Kids Less Intelligent Than Ever

[Saviourmachine]

while he's trying to give a presentation. After the presentation is over they should ask him questions politely and in turn.

 

AM, I still can't believe this. They normally really wait until the presentation is over? And, how can you tell a joke in class after the presentation is over?

 

Could you please explain this statement a little more to me?

There are thinks you have to know in a certain time period. My grandparents should know how to defend their position against neo-nazi's. I see this in the same light.

 

I do my best not to make fun of others simply because I am not beyond misspelling or mistyping myself.

That's neither my intention. I'm Dutch. I wouldn't even try to correct native speakers. If enough people write "irrelevent" - and there was some reason for it - I would change the standard spelling to "irrelevent", if I was a linguist.

[AtheistMommy]

AM, I still can't believe this. They normally really wait until the presentation is over? And, how can you tell a joke in class after the presentation is over?

 

I think you hit the nail on the head when you said the difference here seems to be culture. I'm sure that's why we think of it as rude and you think of it as intelligent. Although, I thought it was plain psychology.

 

There are thinks you have to know in a certain time period. My grandparents should know how to defend their position against neo-nazi's. I see this in the same light.

 

I agree. However, you have to take into the fact that these "teachers" aren't all that informative. Like I said, way too many of them like to teach directly out of the book. Which means you get nothing but what's in the book and they know nothing but what's in the book. I've only had one teacher that didn't use the book at all. He's the hardest teacher I've ever had, but he's damn good too.

 

Take Mr. Reverend Atheistar for example, he'd make an excellent science teacher. Why? Because he doesn't need the book. Because he himself is fascinated with science. And because if he was teaching this class with these children he wouldn't have any problems answering their questions. He would (talking from experience) have problems putting up with the attitude that went along with the questions. Although, I'm teaching him how to redirect bad behavior and he's doing quite well. So maybe soon he'll be ready to take on a science class room filled with teenage fundies.

 

That's neither my intention. I'm Dutch. I wouldn't even try to correct native speakers. If enough people write "irrelevent" - and there was some reason for it - I would change the standard spelling to "irrelevent", if I was a linguist.

 

Than, I'm sorry. I misunderstood. Thank you for explaining.

[Reverend AtheiStar]

I've been there.

 

[...] such a jackass? [...] kick the little asshole out of my class. [...] idiotic piece of comedy. [...] class full or religious hecklers [...] discipline these little hooligans [...] recycled questions and objections [...] little clones [...] these brats [...]

 

I just can't match that. I thank heaven that you are not my father.

 

You have no idea what kind of father I am. You really can't tell how I act with my children by how I act with other adults. I don't swear at my kids. I barely even spank them. I use my loud voice and psychology to discipline them mostly. You'd have been lucky to have me as a father.

[AtheistMommy]

You have no idea what kind of father I am. You really can't tell how I act with my children by how I act with other adults. I don't swear at my kids. I barely even spank them. I use my loud voice and psychology to discipline them mostly. You'd have been lucky to have me as a father.

 

You're a very good father. All parents make mistakes, but I think you do very well. Better than most fathers, in fact. Seriously, I think you're a better father than your father. Way better than my father. And I don't think you should feel the need to defend your parenting skills.

[Reverend AtheiStar]

You have no idea what kind of father I am. You really can't tell how I act with my children by how I act with other adults. I don't swear at my kids. I barely even spank them. I use my loud voice and psychology to discipline them mostly. You'd have been lucky to have me as a father.

 

You're a very good father. All parents make mistakes, but I think you do very well. Better than most fathers, in fact. Seriously, I think you're a better father than your father. Way better than my father. And I don't think you should feel the need to defend your parenting skills.

 

Muchas gracias, mi amor! I love you, too.

[Antlerman]

Pat is about 10 minutes away by highway. I see his big brick compound, CBN, all the time. I like to give it the one finger salute. Jerry, well, his fundy university, "Liberty," is in Lynchburg (how fitting, huh?) and is luckily four hours away. Check out this freaky cross table where they do sacrifices for their death cult.

