Mike D Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 I think most people would regard Christianity as a monotheistic religion, but is it really? As we all know there are 3 distinct entiities referred to in the Bible: Jehova (dad), Jesus (kid) and Holy Spirit (sidekick). But we're told these aren't actually separate entities (even though kid actually prays to dad and calls out to him, etc.), to get around this, the idea of the "Trinity" was invented, which states that there is one God existing as 3 distinct persons, the Father the Son and the Holy Spirit. But aren't "3 distinct persons" just that? Why should anyone take "3 distinct persons" to mean "one god"? Is it because we simply refer to them as "persons" instead of "gods" that we can get away with this? In my opinion, Christianity is a polytheistic religion but Christians don't want to admit it because the OT clearly says there is but one god. But then the NT came along and threw a bit of a monkey wrench into the works, and in a scramble to fix this someone came up with this "trinity" concept with its very fuzzy math which states that 1+1+1=1. And to top that off we're even told the Trinity is a very logical and rational idea Can anyone come up with any way around the absurdity of this doctrine other than "God works in mysterious ways", or "We can't fully comprened God"? And the idea really is completely preposterous......for someone to willingly accept that a being can be its father and its son at the same time is someone who might as well go have a lobotomy because they clearly reject the use of their own brain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thunderbolt Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 I agree Mike Furthermore, the references to Mrs. God (Ashera) were cleverly covered up, and El is sometimes plural in the Old Testament, and other times female as well. But don’t expect to see that in any modern English translation. Aside from the trinity, the Jews were as far from monotheistic as Solomon was from a monogamist. But don't expect an admission from either Christians or Jews any time soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike D Posted February 18, 2006 Author Share Posted February 18, 2006 Furthermore, the references to Mrs. God (Ashera) were cleverly covered up Hmm, who is this? Was this in the original documents? I hadn't heard of this before... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willybilly30 Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 its very polytheistic if you look in history. the old testaments full of so called forbidden idols people worshipped side by side with jehovah. the modern christianity tossed out the goddesses asherah, sophia (holy ghost is not male) among others. what we know of christianity today is so altered deleted and edited and they dont even know it lol im sure someones gonna say the gnostics wasnt the original christians but oh well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike D Posted February 18, 2006 Author Share Posted February 18, 2006 "I am the Lord thy God...you shall have no other gods before me." I agree Mike...worship of one God is different than believing in one god. Christians have to believe in more than one god or else why else would god, say not to have other gods? Yeah I agree this is a problem too. Why would he say this if there wasn't other gods? Although Christians will try to pass the other gods off as "money", "sex", etc. Anything but an actual deity... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 When you consider the fact that the entire bible is made up from a mixture of characteristics from a bunch of different "gods" from different stories that were made up at different points in history, then all of that being thrown together to create The One True God, then yes, Christianity is quite polytheistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike D Posted February 18, 2006 Author Share Posted February 18, 2006 I agree with you Fwee and Willy. I'll be curious to see what any True Christians might have to say about this.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Heaven for Kevin Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 They have nothing to say. They don't untestand why 3 completely seperate entities are actually 1 god. It's makes no friggin sense. It's an exercise in credulity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 When you consider the fact that the entire bible is made up from a mixture of characteristics from a bunch of different "gods" from different stories that were made up at different points in history, then all of that being thrown together to create The One True God, then yes, Christianity is quite polytheistic.I agree with you Fwee and Willy. I'll be curious to see what any True Christians might have to say about this.... I look at it this way... Christianity is one big sponge. A sponge that supports itself not from ideas that arose within itself, but ideas that came from any of the multitudes of belief systems that it has encountered over the centuries. It takes away from any belief system the things that help it to work out its "plan", then discards the rest while at the same time decrying the systems that it gets its ideas from. I think this method is called, dominionism, or something like that, isn't it? It takes previous ideas then claims itself as being the origin of said ideas. It's quite messed up the more you think about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qadeshet Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 Furthermore, the references to Mrs. God (Ashera) were cleverly covered up Hmm, who is this? Was this in the original documents? I hadn't heard of this before... The prophets constantly lectured the people whenever they reverted to their worship of the goddess. Polytheism in Genesis: Baal and Ashtoreth vs. Yahweh The Queen of Heaven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willybilly30 Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 the prophets of the male god ongly belief. i heard a saying once: the religion that was defeated becomes the demons of the the religion that won the battle. they lost so their extra gods and goddesses are now considered bad or demons. theirs two diffrent belief systems duking it out in the bible but it isnt shown very well. Furthermore, the references to Mrs. God (Ashera) were cleverly covered up Hmm, who is this? Was this in the original documents? I hadn't heard of this before... The prophets constantly lectured the people whenever they reverted to their worship of the goddess. Polytheism in Genesis: Baal and Ashtoreth vs. Yahweh The Queen of