Reconciling The Violent God With A Loving God

[TheRedneckProfessor]

Scripture says nothing is impossible for God so if he wants to become flesh he can and his holiness can abide wherever he wants it to.  He also is perfectly capable of changing his mind which he often does in the OT as a result of someone's intercession. 

 

But we know that there are things that are impossible for god, so those scriptures can also be discounted as lies.

 

Why would you want to trust a god who constantly changes anyway?  Would you trust a person who told you one thing today and then told you the complete opposite next week?

[Guest tedbunnny]

 

 

 

crazy man, people have the ability to choose the right and wrong and most people have a fairly good grasp of what is good and what is evil, but human beings are naturally selfish and have desires that are very selfish sometimes a desire for pleasure, reputation, or power that in order to fulfill requires negative consequences to other people.

 

Humans evolved this way because it is necessary for our overall survival as a species.  The reason that the average Joe knows right from wrong is because there is an instinctive morality that evolved as we developed as a social species.  We know that helping each other, looking out for each other, treating others with courtesy as opposed to hostility--these are all preferable because they enhance our own chances of survival.

 

Likewise, people can also be complete dicks at times.  This is also a product of evolution.  If one of your ancestors 27,435 years ago hadn't selfishly hoarded food, you might not be here today.  Struggles for power and position are seen all throughout the animal kingdom.  This is because, generally speaking, a social species has a better chance of survival under the leadership of one member.

 

This is why humans feel the need to serve under a good leader; or, in your case, an imaginary one.

IF you read my OP you will find no where that I declared my statements to be true.  In fact, I simply mentioned where I'm at right now theistically and just very recently developed belief in God and I simply mentioned my favorite explanation of the God of the Old Testament.  It was explained much better than that to me but I summed it up in a few of my own words.

 

I admit that I am lukewarm and don't claim to know the truth so don't have much passion for preaching the scriptures because I myself agree with anyone who says that they contradict themselves.  I personally don't know how any Christian who has read the Bible could claim that it doesn't Contradict itself.

What does any of that have to do with the fact that evolution explains both morality and selfishness without the need of gods, saviors, and sins?

 

Scripture says nothing is impossible for God so if he wants to become flesh he can and his holiness can abide wherever he wants it to.  He also is perfectly capable of changing his mind which he often does in the OT as a result of someone's intercession.

 

But we know that there are things that are impossible for god, so those scriptures can also be discounted as lies.

 

Why would you want to trust a god who constantly changes anyway?  Would you trust a person who told you one thing today and then told you the complete opposite next week?

I cannot answer your question because at this time I believe in God. I don't however trust him, feel very close to him, understand him, or even follow his rules and precepts. I think I made that somewhat clear.

[Orbit]

 

You do realize you contradict yourself a lot, don't you?

Yeah...the theory of evolution contradicts itself as well.

 

So, please provide a list of statements where I contradicted myself.

 

Actually evolution does not contradict itself. I am one of the few liberal christians on this board, having been raised in it, and remaining in it for over 40 years. I understand where you are coming from. You think you've found a kinder, gentler Christianity.

 

You are doing what I did before I deconverted. You're cherry picking the Bible and following the parts you like. I did that a long time. I had a mental vision of a loving God until I decided to actually read Genesis again. I then re-read Paul. Doing both shocked me into the realization that the loving God I had in my head didn't exist in the Bible. Only in my head. If the Bible is the basis for your religion, you have to respect what it actually says.

 

I watched nonstampcollector's "Bible contradictions" on youtube and realized that the Bible is very, very fallible and contradictory. I researched early theology and saw how it was assembled hundreds of years after Jesus lived and bore little resemblance to early Christianity. I researched the stories of the Creation and the Flood and saw they were taken from older Sumerian stories. I researched evolution and cosmology and found the Biblical stories to be myth. The more you find out, the more you will be led away from a belief in God. But don't believe me--research for yourself.

 

You will find that Jesus said you get into heaven by following the commandments; elsewhere it says belief alone will get you there. Which is it? Do you really want to place a bet like that? Below is a short video that shows several important contradictions.

 

Watch this:

 

And this, by a respected Bible scholar, on the divinity of Jesus.

 

[Guest tedbunnny]

I'm busy at the moment so I will respond to the rest of you later.

 

I see repeatedly in the Bible God changes his mind as a result of intercession and I find a god who changes his mind and constantly changes to be uplifting.