 

 

Freaky is exactly the right word for this! It looks like a feast for a cult of cannibals to gather around and eat the flesh of a dead body laid out on this creepy autopsy table!!! Reality is that this is exactly what it is, "take and eat, for this is my body. Drink, for this is my blood". And somehow we don't see this as a cult?? Curious the power of conditioning, isn't it?

[Amanda]

 

 

Freaky is exactly the right word for this! It looks like a feast for a cult of cannibals to gather around and eat the flesh of a dead body laid out on this creepy autopsy table!!! Reality is that this is exactly what it is, "take and eat, for this is my body. Drink, for this is my blood". And somehow we don't see this as a cult?? Curious the power of conditioning, isn't it?

 

Antlerman and all, it does look kind of freaky... however, rituals are often regarded as powerful ways of making internal subjective changes. Unfortunately, these techniques often get abused, and IMO, often done so by many churches in their attempts to suggest for themselves an elitist position. Yet, having said that... what if there are metaphorical meanings to this ritual other than the superficial cannabalistic ones? What if the metaphor is to take a loaf of bread, and giving pieces of it to all... implying humbly that we are ALL pieces of ONE body... and we are humbly blood related as ONE in the human race? Would that be such a bad thing?

 

People here are of a scientific persuasion, which I think is very important and valid. Yet, just because subjective transformations are not able to be validated by objectionable, measureably definable means... do we discount them automatically?

 

I can understand how we can not allow these subjective experiences to contaminate science, as we have in our past. It is important to separate them, however... are they not both important in their own right? Maybe equally so... science contaminates the subjective experiences, if we insist that it must meet that criteria. IDK, but it seems it could do so.

[Antlerman]

Antlerman and all, it does look kind of freaky... however, rituals are often regarded as powerful ways of making internal subjective changes. Unfortunately, these techniques often get abused, and IMO, often done so by many churches in their attempts to suggest for themselves an elitist position. Yet, having said that... what if there are metaphorical meanings to this ritual other than the superficial cannabalistic ones? What if the metaphor is to take a loaf of bread, and giving pieces of it to all... implying humbly that we are ALL pieces of ONE body... and we are humbly blood related as ONE in the human race? Would that be such a bad thing?

I have no problem with rituals and symbolisms as part of the human experience of culture and personal transcendence, but this is not a ritual holding bread in a group and saying "as we eat this, we share in the substance of life that binds us all together." That's a ritual, metaphor, and symbolism that does not have a revolting image at its heart. The table above and the formula of communion are specifically symbolic of another human being's actual flesh and actual blood that they are eating and drinking.

 

The metaphor is given in the verse quoted that it is a symbolic way to eat and drink the blood of Jesus in remembrance of his real blood and flesh that was spilled and hacked apart for you to appease the judgment of a God who requires a human blood sacrifice in order to allow you into his presence. That metaphor is what I take as barbaric, and the symbol of blood drinking in the form of red wine... that speaks for itself. The symbol of drinking the wine is that of drinking human blood, no matter what metaphorical meanings one may wish to assign to it. Genuine cannibalism is also a ritual, rich in metaphors and spiritual meanings too. They don't do it because they’re hungry. It has religious belief at its heart.

 

There are lots of other rituals such as baptism which at least are a more positive rite, and not laden with all the cannibalistic symbolisms. "Take and eat, this is my flesh... Do this in rememberence of me." Then there are those who believe in the mystery of transmutation, such as the Catholics who believe that the wafer and wine literally become the flesh and blood of Christ inside your body after you have eaten him.

[Amanda]

I have no problem with rituals and symbolisms as part of the human experience of culture and personal transcendence, but this is not a ritual holding bread in a group and saying "as we eat this, we share in the substance of life that binds us all together." That's a ritual, metaphor, and symbolism that does not have a revolting image at its heart. The table above and the formula of communion are specifically symbolic of another human being's actual flesh and actual blood that they are eating and drinking.

Antlerman, I know that is what some religions presently believe, however... it does not seem congruent with the message of those days. Cannabalism was not acceptable amongst those in that area, and parables/metaphors were quite popular. Maybe it isn't so much the 'kids' that seem to be less intelligent...