Heaven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All Gods Fail Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 the prophets of the male god ongly belief. i heard a saying once: the religion that was defeated becomes the demons of the the religion that won the battle. they lost so their extra gods and goddesses are now considered bad or demons. theirs two diffrent belief systems duking it out in the bible but it isnt shown very well. Good point, WB. Like they say, history is written by the winners. Just think - if Constantine had gone with Mithras instead, Jesus/Yaweh would be considered a false god or demon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willybilly30 Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 that reminds me in gnosticism yahweh is a false god or demon the old testament was considered false. probally the jews and gnostics were the ones fighting in the bible. the gnostics liked jesus tho but the new testaments been edited and fucked up so you wont see what they say about him. Good point, WB. Like they say, history is written by the winners. Just think - if Constantine had gone with Mithras instead, Jesus/Yaweh would be considered a false god or demon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willybilly30 Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 anybody find it amusing the ones who leave christianity know more about it than the ones who stay in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thunderbolt Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 Hi Mike The most common figurines found in Israel by archeologists is of Asherah, and in 1060 in Hebron an inscription from the eight century BCE was found talking about Yahweh and his Asherah. She was worshipped alongside of God as his female companion by Jews. As Diana Edelman (archeologist of the Department of Biblical studies at Sheffield University) The later Bible scribes have systematically written out Asherah as a goddess. They disguised her presence in the text. There are over 40 references to Asherah that was translated to “The Asherah” throughout the Tanakah, and to add in jury to insult, the translators of the King James Bible had no idea what the word Asherah referred to and assumed it was some kind of sacred grove. But the most startling indirect translation that they worshipped Mrs. God is found in Jeremiah 44:15-19 15 Then all the men who knew that their wives were burning incense to other gods, along with all the women who were present—a large assembly—and all the people living in Lower and Upper Egypt, [c] said to Jeremiah, 16 "We will not listen to the message you have spoken to us in the name of the LORD! 17 We will certainly do everything we said we would: We will burn incense to the Queen of Heaven and will pour out drink offerings to her just as we and our fathers, our kings and our officials did in the towns of Judah and in the streets of Jerusalem. At that time we had plenty of food and were well off and suffered no harm. 18 But ever since we stopped burning incense to the Queen of Heaven and pouring out drink offerings to her, we have had nothing and have been perishing by sword and famine." Although, this Queen of Heaven is not Asherah, but just a demonstration that they told God FU, we will worship her. You can also Google Asherah - there are a number of articles available on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurisaz Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 I think most people would regard Christianity as a monotheistic religion, but is it really? As we all know there are 3 distinct entiities referred to in the Bible... Maybe that's been said already (I tend to read threads from the very beginning ), but I'd say that there are in fact four deities to the jebus cult. Considering the remarkable powers christians like to ascribe to Lucifer/Satan/Devil, I see no reason not to consider that one a deity to, although of course one of evil instead of (supposedly) good. They have nothing to say. They don't untestand why 3 completely seperate entities are actually 1 god. It's makes no friggin sense. It's an exercise in credulity. Exactly. Whenever you ask a christian to explain that absurd concept, finally he/she arrives at some way of saying "gawd works in mysterious ways". No christian really understands that concept. At least none I met so far. Good point, WB. Like they say, history is written by the winners. Just think - if Constantine had gone with Mithras instead, Jesus/Yaweh would be considered a false god or demon. Ever read some of the late Nordic sagas? The old Gods still appear, but are either made into human lords/rulers or agents of Saaaaatan. QED anybody find it amusing the ones who leave christianity know more about it than the ones who stay in it. Always remember the desperate comment of a German JW cultist when he and his mentor just left the place of an Asatruar who soundly trounced their claims, refuting them by quoting the babble: "Why the (censored) do the heathens always know the bible better than we do?!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willybilly30 Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 i cant remember what thread it was but its been said that satan and god were two gods fighting each other in the bible. that zoroastarian dualism good god vs evil god was a concept borrowed in the new testament. its interesting how christianitys against other religions and borrows from them. i could write threads all night on that subject all of its borrowed or maybe i should say stolen. hey maybe i should do that lol peoples been criticising me for not saying anything knew i havent brought that up yet lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toxic Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 i cant remember what thread it was but its been said that satan and god were two gods fighting each other in the bible. When I asked a pastor this they replied that God and Satan were not equal, God was in control of everything, which got me wondering why people need to be "saved" anyway. Come to think of it, why do Catholics say they believe in one God when they pray to Mary and the Saints? Surely Catholicism is especially polytheistic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 i cant remember what thread it was but its been said that satan and god were two gods fighting each other in the bible. When I asked a pastor this they replied that God and Satan were not equal, God was in control of everything, which got me wondering why people need to be "saved" anyway. Come to think of it, why do Catholics say they believe in one God when they pray to Mary and the Saints? Surely Catholicism is