believeingod Posted November 21, 2011 Author Share Posted November 21, 2011 Take our budding creationist, believeingod. He's a typical creationist chump, big on lashing out and short on rational thinking. personal attacks are a sign you are getting out of steam. No factual and reasonable arguments on hand anymore, so adhoms have to take place.... pathetic...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdp Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 .... pathetic...... He's showing self awareness - this is a start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdp Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 . No factual and reasonable arguments on hand anymore You just ignore them anyway. Idiot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigile Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 . No factual and reasonable arguments on hand anymore You just ignore them anyway. Idiot. Or just buries them in quote-mined creationist drivel and moves the conversation goal posts, such as moving the debate about the evolution of dna to a debate about abiogenesis. Sleight of hand shit like that makes conversations impossible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astreja Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Did you know that the human genome (genetic material) carries 3 billion genetic letters in it? Did *you* know that the so-called "information" is an illusion? We are humans only because that's what our genetic structures make. It's a self-replicating recipe with occasional variation, not a design. There is nothing -- Nothing! -- the least bit special about how humans are constructed genetically. - Most of us have 2 arms and 2 legs, but if we had 1, 3 or 6 we'd find a way to function. - Human physiology is a friggin' mess. Our primary airway links up with the esophagus, making it quite possible to choke to death while eating. The endocrine system is fragile and easily unbalanced. The sexual and urinary systems are in entirely too close proximity. The lumbosacral spine is a disaster waiting to happen. If you think our bodies are the work of an intelligent designer, you're insane. Absolutely batshit insane. And any god that would design our bodies this way should be forced to live in one all the way to old age, and spend its declining years plagued by osteoporosis, Type 2 diabetes, hypertension, neuropathy, COPD, fatty liver, GERD and dementia. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astreja Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Nobody, that has truly born again and sealed with the holy spirit, will renounce his faith. As there is no evidence for the "holy spirit," I assert that being "born again" is merely a self-induced psychological state and not an externally-mediated, permanent change. I further assert that, as there is no evidence for life after death and no evidence that consciousness persists in the absence of a physical body, every Christian who has ever lived has automatically and permanently lost his or her faith at the moment of brain death. That is your fate, BIG, and there isn't a prayer in the universe that can save you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skepticalme Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Its obvious that nothing else than a intelligent creator is able to create DNA . Scientific knowledge evidences intelligent design........ Did you know that 98% of the human genome doesn't code for protiens. What kind of designer makes an instruction manual 100,000 pages long, but 98,000 pages of that aren't used? You do get that from an evolutionary model though. See, there is really no mechanism for removing old genes. The genes that coded for fins and gills when our ancestors were fish are still in there. Of course, they have been subject to 100's of millions of years of mutation with no selection preasures so there may be very little of the original code still in there and much of it had been coopted into making lungs. Genetics has only reinforced evidence for evolution. We know that when humans diverged from apes that chromosomes 2 and 3 of the ape genome fused together into the human #2 chromosome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skepticalme Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 You deny the existence of Ex-Christians, Yes, i do. Nobody, that has truly born again and sealed with the holy spirit, will renounce his faith. I was. Church and Sunday school every sunday morning. Baptised when I was 14. There were a few occations where our pastor pointed to charity/volunteer work I had done and used them as examples of how a true christian lets the holy spirit work through them. I later served on one of the commitees that ran the church. In fact, if we had internet forums like this back then, I would probably have been doing the same thing you are trying to do here. I was very happy when I was a christian. Unfortunately, none of it was true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
believeingod Posted November 21, 2011 Author Share Posted November 21, 2011 evolution of dna to a debate about abiogenesis. The arise of DNA has of course to do with abiogenesis. At no moment i showed confusion about this fact. But it seems, you do not understand it, and bring evolution into the game. DNA cannot have arisen trough evolution, as clearly shown. What do you not understand about this ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
