sonofspong Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 Im not a big fan of kids. The thought of having to constantly look after a screaming little monster is something I do not find appealing. Thats also the reason why I only have low-maintenence pets. (a snake and a huge frog) People tell me "ooo, how can you not like kids?." I think for a second, look over to the frantic Mexican lady whos screaming at her mischeivious brood, and I reply "I'ts quite easy, actually" I don't like kids. I dont like playing games with them, talking to them in that rediculous baby talk, wiping their asses, or just watching them to make sure they dont do something stupid. Not surprisingly, it has raised some questions in my family. My mom is pretty hurt that I'm not interested in giving her grandchildren. And my sister feels hurt that I dont play with or spend time with her kids. Us folks who'd rather not procreate are demonized by the public, viewed as cold-hearted monsters. But I believe that just because you can have kids, dosen't mean you should. I see plenty of people who definately shouldn't be spreading their genetic material. Parenthood is a huge responsibility, and there are enough people who do a poor job of raising their kids (if they do at all). I know I'll be one of those people, so I intend never to put myself in that situation. Sadly, there are more than enough childless couples who'd give anything to have a kid of their own, and give him/her a loving home. And there are plenty of healthy, fertile single folk who'd gladly trade thier own fertility (or testicles, or whatever) if they could. Life's really unfair. Is it so wrong to have no desire to raise a family..ever? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 I can relate. However, I can tolerate kids for short periods of time and sometimes they are fun to play with if they are in the elementary school age-range. I do not plan to have kids, and my MIL thinks I am Satan incarnate for this. I don't think it's wrong to be this way at all.. I think parenthood is a responsibility that way too many people don't take seriously enough, and I don't think I'd be a good mom, or at least as good as I'd want to be. I don't want to contribute to the depletion of our earth's resources by having a child and adding to the population, nor do I want to pass on my less-than-ideal genes. Someday, however, I may decide to adopt an older kid if the pressure is too great from family members. My MIL has already threatened to never speak to me again if I don't "open my heart to children." She cries and bawls her eyes out every single time the issues comes up. It's very frustrating. The thing I hate the most about it is that people think that my clock just isn't ticking yet... and that like every respectable woman, I will want kids as soon as I am "settled." It seems beyond some people that having children isn't the life goal for all of us. It doesn't make me selfish, in fact, in some ways, it makes me less selfish than they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 I can tolerate them as long as they're at an age where you can actually talk to them. Before the age of 6 or so, they can be a hassle. Okay, I don't have kids, but I have watched other people's. I gotta agree that it's annoying how people think that everyone wants kids. Last summer, my parents hosted a wedding anniversary party for some friends of my parents who go to my dad's church (also my old church). I think it might've been a 25th anniversary. Anyway, there was someone who made a remark along the lines of "your personality would really blossom if you got married and had kids." I'm 30. If my personality was going to "blossom" any more, it would have already. I'm an introvert. I've learned how to deal with it. Why can't other people? As for parental pressure, I'm glad my parents are intelligent in that regard. It'll probably take me til I'm in menopause to find someone who's actually willing to marry me, anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 Anyway, there was someone who made a remark along the lines of "your personality would really blossom if you got married and had kids." I'm 30. If my personality was going to "blossom" any more, it would have already. I'm an introvert. I've learned how to deal with it. Why can't other people? Oh... that would make my blood absolutely boil. What the hell are they talking about, anyway? My experience is that once a woman has kids, her personality becomes more homogenous with the other mothers out there... Nothing wrong with it, but there is kind of an equalizing influence involved, I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonofspong Posted June 25, 2006 Author Share Posted June 25, 2006 This is off topic, but Pandora mentioned about not wanting to pass on her "undesirable genes" I've given that notion alot of thought in the past, and I must say, there is a sort of cold logic to "survival of the fittest" In the past, only those with good genes tended to survive. Take me, for instance. Had I been born in an earlier time period, I wouldn't have made it past childhood. First of all, I was born prematurly. Second, my appendix bursted when I was 7. Thirldy, my eyesight was very poor. Even If I somehow made it to adulthood, I woulda been virtually useless to my society/clan/tribe, whatever, since I was so nearsighted, I was practically a step away from blindness. I can praise modern medicine and lasik surgery all I want, and yes im grateful for it. Yet, I have this nagging feeling that im simply not the "fittest" member of humankind. Ancient humans didn't survive by being weak and stupid. Natural selection had a tendency to weed out the less capable. So, that makes me wonder. Modern medicine is great, yeah. But is it really that benificial for our race? Because people like me are surviving to adulthood, they're able to...."pollute" (for lack of a better word) the genepool with not so desirable genes. And because of this, you get people like Anna Nicole Smith and pretty much every guest on the Jerry Springer show. From an ethical standpoint, keeping a "pure" genepool sounds very cruel and Nazi-like. And it probably is. But still, makes you wonder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sage Nabooru Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 People tell me "ooo, how can you not like kids?." I think for a second, look over to the frantic Mexican lady whos screaming at her mischeivious brood, and I reply "I'ts quite easy, actually" I