Super Moderator TheRedneckProfessor Posted March 9, 2015 Super Moderator Share Posted March 9, 2015 "If I go up to the heavens, thou art there; if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there." Psalm 139:8 Hell could not have been created as a place outside of god's presence because the scriptures say that god's presence in in hell. You'll have to try harder, Ironhorse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 TheRedNeckProfessor, The "hell" in that verse is referring to the grave. According to the scriptures no one is in Hell at the present time. For that matter, no one is walking around in Heaven at the present. Those departed are awaiting the resurrection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 TheRedNeckProfessor, The "hell" in that verse is referring to the grave. According to the scriptures no one is in Hell at the present time. For that matter, no one is walking around in Heaven at the present. Those departed are awaiting the resurrection. Oh, so you do question the Bible when you want to. And you make up your own private interpretation when it suits your needs. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin Posted March 9, 2015 Author Share Posted March 9, 2015 So how can you tell when "Hell" means "Hell" and when it doesn't? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Penguin, In Old English the word "Hell" meant a pit. Farmers would talk of putting their potatoes in Hell. In translations it has a lot to do with how the Hebrew word "Sheol" is used and the Greek word "Hades." A Google search of the words will help in understanding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreeThinkerNZ Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 TheRedNeckProfessor, The "hell" in that verse is referring to the grave. According to the scriptures no one is in Hell at the present time. For that matter, no one is walking around in Heaven at the present. Those departed are awaiting the resurrection. Please provide the biblical references that relate to your interpretation. Penguin, In Old English the word "Hell" meant a pit. Farmers would talk of putting their potatoes in Hell. In translations it has a lot to do with how the Hebrew word "Sheol" is used and the Greek word "Hades." A Google search of the words will help in understanding. Nah, I can't be bothered doing a google search of these words, because you're talking nonsense anyway. A google search of the words logic, rational, evidence and "critical thinking" would help in your understanding of many things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin Posted March 9, 2015 Author Share Posted March 9, 2015 Penguin, In Old English the word "Hell" meant a pit. Farmers would talk of putting their potatoes in Hell. In translations it has a lot to do with how the Hebrew word "Sheol" is used and the Greek word "Hades." A Google search of the words will help in understanding. Oh, I've done the research. Neither one refers to an everlasting place of torment. Also... Can't tell if POE or just...crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Was "Gehenna" part of your research? I missed mentioning it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin Posted March 9, 2015 Author Share Posted March 9, 2015 Was "Gehenna" part of your research? I missed mentioning it. Yes, I did the research. I did not find sufficient, clear evidence to define Hell. If God is saving us from Hell, you would think he'd be more clear about what he's saving us from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duderonomy Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 duderonomy, The scriptures say that God created Hell for Satan and the fallen angels. ( I'm guess the story of that rebellion and war is a lot bigger than the Star War's stories.) The purpose was to designate a place outside of God's presence for those who choose not to enter God's Kingdom. Ironhorse, you know from Scripture that you can't go anyplace where God is not! Whither shall we go from His presence? How can there be a place where God is not? Is He not everywhere all of the time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 duderonomy, Two good questions. First, what Jesus experienced on the cross is way above our understanding. One writer put is as "three hours of eternal hell" and what he went through in pain and suffering is beyond anything experienced by a human. C.S. Lewis, who really struggled with the idea of hell, came to a conclusion that it was a very small dark prison of a soul who rejected God's love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 First, what Jesus experienced on the cross is way above our understanding. C.S. Lewis, who really struggled with the idea of hell, came to a conclusion that it was a very small dark prison of a soul who rejected God's love. God doesn't love. In the myth of the Bible God is evil, cruel, jealous, a dictator. And God has this weird idea about torturing his son in order to forgive humans. That isn't love. If you love somebody you forgive them without being asked and without hurting anybody. You don't need for them to kill a sheep or a dove in order for you to forgive somebody you love. C. S. Lewis was wrong about most of his theological views. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreeThinkerNZ Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 First, what Jesus experienced on the cross is way above our understanding. One writer put is as "three hours of eternal hell" and what he went through in pain and suffering is beyond anything experienced by a human. But if hell is eternal conscious torment, isn't that much worse than 3 hours? Sounds like he got an easy ride. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
