Hearing The Voice Of Satan

[chosendarkness]

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<br />I'm out. I've been called crazy and insane for my spiritual experiences. I suppose, even in this sub-forum, experiences are bad. <br />I should fucking leave ex-c.<br />

<br />He did say he was bipolar, and if that site is right, it could just as easily be a symptom of him being bipolar.  I dunno i could be wrong, but you know, if there is a medical problem it needs to be addressed.<br />

<br /><br />It COULD be, but it's not HARMFUL, is it?????<br />and COULD BE isn't a way to make a diagnosis. <br />But most would rather me shut up while they all call him "mentally ill" and "insane." So go on and do that.<br />

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I like you! I see why you chose that name now because you probably get alot of people giving you shit because they don't understand. Christians told me over and over that I've 'chosen darkness' (satan) because I don't believe like them anymore. I'd rather choose darkness than arrogant asshole bullshit.

 

Spiritual experiences are real. I don't know what they are but I know it's not all just in the head. Just by what I've read, Googledotman's experience sounds real and helpful. I'd go with it.

[Guest Valk0010]

I'm out. I've been called crazy and insane for my spiritual experiences. I suppose, even in this sub-forum, experiences are bad.

I should fucking leave ex-c.

He did say he was bipolar, and if that site is right, it could just as easily be a symptom of him being bipolar. I dunno i could be wrong, but you know, if there is a medical problem it needs to be addressed.

 

It COULD be, but it's not HARMFUL, is it?????

and COULD BE isn't a way to make a diagnosis.

But most would rather me shut up while they all call him "mentally ill" and "insane." So go on and do that.

I was under the impression, the guy was looking for people who have DIFFERING opinions on it. And I am not someone saying he is schizophrenic. I would even find that insulting. If you don't like it, sorry. And honestly unless I am addressing you, you have no right to get hot at me. You know how much I have sided with you against "atheists." So if you wanna get hot at me, get hot at me. But if you wanna alienate yourself from me that is the perfect way to do it. I know that won't bother you, but I figured I would let you know.

 

When was a suggestion a crime. He can do whatever the hell he wants. But that doesn't stop me from having a opinion.

[Guest Valk0010]

 

 

Am I crazy? Did I have an unintended religious experience? Someone please help.

 

Now apparently luna he isn't just asking for confirmation or what your saying.

 

 

I doubt your crazy. Not sure what else I can say here.

I also said this to, but what that don't matter.

[chosendarkness]

, but the voice also seemed to understand that I was in a stressful period in my life at the time, and told me to wait a year before starting one. He said that if I did, I would find money and a boyfriend (I'm gay and currently broke).

 

 

 

I don't know about making money, but you'll definitely meet people if you start a group. And since it's not specifically Christian you might meet other gay guys. To make money though you have to have an idea exactly how the money is going to be made, then work your ass off for it. It won't seem like hard work though if it's something you enjoy. People are the most happy when they do work that involves helping other people. Any voice that tells you to get out and do something positive is good. I believe if you trust in yourself and the universe they'll guide and help you along the way.

[lunaticheathen]

I guess being in the THEISM AND SPIRITUALITY SECTION still means everything has a fucking medical explanation.

Ok, I'm going to open myself up here. And people will mock me.

I hear voices. I see spirits. I sense the presence of spirits and other entities. And I am not crazy, nor do I need anti-psychotic drugs, nor do I think there is anything wrong with it.

I did once think I was nuts. But nothing any of the entities told me was ever harmful. They don't direct me to skin puppies or eat babies or kill myself.

If all this voice is doing is directing you to get socially active and start a club, how is that ill or dangerous?

I don't know what, or where your voices are coming from. Most of the time, I'm not totally sure of my own. But I'm damn sure not going to call a doctor until I get directions to harm myself or others from them.

[Antlerman]

I think something important to bear in mind is functionality, not means. As I said in my post to the OP that if you understand these experiences as something helpful, than whatever the means it's simply a trait, or characteristic of functionality. Some people have six fingers, and they use it differently than some with only five but at the end of the day, they too drive a car or use a rake. My point is to be careful not to take anything as "facts", but rather means to understanding beyond them.

