qadeshet Posted August 28, 2005 Share Posted August 28, 2005 If you had facts that could prove Christianity is a lie, would you publish your book? Xianity has been debunked in thousands of books. Has any Xian apologist ever answered Thomas Paine's Age of Reason? How many of you have read Origen's lame refutation of Celsus? There is simply no proof whatsoever for the existence of jesus. What proof would Xians consider irrefutable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogmatically_challenged Posted August 28, 2005 Share Posted August 28, 2005 Has any Xian apologist ever answered Thomas Paine's Age of Reason? Not that I'm aware of. No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dead_hobbit Posted August 28, 2005 Share Posted August 28, 2005 Such a book already exists. It is called "HaMiqra" by some, and "Tanakh" by others. Christians half translated it, half paraphrased it, and completely screwed it up when they published it under the title of "Old Testament". Interesting question I thought I'd pose. If you had facts that could prove Christianity is a lie, would you publish your book? If you could prove that the Church knew it was a lie from it's earliest days, would you publish? Something mum was ruminating on and I thought I'd share with the forum . Merlin <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogmatically_challenged Posted August 28, 2005 Share Posted August 28, 2005 Such a book already exists. It is called "HaMiqra" by some, and "Tanakh" by others. Christians half translated it, half paraphrased it, and completely screwed it up when they published it under the title of "Old Testament". <{POST_SNAPBACK}> HAHAHA!!! Outstanding! Yes! The real bible of the god of abraham does kinda debunk xianity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceMonk Posted August 28, 2005 Share Posted August 28, 2005 Who needs the internet, Barnes and Noble or Amazon.com, when you've got the "inspired werd of gawd" to poke holes in? I'd love to see some kind of TV show that points out all the inconsistencies in the bible and its theology. I imagine it to be a counter to the 1/2 hour shows like Kenneth Copeland, Joyce Meyer, etc. Maybe just a few 'heathens' sitting around talking about it, countering all its claims and requirements. Offering counselling, or something, to callers who have deconverted, or need to, etc. Exactly the same as the christian shows do, except the flip side of the coin - so that they couldn't complain. I've heard some of yall say "Oh there are plenty of books on Philosophy, Comparative Religion, debunking the bible and books that explain science to the layperson out there already" Yes Sir, I know that, but people STILL are not aware of these books There could be some kind of infomercial or 'shopping show' that promotes and explains some of the books that are out there... Basically the christian communities need anti-evangelising. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Posted August 28, 2005 Share Posted August 28, 2005 In my neck of the woods we all ready done that kinda. One support group for help in dealing with any kind of addiction...god free. Two more that are striclty religion free, but only makes appeals to higher power only. I helped in those. Why are "adults" to chicken to talk about this stuff? I think they are afraid because they know they will deconvert eventually and are afraid that hell might just exist. There could be some kind of infomercial or 'shopping show' that promotes and explains some of the books that are out there... Or at least, a web site. I think most people are likely to go to the Internet for information these days. I know...start a site and call it "secularbooks.com" or something. Maybe a book blog? I'm sure it's been done before, but it hasn't been advertised. I would like to know since when did heathens ever fight fire with fire? When? If we have done this then what were the negative impacts? Real life not just speculation. I don't know that that's happened in the last fifty years, other than the pro-choice protests and stuff like that, but it wasn't specifically about religion. Yes there were people like Thomas Paine who wrote essays and books, but they didn't catch on. Maybe the time is right now for it to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Posted August 28, 2005 Share Posted August 28, 2005 If you had facts that could prove Christianity is a lie, would you publish your book? Xianity has been debunked in thousands of books. Has any Xian apologist ever answered Thomas Paine's Age of Reason? How many of you have read Origen's lame refutation of Celsus? There is simply no proof whatsoever for the existence of jesus. What proof would Xians consider irrefutable? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Well, "James Patrick Holding" has provided a rebuttal. I'd have to say though that I am not particularly impressed with Thomas Paine. While he was a brilliant propagandist and pamphleteer for the American cause, he wasn't the brightest Bible critic in all of existence and wasn't the intellectual he apparently fancied himself to be! Matthew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qadeshet Posted August 28, 2005 Share Posted August 28, 2005 Well, "James Patrick Holding" has provided a rebuttal. I'd have to say though that I am not particularly impressed with Thomas Paine. While he was a brilliant propagandist and pamphleteer for the American cause, he wasn't the brightest Bible critic in all of existence and wasn't the intellectual he apparently fancied himself to be! Matthew <{POST_SNAPBACK}> James P Holding is not even his real name. What is he hiding? If you have ever read his apologetics, then you know why I have no respect for his views. An apology is not the same as a refutation. Age of Reason was