Question For Amazed

[godlessgrrl]

I do think and i believe i'm getting some to think about what they embrace and its consquences.

 

If you're thinking, it isn't obvious.

 

If you believe you're getting anyone to consider what we "embrace" and "its [sic] consequences", then you're mighty full of yourself. And a bit deluded.

 

Everyone here has already thought long and hard about our beliefs, long before you ever got here. If you were paying attention - if you'd even noticed the NAME of this site - you'd know that already.

 

You haven't told us anything we haven't heard and mulled over before. Get over yourself.

 

 

I have used reason, logic, science, history, Scriptue throughout my posts.

 

Yes, you've certainly used some scripture here and there. However, you have used faulty reason and fallacious logic, almost no science, and very weak history. There is no potency in any of your assertions.

 

What i see on the atheist side for the most part are snide remarks.

 

Actually, our responses to you have been a rather mixed bag. For the most part, they have been patient and considerate, with people far better than I spending more time on you than your willful ignorance warrants. Some responses have certainly been snide too. It's very telling that those are the only answers you seem to have noticed.

 

If anyone has been snide here, you've earned it. Just a note: don't you dare go away for even a fraction of a moment and believe that anyone being snide is "persecuting" you for your belief in Jesus. Honestly, I certainly don't take any issue with you believing in who or whatever you like, and I'm sure the same is true for many people here.

 

No, if anyone is snide to you, you brought it on yourself by being rude, smug, dishonest, unthinking, and generally a willfully ignorant asshat. Some of us have far less patience than others for that sort of thing.

 

But if nothing else, I appreciate your being here, simply for the reminder of why I will never be a Christian again. Thank you for your stellar example.

[Realist]

God can do anything but deal with humans and fix evil. He can't even arrange undeniable proof of his own existence. Pfft. To be God and omnimpotent must suck infinitely big time.

All men who deny he exist are without excuse. He has given his witness in nature and in your heart but you suppress this truth.

 

FYI, when you parrot like this it means you have shut off your brain and are just merely channeling what you have been told like a rote-learned robot. Think man! I'm going to stop engaging you if you don't start putting some real thought into your responses. So far all you have done is proven to be a little christ bot. We know this stuff; better than you do. Give us something fresh that your brain came up with, not what your pastor told you or what the apologetic book you read last week said.

 

I'm not sure why I bother. I'm probably suffering from eternal optimism that at least one of you guys will one day think for yourselves.

I do think and i believe i'm getting some to think about what they embrace and its consquences. I have used reason, logic, science, history, Scriptue throughout my posts. What i see on the atheist side for the most part are snide remarks.

 

..... Amazed .... you truly ARE amazing! I actually have been laughing for the last 5 minutes over your comments here!

 

Firstly let's just summerise YOU!

 

By your posts it is NOT hard to pick you may well be some pimply assed teen who has had but a short lifetime of indoctrination! You may well have grown up from birth being taught there is only one true god and at YOUR age have NO idea of the power that has held over your limited and closed thinking! As for you using reason and logic I find that comment totally laughable and almost offensive to logic and reason!! As for you using science,the more science IS studied the less it supports your belief system! Why do you think an overwhelming percentage of the elite of US and British scientists now do not believe in a god?

I have seen many of your posts. Your answers have been 100% predictable from your limited closed circle of thinking which do not forget most of us here would be able to recite before you had time to type them!

You have also clearly shown the other ignorance signs that go hand in hand with born agains! You are near ignorant on the history of religions .... YOURS included! The other thing you have clearly shown is that you have NOT been bothered to read some superb links which have been posted by some on here .... if you had and truly WERE able to use logic and reason, it would be YOU who would be embracing some of what others have said on here.

 

So let's NOT have the insults of some jerk who thinks it smart ass just to go on someone elses website with NO other reason than to cause trouble! You ARE NOT here to listen and learn. At your pimply age YOU ALREADY KNOW IT ALL! Many on here have suffered unbelievely at the hands of your CULT! Their positions have been reached after YEARS of careful deliberation, pain, searching and hell! I believe your religion to be one of the worst tragedies to befall this planet .... far worse for instance than the evils of Hitler, Stalin and their mobs!