 

The metaphor is given in the verse quoted that it is a symbolic way to eat and drink the blood of Jesus in remembrance of his real blood and flesh that was spilled and hacked apart for you to appease the judgment of a God who requires a human blood sacrifice in order to allow you into his presence. That metaphor is what I take as barbaric, and the symbol of blood drinking in the form of red wine... that speaks for itself.

How could this be the initial meaning of the metaphor if no one really knew Jesus was going to die? Judas hadn't even betrayed him yet! That interpretation is not consistent with the rest of the teachings, and IMO only became the rendering to encourage more people to come to Christianity... probably as a political way to manipulate society or for capitalistic intentions.

 

Let's consider the evolution of the psyche or mental state of man. As I understand it, man only initiated a stable life, instead of nomadic, about 8,000 years ago. The end of the last ice age and a new mutated wheat, giving reliable possibilities to plant and sow, allowed mankind to domesticate animals and provided a fairly abundant food supply. This gave man time to think about other things besides only survival. Civilizations brought the need for laws, an imposed regulation of what was good and bad. It was only in 300 BC that Plato introduced inductive and deductive reasoning. Not having that, people saw themselves as either good or bad, according to the law. I think the sacrificing of animals, done by other 'cults' also, was a way of easing tension... just as self mutilation does for some current disorders. "Jesus", encouraging people to use this new reasoning instead of sacrifices, was able to bring a clearing of the conscience without that horrific ritual, IMO.

 

I have no idea how people went from a metaphor/parable/allegory to cannabalistic attributes for the story! It would be very interesting to know what benefits people subjectively feel this is satisfying in their lives. Does anyone here have any ideas on this? People do live in society, where cannabllism is considered illegal, disgusting, repulsive, and wouldn't even consider it for survival!

[Taphophilia]

You have no idea what kind of father I am. You really can't tell how I act with my children by how I act with other adults. I don't swear at my kids. I barely even spank them. I use my loud voice and psychology to discipline them mostly. You'd have been lucky to have me as a father.

 

You're a very good father. All parents make mistakes, but I think you do very well. Better than most fathers, in fact. Seriously, I think you're a better father than your father. Way better than my father. And I don't think you should feel the need to defend your parenting skills.

 

Muchas gracias, mi amor! I love you, too.

 

You guys need to get a room.

Seriously, go enjoy some alone time together! Make the time.

 

Taph

[Reverend AtheiStar]

You have no idea what kind of father I am. You really can't tell how I act with my children by how I act with other adults. I don't swear at my kids. I barely even spank them. I use my loud voice and psychology to discipline them mostly. You'd have been lucky to have me as a father.

 

You're a very good father. All parents make mistakes, but I think you do very well. Better than most fathers, in fact. Seriously, I think you're a better father than your father. Way better than my father. And I don't think you should feel the need to defend your parenting skills.

 

Muchas gracias, mi amor! I love you, too.

 

You guys need to get a room.

Seriously, go enjoy some alone time together! Make the time.

 

lol... We have a room. A whole house, in fact. And I think our two children are evidence that we use this room quite often!

[Reverend AtheiStar]

Pat is about 10 minutes away by highway. I see his big brick compound, CBN, all the time. I like to give it the one finger salute. Jerry, well, his fundy university, "Liberty," is in Lynchburg (how fitting, huh?) and is luckily four hours away. Check out this freaky cross table where they do sacrifices for their death cult.

 

 

Freaky is exactly the right word for this! It looks like a feast for a cult of cannibals to gather around and eat the flesh of a dead body laid out on this creepy autopsy table!!! Reality is that this is exactly what it is, "take and eat, for this is my body. Drink, for this is my blood". And somehow we don't see this as a cult?? Curious the power of conditioning, isn't it?

 

I see them as a cult., In fact, you'll see me call Christainity a "death cult" all the time. They worship death and yearn for it. They, if they are serious about their religion, can't wait to die. I hear this sentiment on the radio all the time with the psychotic little diddy, "How Far is Heaven?" It's disturbing how happy the tone of the song is. If it were a Muslim song with the same exact messgae, though, you know people would freeak out!

