folks who start out by using such an adjective to refer to 'my kind'?

 

-Dennis

[Cerise]

I would, but then, I enjoy a challenge, and also the opportunity to defend myself from accusations that I might think false. I highly suspect that any thread entitled "fucking athiests" would indeed be granted a visit from myself for precisely these reasons.

 

In any case, it isn't as if I haven't unwittingly entered thread entitled "I LOVE YOU SO MUCH ATHEISTS" and have it turn out to be very much an actual "fucking atheists" fest anyway. Titles are misleading.

[SOIL]

Soil (Dennis)

 

I really like your new avatar. Someone did a great job of capturing the real you. What a friendly face, you look like the kind of person a kid would want to climb on to their lap.

 

The other Dennis, IBF

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You are very kind Dennis,

 

I wish I could say I was smiling at the prospect of talking with a child (like one of my grandsons for instance) who was about to climb up into my lap.

 

In this case though I will show you what I was smiling about (if this attachment is not too large for the board software to accept).

 

-Dennis

[SOIL]

I would, but then, I enjoy a challenge, and also the opportunity to defend myself from accusations that I might think false.  I highly suspect that any thread entitled "fucking athiests" would indeed be granted a visit from myself for precisely these reasons.

 

In any case, it isn't as if I haven't unwittingly entered thread entitled "I LOVE YOU SO MUCH ATHEISTS" and have it turn out to be very much an actual "fucking atheists" fest anyway.  Titles are misleading.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah, I understand,

 

You can't judge a book by it's cover (or a thread by it's title, for that matter).

 

Which is usually true of threads here (I think they most always contain richer content than their title might suggest) --- hey, I am still hanging around.... (a glutton for punishment perhaps?).

 

-Dennis

[white_raven23]

Cerise,

    It's not so much "fear" which I suspect  might keep someone away from such a thread - rather simply,  why would I (or an atheist) be attracted to 'debate' (or maybe, as I normally think - 'discuss') with folks who start out by using such an adjective to refer to 'my kind'?

 

-Dennis

 

 

Maybe you want to take an honest look at how we feel about the tactics Christians use for conversion, or the way they argue (not you, you can actually back yoursef up). Take a look at what chaps our buns, share it with other Christians, where with luck and hope you could find new more courteous methods of presenting the old material (I know....the message never changes)

 

When I was a Christian, I never shied away from the "offensive". I figured allegorically if you want to clean up a nasty bathroom, you sure as heck didn't do it blindfolded. No way could you do the job that way.

I was frustrated with other Christians who didn't see things that way. Help out in a homeless kitchen? Sit and talk with drug addicts? Perish the thought! They might muss their clothes!

 

As a result, I found myself disliking Christians when I still WAS one. Very much an identity crisis.

[Caretaker]

Hey Dennis, did you resize that photo to be that size? Some image reduction algorithms leave the reduced image looking very noisy.

[Cerise]

Yeah, I understand,

 

You can't judge a book by it's cover (or a thread by it's title, for that matter).

 

Which is usually true of threads here (I think they most always contain richer content than their title might suggest) --- hey, I am still hanging around.... (a glutton for punishment perhaps?).

 

-Dennis

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Isn't gluttony a sin, Dennis?

[SOIL]

...

I was frustrated with other Christians who didn't see things that way. Help out in a homeless kitchen? Sit and talk with drug addicts? Perish the thought! They might muss their clothes!

 

As a result, I found myself disliking Christians when I still WAS one. Very much an identity crisis.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

white_raven23,

 

Yeah, I catch your drift,

 

... been there, felt that, even bought the T-shirt! (NOT!).

 

I have been going through some of those feelings for the last year especially - but I can't honestly say that I am all that much better than the ones who I sometimes complain about. Fact is, I still need help.

 

I do still go to church, and one of the reasons is because I know I can use help with how I relate to other people. When a person recognizes he is sick - he may look for a hospital. I consider my local church to kind of like an emergency room for people (like myself), when we recognize we are infected with the sin disease.

 

I'm hoping to get infected with a cure instead ... so maybe I can start spreading that instead.

 

.... well, maybe one day....

 

-Dennis

[SOIL]

Hey Dennis, did you resize that photo to be that size? Some image reduction algorithms leave the reduced image looking very noisy.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yep, I have been experimenting with Microsoft's photo editor - I wasn't sure how small the photo needed to be - in order for me to attach it to a post. I also used that software to get the face small enough to use as an avatar. (Cerise, given the amount I have been eating lately, I wasn't sure if I could shrink my face down to be small enough!).

 

-Dennis

[crazy-tiger]

Thanks CT,

 

(I'll get your check in the mail ASAP <grin>)

 

-Dennis

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Credit where it due...

 

You make a refreshing change to the "typical" Christian I run into.

 

 

 

Do me a favour though... Wait 'till Thursday before cashing that check.

