Inside the Church of Hate

[non conformist]

I came accross this article today. It's about a preacher named Fred Phelps (has anyone heard of him?) He runs his cult, er, church out of Topeka, Kansas with a congregation of 150 members. The biggest irony, and there are many, is how they protest against soldiers who die for Fag Loving America, yet they are exercising the rights that many of those soldiers die believing they're protecting. I also love the "opposing" view of a True Christian, who also presumes to know what God thinks and/or feels.

 

Please read and tell me what you think.

 

Oh, at the bottom of the page there is a great video put together by an undercover reporter. Pleas notice the children....

 

 

http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91136-1200311,00.html

[Asimov]

What sad people.

[Checkmate]

Yeah, the members of this forum are VERY aware of Mr. Phelps and his inbred cult of hatred. Poster child for pro-abortion if there ever was one. Phelps makes Pat Robertson look like a Liberal Christian or a Universalist. Sheer asshole.

[Mythra]

Oh man. You gotta just feel so sorry for those kids. Being raised in that environment. I'm glad they mentioned the similarities to David Koresh, cause that's probably how this group is going to end up.

 

This actually speaks volumes about the theme of another thread here. "God is not the author of confusion".

 

For Fred Phelps to claim he's following the same teachings as people who are polar opposites from this guy - like TAP or Amanda here, (I have deep respect for both of them), yet they are all getting their philosophy of life from the same book.

 

Just goes to show you that the bible can be anything you want it to be. Even an ugly, disgusting excuse for a human being like this putz can think he is "God's man".

[Asimov]

Oh man.  You gotta just feel so sorry for those kids.  Being raised in that environment.

 

Oh...I was talking about those fags. They're the cause of all this pain? How insensitive can you be?

[non conformist]

Just goes to show you that the bible can be anything you want it to be. Even an ugly, disgusting excuse for a human being like this putz can think he is "God's man".

 

That's exactly why every evil can be justified through the bible....All you need to do is claim whatever is being done is in the name of the Lord, back it up by some scripture and voila! You've got yourself another sect of Christianity. Racism is never spoken against in the bible....Jesus never spoke against slavery, in spite of his supposed message of love and peace. The bible says "Slaves obey thy masters." Intolerance and hatred are almost encouraged, camouflaged by love words...just like an abusive relationship. This guy and his "teachings" don't surprise me, they disgust me.

[LadyFeline]

I came accross this article today.  It's about a preacher named Fred Phelps (has anyone heard of him?)

 

No offense, because I'm honestly curious....

 

Where do you live that you have never heard of Fred "God Hates Fags" Phelps?

[Vixentrox]

He's one of god's chosen obviously. A TRUE Christian.

[Mad_Gerbil]

Just incase there isn't enough hatred you've got Prussian Blue:

 

http://prussianblue.net/lyrics.htm

 

Nothing like two teenage twins gals singing about the Aryan race.

Apparently they are making White Supremecy popular.

 

Its gonna get ugly again.

[♦ nivek ♦]

Most of the Phelps Klan is cause for retroative abortion..

 

Like a rabid dawg, best thing, other than avoidance with them, is a large caliber personal protective device.

 

kL

[daniel_1012]

I wonder why the need for lewd imagery of two men about to ingage in sodomy, on the semper fi sign. I say, wherever there is evil... preach against it. Whether that is in the church or in the military. Homosexuality is a sin, and I suppose everyone has their ministry.

 

His theology, though I'm sure I would agree with many points, at this time seems a bit one sided. That is, that it appears he was taken a few verses and developed a theology to bombard in one specific area. Perhaps that is his ministry; however, I can't say. It is a battle, Christianity, to say and do what is holy. Like in battle, as in the body, you have men who do things for specific reasons. Just because they don't do it all, doens't mean they are not part of the body. Just because they are not fulfilling every gift that could be given to men, does not mean they are not part of the body of Christ...

 

2 Corinthians 12:13-23

 

For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. For the body is not one member, but many. If the foot shall say, Because I am not the hand, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body? And if the ear shall say, Because I am not the eye, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body? If the whole body were an eye, where were the hearing? If the whole were hearing, where were the smelling? But now hath God set the members every one of them in the body, as it hath pleased him. And if they were all one member, where were the body? But now are they many members, yet but one body. And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you. Nay, much more those members of the body, which seem to be more feeble, are necessary: And those members of the body, which we think to be less honourable, upon these we bestow more abundant honour; and our uncomely parts have more abundant comeliness.