violetbutterfly Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 C.S. Lewis, who really struggled with the idea of hell, came to a conclusion that it was a very small dark prison of a soul who rejected God's love. His love. Funny. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin Posted March 9, 2015 Author Share Posted March 9, 2015 So if a husband burns his wife alive because she wakes up one day and cheats on him (thereby rejecting his love), is the husband to be praised? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
violetbutterfly Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 IH, you may want to watch this regarding God giving us "free will"... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bornagainathiest Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Ironhorse, Your sword cuts both ways. In a few hours time you will exercise your freedom of choice. To enter into the thread where you can learn about cosmology or to shun it. . . . If you avoid that thread, there will be a reason for you making this choice. Just as there are reasons for every freely made choice every human being makes. That's what you believe, isn't it? That people freely send themselves to hell, deliberately choosing to do so for their own reasons? That they don't end up in hell by accident, right? Every choice has a reason behind it - isn't that what you believe? . . . Which will you choose, Ironhorse? To continue to live by faith and in ignorance or to learn the facts and understand? You can be sure that we will be watching how you choose very closely...! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thackerie Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 duderonomy, Two good questions. First, what Jesus experienced on the cross is way above our understanding. One writer put is as "three hours of eternal hell" and what he went through in pain and suffering is beyond anything experienced by a human. ... That writer was clearly an idiot. A lot of human beings have suffered a lot more than old Jeeze. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 What theological views, do you think, C.S. Lewis was wrong about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Not able to edit my last post.... My question was in response to mymistake's post stating that most Lewis' theological was wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 What theological views, do you think, C.S. Lewis was wrong about? Every. Single. One. Christianity is a house of cards. You only think it is true because you assume it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Iron horse, amongst the thousands of reasons why hell is absurd, why does God not do away with hell and allow everyone to go to heaven? Why is eternal burning even an option on the board? You asked what was God to do with all those who reject his love? You mean to tell me that a loving and just God who can do anything can't find any other way to deal with them but to roast them? If there were a God and he was genuinely just and loving, he wouldn't care one bit about some mere mortals not believing in him. He would send them to heaven anyway. Surely your God is above all that pety nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Justin, My first reply is what do you think God should do with a person who refuses to enter his Kingdom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duderonomy Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Justin, My first reply is what do you think God should do with a person who refuses to enter his Kingdom? Sorry to butt in on your question to Justin, Ironhorse, but what if someone (not to mention your own child, if you have any) rejected your love and didn't want to enter your house. Would you set them on fire? Really? What do you think your neighbors, the police, and the rest of fallen humanity who's hearts are deceitfully wicked would think of you for doing such a thing? Would they say that you did a good and righteous thing? Would you be any different from the ISIS people that put the Jordanian pilot in a cage and set him on fire? You'd wait until you got them alone in front of you, after you made a way to make sure that they would be there and unable to leave, then throw them into a burning cauldron of red hot lava and be able to call yourself just and loving while you heard their wailing and the gnashing of their teeth while they burned alive? Ironhorse, if you wouldn't do that, would you hang out with anyone who would? Why would you latch on to an imaginary friend that would do such a thing, and then go around and try to make everyone else see your imaginary friend? http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Poe If you aren't a poe, you have serious issues. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Justin, My first reply is what do you think God should do with a person who refuses to enter his Kingdom? Nobody has refused to "enter God's kingdom". That is a code phrase that means "people who think it doesn't exist". Only a scumbag would torture people for not believing a story. But yes, if there really was a God's Kingdom then only a scumbag would torture people for refusing that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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