[I Broke Free]

You are very kind Dennis,

 

I wish I could say I was smiling at the prospect of talking with a child (like one of my grandsons for instance) who was about to climb up into my lap.

 

In this case though I will show you what I was smiling about (if this attachment is not too large for the board software to accept).

 

-Dennis

 

 

Dennis, what are you holding? I can't quite make it out. Is it a fish?

 

IBF

[SOIL]

Credit where it due...

 

You make a refreshing change to the "typical" Christian I run into.

Do me a favour though... Wait 'till Thursday before cashing that check. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks yet again CT,

 

You may have misunderstood my awkward attempt at a "joke" though - the inference was that I was going to send you the check (as some sort of prearranged payment to get you to say something good about me) -- at any rate though, if I were to actually do that - you might need to wait longer than next Thursday before taking it to the bank! <sigh>

 

 

-Dennis

[SOIL]

Dennis, what are you holding? I can't quite make it out. Is it a fish?

 

IBF

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Wow, you guys are being so kind it is getting sickeningly sweet in here!

 

What a setup!

 

Yes, that is part of the large mouth of a largemouth bass!

 

(just before I threw it back into one of the ponds on the property I am currently trying to pay for).

 

(Man, I can almost still smell it on my hand!)

 

-Dennis

 

Edited in - P.S. :

 

Actually I was holding it with my left hand (even though I am right-handed) because I am the person who was taking the picture! (Oh man, sometimes the truth hurts).

 

Sometimes I walk to work (from the house where I sleep, to the house down the dirt road where I work). I own (well, rather I am paying on loans toward) the two adjoining properties, and there are a couple of ponds on the 20-some acres. On this occasion, I was carrying my fishing pole and a digital camera, and I needed to get to work pretty quickly after catching that bass. So, as I wanted some sort of record that there actually does exist (at least one) bigger than the small average sized bass in the "small pond", before throwing it into the bigger pond (which is more frequently fished by visitors to our place. I held the camera in my right hand (stretching it out as far as possible, and held the bass so that hopefully I could get both my face and the bass' in the same photo. Well, one and a half (large mouths) was all I managed to get (not being able to look through the viewfinder and all).

 

.... And now you know .... the rest of the story!

[Vixentrox]

I have caught a few of those before. My whole family would always go fishing. My mom was always so easily excitable in the boat.

[crazy-tiger]

Thanks yet again CT,

 

You may have misunderstood my awkward attempt at a "joke" though - the inference was that I was going to send you the check (as some sort of prearranged payment to get you to say something good about me) -- at any rate though, if I were to actually do that - you might need to wait longer than next Thursday before taking it to the bank! <sigh>

-Dennis

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ah, my mistake...

 

 

I got the joke, just not which way the check was going. (it was just after midnight here, and I needed some sleep)

[SOIL]

I have caught a few of those before.  My whole family would always go fishing.  My mom was always so easily excitable in the boat.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Viventrox,

 

Yeah, my brother must be somewhat like your mother!

 

I really enjoy going fishing with him - because it doesn't take a very big (or very many) fish to evoke some real energy!

 

Growing up together, going fishing was the highlight of our life - when dad would take us out to a farm pond (just before the sun showed up for the day) -- Ahh, I can still smell and feel the grass soaked with the morning dew and see the mist rising .....

 

(Wake up Dennis!)

 

Oh, well, at any rate, there is just something about being out of doors and enjoying the relaxation invoked by the water's cadence and the sounds of the birds, the texture of wind .... (oops, there I go again!)

 

-Dennis

[Eponymic]

white_raven23,

 

Yeah, I catch your drift,

 

... been there,  felt that, even bought the T-shirt!  (NOT!).

 

I have been going through some of those feelings for the last year especially - but I can't honestly say that I am all that much better than the ones who I sometimes complain about.  Fact is, I still need help.

 

I do still go to church, and one of the reasons is because I know I can use help with how I relate to other people.  When a person recognizes he is sick - he may look for a hospital. I consider my local church to kind of like an emergency room for people (like myself), when we recognize we are infected with the sin disease.

 

I'm hoping to get infected with a cure instead ... so maybe I can start spreading that instead.

 

.... well, maybe one day....

 

-Dennis

 

There are plenty of other great places or groups you can go & hang out with people & learn how to increase your interpersonal skills and help you become a better person.

 

Definitely much better than continuing to go to the place that is one of the causes (if not a primary cause) of your problems. Staying there will continue to discombobulate & fragment your own sense of self until you have no power to fight back.

 

I'm happy that you realize you still need help, and I'll be even happier when I hear that you're finding help from a place that isn't adding to your troubles.

 

The first step of finding a cure is not dealing with the symptoms, but the cause. That's a big mistake of a lot of people I know that have had to be slowly coaxed out of Christianity & into reality. They're too afraid to get right to the root of their problems and languish in torment much longer than they have to.

 

May you have the wisdom to figure it out sooner than later.