 

So either get off your high horse and try and learn a little .... or else just phuck off!

[Caretaker]

Hey Amazed, I have a problem...

 

Can you please prove Banach's Fixed-Point Contraction Mapping Theorem? I really need help understanding why Banach's Fixed-Point Contraction Mapping Theorem is true.

[RankStranger]

 

This is a difficult doctrine. I wish it were not in the Scriptures and the lips of Christ but it is and we have to deal with it. We all have choices to make and no choice is a choice. It is not God' desire to send anyone to hell but to be saved from it. That's why He sent Christ into the world to save us from it. That's how serious He takes this. I don't know how all these issues will be sorted out about loved ones being there. Its a great mystery. I do know that we must do everything we can to avoid it and warn others also. I just don't see how your suffering in hell would be any benefit to anyone else.

I hope and pray you will reconsider this.

 

Why do you wish that, Amazed?

[Caretaker]

Ah, I think I see another problem. Appealing to Scripture!

 

Do you realize that Scripture has zero credibility here?

 

NONE

ZIP

ZERO

ZILCH

NADDA

NOTHING

NILL

/dev/null

Less than every positive real number

 

No credibility with us what-so-forking ever. So if you are going to appeal to scripture, you automatically lost credibility with us as well.

 

So why do you appeal to scripture?

 

And as for your claim that you are appealing to logic, don't piss on my leg and tell me it is raining. Until you can provide me with proof of Banach's Fixed Point Contraction Mapping Theorem, including every last mundane mathematical detail, I will call into question your ability to use logic correctly. Seriously. That is a gateway question for you to answer, so I will have no reason to engage in further conversation until you can prove to me that you know how to utilize logic correctly.

 

Yeah, call me a snobby mathematician all you want. I know how to utilize logic, so don't insult my intelligence.

[Guest Marty]

 

I do think and i believe i'm getting some to think about what they embrace and its consquences. I have used reason, logic, science, history, Scriptue throughout my posts. What i see on the atheist side for the most part are snide remarks.

 

 

 

you xtians make me laugh, that's about the only thing you got through to me!

[Guest amazed]

 

This is a difficult doctrine. I wish it were not in the Scriptures and the lips of Christ but it is and we have to deal with it. We all have choices to make and no choice is a choice. It is not God' desire to send anyone to hell but to be saved from it. That's why He sent Christ into the world to save us from it. That's how serious He takes this. I don't know how all these issues will be sorted out about loved ones being there. Its a great mystery. I do know that we must do everything we can to avoid it and warn others also. I just don't see how your suffering in hell would be any benefit to anyone else.

I hope and pray you will reconsider this.

 

Why do you wish that, Amazed?

I don't like it because its a bad place to end up in.

[Guest amazed]

God can do anything but deal with humans and fix evil. He can't even arrange undeniable proof of his own existence. Pfft. To be God and omnimpotent must suck infinitely big time.

All men who deny he exist are without excuse. He has given his witness in nature and in your heart but you suppress this truth.

 

FYI, when you parrot like this it means you have shut off your brain and are just merely channeling what you have been told like a rote-learned robot. Think man! I'm going to stop engaging you if you don't start putting some real thought into your responses. So far all you have done is proven to be a little christ bot. We know this stuff; better than you do. Give us something fresh that your brain came up with, not what your pastor told you or what the apologetic book you read last week said.

 

I'm not sure why I bother. I'm probably suffering from eternal optimism that at least one of you guys will one day think for yourselves.

I do think and i believe i'm getting some to think about what they embrace and its consquences. I have used reason, logic, science, history, Scriptue throughout my posts. What i see on the atheist side for the most part are snide remarks.

 

..... Amazed .... you truly ARE amazing! I actually have been laughing for the last 5 minutes over your comments here!

 

Firstly let's just summerise YOU!

 

By your posts it is NOT hard to pick you may well be some pimply assed teen who has had but a short lifetime of indoctrination! You may well have grown up from birth being taught there is only one true god and at YOUR age have NO idea of the power that has held over your limited and closed thinking! As for you using reason and logic I find that comment totally laughable and almost offensive to logic and reason!! As for you using science,the more science IS studied the less it supports your belief system! Why do you think an overwhelming percentage of the elite of US and British scientists now do not believe in a god?