 

Yet, having said that... what if there are metaphorical meanings to this ritual other than the superficial cannabalistic ones? What if the metaphor is to take a loaf of bread, and giving pieces of it to all... implying humbly that we are ALL pieces of ONE body... and we are humbly blood related as ONE in the human race? Would that be such a bad thing?

 

If that's what it meant, no. But that's not what it means. It's an attempt to satisfy a need for human sacrifice (think: Aztecs) by turning it into a metaphor. It's a way to worship death without actually killing anyone. Problem is, it doesn't work. History has shown Christainity to be the bloodiest religion ever to infect this plent. Since they're constantly immersed in this death worship they have seen nothing wrong with slughtering Muslims, Jews, Witches, Heretics, Atheists, etc. Kill them all, let God sort them out!

[Antlerman]

How could this be the initial meaning of the metaphor if no one really knew Jesus was going to die? Judas hadn't even betrayed him yet! That interpretation is not consistent with the rest of the teachings, and IMO only became the rendering to encourage more people to come to Christianity... probably as a political way to manipulate society or for capitalistic intentions.

It seem like you are making an error assuming that the gospel "narrative" was written down as "minutes" during the life of Jesus. The fact is the author of the book knew full well how the story was going to end as he wrote it, as a hindsight "account", or as I would put it, "a Homeric style hero's tale". In either case, as you should know, that anyone recounting something from the past will always inject future knowledge or understandings into their accounting of history. So that said, the author did in fact know how the story was going to end, and so his account of what was "said" by Christ would be totally influenced by his own personal understanding of what it meant.

 

The interpretation of it is given by the gospel writer when he says, "take and eat, for this is my body.... do this in remembrance of me". He understood the act of taking bread and wine to be a symbolic eating of the flesh and blood of Jesus in remembrance of his blood sacrifice he was going to make a few chapters later in his story the author was writing about him.

 

 

It was only in 300 BC that Plato introduced inductive and deductive reasoning. Not having that, people saw themselves as either good or bad, according to the law. I think the sacrificing of animals, done by other 'cults' also, was a way of easing tension... just as self mutilation does for some current disorders. "Jesus", encouraging people to use this new reasoning instead of sacrifices, was able to bring a clearing of the conscience without that horrific ritual, IMO.

It was actually Aristotle who came up with a primitive inductive method. Prior to this empiricism can be traced back to Imhotep around 2600 BCE. Even since the development of various logic methods, people still avail themselves readily of superstitions and speculations as the fast path to knowledge. Sacrificing animals and humans in cultures probably had little to do with easing tensions spawned by some form of disorder, and was more rooted in mythologies that served as a means to relate to the greater world that was beyond their control.

 

An interesting foot note on that: I saw a program recently that talked about the Mayan people how they would sacrifice children as part of their mythology of the death and rebirth of one of their gods who was responsible for the corn that sustained their culture. Then along comes the Catholic Church with a sacrificed man hanging on a stick as a symbol of their religion. Obviously, this was something they already well aquainted with in their culutre! So what did they do you ask? They incorporated the death ritual of the Chrisitian Diety into their own religion and began crucifying their children as part of their traditional death sacrifices to the corn god! And what do you think the churches response was? Introspection and self correction?? No!!! They ordered the burning of all of the Mayan people's books, effectively destroying passing on knowledge of their language and culture!!

 

So death sacrifices are nothing new to religion, and the story of Jesus was just a way to tie OT bloodletting sacrifices of animals, which had been borrowed from other culutres, into an apologetic story about their hero of their new-found mystery religion, Christianity.

 

One last comment on communion. I early misspoke calling the doctrine in the Catholic Church, "transmutation". It is actually "Transubstantiation” From the council of Trent:

 

 

And because that Christ, our Redeemer, declared that which He offered under the species of bread to be truly His own body, therefore has it ever been a firm belief in the Church of God, and this holy Synod doth now declare it anew, that, by the consecration of the bread and of the wine, a conversion is made of the whole substance of the bread into the substance of the body of Christ our Lord, and of the whole substance of the wine into the substance of His blood; which conversion is, by the holy Catholic Church, suitably and properly called Transubstantiation

[Saviourmachine]

lol... We have a room. A whole house, in fact. And I think our two children are evidence that we use this room quite often!