 

I think what Mr. Phelps needs, is a good study of what it means to be part of the body of Christ. We all all different part, but we are one body. Though he rightfully condemns many things that are wrong, He is inattentively condemning things that are good. Like walking into a room where their is weeds, and swinging an axe -- cutting down the good with the bad in one swoop. Removal of weeds takes proper planning, and removal steps. He has zeal to destroy what is evil, but blindly swinging an axe, also claiming what is good along with what is evil, I can see his actions becoming evil -- ripping up the good plants, with the bad. Ripping out the good plants, instead of tending to their weaknesses. However, URL=http://www.learnthebible.org/Zeal%20Without%20Knowledge.htm]ZEAL WITHOUT KNOWLEGE[/url] is not good. I would personally love to discuss this with the man, on both points.

 

I won't even go so far as to say Mr. Phelps is not saved, I believe he does know the Lord, or has known the Lord, and I have been guilty of zealous attempt without knowledge myself... it can be difficult. As the psalmest writes -- Psalms 119:139 - My zeal consumes me, because my foes forget thy words.

 

It seems as though, his zeal has consumed him... but I believe he will be amazed at how God was gracious to those that were really Christians.

[daniel_1012]

I wonder why the need for lewd imagery of two men about to ingage in sodomy, on the semper fi sign.  I say, wherever there is evil... preach against it.  Whether that is in the church or in the military.  Homosexuality is a sin, and I suppose everyone has their ministry.

 

His theology, though I'm sure I would agree with many points, at this time seems a bit one sided.  That is, that it appears he was taken a few verses and developed a theology to bombard in one specific area.  Perhaps that is his ministry; however, I can't say.  It is a battle, Christianity, to say and do what is holy.  Like in battle, as in the body, you have men who do things for specific reasons.  Just because they don't do it all, doens't mean they are not part of the body.  Just because they are not fulfilling every gift that could be given to men, does not mean they are not part of the body of Christ...

 

2 Corinthians 12:13-23

 

For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. For the body is not one member, but many. If the foot shall say, Because I am not the hand, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body? And if the ear shall say, Because I am not the eye, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body? If the whole body were an eye, where were the hearing? If the whole were hearing, where were the smelling? But now hath God set the members every one of them in the body, as it hath pleased him. And if they were all one member, where were the body? But now are they many members, yet but one body. And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you. Nay, much more those members of the body, which seem to be more feeble, are necessary: And those members of the body, which we think to be less honourable, upon these we bestow more abundant honour; and our uncomely parts have more abundant comeliness.

 

I think what Mr. Phelps needs, is a good study of what it means to be part of the body of Christ.  We all all different part, but we are one body.  Though he rightfully condemns many things that are wrong, He is inattentively condemning things that are good.  Like walking into a room where their is weeds, and swinging an axe -- cutting down the good with the bad in one swoop.  Removal of weeds takes proper planning, and removal steps.  He has zeal to destroy what is evil, but blindly swinging an axe, also claiming what is good along with what is evil, I can see his actions becoming evil -- ripping up the good plants, with the bad.  Ripping out the good plants, instead of tending to their weaknesses.  However, URL=http://www.learnthebible.org/Zeal%20Without%20Knowledge.htm]ZEAL WITHOUT KNOWLEGE[/url] is not good.  I would personally love to discuss this with the man, on both points.

 

I won't even go so far as to say Mr. Phelps is not saved, I believe he does know the Lord, or has known the Lord, and I have been guilty of zealous attempt without knowledge myself...  it can be difficult.  As the psalmest writes --  Psalms 119:139 - My zeal consumes me, because my foes forget thy words.

 

It seems as though, his zeal has consumed him... but I believe he will be amazed at how God was gracious to those that were really Christians.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

http://www.learnthebible.org/Zeal%20Without%20Knowledge.htm

[Checkmate]

..............

No need to double post. We read your blather the first time. Didn't like it the first time, either.