I have seen many of your posts. Your answers have been 100% predictable from your limited closed circle of thinking which do not forget most of us here would be able to recite before you had time to type them!

You have also clearly shown the other ignorance signs that go hand in hand with born agains! You are near ignorant on the history of religions .... YOURS included! The other thing you have clearly shown is that you have NOT been bothered to read some superb links which have been posted by some on here .... if you had and truly WERE able to use logic and reason, it would be YOU who would be embracing some of what others have said on here.

 

So let's NOT have the insults of some jerk who thinks it smart ass just to go on someone elses website with NO other reason than to cause trouble! You ARE NOT here to listen and learn. At your pimply age YOU ALREADY KNOW IT ALL! Many on here have suffered unbelievely at the hands of your CULT! Their positions have been reached after YEARS of careful deliberation, pain, searching and hell! I believe your religion to be one of the worst tragedies to befall this planet .... far worse for instance than the evils of Hitler, Stalin and their mobs!

 

So either get off your high horse and try and learn a little .... or else just phuck off!

Hope you fell better now.... I'd like to start a topic on how ex Christians were abused but i won't be able to with all the other stuff going on.

[agnosticator]

I wish it were not in the Scriptures and the lips of Christ but it is and we have to deal with it. We all have choices to make and no choice is a choice. It is not God' desire to send anyone to hell but to be saved from it. That's why He sent Christ into the world to save us from it. That's how serious He takes this. I don't know how all these issues will be sorted out about loved ones being there. Its a great mystery. I do know that we must do everything we can to avoid it and warn others also. I just don't see how your suffering in hell would be any benefit to anyone else.

 

 

Hmmm...The christian god blames humans for being born with a human nature that supposedly can only be and do evil-never good. Evil is defined as anything humans think and do before confession and acceptance of salvation. We are to feel guilt for having a human nature given to us by this god. If we don't believe the story, we automatically are counted as having made the choice to rebel/reject this god. We are then to be tortured eternally as punishment unless we believe the Jesus story, and take it personally as if it were our fault. Never mind that this god is also responsible for all the suffering that ever was and ever will be. All this is his desire, since he knew it "from the foundation of the world", and set it up to be so.

 

Since this seems to be unfair and mind-boggling, we shall call it a mystery.

[RankStranger]

 

This is a difficult doctrine. I wish it were not in the Scriptures and the lips of Christ but it is and we have to deal with it. We all have choices to make and no choice is a choice. It is not God' desire to send anyone to hell but to be saved from it. That's why He sent Christ into the world to save us from it. That's how serious He takes this. I don't know how all these issues will be sorted out about loved ones being there. Its a great mystery. I do know that we must do everything we can to avoid it and warn others also. I just don't see how your suffering in hell would be any benefit to anyone else.

I hope and pray you will reconsider this.

 

Why do you wish that, Amazed?

I don't like it because its a bad place to end up in.

 

But if God did it, then is it not "good" by definition?

 

Why do you not like something that is 'good'?

 

Or do you not agree that the hell doctrine IS in fact 'good'?

[Guest amazed]

 

This is a difficult doctrine. I wish it were not in the Scriptures and the lips of Christ but it is and we have to deal with it. We all have choices to make and no choice is a choice. It is not God' desire to send anyone to hell but to be saved from it. That's why He sent Christ into the world to save us from it. That's how serious He takes this. I don't know how all these issues will be sorted out about loved ones being there. Its a great mystery. I do know that we must do everything we can to avoid it and warn others also. I just don't see how your suffering in hell would be any benefit to anyone else.

I hope and pray you will reconsider this.

 

Why do you wish that, Amazed?

I don't like it because its a bad place to end up in.

 

But if God did it, then is it not "good" by definition?

 

Why do you not like something that is 'good'?

 

Or do you not agree that the hell doctrine IS in fact 'good'?

Personally i don't like the doctrine because of what it implies but on the other hand i do think its the right and just thing because there must be a place for those who totally reject God.

