Guest Babylonian Dream Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 I'll have to agree with Ourobos here. Also, there is a tendacy for some atheists to see themselves as superior it seems, to the point where they believe that they're immune to the trappings of groupthink, and hence groupthink things and respond to threads with the herd mentality. It can be pretty intense, if you are a believer in something, to have like 10 people comparing what you believe to that of terrorism, Jim Jone's cult, and calling you delusional. I'm not saying people shouldn't make fair comparisons, but it can give the impression of people ganging up on the spiritualfolk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 My relationship with my gods is deeply personal and multifaceted. I suppose there are parts of my beliefs/practices/experiences that you would call deluded and abnormal. It would take years for me to properly hash out just a little of my spiritual life. And no, it's not all rational. Let me explain my view about "delusion" here. To take the analogy from computers, I consider delusions to be more of a software problem in our minds, while "insane" would be the category of a hardware problem. Insane can only be suppressed with medication, while delusions come and go over life and some are worse than others. A delusion to me is when we maintain a belief in something contrary to evidence. Basically, when the evidence doesn't support it but we continue to believe, we are deluding ourselves. And I see this a lot with Christians, but not necesssarily with all and every believer or in every spirituality. I think there might be something to deism, theism, buddhism, etc, and I'm keeping my mind open. But I don't consider praying to your cat for guidance to be natural, nor praying to a rock or a pice of wood for healing, but if you put two planks together in a cross and pray to it because it symbolizes a dead human, then we're supposed to accept it as normal. I don't. Do you see where I'm going with this and the difference I make? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 I am staying silent more on the particulars of my beliefs. It does seem like sharing them just gives certain small individuals a handle to beat me with. :\ And Im staying quiet about many things I believe as well, because I have bad experiences too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 small individuals Indeed, this is the sad state affairs in my opinion. It seems some people cannot stand, absolutely cannot stand, to see vulnerablity in others. Well that may not be quite accurrate. Perhaps they relish seeing vulnerability because they see an opportunity to wound someone. It's cowardly. (in my opinion) It's also the curse of Internet. Psychologically, we tend to behave different and let our guards down online. We expose our inner feelings more, and we attack other people's feelings as well. Things we wouldn't do in real-time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 .... some atheists .... ganging up on the spiritualfolk. That's about right. Uh... What's to be done about it? Humble the atheists? Shit. Live by die by. Institute a spiritual gaurdian? Shit. That's Jesus (pogo stick) Christ. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Institute a spiritual gaurdian? Shit. That's Jesus (pogo stick) Christ. We've kind of done that by declaring the "Spiritual" section as a safe zone for still believing Ex-Cs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Babylonian Dream Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 .... some atheists .... ganging up on the spiritualfolk. That's about right. Uh... What's to be done about it? Humble the atheists? Shit. Live by die by. Institute a spiritual gaurdian? Shit. That's Jesus (pogo stick) Christ. I stated a fact, that fact is true, right? I said nothing about infringing upon your right to speak your mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Institute a spiritual gaurdian? Shit. That's Jesus (pogo stick) Christ. We've kind of done that by declaring the "Spiritual" section as a safe zone for still believing Ex-Cs. I guess that makes A-man Jesus (pogo stick) Christ. ooh ah betalata bing bang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lunaticheathen Posted December 31, 2011 Author Share Posted December 31, 2011 Do you see where I'm going with this and the difference I make? I think I do. But I'm still the first to admit my beliefs are strange. I weird other pagans out with some things I believe. But I am always growing. Just hope no one is holding their breath hoping I "grow" into an atheist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 I stated a fact, that fact is true, right? I said nothing about infringing upon your right to speak your mind. Ah.. you seem to be misinterpreting me BD. I don't want to try and humble the atheists. Why? Because to try and humble them would destroy me. basically I don't want to be a spiritual gaurdian because the job is filled with all kinds of pitfalls. Does that help? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Institute a spiritual gaurdian? Shit. That's Jesus (pogo stick) Christ. We've kind of done that by declaring the "Spiritual" section as a safe zone for still believing Ex-Cs. I guess that makes A-man Jesus (pogo stick) Christ. ooh ah betalata bing bang Oh, cut it. We don't need that. Like I said, this section is moderated harder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 I think I do. But I'm still the first to admit my beliefs are strange. I weird other pagans out with some things I believe. But I am always growing. Good. Just hope no one is holding their breath hoping I "grow" into an atheist. I would never push anyone to become one. It has to be a person's own change, and I honestly don't think it's the best answer for everyone to become one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Oh, cut it. We don't need that. Yes sir. I knew it was wrong when I said it. I was out of bounds. Won't happen again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Oh, cut it. We don't need that. Yes sir. I knew it was wrong when I said it. I was out of bounds. Won't happen again. Appreciate that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Babylonian Dream Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 I stated a fact, that fact is true, right? I said nothing about infringing upon your right to speak your mind. Ah.. you seem to be misinterpreting me BD. I don't want