 

Why doesn't it surprise me that you can find it in your heart to be compassionate and forgiving of HATE from your "brother in Christ" Phelps, while you can BOTH condemn others to hell? Typical "Christian" love and understanding. Condemn unbelievers, and forgive your "brethren". Whatever.

[daniel_1012]

No need to double post.  We read your blather the first time.  Didn't like it the first time, either.

 

Why doesn't it surprise me that you can find it in your heart to be compassionate and forgiving of HATE from your "brother in Christ" Phelps, while you can BOTH condemn others to hell?  Typical "Christian" love and understanding.  Condemn unbelievers, and forgive your "brethren".  Whatever.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I can forgive my uncle in prison, and I can forgive my aunt who is at home. However, my forgiveness will neither set my uncle free, nor will imprison my aunt.

 

Forgiveness goes out in many avenues, towards many men... but unless a man repent toward God, it is as Mr. Phelps said -- they shall noways see the inside of heaven.

 

I believe, that Mr. Phelps knows the Lord. That is what I beleive. Therefore, he is a brother as you said. As for my anology before, this applies in this way. He is my aunt sitting at home who offends me, and her offenses do not pend condemnation in jail, because she is a free woman -- men are free in Christ. A non-Christian such as yourself, I can also forgive in the same way. However, my forgiveness will not set you free from prison. You are destined for hell, just as God's Word says you are... unless you repent of your transgression which are holding you in hell.

 

I can forgive you too, and tell you that you're going to hell. It is God's forgiveness you need to set you free.

[Onyx]

Assholism at its finest. Homosexuality, lesbianism and bisexuality is good and dandy. Now leave them alone, please.

[daniel_1012]

Assholism at its finest. Homosexuality, lesbianism and bisexuality is good and dandy. Now leave them alone, please.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

According to what? What do you base that on? Our law? American law? English law? Your law? Feelings law? What do you base what you just said, as truth on?

[Onyx]

My own morality as well the universal morality: Love, kindness, justice and mercy. Homosexuality's isn't your business.

 

WEll, these gays have been bashed long enough from Mr Phelps and Jerries.

 

My point is, leave them alone.

[Vigile]

I believe, that Mr. Phelps knows the Lord.  That is what I beleive.  Therefore, he is a brother as you said. 

 

Then I had you pegged correctly. You truly are a hateful person. You're holy ghost fruit is showing and it ain't pretty.

[Vigile]

According to what?  What do you base that on?  Our law?  American law?  English law?  Your law?  Feelings law?  What do you base what you just said, as truth on?

 

Oh, yes, of course, morality is objective. And, lemme guess, the bible is the arbiter of the absolutes. Did I get it right? Do I win a prize?

 

Thank reason that your views are marginalized.

[Onyx]

Vigile, correct.

 

He sounds hateful, by golly, Phelp's gonna suck him off in the dead of night.

[daniel_1012]

My  own morality as well the universal morality: Love, kindness, justice and mercy. Homosexuality's isn't your business, unless it's these evil pedophiles or rapists.

 

Apart from that, homosexuality is alright.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

On your own morality? Well sorry, if we base good/bad on our own morality, then neither of us are right or wrong -- even when my morality directly conflicts with yours. Your belief that your own morality is good, you must also say my morality is good... Even if my morality tells you that you are wrong. Then how can you argue when I say these things are wrong, if we base good/bad on our own morality?

 

Furthermore, I do not know what universal morality you are talking about. You named some things, such as love, kindness, justice, and mercy. You say these things are good. Let's look at these four things.

 

Love - What is love, and who defines it? I can ask this about all of the following four things. What if I say it is love to kill you for my family. My family is in need of money, and because I love them... I must kill you, because I feel I have no other choice. Is that love? Perhaps it is love to steal from others... for I myself, love money. I love money so much, that I must bring it in to myself so that I may enjoy the love I have for whatever else I choose to love... so what is love? Do you define it, and can you argue with anothers set standard of love when it conflicts with your own?

 

Kindness - If a man thinks it is kind to sleep with another's wife, because he doesn't believe those two were meant for eachother... and he is just speeding up their (in his eyes) failing marriage -- is it kind that he sleep with her in order to bring it to be? Is it kind to to give to my family... or is it kind to give to your family? What if those two collide... which is kind? Should I give to mine and my own, or should I reach out and give to yours even if it puts my immediate family in jeopardy? What is kind?