especially polytheistic? Heh - yes, why the need to be saved when Gawd is in control? I hate when Xians lay that line on me... I am an ex-Catholic. Catholics do not consider the saints to be equal to Gawd and do carefully structure their prayers to them to only be like asking them for favors and for prayers. Of course, it's only one step away from having the saints as just another pantheon, though, and it sure seems like that to any non-Catholic. It's how the Church gets to foster devotion and spread its religion as well as avoiding the idolatry accusation; after all, Catholicism was the first Xian cult to triumph over Paganism. In Pagan religions, you have lots of gods at times for different things; here comes Xianity and they have lots of saints to make up for all the little gods the people would lose. That, and it was natural for people to make up saints for themselves, saints in charge of this or that, because their culture was steeped in "discovering" new gods or additional roles for old ones. But Xianity, no matter what flavor, has a severe polytheistic bend. The 3-in-1 excuse is pretty poor in the end and the appeal that "the nature of Gawd is beyond our comprehension" is just a convenient cop-out devised to quell all questioning of the contradiction. That's how Xianity can claim to worship the One True God of the OT while still have Jesus. After all, Xianity is just the adoration of this Jesus person to the degree he is deified. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All Gods Fail Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 When I asked a pastor this they replied that God and Satan were not equal, God was in control of everything, which got me wondering why people need to be "saved" anyway. Satan is another transplanted god - the similarities between him and various underworld gods from the pagans is astounding. Hades, anyone? Hades possesses the riches of the earth, and is thus referred to as 'the Rich One'. Possibly also because -- as Sophocles writes -- 'the gloomy Hades enriches himself with our sighs and our tears'. Of all the gods, Hades is the one who is liked the least and even the gods themselves have an aversion of him. People avoided speaking his name lest they attracted his unwanted attention. With their faces averted they sacrificed black sheep, whose blood they let drip into pits, and when they prayed to him, they would bang their hands on the ground. The narcissus and the cypress are sacred to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mythra Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 Even the concept of three-gods-in-one isn't original to christianity. The Babylonians used the symbol of an equilateral triangle to represent their trinity. (1,400 years before Christ) It represented the planet Venus, the Moon, and the Sun. (Yes - the Babylonians - who believed that the organ the heart was the center of human thought and the liver was the center of human emotion) The Greeks also had their trinity - Zeus, Athena, and Apollo. The Romans had theirs also - Jupiter, Mercury, and Venus. So, of course Christianity had to keep up with the Jones - and show that they had a three-in-one God also. (Although the concept took several hundred years to develop, as Pagans converted to Christianity, and brought their ideas with them) So, when, exactly did Jesus become God? Was it when he was born, or when he was baptized and the dove fell upon him, or has he always been God and existed as God eternally? The correct answer? None of the above. Jesus became God in the fourth century - when Emporer Constantine sided with Athanasius (Jesus was fully divine with the full divinity of the Father) instead of siding with Arius (Jesus was the highest and mightiest of all God's creations) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffXL Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 Xtian Propaganda Ministers (a.k.a. "theologians') use scholarly-sounding words to say that gawd works in mysterious ways. "Homoiousia" and "hypostatic union" are the popular ones. They were invented because there were violent disagreements about who the hell Je$u$ fit in their god schemes. One essence! No, no, similar essence! One person, two natures! One nature, two persons! DIE HERETICS! All this bullshit over their imaginary friends. Sorry this is so rambling, but I wasted so much time over this crap and I really am pissed off that I did. But Xtians call on all 3 gods "Father, Son, Holy Spurt." Why not just Gawd? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike D Posted February 18, 2006 Author Share Posted February 18, 2006 By the way I should add that I don't believe the word "trinity" is found anywhere in the Bible, yet we're told that this doctrine is Biblical anyway. I guess when you are desperate to make Biblical contradictions go away you can make anything up to make it go away as long as you have a fancy name for it. It's amazing what a little brainwashing combined with suspension of reason will do to a sound mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffXL Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 By the way I should add that I don't believe the word "trinity" is found anywhere in the Bible, You are correct! Trinity is nowhere in Wholly Bile. But the clergy will spoonfeed anything to their brainwashed flock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike D Posted February 18, 2006 Author Share Posted February 18, 2006 Xtian Propaganda Ministers (a.k.a. "theologians') use scholarly-sounding words to say that gawd works in mysterious ways. "Homoiousia" and "hypostatic union" are the popular ones. Hey I just posted something like this I guess great minds think alike. To me taking these ideas and giving them scholarly sounding, abstract names is just like taking dog shit, wrapping it up nicely and putting a pretty red bow on top. It looks nice at first glance but when you take the wrapper and pretty bow off you still have nothing in the box but a pile of dog shit Sorry this is so rambling, but I wasted so much time over this crap and I really am pissed off that I did. And, you are not the only one, many of us were suckers and bought into this nonsense hook line and sinker. The worse part for me was just blindly accepting this stuff even though I smelled a rat, I just couldn't put my finger on it. And of course when confronting my pastor or anyone who I thought was knowledgable on the subject I was always getting the "son, there are just some things about God we just can't fully understand" speech! Yeah we can't understand it because it's ridiculousness goes completely beyond that point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts