Skeptic Posted May 5, 2009 Share Posted May 5, 2009 Aw, thanks. My pleasure. It sounds like you need all the hugs you can get. Yeah, the brain does really odd things when it's programmed to respond to certain stimuli. I honestly couldn't tell you most of what happened during the actual exorcisms. I'm fairly certain I was guided into a trance state and whatever went down, my subconscious put it away somewhere. Yeah, that can happen often. It's the brain's way of protecting itself from the trauma. You were probably in some type of dissociative state where your brain tried to pretend like it wasn't happening, almost. You may also have trauma-induced amnesia where you don't remember what happened because you don't want to. Out of curiousity, have you seen any mental health professionals for this? I'll admit that I've had trauma and abuse and I haven't gone to see anyone about it (yet), so if you haven't, then that's fine, I guess. It can be hard to talk about it to another person, especially if you know that that person has to be emotionally detached as part of their job. I'm not looking forward to the day it comes back up to resolve itself, if it ever does. I have these latent feelings of absolute terror and major trauma but nothing concrete to hang those feelings on. I don't know quite what to say to this. I find myself wanting to explain what it's like to have that come back, but I'm afraid that I might scare you. I'm not sure how it'll be for you, but this is what it was like for me. It was like I was standing in front of a wall of glass, like a sliding glass door or a full-sized mirror, that is perfectly intact, and then one day, something came along and just shattered it. That is the best way that I know how to describe that. I am extremely fortunate to have found a friend who I can talk to about it who understands that, and it sounds like you need someone like that. To be honest, I'm reluctant to fill that role for you because I don't want to get triggered myself, and I wouldn't be able to fill it perfectly, but I could try if that was something you were interested in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarahgrace Posted May 5, 2009 Share Posted May 5, 2009 Skeptic, thanks for your thoughts. I have often thought of getting into counseling to work through some of this stuff but it just keeps getting put on the backburner, y'know? It's still in my head to do, though. I don't know if I'm ready to really talk about it with friends at all... Most of my friends were with me through that when I first experienced it (not present at the actual event, but they were in my life) and I don't know if they would understand how I see it differently now. The one person I feel like I could really talk about it with is living in Japan right now, and it's so much harder to talk to him about this stuff without having him there beside me to give me a hug and stuff. He's an ex-christian atheist as well, and also went to a crazy charismatic church. But yeah, I dunno, it's one thing to discuss these things in text on a website... I write things like they happened to someone else, not to me. I don't know if I'm ready to really deal with it; I've got too much other stuff going on that needs my attention, you know? Thanks for putting yourself out there though. It means a lot to know that others have dealt with similar things, and that there are supportive people out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeptic Posted May 14, 2009 Share Posted May 14, 2009 Okay, I'm going to rant. I had to wait until the thread was completely dead so I wouldn't kill another one lol. I had the whole demon experience, too, as a kid, no less. I obviously don't believe in the shit anymore, but when I get triggered, that goes out the window, basically. I get really hypervigilant, I turn on all the lights in the house, I can't sleep in the dark (I didn't used to be able to until after I deconverted, so I was basically scared of the dark for 18 or so years), I can't leave my back exposed to open air because I'm afraid that some imaginary demon will come up to me and touch me or some crap. It's maddening, really, especially when I'm an atheist, I don't have to believe in this anymore, blah blah. My mother is most likely mentally ill (although I didn't know this when I was, you know, three years old) and she would tell me all these stories about how she'd see demons everywhere or something stupid like that. She told me when I was around five years old that she had a conversation with Satan. I don't remember exactly how old I was, but it was before I went to Kindergarten, and I started Kindergarten at five years old and moved on to first grade at six. I was taught that I had the "spiritual gift" of discernment, which meant that I could feel demonic presences. Of course, I wasn't allowed to tell anyone about my mother's craziness, and I couldn't tell anyone about what I myself was being led to believe, and even if I did, no one would believe me anyway. I told this one girl that I went to school with about something along those lines, because I went to a xian school in Kindergarten and I thought all xians believed in demons, and it scared her shitless. I think she might've even stopped talking to me after that. I can't remember. After that, I never talked about it again to anyone outside of my immediate family, not even to extended family. It was this dark, twisted secret that I had to keep to