 

it means that God is growing more tolerant and compassionate and understanding of us.

 

for instance, God doesn't like homosexuality or fornication.

 

however God has repeatedly seen homosexuals who are miserable and become happy when they fall in love with someone that they have genuine love for and companionship.

 

jesus never preached against homosexuality and even in the Old Testament there was far far more preaching against other vices and very little about homosexuality.

I've seen miserable men develop a gleam in their eye and a love for life when they get with a girl that they love deeply and are attracted to.

 

I think any father would rather have their child happy in a relationship as long as it's not a relationship where they are hurting each other but care deeply about each other and he knows that we are sexual creatures and it can be very healthy for our emotional and physical health to have a good lay and companionship.

[mymistake]

 

You do realize you contradict yourself a lot, don't you?

Yeah...the theory of evolution contradicts itself as well.

 

Uh . . . no.  It does not.  Perhaps you don't understand evolution?

[mymistake]

I'm busy at the moment so I will respond to the rest of you later.

 

I see repeatedly in the Bible God changes his mind as a result of intercession and I find a god who changes his mind and constantly changes to be uplifting.

 

it means that God is growing more tolerant and compassionate and understanding of us.

 

for instance, God doesn't like homosexuality or fornication.

 

however God has repeatedly seen homosexuals who are miserable and become happy when they fall in love with someone that they have genuine love for and companionship.

 

jesus never preached against homosexuality and even in the Old Testament there was far far more preaching against other vices and very little about homosexuality.

I've seen miserable men develop a gleam in their eye and a love for life when they get with a girl that they love deeply and are attracted to.

 

I think any father would rather have their child happy in a relationship as long as it's not a relationship where they are hurting each other but care deeply about each other and he knows that we are sexual creatures and it can be very healthy for our emotional and physical health to have a good lay and companionship.

 

 

Homosexuality isn't a vice.  If God didn't like homosexuals then it was a very strange thing for God to make people homosexual.  Kind of like how it is strange for God to put a foreskin on every single penis when God hates foreskin on penises.

 

The reason the Bible looks like a mismatched hodge-podge of several different religions from the late bronze age and early iron age crammed together by con artists is because that is exactly what the Bible is.  The Bible doesn't agree with itself because the men who wrote different parts of the Bible saw each other as false teachers from false religions.

 

If you are happy with your new found liberal Christianity then hanging out here isn't going to help you.

[DataLady]

Are you sure you're not just going back to Christianity because you want to be part of that group?  That is the one thing I miss about Christianity.  I also looked at other religions to see if I would fit in - because I feel I would like to be part of something.  However, there is no religion that quite fits me - I think I'll have to invent my own which would be a blend of Buddhism, Quakerism, Unitarianism with a sprinkling of Hinduism ;-)

 

That's the only thing I miss though - generally I feel a lot better and freer without Christianity, and can now truly be myself.  I no longer need to make excuses for the nastier bits of the Bible, or to say 'God works in mysterious ways, we won't know until we get to heaven'.  I can just have my own opinions and not filter them through what Scripture teaches.

 

I was a liberal Christian for a while before deconverting fully - it was the issue of homosexuality which made me become liberal as I couldn't believe that God would make gays and then expect them to be celibate for live, or to pretend to be heterosexual.  I just couldn't make liberal Christianity work for very long though, I'm not sure how people do it.

[DataLady]

Sorry, I meant 'celibate for life', not 'celibate for live'.

[1AcceptingAThiest1]

 

 

 

 

Hey tedbunny thanks for sharing your story. Will u be staying with us for awhile here at ex-c?

[DataLady]

By the way, I'm also puzzled about these supposed inconsistencies in the theory of evolution.  Even as a Christian, I always accepted evolution (of the theistic kind).  I could never bring myself to take the creation stories in Genesis literally.

[Orbit]

I'm busy at the moment so I will respond to the rest of you later.

 

I see repeatedly in the Bible God changes his mind as a result of intercession and I find a god who changes his mind and constantly changes to be uplifting.

 

it means that God is growing more tolerant and compassionate and understanding of us.

 

for instance, God doesn't like homosexuality or fornication.

 

however God has repeatedly seen homosexuals who are miserable and become happy when they fall in love with someone that they have genuine love for and companionship.

 

jesus never preached against homosexuality and even in the Old Testament there was far far more preaching against other vices and very little about homosexuality.