 

Another thought to add, that there is a fine line between genius and madness, or between enlightenment and insanity. How does one really tell such things? I would say its through the fruit of one's life. If insane, you will begin to deconstruct. If enlightened, you will shine. Hold all understanding with an open hand.

[chosendarkness]

I wouldn't have believed the experiences you have are real awhile back Lunatic. I was so stubborn after I deconverted that I even tried to ignore my own experiences for awhile. Then I started finding out other people have had the same thing happen. Finding that out changed my life. I've shot out of my body straight up into space, I've had something visit and speak to me a number of times, and I've felt real magic, and it's the most positive thing there is.

 

Sometimes I can kind of see where things are headed, and I have a suspicion that serious research on the 'supernatural' is going to get big in the not too distant future, and people are going to realize they were wrong about alot of things. The 'crazy' people are always the ones who make progress.

[chosendarkness]

If insane, you will begin to deconstruct. If enlightened, you will shine. Hold all understanding with an open hand.

What if people are actually experiencing something supernatural, yet deconstruct because subconsciously they believe the 'reality' that they're mentally ill, a kind of placebo effect? Our environment is the most powerful illusion there is. Maybe people who experience the supernatural also tend to suffer from mental problems for this reason?

[Guest Valk0010]

There is a fine line between being eccentric and flat out nuts. Most people for themselves know the difference as relates to there own lifes. I know where I would start thinking I was nuts. Other people think differenetly. As to the OP. I think you will know the difference.

[Xerces]

lunaticheathen:

 

I guess being in the THEISM AND SPIRITUALITY SECTION still means everything has a fucking medical explanation.

 

You know I hardly ever waltz into this region of the forums, but when someone has a genuine problem I don't think I should have to be silent just because it doesn't agree with your "spirituality".

 

 

Ok, I'm going to open myself up here. And people will mock me.

 

I'm not mocking anybody, but you're doing a fairly good job of doing that to yourself.

 

I hear voices. I see spirits. I sense the presence of spirits and other entities. And I am not crazy, nor do I need anti-psychotic drugs, nor do I think there is anything wrong with it.

 

Okay fair enough, but how do you think that makes you look admitting to hearing and seeing things, while not taking medication? This isn't some looking for a deeper connection through yoga, or meditation type shit, you're claiming to hear and see things, and you have nothing to show for it. I think you should know that before you brought your "beliefs' into this thread, nobody was insulting or criticizing them. What you did do was get mad and bring your "beliefs" up when I made a remark about your condoning him listening to the voices bouncing around up there.

 

I did once think I was nuts. But nothing any of the entities told me was ever harmful. They don't direct me to skin puppies or eat babies or kill myself.

 

You actually often talk about thoughts of harming yourself or committing suicide, I'm not blind I've seen the way you talk in the chat.

 

If all this voice is doing is directing you to get socially active and start a club, how is that ill or dangerous?

 

It isn't even about what it is telling him to do, its the fact that he is hearing voices at all that is concerning. He shouldn't just take it lightly, because it could get worse if he doesn't get help. Or what happens if the voices start telling him to do harmful things? Do you think he will remember all the great advice about how he shouldn't worry and just follow the voices? Get real.

 

I don't know what, or where your voices are coming from. Most of the time, I'm not totally sure of my own. But I'm damn sure not going to call a doctor until I get directions to harm myself or others from them.

 

 

I disagree, you should make an appointment asap.

[chosendarkness]

Or maybe some people are born able to have supernatural experiences, but the brain doesn't know how to deal with it and, it causes negative mental symptoms. Maybe some people are just more sensitive to the world around us and have no idea how to process it, and it causes reactions in parts of the mind. Or maybe in some cases there is an underlying mental illness, but that illness opens their mind to supernatural things. Maybe if we believed people instead of assuming they're just imagining, we'd find ways to help them instead of doping them up. Regardless, there are plenty of people who see strange things and have no negative mental symptoms whatsoever. I guess instead of crazy we usually call them religious. Once they start seeming a little weird, then we call them crazy.