Oh, shit...You two are hubby and wife?

Ah. I was already thinking; how does she know about his capabilities as a dad... That's why you both "twee handen op één buik zijn". Literal translation "you are two hands on one belly", meaning that you're supporting each other without reservations. That's two against one! Who wanna help me?!

[Reverend AtheiStar]

lol... We have a room. A whole house, in fact. And I think our two children are evidence that we use this room quite often!

 

 

Oh, shit...You two are hubby and wife? I was wondering why you replied 'thanks' to my reply to AtheistMommy when I told her that her kids were good lookin';.I hadn't a clue that they were yours too In that case, your wife and children are gorgeous.

 

I like your wife but I'm not quite sure about you....yet Now I feel slightly guilty for the wording of my post to you Reverend AteiStar...sorry AtheistMommy for my tone with your dh.

 

Yup, sure are. We work off of the same computer and sit in the same chair! lol... It's ok if you think I'm an "obnoxious asshole," I am one. She read what you wrote, hugged me and said to me, "It's ok. I love my Asshole." lol...

 

lol... We have a room. A whole house, in fact. And I think our two children are evidence that we use this room quite often!

Oh, shit...You two are hubby and wife?

Ah. I was already thinking; how does she know about his capabilities as a dad... That's why you both "twee handen op één buik zijn". Literal translation "you are two hands on one belly", meaning that you're supporting each other without reservations. That's two against one! Who wanna help me?!

 

lol... We do tend to tag team sometimes.

[Reverend AtheiStar]

Yes, there are proper way to questions, but when will the teacher be able to thoroughly answer those questions? After kids settle down and then have role call, after a quick review of yesterdays 'lesson', then the new material...how much time is left for questions from students? Gotta keep on schedule, gotta get ready for the almighty standardized achievement tests.

 

If it can't wait until after the presentation then the proper way, as I've stated before, is to raise your hand. And if the teacher can't throughly answer the questions (this is quite possible, evolution aswers often need a long explanation) I see no reason why he can't recommend further reading. The thing is, though, that these kids are hard core creationists. They don't want to read about evolution unless it's framed in a creationist anti-evolution perspective. They don't want his class to go well because they don't believe any of it and even go so far as to fail on purpose. They don't respect him or his beliefs and it shows.

 

Maybe in a separate mythology class?

 

I suggested this early on. I said that I'd be cautious, though, because the Christains could take this opportunity and turn into a chance to evangelize.

 

Why not quit being such an obnoxious asshole to someone who was only making a suggestion and until now, was not disrespectful to you at all? Why not use the opportunity for teachers like yourself to make them start questioning their FAITH?

 

I was simply taking your suggestion to it's logical end. If you start teaching pseudoscience in science class this could swing the door wide open. And btw, I'm not a teacher, unless you meant this in a loose sense.

[AtheistMommy]

 

You guys need to get a room.

Seriously, go enjoy some alone time together! Make the time.

 

Taph

 

We have a room, what we need is a new bed. Our bed is warn out so bad.

 

 

 

Oh, shit...You two are hubby and wife? I was wondering why you replied 'thanks' to my reply to AtheistMommy when I told her that her kids were good lookin';.I hadn't a clue that they were yours too In that case, your wife and children are gorgeous.

 

I like your wife but I'm not quite sure about you....yet Now I feel slightly guilty for the wording of my post to you Reverend AteiStar...sorry AtheistMommy for my tone with your dh.

 

 

You have no idea how many times I have to explain to people who know us that we are two different types of Atheists. It's not that I'm weak and he's strong, its just that I think he just loves to go for blood while I'm after tolerance.

 

We are part of a local Atheist group in Virginia and I made him a pet name: FundieReverendAtheistasshole

 

I love him but man can he be a thorn in everyone's side. In fact, I think this is a major reason why I love him.

 

BTW, thank you

 

 

lol... We do tend to tag team sometimes.

