duderonomy Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 Can it be addressed scientifically we know where consciousness comes from biologically speaking we know what makes us age we know how our DNA effects our inclination to certain behavioral traits we don't know if an ethereal concept like a soul exists and if it even has an effect on this world how would one test it anyways? What traits do you assign to a soul that could be testable? does it influence our consciousness/behaviors? does it effect our biology? "we know where consciousness comes from biologically speaking" We do? Good. What about the part of it that doesn't come biologically? Edited to add: Just kidding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midniterider Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 Can it be addressed scientifically we know where consciousness comes from biologically speaking we know what makes us age we know how our DNA effects our inclination to certain behavioral traits we don't know if an ethereal concept like a soul exists and if it even has an effect on this world how would one test it anyways? What traits do you assign to a soul that could be testable? does it influence our consciousness/behaviors? does it effect our biology? "we know where consciousness comes from biologically speaking" We do? Good. What about the part of it that doesn't come biologically? Edited to add: Just kidding. I know where biology comes from, consciously speaking. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 Christians like to pull out these various argument as evidence that there is a God. Why would there just be one? It would make far more sense that, if such such beings exist, that there would be billions of them or even trillions of them rather than just one. Doesn't our universe look like it was designed by a committee? The evidence of political in-fighting is everywhere. The Black Hole Lobby has a lot of influence on the Divine Committee. The Dark Energy Lobby also has much influence. And you can clearly see these Gods can't come to a consensus without stubbornly dragging along their own personal pork-belly issues. When the Gods made humans in their image that means the human dispensation for creating parliaments and senates. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HymenaeusAlexander Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 You lost me sir. Perhaps I don't understand your thoughts, but just looking at some of your truths, you seem rather foobarred. Just my tried and true with respect to me. Dude, it was just a joke. I thought the implied humor was fairly clear, given the reference to an invisible magic 8-ball delivered by a kitten. I didn't take your question to be a serious one and therefore didn't offer a serious answer. Perhaps my error can be attributed to the fact that at the time I responded the only things I was really contemplating deeply was a delivery method for some alcohol and an imminent sexual encounter. Now that I think about it, though, I'm not sure I can offer anything more meaningful than an lolcat in response to your question and subsequent observations. After all, I'm merely a foobarred egotistical pseudo-intellectual who abuses words like a Lewis Carroll character. The only requirement for membership to this forum is a valid email address after all. Just my tried and true illusorily reliable with respect to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest end3 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 As long as the people with brainz like HA continue to have egos like HA, then we will fail to address it scientifically. You've got a lab. Measure the Spirit of God. Make a prediction and test it. Observe under controlled conditions and compare to a control group. In Luke 4:1 was God the Son really full of God the Spirit? What criteria did the author of Luke use to establish this? I mean, what if Jesus was only half full of the Spirit . . . or even half empty of the Spirit? Is that what it means by "do not test God". Get it...testing lab. "Redneck Discovers Proof of God in Portable Gas Lab, Details at Ten" "He is most adament about not removing the cover of one particular beaker and should only transport it two steps at a time with people wearing virgin lab coats". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
♦ ficino ♦ Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 Careful carrying the beaker - remember the dude who tried to keep the Ark of the Covenant from falling over and he got zapped? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bornagainathiest Posted July 30, 2013 Share Posted July 30, 2013 Hello Ben. I've been absent from this forum for two weeks due to ill health. Now that I'm back I see that you didn't get round to replying to my July 13 post (#106, page 6) in the, "What is the Gospel?" thread and that this thread is now locked. Never mind. I'm happy to let that go. However, there is something you've written in this thread that puzzles me and I'd like to question you about, ok? You say that you were an Ex-Christian. But now you call yourself a Christian... again. So, perhaps you could help me out here and supply the scriptural basis for your 'return' to Jesus Christ? When I was a Christian, I was taught that nobody can return to Christ if they reject him. The Biblical basis for this teaching can be found in Hebrews 6 : 4 - 8, 1 John 2: 18 - 23 and 1 John 4 : 1 - 3. Therefore