[Guest amazed]

I wish it were not in the Scriptures and the lips of Christ but it is and we have to deal with it. We all have choices to make and no choice is a choice. It is not God' desire to send anyone to hell but to be saved from it. That's why He sent Christ into the world to save us from it. That's how serious He takes this. I don't know how all these issues will be sorted out about loved ones being there. Its a great mystery. I do know that we must do everything we can to avoid it and warn others also. I just don't see how your suffering in hell would be any benefit to anyone else.

 

 

Hmmm...The christian god blames humans for being born with a human nature that supposedly can only be and do evil-never good. Evil is defined as anything humans think and do before confession and acceptance of salvation. We are to feel guilt for having a human nature given to us by this god. If we don't believe the story, we automatically are counted as having made the choice to rebel/reject this god. We are then to be tortured eternally as punishment unless we believe the Jesus story, and take it personally as if it were our fault. Never mind that this god is also responsible for all the suffering that ever was and ever will be. All this is his desire, since he knew it "from the foundation of the world", and set it up to be so.

 

Since this seems to be unfair and mind-boggling, we shall call it a mystery.

Do what you will to talk your way out of it. There are many things i don't understand but i do know your rejection of salvation in Christ will result in tragic consquences for you and others if you persist. Do you think you are powerful enough to resist Him because you don't like the way Scripture describes our fallen condition?

[thefriendlyghost]

 

This is a difficult doctrine. I wish it were not in the Scriptures and the lips of Christ but it is and we have to deal with it. We all have choices to make and no choice is a choice. It is not God' desire to send anyone to hell but to be saved from it. That's why He sent Christ into the world to save us from it. That's how serious He takes this. I don't know how all these issues will be sorted out about loved ones being there. Its a great mystery. I do know that we must do everything we can to avoid it and warn others also. I just don't see how your suffering in hell would be any benefit to anyone else.

I hope and pray you will reconsider this.

 

Why do you wish that, Amazed?

I don't like it because its a bad place to end up in.

 

But if God did it, then is it not "good" by definition?

 

Why do you not like something that is 'good'?

 

Or do you not agree that the hell doctrine IS in fact 'good'?

Personally i don't like the doctrine because of what it implies but on the other hand i do think its the right and just thing because there must be a place for those who totally reject God.

 

 

And it MUST be a lake of fire? For all eternity? Your lack of compassion is amazing, amazed. You must be a real hoot to hang out with. If you could see your own child being thrown into hell, I know you would think differently. You make me sick. You take after your Father.

[Guest Net Eng]

Personally i don't like the doctrine because of what it implies but on the other hand i do think its the right and just thing because there must be a place for those who totally reject God.

 

 

I never understood that even when I was a Christian.

 

Why does an omni <fill in the blank> deity care if I don't believe in him ??

 

Seems like a petty thing for the ruler of the universe to be upset about.

[Guest amazed]

 

This is a difficult doctrine. I wish it were not in the Scriptures and the lips of Christ but it is and we have to deal with it. We all have choices to make and no choice is a choice. It is not God' desire to send anyone to hell but to be saved from it. That's why He sent Christ into the world to save us from it. That's how serious He takes this. I don't know how all these issues will be sorted out about loved ones being there. Its a great mystery. I do know that we must do everything we can to avoid it and warn others also. I just don't see how your suffering in hell would be any benefit to anyone else.

I hope and pray you will reconsider this.

 

Why do you wish that, Amazed?

I don't like it because its a bad place to end up in.

 

But if God did it, then is it not "good" by definition?

 

Why do you not like something that is 'good'?

 

Or do you not agree that the hell doctrine IS in fact 'good'?

Personally i don't like the doctrine because of what it implies but on the other hand i do think its the right and just thing because there must be a place for those who totally reject God.

 

 

And it MUST be a lake of fire? For all eternity? Your lack of compassion is amazing, amazed. You must be a real hoot to hang out with. If you could see your own child being thrown into hell, I know you would think differently. You make me sick. You take after your Father.

This is what Scripture says and yet no one has to suffer this fate. I don't want to see anyone thrown in it that's why i ask you to reconsider your beliefs.

[RankStranger]

This is what Scripture says and yet no one has to suffer this fate. I don't want to see anyone thrown in it that's why i ask you to reconsider your beliefs.