 

Anyway I try to ignore close minded people are quick to judge things they don't understand, they're just like closed-minded Christians, and aren't worthy of even listening to.

[Galien]

Whatever voice I heard, I would just tell it to shut up. I just listen to my own voice now In the long run it is the only one that has been reliable.

[Antlerman]

If insane, you will begin to deconstruct. If enlightened, you will shine. Hold all understanding with an open hand.

What if people are actually experiencing something supernatural, yet deconstruct because subconsciously they believe the 'reality' that they're mentally ill, a kind of placebo effect? Our environment is the most powerful illusion there is. Maybe people who experience the supernatural also tend to suffer from mental problems for this reason?

I don't necessarily disagree with this, but it needs qualification and context. Someone experiencing the truly transcendent will always translate it however they have been adapted to. If they have no language for it to match, then it comes off as insane with the context where they have to talk about it. Again the line between visionary and madman is fine. However, as I said, it depends.

 

Could someone who was exposed to that having no context for themselves, turn that in on themselves as madness? Yes. But the tricky part is what is truly mad, as opposed to what only appears mad? Think the shaman, the saint, the sage... the madman. One point to digest is that the just because something appears irrational it doesn't make it at all identical. Non-rational can be either pre-rational, or transrational. How do you suppose to discern?

[JadedAtheist]

My mother has Schitzophrenia (or use to at least). The voices started off just talking to her. Simply conversations, occasionally they started saying things that made her laugh. Then, she started laughing a lot. You couldn't have a conversation with her without her bursting into laughter.

 

Eventually the voices started tormenting her, telling her awful things, making her cry, making her angry, making her defeated. It was at this point that worse things happened.

 

You don't need to seek medical treatment if you don't want to but to disregard it as a possible medical issue, especially If you've had similar instance that was diagnosed to be one, you are bringing yourself into possible harm.

 

It's best to get it checked out now early on because it could develop into something worse later on. It could be a "genuine religious experience with God" but I personally doubt it. When I use to visit my mother in the hospital I met a lot of people there who had a religious side to their mental problems. And trust me, they did have real mental problems aside from that.

[Guest Valk0010]

I post this with some hesitation since this is a sensitive subject. If I hurt feeling here sorry.

 

I know only what I would do if this happened to me. I would see a head doctor, but when it gets down to it, its up the the person who is experiencing the shit, how far they take it. I wouldn't wanna risk it getting worse personally. You have no right to think less of them as a person if they decide not to get there head checked in my opinion. I also don't think,Xerces we have the right to be judgemental, which is a line you crosses awhile ago. I dunno food for thought maybe. I wouldn't want to be thought badly for anything. I like advice but not disrespect as I think most people. It depends on the person.

[chosendarkness]

If insane, you will begin to deconstruct. If enlightened, you will shine. Hold all understanding with an open hand.

What if people are actually experiencing something supernatural, yet deconstruct because subconsciously they believe the 'reality' that they're mentally ill, a kind of placebo effect? Our environment is the most powerful illusion there is. Maybe people who experience the supernatural also tend to suffer from mental problems for this reason?

I don't necessarily disagree with this, but it needs qualification and context. Someone experiencing the truly transcendent will always translate it however they have been adapted to. If they have no language for it to match, then it comes off as insane with the context where they have to talk about it. Again the line between visionary and madman is fine. However, as I said, it depends.

 

Could someone who was exposed to that having no context for themselves, turn that in on themselves as madness? Yes. But the tricky part is what is truly mad, as opposed to what only appears mad? Think the shaman, the saint, the sage... the madman. One point to digest is that the just because something appears irrational it doesn't make it at all identical. Non-rational can be either pre-rational, or transrational. How do you suppose to discern?

I think if health professionals could find links between sensitivity to the spiritual and mental illness we might be able to better serve them. First, not just automatically assuming everyone who has experiences is delusional, and then compiling information and finding patterns. It would mean accepting the supernatural in the first place, which we're not likely to do any time soon. One thing I've noticed s we know almost nothing about the cause of mental illness. Perhaps it is partly spiritual and we need to approach it that way in order to really help people. I really believe we're missing out on a big part of understanding ourselves and the world by not researching the supernatural.