Ben, if you did reject Jesus... ...and denied that he was the Christ... ...and denied that he was the son of God... ...and denied both the Father and the the Son... ...and denied that Jesus has come in the flesh... ...then must still be an Ex-Christian, because, as Hebrews 6 : 4 clearly states... "It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance." You cannot return to Christ if you truly rejected him. You cannot be brought back to a true condition of true repentance. You cannot be reborn of the Holy Spirit because the Trinity is ONE - rejection of one is a rejection of ALL. You cannot have your sins washed away the blood of Jesus twice because he died once for the sins of the world. You cannot be re-enlightened. You cannot re-taste the heavenly gift. You cannot re-taste the goodness of the word of God. You cannot have your name removed from and then re-written into the Book of Life. You cannot join God's sheep on Judgement day because you have made yourself a goat. You cannot enter heaven because nothing sinful (you!) can enter into God's holy presence. Why, Ben? Because... to your loss, you are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting Him to public disgrace. (See Hebrews 6 : 6) ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- So what are you? An Ex-Christian who truly rejected Jesus Christ or an Authentic Christian Believer in the Trinity? If it's the former, then please change your profile info accordingly and remove the inappropriate image. If it's the latter, then please stop calling yourself an Ex-Christian - because that's lying to us about yourself. Thanks, BAA. . . . . p.s. Please don't respond to this message before you answer Ficino's and Bhim's posts. They have been very patient with you and deserve first dibs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
♦ ficino ♦ Posted July 30, 2013 Share Posted July 30, 2013 Hey, sorry to hear you haven't been well, BAA. I hope you're OK now. Take it easy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bornagainathiest Posted July 31, 2013 Share Posted July 31, 2013 Hey, sorry to hear you haven't been well, BAA. I hope you're OK now. Take it easy! Thanks, F. Yeah, I'm ok(ish), back home and have no choice but to take it easy for a while. Why? Well, have you ever been stabbed from behind with a rusty, red-hot bowie knife while you were hosing the porcelain? Me neither. But that's what it felt like when I passed a mountain kidney stone in the restroom of a local diner. At the county hospital they scanned me, found the rest of the mountain range stones in both kidneys and opted to remove them. With some post-op complications, I've been away from home for twelve days. Which explains my lack of recent input here. . . . Speaking of which Ficino, I don't really hold out much hope of our filter-feeding friend actually coming up with the goods. Do you? BAA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhim Posted July 31, 2013 Share Posted July 31, 2013 Hi BAA. Sorry to hear about the kidney stones...that sounds extremely uncomfortable. Sounds like you're well on the way to recovery though; glad to hear it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted August 1, 2013 Share Posted August 1, 2013 BAA I hope you are feeling better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midniterider Posted August 1, 2013 Share Posted August 1, 2013 Hey, sorry to hear you haven't been well, BAA. I hope you're OK now. Take it easy! Thanks, F. Yeah, I'm ok(ish), back home and have no choice but to take it easy for a while. Why? Well, have you ever been stabbed from behind with a rusty, red-hot bowie knife while you were hosing the porcelain? Me neither. But that's what it felt like when I passed a mountain kidney stone in the restroom of a local diner. At the county hospital they scanned me, found the rest of the mountain range stones in both kidneys and opted to remove them. With some post-op complications, I've been away from home for twelve days. Which explains my lack of recent input here. . . . Speaking of which Ficino, I don't really hold out much hope of our filter-feeding friend actually coming up with the goods. Do you? BAA Ouch. Get better. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrotherJosh Posted August 1, 2013 Share Posted August 1, 2013 Glad to hear you are doing better, BAA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bornagainathiest Posted August 1, 2013 Share Posted August 1, 2013 Thanks very much for the support, you guys. I appreciate it. You know that I'm an astronomy buff, so this image... http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap051228.html ...isn't of the f****r that got me. But it felt like it at the time! At least it's all over now, so I can look back and try to see something humorous about it. Cheers, BAA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