I've seen miserable men develop a gleam in their eye and a love for life when they get with a girl that they love deeply and are attracted to.

 

I think any father would rather have their child happy in a relationship as long as it's not a relationship where they are hurting each other but care deeply about each other and he knows that we are sexual creatures and it can be very healthy for our emotional and physical health to have a good lay and companionship.

You are making things up. You are making up in your head what you think God would think, but it's really just what YOU would think. There is no basis in the Bible for what you are saying.

[florduh]

You are making things up. You are making up in your head what you think God would think, but it's really just what YOU would think. There is no basis in the Bible for what you are saying.

 

That's what I've been saying. This is just another one-man-religion, totally fabricated to suit the user. Whatever.

[TheRedneckProfessor]

I'm busy at the moment so I will respond to the rest of you later.

 

I see repeatedly in the Bible God changes his mind as a result of intercession and I find a god who changes his mind and constantly changes to be uplifting.

 

it means that God is growing more tolerant and compassionate and understanding of us.

 

for instance, God doesn't like homosexuality or fornication.

 

however God has repeatedly seen homosexuals who are miserable and become happy when they fall in love with someone that they have genuine love for and companionship.

 

jesus never preached against homosexuality and even in the Old Testament there was far far more preaching against other vices and very little about homosexuality.

I've seen miserable men develop a gleam in their eye and a love for life when they get with a girl that they love deeply and are attracted to.

 

I think any father would rather have their child happy in a relationship as long as it's not a relationship where they are hurting each other but care deeply about each other and he knows that we are sexual creatures and it can be very healthy for our emotional and physical health to have a good lay and companionship.

One of the reasons the old testament god seems to change so much is because the stories in the old testament were originally written about many different gods.  After the Babylonian exile, the books were re-written to provide the basis for the monotheistic religion that would become Judaism.  Ravenstar is much more of an expert on this than I am, so I'll leave the finer points of old testament history to her.

[Guest tedbunnny]

 

I'm busy at the moment so I will respond to the rest of you later.

 

I see repeatedly in the Bible God changes his mind as a result of intercession and I find a god who changes his mind and constantly changes to be uplifting.

 

it means that God is growing more tolerant and compassionate and understanding of us.

 

for instance, God doesn't like homosexuality or fornication.

 

however God has repeatedly seen homosexuals who are miserable and become happy when they fall in love with someone that they have genuine love for and companionship.

 

jesus never preached against homosexuality and even in the Old Testament there was far far more preaching against other vices and very little about homosexuality.

I've seen miserable men develop a gleam in their eye and a love for life when they get with a girl that they love deeply and are attracted to.

 

I think any father would rather have their child happy in a relationship as long as it's not a relationship where they are hurting each other but care deeply about each other and he knows that we are sexual creatures and it can be very healthy for our emotional and physical health to have a good lay and companionship.

 

 

Homosexuality isn't a vice.  If God didn't like homosexuals then it was a very strange thing for God to make people homosexual.  Kind of like how it is strange for God to put a foreskin on every single penis when God hates foreskin on penises.

 

The reason the Bible looks like a mismatched hodge-podge of several different religions from the late bronze age and early iron age crammed together by con artists is because that is exactly what the Bible is.  The Bible doesn't agree with itself because the men who wrote different parts of the Bible saw each other as false teachers from false religions.

 

If you are happy with your new found liberal Christianity then hanging out here isn't going to help you.

 

The God of the BIble clearly changed his views on circumcision when he decided that and other pieces of the OT law no longer needed to be followed

[Orbit]

 

 

I'm busy at the moment so I will respond to the rest of you later.

 

I see repeatedly in the Bible God changes his mind as a result of intercession and I find a god who changes his mind and constantly changes to be uplifting.

 

it means that God is growing more tolerant and compassionate and understanding of us.

 

for instance, God doesn't like homosexuality or fornication.

 

however God has repeatedly seen homosexuals who are miserable and become happy when they fall in love with someone that they have genuine love for and companionship.

 

jesus never preached against homosexuality and even in the Old Testament there was far far more preaching against other vices and very little about homosexuality.

I've seen miserable men develop a gleam in their eye and a love for life when they get with a girl that they love deeply and are attracted to.

 

I think any father would rather have their child happy in a relationship as long as it's not a relationship where they are hurting each other but care deeply about each other and he knows that we are sexual creatures and it can be very healthy for our emotional and physical health to have a good lay and companionship.