preserve...what, I don't know, but telling someone wasn't an option for me at the time. It's barely even an option for me at this point even after deconverting because barely anyone talks about that, with good reason. I mean, I've killed threads here with this shit. That alone tells me something. I've seriously considered telling someone in my family the things that my mom told me so that she can get some kind of psychological counseling. I think she might've tried to get xian counseling at one point, but that just feeds into it, especially the kind of "counseling" that she was getting. At this point, I'm not even upset in the way that you'd think that I would be. I'm just pissed. I'm pissed that it happened to me, that I couldn't have deconverted at an earlier age because of how authoritarian my parents were, that my mother put all of this burden on my shoulders as a CHILD, for fuck's sake, when she could've gone to some counselor to tell them instead, that I couldn't tell anyone, that I had to be terrified of something that doesn't even fucking exist and that I couldn't see that earlier, the list goes on and on. I'm not looking for any kind of pity or sympathy when I say stuff like this, and the only reason I'm posting this, really, is so someone else besides me will know that this even happened. I don't have to keep the fucking secret anymore, so I might as well tell someone, right? If you read through this, then I'm very sorry for probably scaring the crap out of you, but I had to say it or I would've obsessed over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeptic Posted May 14, 2009 Share Posted May 14, 2009 I purposely triggered myself about an hour ago. I didn't want to feel pissed off about it, and the reason for that is kind of complicated, but I watched the newest episode of House on Hulu, and that show had been triggering the crap out of me lately, because of what House is going through at the moment. If you watch the show, you know what I'm talking about. That sorta did the trick, but it wasn't as strong as I wanted, so I looked up exorcism on YouTube and I watched a 20/20 special on exorcism. It showed a few clips of people undergoing exorcisms. This one part of the report was an interview with people whose mom or something was being "attacked by demons". At one point, the woman said that she wouldn't be able to convince anyone that her mom was being attacked by supernatural forces unless they wanted to believe that, and I decided that I didn't want to believe that, so I didn't. Then I watched 30 Rock, which is a pretty funny show, and I laughed over that. This might sound like an emotional rollercoaster, but it wasn't. I didn't feel like I was stuck on some ride that I wanted off of, I felt like I was driving. I knew how I wanted to feel, I knew how to induce that feeling, I felt it, then moved onto the next one. I'm not repressing the anger or the terror, either. I just don't feel either one of those. I'm not hypervigilant, I'm not trying to figure out the physical cause of every little noise that I hear, I just don't believe in demons. I haven't spiralled into irrationality. I'm still rational. I feel confident and I wanted to feel that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vomit Comet Posted May 15, 2009 Author Share Posted May 15, 2009 Okay, I'm going to rant. I had to wait until the thread was completely dead so I wouldn't kill another one lol. I'm not looking for any kind of pity or sympathy when I say stuff like this, and the only reason I'm posting this, really, is so someone else besides me will know that this even happened. I don't have to keep the fucking secret anymore, so I might as well tell someone, right? If you read through this, then I'm very sorry for probably scaring the crap out of you, but I had to say it or I would've obsessed over it. Your story is far more common than you realize. Believe me, I know. And I can very much empathize with your experiences, except that I was fortunate not to endure it as a child. More like between the ages of 17 and 28, very roughly speaking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vomit Comet Posted May 15, 2009 Author Share Posted May 15, 2009 Pitchu's story has helped me a lot, as has yours, just knowing there are others who couldn't fall for this craziness, but were still hurt by it, and can recover. Shit! I'm going to be turning that one over in my head for the next week or three. That's one hell of a story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dhampir Posted May 15, 2009 Share Posted May 15, 2009 Spam Bot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeptic Posted May 16, 2009 Share Posted May 16, 2009 Your story is far more common than you realize. Believe me, I know. And I can very much empathize with your experiences, except that I was fortunate not to endure it as a child. More like between the ages of 17 and 28, very roughly speaking. Thanks for saying that. It doesn't usually come up in conversation with people, and it's something that I couldn't really talk about until now, so I had no idea. I mean, I told one person about it once and and she was completely freaked out. I didn't really want a repeat of that experience. It's kind of a double-edged sword, though; it's kind of good that you and others empathize because then we can understand each other, but then it's not something that anyone should ever have to go through in the first place. Thank you for making that clear to me, though. That was much appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubyfruit Pixie Posted May 17, 2009 Share Posted May 17, 2009 I clicked every single box on that last question. Then again, I was raised Pentecostal. I just wish that there was an "All Of The Above" option, because in the church I used to go to, people tried to cast demons out of everything or bind demons in the name of Jesus...looking back now, I must've looked and felt pretty stupid flailing around and screaming at the air. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted May 17, 2009 Share Posted May 17, 2009 Top of each list, and checked all check boxes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vomit Comet Posted May 19, 2009 Author Share Posted May 19, 2009 looking back now, I must've looked and felt pretty stupid flailing around and screaming at the air. I am so glad that cell phone video cameras and YouTube weren't around back then. Imagine if someone posted a YouTube vid here called "crazy holy rollers yelling at demons, caught on cell phone cam" and... lo and behold.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Perus32 Posted May 24, 2009 Share Posted May 24, 2009 Great analysis, fuego! Apparently blinking rapidly while doing this makes it work better. Don't forget cramming your eyelids so tightly shut you see stars (angelic/demonic power, the holy spirit or whatever) and grimacing like you're about to take a shit. I had a couple books recommended to me to help me deal with psychological issues (Bondage Breaker and another book by the same author) that basically told me all my problems were because of demons. Scary thing is, I believed it. Worse, I gave one to a friend to try and help him improve his life. Wish I could take that move back. Yeah, Neil Anderson's stuff really messed things up for me...Bondage Breaker sure put me in a lot of bondage! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naiya Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 Ugh. EVERY board I went to and talked honestly on, without exception, believed that I was demon possessed. Just because I have OBE and lucid dreams with dream entities, people think it's Teh Devil. When I was a teenager my friends did some BS ritual to banish the "demon." There were several more deliverances online and offline over the years. Ironically I did not believe in spirits or demons previously, but these crazy people pretty much scared me into believe it, and because I was afraid and confused about what was happening to me (I had little knowledge of altered states of consciousness) I let them walk all over me with their bullcrap. The worst thing of all was the guilt and fear and blame games they played when their BS didn't work. After the process of deconverting, which only until fairly recently came to a true close, and a lot of sorting out of things it got better. Whatever entities I talk to are 1. Only in altered states of consciousness like dreams and OBEs; 2. Are very possibly part of my subconscious, which was strong enough to have given themselves identities without my conscious effort, and thus are important parts of my mind and identity; 3. About 100 times more helpful and useful than God ever was, and are concerned with MY health and well-being and not about crap like worship and forgiveness. But yeah...try explaining that stuff to any theist and they usually flip out about it, especially Christians. In their view it's practically proof that Teh Devil deconverts people. Not to mention it was like the "ooh shiny!" chance to "prove" their magic powers. In my view it was complete proof that God doesn't exist because God couldn't cure me of something that isn't even tangible and is in his field. I figure it's pretty weird but technically I'm still less delusional than most theists. And if I'm going to be delusional it might as well be my own original delusions and not some guy's from two thousand years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ephymeris Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Ugh. EVERY board I went to and talked honestly on, without exception, believed that I was demon possessed. Just because I have OBE and lucid dreams with dream entities, people think it's Teh Devil. When I was a teenager my friends did some BS ritual to banish the "demon." There were several more deliverances online and offline over the years. Ironically I did not believe in spirits or demons previously, but these crazy people pretty much scared me into believe it, and because I was afraid and confused about what was happening to me (I had little knowledge of altered states of consciousness) I let them walk all over me with their bullcrap. The worst thing of all was the guilt and fear and blame games they played when their BS didn't work. After the process of deconverting, which only until fairly recently came to a true close, and a lot of sorting out of things it got better. Whatever entities I talk to are 1. Only in altered states of consciousness like dreams and OBEs; 2. Are very possibly part of my subconscious, which was strong enough to have given themselves identities without my conscious effort, and thus are important parts of my mind and identity; 3. About 100 times more helpful and useful than God ever was, and are concerned with MY health and well-being and not about crap like worship and forgiveness. But yeah...try explaining that stuff