[Antlerman]

If insane, you will begin to deconstruct. If enlightened, you will shine. Hold all understanding with an open hand.

What if people are actually experiencing something supernatural, yet deconstruct because subconsciously they believe the 'reality' that they're mentally ill, a kind of placebo effect? Our environment is the most powerful illusion there is. Maybe people who experience the supernatural also tend to suffer from mental problems for this reason?

I don't necessarily disagree with this, but it needs qualification and context. Someone experiencing the truly transcendent will always translate it however they have been adapted to. If they have no language for it to match, then it comes off as insane with the context where they have to talk about it. Again the line between visionary and madman is fine. However, as I said, it depends.

 

Could someone who was exposed to that having no context for themselves, turn that in on themselves as madness? Yes. But the tricky part is what is truly mad, as opposed to what only appears mad? Think the shaman, the saint, the sage... the madman. One point to digest is that the just because something appears irrational it doesn't make it at all identical. Non-rational can be either pre-rational, or transrational. How do you suppose to discern?

I think if health professionals could find links between sensitivity to the spiritual and mental illness we might be able to better serve them. First, not just automatically assuming everyone who has experiences is delusional, and then compiling information and finding patterns.

I agree with this and I know that there are branches of psychology that strive to recognize the differences between mental illness and spiritual experience. The whole field of Transpersonal Pychology is one. But as much as I think it's important to recognize and discern the transpersonal, this is not at all to say we should conclude that mental illness is transpersonal. It's not necessarily. It's not one or the other, and symptoms of one may be mistaken as the other. Someone in a religious shamanic trance might be viewed as having a schizophrenic episode, however, someone might just be schizophrenic and religious feelings are part of the episode. I agree that it's important to recognize the difference between types of religious experience and mental illness and not conflate the two into one thing.

 

I do tend to think that if people are simply hearing voices throughout the day, that is outside the state of say, the subtle-level religious experience. If someone were in that state all the time, there would be strong tell-tale signs of that. They would for one be serene individuals. Subtle-level experiences may have visual or auditory experience as part of that, such as 'seeing the Christ', for instance. This can and does happen to people who otherwise have no history of mental illness, nor should it be taken as a symptom of it. Mystics the world over may experience such things as part of their transcendent experiences. But just because someone is seeing things or hearing voices, does not automatically make it part of a mystical experience. It could be a problem.

 

It would mean accepting the supernatural in the first place, which we're not likely to do any time soon.

I personally don't care for the term supernatural, but I get the gist of what you're saying and agree with it. I do tend to think that better health-care professionals may try to not be so fast to judge all religious experience as a symptom of mental illness; nor necessarily be careless in assuming that someone with a mental illness is in fact just having a religious experience. Really, I think it depends on how functional or dysfunctional the person is, their family histories, the contexts of when these things happen, etc.

 

One thing I've noticed s we know almost nothing about the cause of mental illness. Perhaps it is partly spiritual and we need to approach it that way in order to really help people. I really believe we're missing out on a big part of understanding ourselves and the world by not researching the supernatural.

Again, I don't think it's helpful to say we need to research the 'supernatural', as I think religious experience is very much natural. The error I see is the mindset that dismisses anything transcendent in terms of reductionist philosophies. "It's just the brain misfiring", etc. Is the brain involved in religious experience? Yes of course. Is it a malfunction? No. In a religious practice it may be an induced altered state that opens one to a certain clarity of mind through vision. But is someone out walking around and suddenly hear their cat talking to them in a human voice a misfire of the brain? I would tend to think it was.

 

I agree I think that to dismiss religious experience as a fluke of biology is as gutting to real reality, true nature, as calling love a 'freebe' of nature that has no purpose. I deeply disagree with both of those conclusions, and agree it impoverishes our understanding and our development.