 

 

Homosexuality isn't a vice.  If God didn't like homosexuals then it was a very strange thing for God to make people homosexual.  Kind of like how it is strange for God to put a foreskin on every single penis when God hates foreskin on penises.

 

The reason the Bible looks like a mismatched hodge-podge of several different religions from the late bronze age and early iron age crammed together by con artists is because that is exactly what the Bible is.  The Bible doesn't agree with itself because the men who wrote different parts of the Bible saw each other as false teachers from false religions.

 

If you are happy with your new found liberal Christianity then hanging out here isn't going to help you.

 

The God of the BIble clearly changed his views on circumcision when he decided that and other pieces of the OT law no longer needed to be followed

 

You are directly contradicting Jesus, who said the way to salvation was to follow the law, which to him meant the Torah and the OT laws.

[Guest tedbunnny]

Are you sure you're not just going back to Christianity because you want to be part of that group?  That is the one thing I miss about Christianity.  I also looked at other religions to see if I would fit in - because I feel I would like to be part of something.  However, there is no religion that quite fits me - I think I'll have to invent my own which would be a blend of Buddhism, Quakerism, Unitarianism with a sprinkling of Hinduism ;-)

 

That's the only thing I miss though - generally I feel a lot better and freer without Christianity, and can now truly be myself.  I no longer need to make excuses for the nastier bits of the Bible, or to say 'God works in mysterious ways, we won't know until we get to heaven'.  I can just have my own opinions and not filter them through what Scripture teaches.

 

I was a liberal Christian for a while before deconverting fully - it was the issue of homosexuality which made me become liberal as I couldn't believe that God would make gays and then expect them to be celibate for live, or to pretend to be heterosexual.  I just couldn't make liberal Christianity work for very long though, I'm not sure how people do it.

Yes I kind of am embracing Christianity to stay with this group.

 

Guilty as charged.  You will get honesty from me at the price of me recognizing you will have less respect of me when I do.

 

WHy am I a lukewarm Christian?  Well, because I can't be fervent about something that I can't prove is true and that I don't entirely see as just.  However, I have met some amazing people recently that I believe have the grace of God in their lives.  ONe of them was a criminal at one time and a meth addict.  He now has a high paying job as a contractor but the majority of his work that he does is hours and hours and hours of helping people and he doesnt get paid.

 

He devotes many hours to giving clothing and food to the poor.  He also devotes a lot more time and gas money driving people all over the place that lack transportation.  He also takes homeless people into his house even when they are piss drunk until they can find some sort of treatment center or transitional housing.

 

He is from what I see an excellent Father of four children.  This man also had a shitty marriage where his wife would verbally abuse him, physically beat him, break things, and throw things at him.  Yet I don't detect any bitterness in him but compassion for his Ex Wife's brokenness.

 

I have never once seen the guy get angry or belligerant.  I feel like I see God...or at least something I really admire that I believe to be the grace of God.  If not God at work, this is the epitome of a good person that I have seen compared to other Christians.  And it largely has to do with his faith in God which is the center of his life. I also have met his pastor who appears to be amazing, educated, influential, and struggled with many of the same issues that I have with Christian Theology and Scripture.

 

It moves me and yes I have a much better life already as a result of belonging to this "group" and life rebuilding faith based program. 

[mymistake]

 

 

I'm busy at the moment so I will respond to the rest of you later.

 

I see repeatedly in the Bible God changes his mind as a result of intercession and I find a god who changes his mind and constantly changes to be uplifting.

 

it means that God is growing more tolerant and compassionate and understanding of us.

 

for instance, God doesn't like homosexuality or fornication.

 

however God has repeatedly seen homosexuals who are miserable and become happy when they fall in love with someone that they have genuine love for and companionship.

 

jesus never preached against homosexuality and even in the Old Testament there was far far more preaching against other vices and very little about homosexuality.

I've seen miserable men develop a gleam in their eye and a love for life when they get with a girl that they love deeply and are attracted to.

 

I think any father would rather have their child happy in a relationship as long as it's not a relationship where they are hurting each other but care deeply about each other and he knows that we are sexual creatures and it can be very healthy for our emotional and physical health to have a good lay and companionship.

 

 

Homosexuality isn't a vice.  If God didn't like homosexuals then it was a very strange thing for God to make people homosexual.  Kind of like how it is strange for God to put a foreskin on every single penis when God hates foreskin on penises.