 

Tag team, you normally don't need my help. Of course, I like to think together we make wonderful music and a unbeatable debate team At least we do when it comes to your dad. LOL

[Amanda]

Yet, having said that... what if there are metaphorical meanings to this ritual other than the superficial cannabalistic ones? What if the metaphor is to take a loaf of bread, and giving pieces of it to all... implying humbly that we are ALL pieces of ONE body... and we are humbly blood related as ONE in the human race? Would that be such a bad thing?

 

If that's what it meant, no. But that's not what it means.

 

How do you KNOW that's not what it means?

[Caretaker]

lol... We have a room. A whole house, in fact. And I think our two children are evidence that we use this room quite often!

Only two? Why.... A good Catholic couple should be capable of putting out 16!

 

 

 

 

j/k

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Amanda]

The interpretation of it is given by the gospel writer when he says, "take and eat, for this is my body.... do this in remembrance of me". He understood the act of taking bread and wine to be a symbolic eating of the flesh and blood of Jesus in remembrance of his blood sacrifice he was going to make a few chapters later in his story the author was writing about him.

Antlerman, you have my utmost respect, yet perhaps you may be assuming this to be so here? IMO, I don't see any rational for putting the cart before the horse. It seems to me the point would be, we are of ONE body, ALL related by human blood, as being more congruent with the rest of the story. Hence, treat your neighbor as yourself, and EVERYONE is your neighbor... which is the main thrust of these teachings.

It was actually Aristotle who came up with a primitive inductive method. Prior to this empiricism can be traced back to Imhotep around 2600 BCE. Even since the development of various logic methods, people still avail themselves readily of superstitions and speculations as the fast path to knowledge. Sacrificing animals and humans in cultures probably had little to do with easing tensions spawned by some form of disorder, and was more rooted in mythologies that served as a means to relate to the greater world that was beyond their control.

Apologies, you are right about Aristotle instead of Plato. They were both very closely affiliated, and of the same time period. I think they both influenced greatly these teachings of using reason/logic to clear our conscience seen in the NT. Hence, you're not going to get your oxen out of the ditch on the sabbath!?!

 

Mythology seems to seve other purposes besides that one too. It seems some are like fables, and it also seems some are super imposed onto actual events... hence St. Nicholas to Santa Claus. It astonishes me how these kids can totally dismiss evolution, as in the article in this thread. However, I too, as an adult, have fallen for the consideration that some of these fables might have been true. *sigh* Maybe it is the power of a presuppositional position to be so in our culture/society. Unfortunately, there are only rare opportunities these get to be critically challenged. Maybe this science class would be a great place to have such a debate?

They ordered the burning of all of the Mayan people's books, effectively destroying passing on knowledge of their language and culture!!

Unfortunately, the huge list of tragedies by the self professed "Christian" movements does not and do not stop there.

One last comment on communion. I early misspoke calling the doctrine in the Catholic Church, "transmutation". It is actually "Transubstantiation” From the council of Trent:

Is this to prove the definition of communion, or disprove the validity of many of the churches' interpretations? I agree with the latter, as with much of western organized religions' interpretations. I'd lean more to Yogananda or such.

[AtheistMommy]

 

LOL...Sounds like you are the perfect balance for RA. BTW...my hubby is a native Virginian, Norfolk to be exact. We'll be visiting sometime next year, his folks live in Yorktown.

 

Funny, we live in Norfolk. Actually on the boarder of Norfolk and Virginia Beach. It's a small world.

[Reverend AtheiStar]

Yet, having said that... what if there are metaphorical meanings to this ritual other than the superficial cannabalistic ones? What if the metaphor is to take a loaf of bread, and giving pieces of it to all... implying humbly that we are ALL pieces of ONE body... and we are humbly blood related as ONE in the human race? Would that be such a bad thing?

 

If that's what it meant, no. But that's not what it means.

 

How do you KNOW that's not what it means?

 

Easy. The Bible clearly spells out that this cannibalisitic ritual is to be done "in remembrance of me." What is being remembered? His bloody execution, of course! You are eating his corpse! The bread is his dead flesh and the wine is his blood. I'm sure I can dig up all I need. Do you wish to continue?