[freespirit]

I have really appreciated the back and forth dialogue in this thread. Spiritual experiences are something I wholeheartedly believe in and have experienced and I am glad to see others here have them too. There is no way, in my thinking, that these experiences mean the need to see a doctor. On the flip side, I think there is a need to see a doctor sometimes. Maybe just as there is a healthy and unhealthy physical body, there is also a healthy and unhealthy spirituality. Unhealthy spirituality causes destruction and damage, but to deny spirituality at all is an error in my opinion. I don't talk much about my spiritual experiences because I find that I am more balanced when I keep things to myself. Otherwise, too many other voices enter into the equation ( meaning people who interject why my thinking must be off). The thinking is simply clearer when I think alone. To the poster of this thread....it seems to me that you are in the beginning stages of trying to follow the voice of God or whatever you want to call it, spirituality or what have you. I think you need to be careful. Honing these experiences takes time and discipline. You might try starting the group you are thinking about starting but remember that you are sifting and sorting your thoughts while you do so. Don't believe that the "voice" said anything hard and fast that you MUST obey that can't be modified. If God is patient, like we think he is, he won't wallop you if you don't get it right the first time. My two cents.

[Googledotman]

Good god (Not Jesus)! I leave Ex-christian.net for a couple of days and I get all of these wonderful replies. I did go see a doctor and he told me that sometimes when people, bipolar or not, are stressed out they hear voices. Looking back on it, I was rather stressed out that day. I did try to start the alternative spirituality club on campus by putting up signs, and heard even more voices attributed to stress with trying to get that started. I was having a rough time in college so I started hearing voices again. After a change in meds and 4 weeks of being away in school, I feel much better, NO MORE VOICES. I do hear James Earl Jones every now and then, but only extremely rarely. The voices were probably instigated by some type of stress, at least that is what my doctor said. Sorry if I freaked any of you guys out.

 

But it would be nice to have money and a boyfriend. If there was a Mirror of Erised in real life, that is what I would probably see. I would say pray for me in your own religious beliefs, but seeing the wild response I saw with this post, I will just say keep posting. I will lurk around these forums every now and then. Thank you for the outpour of support and posts.

 

-Googledotman

[Googledotman]

Oh! Before I forget, I had forgot to say that I told one of my Christian friends about the voices I heard and she said they were of Satan, hence the title of the post.

[Antlerman]

Oh! Before I forget, I had forgot to say that I told one of my Christian friends about the voices I heard and she said they were of Satan, hence the title of the post.

I was wondering if it was something like that. Leave it to the Christian to have all the easy answers! Glad to hear you're working things out.

[foolish girl]

Arguing with voices in your head does not constitute as crazy? Am I missing a memo on the new definition of what crazy is? Or are we all just trying to be politically correct here?

 

OP you aren't the unstable kind of crazy, you seem to me like you genuinely have the capability to tackle this issue affecting your life, and that is wonderful. Many people won't even admit they have a problem.

 

I'm not trying to be mean but I don't want to sugar coat something serious either. if I made a post like this I would want someone to give it to me bluntly.

 

Agreed. Don't Worry, X...I'll tell ya.

[Ouroboros]

Hearing voices is not so crazy after all: http://news.softpedia.com/news/Is-it-Normal-to-Hear-Voices-in-Your-Head-35953.shtml

[Antlerman]

Hearing voices is not so crazy after all: http://news.softpedia.com/news/Is-it-Normal-to-Hear-Voices-in-Your-Head-35953.shtml

That's really interesting. I like what this said in that link: "She also added: "It doesn't seem to be hearing voices in itself that causes the problem. What seems to be more important is how people go on to interpret the voices." " That's kind of to the point I made is that how serious or "Gospel Truth" someone takes them. It could just be a feature of the mind, like having an extra finger on each hand. It doesn't need to be some supernatural thing, and may be just the way the mind finds to process.

[Rev R]

Hearing voices is not so crazy after all: http://news.softpedia.com/news/Is-it-Normal-to-Hear-Voices-in-Your-Head-35953.shtml

 

I doubt that will deter our armchair mental health experts from diagnosing an alleged spiritual experience as insanity.