written without source materials. Paine was forced to rely on his own memory. Many modern Xian critics simply build on Paine's original work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlinfmct87 Posted August 30, 2005 Author Share Posted August 30, 2005 I want you all to know, right now, that this thread has *not* gone unread. Mum and I have gone through all the replies and appreciate all of your opinions/viewpoints/insights. Merlin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdwardAbbey Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 Interesting question I thought I'd pose. If you had facts that could prove Christianity is a lie, would you publish your book? If you could prove that the Church knew it was a lie from it's earliest days, would you publish? Something mum was ruminating on and I thought I'd share with the forum . Merlin <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I think there will always be a large population of people who will continue to believe the lie no matter how much evidence you show them. there is plenty of freethought material available to anyone who will dare to think more objectively and critically. It might not be considered proof persay but it is damn close to it. All one has to do is think a little bit. The results, deconversion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clergicide Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 Interesting question I thought I'd pose. If you had facts that could prove Christianity is a lie, would you publish your book? If you could prove that the Church knew it was a lie from it's earliest days, would you publish? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Oh hell yes I'd publish. But you'd really have to have your academic credibility locked down before doing it. Leaving them with only the fallback position: "the devil must have a hold on the author". You only get death threats if your message is effective, your message is only effective if it gets read seriously, it only gets read seriously if people think you know whereof you speak. PHD + small mountain of field work with stellar accreditations will do the trick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TruthSeeker Posted September 22, 2005 Share Posted September 22, 2005 I agree completely. Also, wanted to compliment your "I don't want to believe, nor do I want to disbelieve. I want to know the truth." quote of your signature. Perfectly expressed! I also recommnd Asimov's Guide to the Bible for those who want to know when Biblical texts entered the texts...obviously written by man to control man. Definitely, if I thought it was something new that hadn't been published or widely publicized before. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlinfmct87 Posted September 23, 2005 Author Share Posted September 23, 2005 I think there will always be a large population of people who will continue to believe the lie no matter how much evidence you show them. there is plenty of freethought material available to anyone who will dare to think more objectively and critically. It might not be considered proof persay but it is damn close to it. All one has to do is think a little bit. The results, deconversion. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> True enough, there is already enough floating around in the libraries and on the internet to debunk Christianity on it's face... but there's always the possibility that it's 'Satan's doing' or somesuch other nonsense. Not to mention many Christians simply refuse to let freethought material(hell, anything unChristian really) in the public libraries. I can't tell you how many wicca books I found in the library that had been defaced(pages torn out) or outright stolen. Same goes for many of the science books(God forbid a book on evolution or geology be allowed to be read!). And Robert Ingersoll? FORGET ABOUT IT. Not one book of his in the whole fucking system. You can really tell I live in a red state unfortunately. *grumble*. Thank goodness for Infidels.org and Wikipedia. Oh hell yes I'd publish. But you'd really have to have your academic credibility locked down before doing it. Leaving them with only the fallback position: "the devil must have a hold on the author". You only get death threats if your message is effective, your message is only effective if it gets read seriously, it only gets read seriously if people think you know whereof you speak. PHD + small mountain of field work with stellar accreditations will do the trick. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Oh, absolutly! There can't be any wiggle room, any room for doubt... you'd have to prove your case beyond any doubt... which is exactly what she's shooting for. I agree completely. Also, wanted to compliment your "I don't want to believe, nor do I want to disbelieve. I want to know the truth." quote of your signature. Perfectly expressed! I also recommnd Asimov's Guide to the Bible for those who want to know when Biblical texts entered the texts...obviously written by man to control man. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Properly read, the Bible is the most potent force for Atheism ever conceived. Couldn't agree more. Merlin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Posted September 23, 2005 Share Posted September 23, 2005 True enough, there is already enough floating around in the libraries and on the internet to debunk Christianity on it's face... but there's always the possibility that it's 'Satan's doing' or somesuch other nonsense. True. I mean, I deconverted after reading books that were already written. But I was looking for the truth, I was not interested in deluding myself further. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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