to any theist and they usually flip out about it, especially Christians. In their view it's practically proof that Teh Devil deconverts people. Not to mention it was like the "ooh shiny!" chance to "prove" their magic powers. In my view it was complete proof that God doesn't exist because God couldn't cure me of something that isn't even tangible and is in his field. I figure it's pretty weird but technically I'm still less delusional than most theists. And if I'm going to be delusional it might as well be my own original delusions and not some guy's from two thousand years ago. Naiya, forgive my ignorance but OBE, does it stand for out of body experience? I have had experiences when falling asleep where I felt disassociation from my body, I've had hypnogogic hallucinations including "shadow people" and spiders, lucid dreaming, and other strange sleep related issues. I finally went to sleep medicine and they are pretty sure I'm narcoleptic. I say "pretty sure" because they are waiting on my neurology report to officially confirm it. Another option they gave me, petite mal epilepsy...When I was a christian, I was afraid this was a demon issue but I'm relieved to know I'm not crazy, not possessed, just having a health issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naiya Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Naiya, forgive my ignorance but OBE, does it stand for out of body experience? I have had experiences when falling asleep where I felt disassociation from my body, I've had hypnogogic hallucinations including "shadow people" and spiders, lucid dreaming, and other strange sleep related issues. I finally went to sleep medicine and they are pretty sure I'm narcoleptic. I say "pretty sure" because they are waiting on my neurology report to officially confirm it. Another option they gave me, petite mal epilepsy...When I was a christian, I was afraid this was a demon issue but I'm relieved to know I'm not crazy, not possessed, just having a health issue. Yep OBE means out of body experience. I would not want to take medicine to stop what happens to me at this point, because personally I do not feel that it is a bad thing anymore and as long as my religious beliefs don't make me all terrified and guilty it really doesn't interfere with my health or daily life. But I'm glad that you were able to get some help with your sleep issues--did they just diagnose you with things, or did they give you treatment? Did you have a lot of sleep paralysis also? Sometimes that happens a lot with the hypnogagic hallucinations. You can take advantage of SP and use it to WILD (wake initiated lucid dream). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ephymeris Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Yep OBE means out of body experience. I would not want to take medicine to stop what happens to me at this point, because personally I do not feel that it is a bad thing anymore and as long as my religious beliefs don't make me all terrified and guilty it really doesn't interfere with my health or daily life. But I'm glad that you were able to get some help with your sleep issues--did they just diagnose you with things, or did they give you treatment? Did you have a lot of sleep paralysis also? Sometimes that happens a lot with the hypnogagic hallucinations. You can take advantage of SP and use it to WILD (wake initiated lucid dream). Sleep medicine put me through a sleep study and nap study which was pretty unpleasant. At least 50 wires coming off my head, face, neck, arms, legs, chest, not to mention the two nasal canulas, 2 breathing belts, and chest monitor. Not to mention the paranoia of knowing someone in another room could see you, hear you, and know if you were awake or asleep. I tend to curse in my sleep, and as I was doing it I was freaked out people could hear it. Then I had to stay all day and take 5 scheduled naps while they monitored my brain waves. I haven't started any medications yet, I'm still waiting on the neuro report. Treatment options don't sound great as they are drug based and I don't like taking medicine. Knowing what the problem is will possibly give me homeopathic and behavioral options. I often have vivid dreaming as I'm falling asleep when reality and dream kind of meld together but I've yet to figure out how to make this a lucid situation. I can get control of my deep sleep dreams if they cause intense emotional response from me (very scared or happy) but I'm no pro for sure. Cataplexy in the form of full paralysis is rare with me but it has happened, I often wake up with upper body weakness. My arms and head feel very heavy and I can't move around well for a few minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hereticzero Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Metaphorically, I still believe monsters walk among us but they are disguised as humans. Realistically, these people are just evil! No demons, just very evil people. The bad part is that no one knows they are in the presence of such monsters until it is too late. I've met a few monsters in my life time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vomit Comet Posted June 4, 2009 Author Share Posted June 4, 2009 Anybody ever experience sleep paralysis? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mriana Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Metaphorically, I still believe monsters walk among us but they are disguised as humans. Realistically, these people are just evil! No demons, just very evil people. The bad part is that no one knows they are in the presence of such monsters until it is too late. I've met a few monsters in my life time. I'm that way with angels and I've met my share of angels in my lifetime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decafaholic Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Wow, I've been on this board for 2 years and I had no idea so many others shared the aweful experience of demon paranoia. I now consider the Assemblies of God a cult for the crazy emotional shit they put people through, even at young ages. Here's a terrible story from my youth group days: There was a kid in my youth group, Ryan, about 4 years younger than me. At the time I think he was 13 or 14. Very impressionable and sensitive kid. So, our youth group went to church camp that summer (http://www.ex-christian.net/index.php?showtopic=30978) but I went a different week so I didn't see this, I just heard it from Ryan when he got back. At church camp, there is an extended time of singing before the sermon and this can be a very emotional event. A few days prior to this event, he had been hearing voices telling him he should kill himself. During the singing time, he fell out of his chair onto the floor and started breathing really hard. His sister got the nurse to come because it looked like he was having some sort of asthma attack even though he doesn't have asthma. Well, the nurse decided it was a spiritual attack, not a health problem. Ryan said he blacked out and when he "came to", he was being held down and screamed at by a male counselor. When I guess the counselors were convinced they had cast the demon out, the camp director pulled Ryan aside and asked him what he had been doing to invite demons into his life. The poor kid was depressed and suicidal and now probably humiliated in front of his peers and it's HIS FAULT?? Well, Ryan decided that because he had been listening to rock music, that's why all that had happened. Ryan just graduated high school this year, and you know, I still worry about him. Because he's still very involved in the cult I escaped. And Because I know what it's like to be depressed and convinced that f you just pray hard enough or bind the right demons in the right tone of voice that you'll get relief. I hope he'll be okay. I hope he can get out someday. It's tough seeing the people you care about still caught up in the mind fuck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vendredie Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Anybody ever experience sleep paralysis? I have. It's terrifying, because it normally happens when I'm either dreaming about being hit by lightning or chased by zombies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ephymeris Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Anybody ever experience sleep paralysis? *raises hand* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vomit Comet Posted June 5, 2009 Author Share Posted June 5, 2009 When you're a Pentecostal and you get sleep paralysis, you automatically assume it's scary demons. And the people at your church will more than likely reinforce this. Even if there are medical professionals that could tell you what it is, your distrust of them will prevent you from telling them your experiences. Because you know it's demons and you also know they would think you were crazy. So imagine crying out to Jesus to save you when the "demons" show up, but Jesus doesn't do shit, it just keeps happening. For hours at times, night after night, as my own case was apparently rather severe. Even after I finally learned what sleep paralysis was, I was too scared to deal with it in the way that the doctor told me too. Because I thought that if I didn't do it the Pentecostal way, that the demons would drive me mad and make me jump out a fifth floor window or some shit. After I fell away, I tried what the doctor had told me to do years prior. And it worked like a charm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vomit Comet Posted June 5, 2009 Author Share Posted June 5, 2009 During the singing time, he fell out of his chair onto the floor and started breathing really hard. His sister got the nurse to come because it looked like he was having some sort of asthma attack even though he doesn't have asthma. Well, the nurse decided it was a spiritual attack, not a health problem. Ryan said he blacked out and when he "came to", he was being held down and screamed at by a male counselor. When I guess the counselors were convinced they had cast the demon out, the camp director pulled Ryan aside and asked him what he had been doing to invite demons into his life. The poor kid was depressed and suicidal and now probably humiliated in front of his peers and it's HIS FAULT?? Well, Ryan decided that because he had been listening to rock music, that's why all that had happened. I regret that I would have been one of the people screaming in his face at the demons, had I been there. During the height of my pentecostal involvement, I mean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bird28 Posted June 7, 2009 Share Posted June 7, 2009 I hear stories of people that said they have had encounters with demons, including many of my family members. I never seen them myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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