 

Justice - Who will be just if they can't establish what is right and wrong? Just to do what? Just to preserve what? Just to uphold what? What is right and what is wrong? You can't tell me, because you are just naming things but have no source of truth. You don't have the law of God as I have... so you reach out in hopes to hit a target in your godless reality -- but you will not. You will miss miserably. You can do no justice, because the one who is just you do not uphold. You only hope to make yourself, in as you said your own morality to uphold, a righteous person. But so far you haven't given me anything to base good or bad on.

 

Mercy - But what is mercy, accept that in and of itself it is based on a morality that pends some sort of justice? If mercy be merciful, it must be mercy from an otherwise unnegotiable truth. Once again, there must be a law... is that our law, or is that your law, my law? Is it America's law? How can you tell me what is wrong, or where to show mercy... if you can't even show me unnegotiable law?

[daniel_1012]

Then I had you pegged correctly.  You truly are a hateful person.  You're holy ghost fruit is showing and it ain't pretty.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yes, I hate sin, and I won't say I don't to please your godless mind. There is coming a day that God will judge the world in righteoussness, and he is coming in flaming fire on them that know not God and obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. Will you, on that day, tell God He is hateful? What will you do?

 

Ah, but you will do nothing... just as the psalmest wrote in Psalm 1... "the wicked will not stand in the judgment" for you shall have nothing to say, and you will be without words at all. Will hope now, in this day, to tell God He is hateful? Will you hope to stand before him, and tell Him He is not just? What will you do, when the God that made you and set law before you, has the power to case you where He will? What you say is based on nothing, and nothing is what you will have to stand on in that day.

[Vigile]

It is a battle, Christianity, to say and do what is holy.

 

Since when were you guys called to force your own views of morality on the world? You are to be the salt of the earth, to live in the world, but not be OF the world. You are to obey your leaders. Show me where you or any other xtian is called by your own bible to be an activist against sin?

 

 

And what is it with you guys and homosexuals anyway? Do they creep you out or something? Are you afraid they might hit on you? Why don't you go and rally, protest, and lobby against gluttony, against lewd hetrosexual behavior, against evil thoughts, against J-walking? These are sins according to your own scripture to?

 

Let me spell it out for you: EVERY FUCKING CHRISTIAN THINKS EVIL THOUGHTS, OR OVEREATS, OR SINS IN SOME WAY. Why single out one group of people who make no claims on your goddamn religion when all supposed sin is equal in god's eyes. As a matter of fact, why the fuck are you focusing on sin at all? Aren't all men sinners who fall short of god's glory? Why aren't you just out their trying to save their souls from whence the holy ghost will supposedly take over and convict your victims of their supposed sin? WHO THE FUCK MADE YOU THE BEDROOM AND THOUGHT POLICE!? Not your god, I can tell you that

[Vigile]

Vigile, correct.

 

He sounds hateful, by golly, Phelp's gonna suck him off in the dead of night.

 

Yeah, homophobes are probably closet homosexuals who hate others for what they can't act on. I feel sorry for them.

[euphgeek]

Yes, I hate sin, and I won't say I don't to please your godless mind.  There is coming a day that God will judge the world in righteoussness, and he is coming in flaming fire on them that know not God and obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ.  Will you, on that day, tell God He is hateful?  What will you do?

 

Ah, but you will do nothing... just as the psalmest wrote in Psalm 1... "the wicked will not stand in the judgment" for you shall have nothing to say, and you will be without words at all.  Will hope now, in this day, to tell God He is hateful?  Will you hope to stand before him, and tell Him He is not just?  What will you do, when the God that made you and set law before you, has the power to case you where He will?  What you say is based on nothing, and nothing is what you will have to stand on in that day.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

For myself, I will say that yes, I would tell God to his face that he is hateful if he is the type of God that would torture someone forever just for not being his cheerleader. And I will gladly burn in hell for all eternity if my beliefs are wrong. What about you? Can you say that you would gladly burn in hell if your beliefs are wrong?