believeingod Posted November 21, 2011 Author Share Posted November 21, 2011 Did you know that the human genome (genetic material) carries 3 billion genetic letters in it? Did *you* know that the so-called "information" is an illusion? you should tell that Dawkins, Crigg, and Watts..... It's a self-replicating recipe with occasional variation, not a design. Baseless assertion and non sequitur. How do you know its not design ? and what does the fact, that it is self replicating , to do with your assertion its not design ? There is nothing -- Nothing! -- the least bit special about how humans are constructed genetically. again : baseless assertion. - Most of us have 2 arms and 2 legs, but if we had 1, 3 or 6 we'd find a way to function. and what is a men's beard for ? what survival function does it have ? - Human physiology is a friggin' mess. what does that have to do with the fact, that DNA carries complex, specified, codified information, and the impossibility that to have arisen by chance ? Our primary airway links up with the esophagus, making it quite possible to choke to death while eating. The endocrine system is fragile and easily unbalanced. The sexual and urinary systems are in entirely too close proximity. The lumbosacral spine is a disaster waiting to happen. oh, so you want to shift now from one issue to the other, and argue of bad design ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
believeingod Posted November 21, 2011 Author Share Posted November 21, 2011 Did you know that 98% of the human genome doesn't code for protiens. well, it has other functions, which we still do not 100% understand......but that does not eliminate the fact, that DNA contains codified information. And that evidences a intelligent creator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
believeingod Posted November 21, 2011 Author Share Posted November 21, 2011 You deny the existence of Ex-Christians, Yes, i do. Nobody, that has truly born again and sealed with the holy spirit, will renounce his faith. I was. Church and Sunday school every sunday morning. Baptised when I was 14. There were a few occations where our pastor pointed to charity/volunteer work I had done and used them as examples of how a true christian lets the holy spirit work through them. I later served on one of the commitees that ran the church. In fact, if we had internet forums like this back then, I would probably have been doing the same thing you are trying to do here. I was very happy when I was a christian. Unfortunately, none of it was true. Nothing of all that evidences a true born again christian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 evolution of dna to a debate about abiogenesis. The arise of DNA has of course to do with abiogenesis. At no moment i showed confusion about this fact. But it seems, you do not understand it, and bring evolution into the game. DNA cannot have arisen trough evolution, as clearly shown. What do you not understand about this ? I can't understand why you would assert "DNA cannot have arisen through evolution" to people who already know this as fact. If you are not confused then why do you make pointless objections and avoid actually providing objective evidence that supports your views? You are wasting time avoiding your responsibility. You were asked to support your views. Do so now please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 You deny the existence of Ex-Christians, Yes, i do. Nobody, that has truly born again and sealed with the holy spirit, will renounce his faith. I was. Church and Sunday school every sunday morning. Baptised when I was 14. There were a few occations where our pastor pointed to charity/volunteer work I had done and used them as examples of how a true christian lets the holy spirit work through them. I later served on one of the commitees that ran the church. In fact, if we had internet forums like this back then, I would probably have been doing the same thing you are trying to do here. I was very happy when I was a christian. Unfortunately, none of it was true. Nothing of all that evidences a true born again christian. And now your fantasy gets you in trouble again. What is the objective evidence that some Christian is "a true born again Christian"? Demonstrate or else admit that you cannot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigile Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 evolution of dna to a debate about abiogenesis. The arise of DNA has of course to do with abiogenesis. At no moment i showed confusion about this fact. Clearly you did, otherwise, why post a hayseed story about the genome guy who entertained a blatant false dichotomy. But it seems, you do not understand it, and bring evolution into the game. DNA cannot have arisen trough evolution, as clearly shown. What do you not understand about this ? That you are making unsupported claims not represented by the virtual unanimous scientific consensus on the subject? I don't know, you tell me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realist Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Nothing of all that evidences a true born again christian. .... yes, I totally agree with you! No signs of small mindedness, tunnel vision, ignorance, self importance, and hypocrisy. Truly never was a "TRUE" born again christian! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
believeingod Posted November 21, 2011 Author Share Posted November 21, 2011 evolution of dna to a debate about abiogenesis. The arise of DNA has of course to do with abiogenesis. At no moment i showed confusion about this fact. But it seems, you do not understand it, and bring evolution into the game. DNA cannot have arisen trough evolution, as clearly shown. What do you not understand about this ? I can't understand why you would assert "DNA cannot have arisen through evolution" to people who already know this as fact. " Fully human " seems did not know it, since he argued that evolution was the driving force to create DNA....... If you are not confused then why do you make pointless objections and avoid actually providing objective evidence that supports your views? that you ignore my explanations, is your problem , not mine. Can you show me a natural mechanism, that is able to produce codified information , as contained in DNA ? You were asked to support your views. Do so now please. see above answer...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
believeingod Posted November 21, 2011 Author Share Posted November 21, 2011 And now your fantasy gets you in trouble again. What is the objective evidence that some Christian is "a true born again Christian"? Demonstrate or else admit that you cannot. I don't know, since only God knows each ones heart. But i know, that anyone, that belongs to the family of God, will never want to pull out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
believeingod Posted November 21, 2011 Author Share Posted November 21, 2011 you are making unsupported claims not represented by the virtual unanimous scientific consensus on the subject? Oh, do I ? Please let me know, what claim i made, which is not represented by the scientific consensus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 " Fully human " seems did not know it, since he argued that evolution was the driving force to create DNA....... No, he addressed your other point about how DNA became so complicated. How DNA got started is a separate issue. You constantly mix them up as if you do not understand the difference. that you ignore my explanations, is your problem , not mine. Can you show me a natural mechanism, that is able to produce codified information , as contained in DNA ? I do not ignore your explanations. I do not have an answer for the problem of abiogenesis. To presume God from that is the fallacy of Argument from Ignorance. see above answer...... Clearly you do not support your claims. You are the one who denies the obvious. Your projection of your problem onto atheists is false. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 And now your fantasy gets you in trouble again. What is the objective evidence that some Christian is "a true born again Christian"? Demonstrate or else admit that you cannot. I don't know, since only God knows each ones heart. But i know, that anyone, that belongs to the family of God, will never want to pull out. Make up your mind. You contradict yourself. If you do not know what makes someone a true born again Christian then you do not know what one will or won't do. You can't honestly tell someone that they were never really Christian if you don't know. Once again you are left with nothing but your bankrupt beliefs. Great you have beliefs. They mean nothing in the real world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
believeingod Posted November 21, 2011 Author Share Posted November 21, 2011 I do not ignore your explanations. I do not have an answer for the problem of abiogenesis. To presume God from that is the fallacy of Argument from Ignorance. Well, but based on the fact that we KNOW that DNA contains codified information, and based on the fact that we KNOW that codified information comes ALWAYS from a mind, we can conclude logically, DNA was created by a mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
believeingod Posted November 21, 2011 Author Share Posted November 21, 2011 And now your fantasy gets you in trouble again. What is the objective evidence that some Christian is "a true born again Christian"? Demonstrate or else admit that you cannot. I don't know, since only God knows each ones heart. But i know, that anyone, that belongs to the family of God, will never want to pull out. Make up your mind. You contradict yourself. If you do not know what makes someone a true born again Christian then you do not know what one will or won't do. You can't honestly tell someone that they were never really Christian if you don't know. Once again you are left with nothing but your bankrupt beliefs. Great you have beliefs. They mean nothing in the real world. What appears to be, is not always what appears to be. Thats why i said : I cannot see into someones heart, to judge, if someone is a true christian, or not. Only God knows the heart of someone. But one thing i know : a true christian never gives up his faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdelsolray Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 evolution of dna to a debate about abiogenesis. The arise of DNA has of course to do with abiogenesis. At no moment i showed confusion about this fact. But it seems, you do not understand it, and bring evolution into the game. DNA cannot have arisen trough evolution, as clearly shown. What do you not understand about this ? DNA likely arose, via natural selection, from simpler single-stranded RNA. This is one of the current working hypotheses of abiogenesis. Your assumption that all life in the past contained double-stranded DNA is just that - an assumption. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 What appears to be, is not always what appears to be. Thats why i said : I cannot see into someones heart, to judge, if someone is a true christian, or not. Only God knows the heart of someone. Okay, so you cannot say that you know a true Christian never gives up his faith. But one thing i know : a true christian never gives up his faith. Wait a minute, if that were so then you cannot say that you cannot judge someone's heart. Christianity has you all messed up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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