 

 

Amazed, let's say some crazed evil Muslim tells you that you have to immediately believe in Allah, or he'll shoot you. And you're hooked to a lie detector test, so he'll know whether or not you REALLY believe. Could you do it? Could you CHOOSE to believe in a god sold by a prophet who claimed to ride a winged horse around... just to save your ass? Could you just DECIDE to believe just so you don't get shot- even though you know better?

 

'Cause that's essentially what you're saying we should do.

[agnosticator]

Do what you will to talk your way out of it. There are many things i don't understand but i do know your rejection of salvation in Christ will result in tragic consquences for you and others if you persist. Do you think you are powerful enough to resist Him because you don't like the way Scripture describes our fallen condition?

 

You don't know me. I was a very serious christian for many years. I finally realized it is untrue after much prayer, bible study, and thought. It's not a matter of NOT LIKING the scriptures' wording, but seeing people and life as they really are. The human condition is not "fallen". Humans are not only capable of bad behavior, but also good.

[bdp]

i do know your rejection of salvation in Christ will result in tragic consquences for you and others

 

You don't 'know' it, you merely believe it. 'Salvation in Christ' is a fairytale, I don't need to be 'saved' from anything.

[Franko47]

 

 

Personally i don't like the doctrine because of what it implies but on the other hand i do think its the right and just thing because there must be a place for those who totally reject God.

 

 

Yes, tortured forever and ever, even if they were generally nice people.

 

 

So you believe that we infidels and apostates all deserve to be tortured ? Forever ????

[Vigile]

 

Personally i don't like the doctrine because of what it implies but on the other hand i do think its the right and just thing because there must be a place for those who totally reject God.

 

And this is where being a christian makes you a Worse person than you would otherwise be. You believe that there is justice in tyranny. Not just tyranny, but the worst type of injustice that could ever be imagined, torture for mere rejection; an eternity of torture for a mere lifetime of rejection. There's an ugly black hole in your moral compass.

[Guest amazed]

 

Personally i don't like the doctrine because of what it implies but on the other hand i do think its the right and just thing because there must be a place for those who totally reject God.

 

And this is where being a christian makes you a Worse person than you would otherwise be. You believe that there is justice in tyranny. Not just tyranny, but the worst type of injustice that could ever be imagined, torture for mere rejection; an eternity of torture for a mere lifetime of rejection. There's an ugly black hole in your moral compass.

Do you believe only those things that make you feel good?

[Vigile]

I believe only things that weigh in with a preponderance of the evidence.

 

If I did believe what you believe, I would also believe that a god who could create such a system is evil, sick and twisted beyond Stalin, beyond Hitler, beyond Nero.

[Guest Marty]

I'd like to start a topic on how ex Christians were abused but i won't be able to with all the other stuff going on.

 

I am convinced xtians do not read much of what we say. They scan the posts looking for somewhere they can try to interject scripture or jeebus, but they just do not listen to a damn thing we try to say.

 

Either that, or they are just stupid.

[Guest Marty]

 

Personally i don't like the doctrine because of what it implies but on the other hand i do think its the right and just thing because there must be a place for those who totally reject God.

 

What you describe is a dictator. Believe in and follow the line to the letter, without question, or die horribly. Your god seems no different than Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Lennin, etc etc.

 

For an omnipotent being, your god sure seems to have a weak ego. Hell, I'm just a mere mortal and I could care less if someone doesn't like me or believe what I tell them. I guess I'm better than your god?

[oddbird1963]

I'd like to start a topic on how ex Christians were abused but i won't be able to with all the other stuff going on.

 

I am convinced xtians do not read much of what we say. They scan the posts looking for somewhere they can try to interject scripture or jeebus, but they just do not listen to a damn thing we try to say.

 

Either that, or they are just stupid.

 

Marty,

 

I think that in Amazed's case you are certainly right.

 

He stated, essentially, that an atheist's worldview lacks credibility and viability because we have no reason to be charitable and no way to handle hardship and death.

 

Several ex-christians showed multiple examples of both. Yet I see no acknowledgment of that.

 

We corrected him on his claims every step of the way, but when we do, he ignores our answers or moves the goal post.

 

Yet, he seems to be claiming victory. Apparently he feels he is kicking our intellectual asses.

 

I think your head-banging emoticon says it all.

 

OB '63