[Amanda]

Easy. The Bible clearly spells out that this cannibalisitic ritual is to be done "in remembrance of me." What is being remembered? His bloody execution, of course! You are eating his corpse! The bread is his dead flesh and the wine is his blood. I'm sure I can dig up all I need. Do you wish to continue?

Reverend Atheistar, that may be the 'literal' take from the KJV, but using the concordance to access the manuscript from which it was taken may show a different interpretation. Parables, metaphors, and allegories are how they often communicated their messages, and taking the time to decipher them is part of the transformational process in one's own life. IMHO, this is much how Buddhism and other eastern spiritual teachings are done too.

 

The ONE loaf of bread represents the ONE body of us all. This is my body, Matthew 26:26, simply means this is the body of ALL mankind, more specifically directed to those who were with him in his humble movement for equality for ALL. See #3 of the definition found here. Notice that it evolved from this definition found here. 'Blood' in 26:28 has just the meaning of the seat of life, found here, although I have found where it also refers to the related aspect we are to each other as human beings. Sometimes he is referred to as bread, metaphorically meaning his message kneads us into a unified mass, prepared with God's energy (baked), which gives rise to our spirituality for the sustaining of life.

 

I know the popular contemporary spin that has been put on this, however, it only makes it a 'thread' that has been constantly hijacked and interjected with myths throughout history. The myth part I can understand, as an attempt to be inclusive of everyone's beliefs. Yet, to use it to manipulate people into one mindset, or to twist it to coerce others into "Christianity" is yet another atrocity by these self proclaimed "Christians". The manuscript from which the translation was taken, read in a congruent manner, does NOT say this, IMO.

 

I've learned from this site how fundamentalism is very much like a disorder. I would never want to impede the recovery process out of this distructive mindset. However, in this forum are those of scientific inclinations, and it seems recovery is not as relevent to those here. There are deeper meanings to allegories, metaphors, and parables... and is it so difficult to consider that aspect, from those who seem to be more rational, reasonable thinkers? It seems it would only be another aspect of possible meanings that would be much more plausible to consider than the literal view.

[jjacksonRIAB]

I've learned from this site how fundamentalism is very much like a disorder. I would never want to impede the recovery process out of this distructive mindset. However, in this forum are those of scientific inclinations, and it seems recovery is not as relevent to those here. There are deeper meanings to allegories, metaphors, and parables... and is it so difficult to consider that aspect, from those who seem to be more rational, reasonable thinkers? It seems it would only be another aspect of possible meanings that would be much more plausible to consider than the literal view.

 

I don't know. I'm compelled to say I've gotten a stronger grip on abstract thought by reading poetry than I ever could have from reading scripture.

 

Is it not possible that we place gems (and written too hastily, mines) in our own writings that we had no intention of putting there?

 

I'm not saying you're wrong, but I am saying I've found places that I feel can be delved more deeply. I feel such sorrow for people who know only the Bible, and forsake all other things to skim its narrow depths.

[Amanda]

I'm not saying you're wrong, but I am saying I've found places that I feel can be delved more deeply. I feel such sorrow for people who know only the Bible, and forsake all other things to skim its narrow depths.

JJacksonRIAB, I absolutely agree! I just think the Bible now is very little like the original one, and certainly very different than the intentions of the manuscript from which the KJV was taken! If one is going to read the Bible at face value, you're right, they're certainly better off reading poetry. It's a shame what it has evolved into through the years, and I didn't see that so much till I came to this site.

 

IMO, the Bible's messages are encrypted with the use of parables, metaphors, and allegories. Additionally, I think the far eastern teachings, such as Buddhism, have deeper concepts and delivery... however, it is very difficult for me to understand it. I have high regards for the Buddhist mindset, and it seems to me, fwiw, Jesus was probably more into Buddhism than anything else. It still puzzles me how the Bible became laced with so many myths taken to be true, and it seems this never happened with these far eastern teachings. Of course, I'm assuming Buddha existed, just as I assume Jesus did too.