♦ ficino ♦ Posted August 1, 2013 Share Posted August 1, 2013 Glad you're on the mend, BAA. I think we would have heard from Barnacleben by now if he intended to show why Jesus' purported miracles of 2000 yrs ago are credible, but miracles by Hindu swamis two generations ago are not. Or if he intended to cite historians who believe that the bulk of the NT (I think that was B's phrase) is historical and who aren't seminary employees. Or if he was going to answer your q's above. Of course, he might respond after all ... or might show up months from now and repeat all the same stuff again, as though none of it had been answered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duderonomy Posted August 2, 2013 Share Posted August 2, 2013 Hi BAA. I'm sorry to hear what happened and I'm glad you got through it. I've never had to deal with such a thing, and after hearing your story, frankly I'm a little frightened! I wanted to hear about bb's Christian/Ex-Christian/Christian story too. I still say IF he comes back to this thread, or starts another, even if a while from now, let's hold him the questions on this thread first, since the whole "what do I believe" thing was his idea in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaitingInfinity Posted August 3, 2013 Share Posted August 3, 2013 Tell us something you believe that doesn't quote or ref a bible verse. I believe it is really special that God made the force of gravity proportional to the inverse squared and not ~^2.091234482348498 or something. It makes gravity simple to mathematically model so that it can be easily introduced into a wide range of applied physics problems. Because God really cares about how easily we can do applied physics and find parking spots near the door at Wally World, but not about serious prayers like world hunger or cancer. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duderonomy Posted August 4, 2013 Share Posted August 4, 2013 Tell us something you believe that doesn't quote or ref a bible verse. I believe it is really special that God made the force of gravity proportional to the inverse squared and not ~^2.091234482348498 or something. It makes gravity simple to mathematically model so that it can be easily introduced into a wide range of applied physics problems. Because God really cares about how easily we can do applied physics and find parking spots near the door at Wally World, but not about serious prayers like world hunger or cancer. In the Bible, God said there would be hunger, sure, but not "world" hunger. He also said there would be all manner of diseases, and I bet that includes cancer. Why do Christians still pray about these things? Christians are told to pray in God's will, and not against it! Parking spots at Wally World? Did you see the movie? The Family Truckster was the only car in that huge parking lot! Really, I'm just saying hello and welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
par4dcourse Posted August 4, 2013 Share Posted August 4, 2013 When Ben and all the other christians agree on what the bible really says, come talk to me. I'm not holding my breath. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Moderator florduh Posted August 4, 2013 Super Moderator Share Posted August 4, 2013 When Ben and all the other christians agree... The others aren't True Christians. Sheesh. There's only one True Christian Faith, and it's Ben's version. No, it's Thumbelina's version. Wait, it's really, uh, now I'm getting confused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midniterider Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 The Christianity given to us by these Christians doesn't seem to have the power to convert anyone does it? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bornagainathiest Posted August 6, 2013 Share Posted August 6, 2013 Hi BAA. I'm sorry to hear what happened and I'm glad you got through it. I've never had to deal with such a thing, and after hearing your story, frankly I'm a little frightened! I wanted to hear about bb's Christian/Ex-Christian/Christian story too. I still say IF he comes back to this thread, or starts another, even if a while from now, let's hold him the questions on this thread first, since the whole "what do I believe" thing was his idea in the first place. Agreed, Dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thumbelina Posted August 6, 2013 Share Posted August 6, 2013 Hey, sorry to hear you haven't been well, BAA. I hope you're OK now. Take it easy! + 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdelsolray Posted August 6, 2013 Share Posted August 6, 2013 When Ben and all the other christians agree... The others aren't True Christians. Sheesh. There's only one True Christian Faith, and it's Ben's version. No, it's Thumbelina's version. Wait, it's really, uh, now I'm getting confused. That's True Christian Faith™ to you and the rest of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gall Posted August 7, 2013 Share Posted August 7, 2013 HA made an excellent and well reasoned post, as did some others, but to expect a reasoned response at this point is folly. This is not a Christian we can have meaningful dialog with. We'd do better with end3! (Love you, end!) There is NO meaningful dialogue when belief is concerned, any belief. It precludes the idea for you to be reasonable. I say have ideas those can more easily be argued and changed. They can also be accepted more readily. Beliefs cause people to die for them and worse to kill for them and try and enslave our minds to follow their belief so they don't feel so damn alone. There is nothing reasonable about sci fi or fantasy that is why they are called fiction. I know you already know this it is to bad that the chrstns that come here for the most part just make targets of themselves while thinking... heheheheheheheh i am gonna get them this time... yeah not gonna happen. I am sure you agree. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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