know, what is up with that? Not just fundies, but it seems just about everybody with kids of their own thinks that childfree people are "selfish". Oh yeah, I'm sooo selfish - I'm not bringing another human into the world to eat more food, use up more resources, spend more money on products made by slave labor, drink more water, buy up more land for more housing, guzzle more gas, and produce more trash for more landfills in the name of vague reasons like "I wanted something to love that would love me back" or "I want to pass my wisdom on to another generation".....and what do those two statements begin with? "I WANT"! Who's selfish now? I think a lot of the time people have children because they're bored and want something to do with their lives. If that's not selfish I don't know what is. I remember Wanda Sykes once did a stand-up bit in which she mentioned that parents always list the troubles and tribulations their children bring upon them, and then say quietly, "But it's worth it....." and they will NEVER look you in the eye when they say it. I find that to be totally true. So, that makes me wonder. Modern medicine is great, yeah. But is it really that benificial for our race? Because people like me are surviving to adulthood, they're able to...."pollute" (for lack of a better word) the genepool with not so desirable genes. And because of this, you get people like Anna Nicole Smith and pretty much every guest on the Jerry Springer show. In my opinion all research into fertility should be forcibly stopped worldwide. We already have too many children to feed, why are we putting money into creating more? I think it was a year or two ago that Britain proudly touted the fact that its scientists had created a baby with two mothers. Great. But, what the hell for? So we can create even more hungry mouths in more creative ways? I'm sorry but whenever I see some couple whining and crying over how they just can't conceive and they've been visiting all kinds of doctors and having all kinds of surgery, I just feel a total deep-seated disgust. Again - now who's selfish? Me, or you for insisting on creating another mouth to feed rather than take a child in who desperately needs care? And, I sometimes have to wonder what it is with prolonging and prolonging our lives. Sure, it's great and all. But I've been inside the nursing home industry, and I can tell you that just because you're living LONGER, doesn't mean that your life is worth living. So much geriatric medicine today seems to be focused around popping enough needles into delirious Alzheimer's patients and vegetables to ensure that their hearts beat enough times to last until the next dosage is delivered. What's the point of prolonging life if that life is spent locked up in a nursing home totally oblivious to your surroundings? It may just be me but I have noticed that countries that tend to be more religious have a more accepting culture concerning death and the cycle of life. European countries with more anti-religious attitudes as compared to the US, like Britain and France, seem to have more scientists whose research is based on pushing the very limits of mortality itself (Raelians, anyone?). You mention survival of the fittest and it brings to mind things like birth defects. Of course a birth defect is a terrible thing, but it's a fact of nature. Many children die. It's sad but a part of life. In order for life to continue as a whole life needs to end individually. Yet so many countries put so much research into making sure birth defects and childhood diseases never happen again. (That's another thing that pisses me off about children. People think that children are more important than adults, or that their emotions matter more. That's why I would never donate to something like Locks of Love. It may sound mean but I think it's a discriminatory organization, to only offer wigs to children, like adults would never feel ashamed or embarrassed about chemo baldness, or at least that their shame is acceptable. All people are equal and it's downright prejudiced to favor children over adults.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurari Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 Totally not wrong. I had my tubes tied when I was 24 and I don't miss that ability in the slightest. My usual response to nosy people who ask me, "Why don't you want kids?" "I met yours." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth C Triggs Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 Myself, I never was really into kids. I didn't even realize that I *could* choose to not have children until relatively recently in my life, which is a good thing. There's a lot of societal pressure (a lot of times religious) that makes people start families (badly). So I agree with you, SonofSpong. I happily identify as childfree, in fact, because I do not feel a lack of children. My life is plenty happy without them, thank you very much...and I absolutely don't really have the desire to be around them. Which is ironic because I teach teens, one would say. But they don't have to come home with me. -Seth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 I know, what is up with that? Not just fundies, but it seems just about everybody with kids of their own thinks that childfree people are "selfish". Oh yeah, I'm sooo selfish - I'm not bringing another human into the world to eat more food, use up more resources, spend more money on products made by slave labor, drink more water, buy up more land for more housing, guzzle more gas, and produce more trash for more landfills in the name of vague reasons like "I wanted something to love that would love me back" or "I want to pass my wisdom on to another generation".....and what do those two statements begin with? "I WANT"! Who's selfish now? I think a lot of the time people have children because they're bored and want something to do with their lives. If that's not selfish I don't know what is. Yeah, you have a point. So many people have kids for the wrong reasons, either for the ones you mentioned, or they think their religion demands it. If they want someone to love, they should go to a dating site and hook up with someone. If they want to pass their wisdom on, then they should write it down in a blog or in a book. Anyway, most of them don't think before they start having families. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taphophilia Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 People who want children tend to think of the cute little baby. They do not consider that the cute baby may have colic and scream for two months straight. They do not understand that their cute little baby will become a teenager with out of control hormones and an attitude. They do not understand what a genetic lottery it is, and your kid may take after a family member you hate. They do not think or consider that their kid could have ADHD and are clueless about the nightmare that is to deal with. Talking to other parents about the problems they have with their kids, I am very, very lucky. It really isn't that much about my parenting skills, but that my kids are just decent people. Even still, I'm a single divorced mom with three kids. If I knew what it was like to be a parent before I had them, I highly doubt they would exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sage Nabooru Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 People who want children tend to think of the cute little baby. They do not consider that the cute baby may have colic and scream for two months straight. They do not understand that their cute little baby will become a teenager with out of control hormones and an attitude. They do not understand what a genetic lottery it is, and your kid may take after a family member you hate. They do not think or consider that their kid could have ADHD and are clueless about the nightmare that is to deal with. You would be amazed how many teenagers - TEENAGERS - go on and on about how desperately they want a cute little baby in their lives, and how many of them actually follow through with it, exactly as you describe: they picture the Gerber Baby Food commercial kids, all plump and smiling, and dream of cuddling it and cooing over it and playing with it. Never does it occur to them that babies cry like nails on a chalkboard only a million times louder, babies need their diapers changed, and most of all, babies grow up. They just have this utopic picture in their minds of this angelic child and themselves as the joyous young madonnas. Answer: Get a dog. Even if you don't plan to have kids you should have a dog. For nothing makes life more pleasurable then dogs. I am with dogs the way normal people are with kids - tell me you don't like them and my face is aghast, and I gasp, "Omigod like how could you not like a dog?" Only thing is with me I truly cannot understand your dislike (whereas I'm willing to bet most parents know damned well why you don't like children). Dogs take up less maintenance and give so much more back than a kid ever could. Dogs win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DucorpsToo Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 Another one here in the childfree camp! . Hubby and I have been married 17 years and are blissfully childfree for similar reasons as the beginning poster and Sage Nabooru. We consider parenthood as just another lifestyle choice and is not for everyone..just as being, say, a physician or chemist is not for everyone. I'm not particularly fond of kids nor do I wish to take on the huge responsibilty for their care (feed, clothe, medical care, incessant lecturing or having to explain why they're not allowed to hang out with a certain group of so-called friends...etc). And others here are correct..when some childed people villify us as being selfish, the reasons why many of the childed had kids amount to ego-gratification as well. Actually I find it more selfish for a person to bring a child into the world and lead his life as if he were non-childed (e.g. partying,..not spending quality time with said child, neglectful, dumping kid off on grandma...etc) than the childfree person who vocalizes his brutally honest and "selfish" reasons for not procreating because in this case the "child" doesn't exist to begin with and hence does not suffer. Luckily, here in southern California we very rarely get "bingoed" like that. As I mentioned in another post, my husband has gotten some of the "breeder bingo" from some of his fellow Iraqis, but he usually tells them that it's none of their goddamned business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexandrian Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 If you don't want to have kids, I can't see you do a child any favors by having one not because you wanted them but out of a sense of obligation... Of course, you have to worry what will happen if all the intelligent people have no or few kids, and the religious fundies breed like rodents. When I was Christian, I knew plenty of people who wanted to have "As Many Children as God Provides". Not going to be good if those people take over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chefranden Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 Is it so wrong to have no desire to raise a family..ever? No, it is not wrong at all. There are plenty of people. If i were you I'd get fixed. That will cut down on the pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taphophilia Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 If you don't want to have kids, I can't see you do a child any favors by having one not because you wanted them but out of a sense of obligation... Of course, you have to worry what will happen if all the intelligent people have no or few kids, and the religious fundies breed like rodents. When I was Christian, I knew plenty of people who wanted to have "As Many Children as God Provides". Not going to be good if those people take over. At least Jerry Springer and Maury Povitch won't have a lack of guests. Jesus, bad genetics coupled with poor parenting make great entertainment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Checkmate Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 Holy fuck! ANOTHER thread tailor made for me! My lament? "All Daddy wanted was a blow job!" Boy, oh BOY, do I believe that not everyone should have kids. Especially not me! Unfortunately the horse already escaped the barn on THAT one. I'm a Father and I fucking HATE it! It wasn't my choice. It was an accident. I'm doing the best I can, but MAN!, do I wish life came with an erase/rewind button! Not everyone was meant to be a parent. That, too, is part of "natural selection". If parenting is for you, then yeah, do it. If not, then fuck no! There's not a damn thing wrong with keeping your sperm/eggs in solitary confinement. (So to speak.) Aren't there enough fucking humans overcrowding this world? (Author included. ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth C Triggs Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 Definitely, if you can, go for the good ol' snip. I did, and it was probably one of the best decisions I could've made. I feel so secure now! -Seth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandora Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 Totally not wrong. I had my tubes tied when I was 24 and I don't miss that ability in the slightest. My usual response to nosy people who ask me, "Why don't you want kids?" "I met yours." I mentioned this to my doctor after my miscarriage, at the public hospital, and they wouldn't do it. I can't find anyone anywhere that will tie the tubes of a nulliparous woman. Ticks me off. How did you manage to convince someone to get the surgery for you? I'm jealous. And yes, I agree with the rest of you... there is something neurotically selfish about having children for the reasons you all mention, and I don't think they will ever understand how in some ways, our decision is unselfish. Of course, there are unselfish things that parents do, and there are some selfish reasons we choose not to have kids... but I don't think either of those are the primary reasons we choose what we choose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex-COG Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 Totally not wrong. I had my tubes tied when I was 24 and I don't miss that ability in the slightest. I mentioned this to my doctor after my miscarriage, at the public hospital, and they wouldn't do it. I can't find anyone anywhere that will tie the tubes of a nulliparous woman. Ticks me off. How did you manage to convince someone to get the surgery for you? I'm jealous. That's what I've always heard. Are the doctors afraid that later you'll change your mind, and come back to sue them? Or is it considered "unneccessary surgery"? But if someone really does not want kids, I would think it's neccessary to the individual. One more way that the medical profession controls the bodies of women! What about guys? Can they easily get a vasectomy even if they don't have kids? If they can, cry foul! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misterspock1 Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 Is it so wrong to have no desire to raise a family..ever? According to the Bible it is. Just read Genesis 1:28. I have had some serious questions about this issue myself. There is part of me that wants to have a child that I can play with and bond with, a son with whom I can have meaningful, insightful man-to-man discussions about life, or a daughter who still calls me "Daddy" even when she's 40. There is also a part of me that is terrified at the very thought of raising a child. The responsibilities of providing food, shelter, and security for them are just the tip of the iceberg. What I really fear is teaching them values and ethics. I am very confused about everything right now, and I know that if I have a child right now I am just going to fuck them up. However, I am afraid that even when I get these isses resolved that I will still fuck up my children. My parents made some very serious mistakes, and while I fear that I will make the same mistakes, I also fear that I will go too far to the opposite and make even more mistakes. My sister and my counselor both say that I have a lot of really good qualities that would make me a good husband and father. Maybe I do and maybe I don't, but for right now I definitely do not want any kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godlessgrrl Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 I think kids are cool. I dig kids. But I'm smart enough to know that the only reason I think so is because when I did babysitting and nannying for all those years... I got to give them back at the end of the day. I have a HUGE list of reasons why I don't want kids. It gets longer every year, and gets longer every time I meet some set of brats spawned by somebody who just popped out a litter because that was what their family and culture said they should do. Kids are too important to fuck up. I wish people would realize that more often. I think if they did we'd have fewer kids on the planet, and certainly fewer fucked up kids. I for one have no desire whatsoever to be a fucking baby factory. No way. I value my sleep too much, and I'm just WAY too selfish. I'd hate the competition a kid would bring. Plus I'd probably kill them within 6 months just from sheer sleep deprivation. (I'm fucking psycho when I don't have enough sleep. Seriously.) Fortunately I'm kind of lucky. My mom definitely doesn't want to be a grandmother. I don't think my sister wants kids either. I suppose the only person who'd be disappointed might be my dad, because he really just loves kids... but heh, my sister and I pegged our cousin as the family breeder years ago, and she just recently had her first baby. And more power to her - it's what she wanted to do, and she and her hubby are going to be *great* parents. There's nothing wrong with not wanting to have kids. Nothing at all. In fact we've got 6+ billion people on the planet and I really wish people would stop and *think* about it more before reproducing. Cuz I have to wonder, how many people would actually remain childless if they felt they really had a choice? Anyway. Thoughts from someone who's content to be the Eccentric Auntie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigile Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 I want a dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 I wish I wasn't allergic to dogs. I have a gecko. Geckos are cute, in a weird reptilian way. Plus they don't have dander (AFAIK) and they don't shed all over the place or have to be house-trained. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigile Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 Yeah, the reason we don't have one is we live in a downtown hi rise. I don't want to go up and down the elevator all day taking one for a walk. We like to travel and don't know what to do with a dog when we are gone. We are also worried a puppy will ruin our leather couch. Dogs satisfy most of those familial instincts that we try to accomplish through kids though and they don't come with many of the same problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 My apt. complex doesn't allow dogs. They do allow cats, but I'm even more allergic to cats than I am to dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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