to try and humble the atheists. Why? Because to try and humble them would destroy me. basically I don't want to be a spiritual gaurdian because the job is filled with all kinds of pitfalls. Does that help? Yes. I understand what you're saying. I still think its harsh to gang up on someone for what they believe, if what they believe is harmless to you. I don't do it, not to be all nice to their beliefs, but to respect people and to give them a bit of dignity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VacuumFlux Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 I don't think you're delusional. I have a different set of experinces than you do and have come to different conclusions, but I have finally reached the point where I don't flip out trying to figure out which "side" is "right". I think that attitude is a holdover from the fundy christianity I grew up with, where having the right doctrine was seen as more important than actually acting like a decent human being. I still have some issues myself over the whole materialism/spirituality thing from both directions. I still feel like I can be a materialist (as I define it) yet believe that the spiritual aspect of being human is important. I was scared of posting in the spiritualities forum for a while because I thought that I would be as unwelcome here as I would be admiting to my atheism in a Christian church. But that fear was unfounded, and I really appreciate the ability to compare notes on why everyone believes what they believe without too much fighting over who is right. And I have learned that many people have different experiences than I do, and the spiritual conclusions they draw from those experiences are completely rational. It would be nice to have a final answer on who is really right, but I doubt that will ever happen. I think if I worry too much about being right and not about being good, I'll end up being neither. So I'm left with a vague uncertainty, but I think that's ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Institute a spiritual gaurdian? Shit. That's Jesus (pogo stick) Christ. We've kind of done that by declaring the "Spiritual" section as a safe zone for still believing Ex-Cs. Is it a safe zone for bashing atheists? I feel like that is what this thread has become. I feel like I am being misrepresented but I can't defend myself because then I would be the bad guy. I get the same feeling in the chat room too. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 I feel like I am being misrepresented but I can't defend myself because then I would be the bad guy. I feel the same way for being a Southern white man. A few bad apples ruin the bunch. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Babylonian Dream Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 I don't think you're delusional. I have a different set of experinces than you do and have come to different conclusions, Not saying anyone is delusional, but I just wanted to point out that this isn't just how ordinary beliefs grounded in reality develope, its also how delusions can as well. Is it a safe zone for bashing atheists? I feel like that is what this thread has become. I feel like I am being misrepresented but I can't defend myself because then I would be the bad guy. I get the same feeling in the chat room too. Probably not, but I don't see how this has become a safezone for bashing atheists. The only person who said anything specifically about atheists, was me, and I most certainly wouldn't bash myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Is it a safe zone for bashing atheists? Yes. To some degree that is right. But consider that 10 other forums on this website is safe zones for atheists to bash everyone and anyone, so it's not so bad. If you have an issue with what is said in this forum, just bring it up in a topic in one of the other sections. I feel like that is what this thread has become. I feel like I am being misrepresented but I can't defend myself because then I would be the bad guy. I get the same feeling in the chat room too. Feel free to start a topic in the Lion's Den and have at it. It's not that you can't do it on this site, only that it's restricted in this particular section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 It's not that you can't do it on this site, only that it's restricted in this particular section. ooooooh, but I want to pee where I want to pee. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Is it a safe zone for bashing atheists? Yes. To some degree that is right. Thank you for the clarification. It is easier to accept knowing it is a rule. Feel free to start a topic in the Lion's Den and have at it. It's not that you can't do it on this site, only that it's restricted in this particular section. Thank you but I'm not going to do that. I think that is a battle that I will lose by winning. Instead I'm just going to let it go and hope the whole thing blows over. Maybe too much has already been made over it and I should let it die down. Again thank you for the clarification. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Ah ha haaaaa yaaaaaa ha Let wisdom reign! Let wisdom reign! Let my soul sing. And please let wisdom reign! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galien Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 It is pretty hard to let wisdom reign when the actual religion of some is being right. Doesn't matter what the actual issue is, in their mind they are just.....right. That assumption carries with it a strange kind of arrogance that allows the owner to completely disregard the other. You cannot reason with a person like that because if they challenge you it is because they are right, but if you challenge then it is because you are delusional. I run into that attitude here alot more often than I would like to. Believe what you want Luna, anyone who has an issue with it, or needs to put you down to make themselves feel superior has a lot of maturing to do. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legion Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 It is pretty hard to let wisdom reign when the actual religion of some is being right. This Galien. This. This is our bond. These words are now MINE! And they are yours. They are ours. We will add your biological and technological essence to our own. Really though, I will contemplate this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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