 

The reason the Bible looks like a mismatched hodge-podge of several different religions from the late bronze age and early iron age crammed together by con artists is because that is exactly what the Bible is.  The Bible doesn't agree with itself because the men who wrote different parts of the Bible saw each other as false teachers from false religions.

 

If you are happy with your new found liberal Christianity then hanging out here isn't going to help you.

 

The God of the BIble clearly changed his views on circumcision when he decided that and other pieces of the OT law no longer needed to be followed

 

 

 

Sure, if by "God of the Bible" you mean the man who called himself Paul the Apostle.  Paul declared that many of God's laws were completely irrelevant.  It begs the question of who was this mere mortal who would dare to rebuke a God but it is okay because deep down inside Paul understood exactly what a God is.  That is why Paul had the freedom to make all those changes.

[florduh]

The God of the BIble clearly changed his views...

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.

 

 

 

 

God is not man, that he should lie, or a son of man, that he should change his mind. Has he said, and will he not do it? Or has he spoken, and will he not fulfill it?

 

 

 

Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change.

 

 

God is not man, that he should lie, or a son of man, that he should change his mind.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So.....what religion are you following and what god do you believe in? Clearly your views have nothing to do with the Bible or Christianity.

 

 

 

 

[Guest tedbunnny]

 

 

Hey tedbunny thanks for sharing your story. Will u be staying with us for awhile here at ex-c?

 

Undecided.  I'll be here for another 24 hours and will see if I care to stay for another day after that.  One day at a time.   I certainly have no commitment and will not convert anyone nor did I come here to.

 

I had a conversion about a week ago and thought I'd share.

[Guest tedbunnny]

 

I'm busy at the moment so I will respond to the rest of you later.

 

I see repeatedly in the Bible God changes his mind as a result of intercession and I find a god who changes his mind and constantly changes to be uplifting.

 

it means that God is growing more tolerant and compassionate and understanding of us.

 

for instance, God doesn't like homosexuality or fornication.

 

however God has repeatedly seen homosexuals who are miserable and become happy when they fall in love with someone that they have genuine love for and companionship.

 

jesus never preached against homosexuality and even in the Old Testament there was far far more preaching against other vices and very little about homosexuality.

I've seen miserable men develop a gleam in their eye and a love for life when they get with a girl that they love deeply and are attracted to.

 

I think any father would rather have their child happy in a relationship as long as it's not a relationship where they are hurting each other but care deeply about each other and he knows that we are sexual creatures and it can be very healthy for our emotional and physical health to have a good lay and companionship.

You are making things up. You are making up in your head what you think God would think, but it's really just what YOU would think. There is no basis in the Bible for what you are saying.

 

I'm not making things up but I am blending my conscience of what is right and wrong and what Scripture says, which is what every theologion does as well though Im not a Theologian and I only read the Bible all the way through once and don't care to do it again. 

 

But here is some of my basis.  John 13 ³⁴ “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. ³⁵ By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.”  That was his primary commandment and one of his last things he said to his disciples before getting arrested.

 

He said All the Law and the Prophets hang on that commandment. 

 

So what is God's idea of love.  He went on to say what it is.  THose who entered paradise were those who eased the suffering of others:

 

Matthew 25

³¹ “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. ³² All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. ³³ He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

³⁴ “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. ³⁵ For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, ³⁶ I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

³⁷ “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? ³⁸ When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? ³⁹ When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

⁴⁰ “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

[Ravenstar]

Finding people who have 'changed' for the better is not that hard, and definitely not just a Christian thing…. go to any meeting of AA, NA or any other group/peer counselling thing.. weight watchers, whatever. Even EVERY religion on the planet has tons of people who've changed for the better because of… name it, it's been claimed. Scientology thrives on this actually.

 

It's amazing what people can do when they think they can, and with a little support. We are social animals, and do best when we work together.

 

The Old Testament is a myriad of syncretism (absorption of many religious concepts from the entire Mediterranean) starting with late paleolithic/early Egyptian and Canaanite theologies. THAT is why Yahweh seems to change his mind, also because he has evolved as society has.

 

So interesting that Christ was egalitarian (a Greek concept) during the HELLENISTIC period… that Japhtheth sacrificed his daughter during a time when that was a common practice, and that the Hebrews became conquerors (maybe) during a time of much turmoil and warfare in the middle east. You see nothing of compassion for others (outside the tribal unit) early on, but later there is (The good samaritan is one example) because the ROMAN world was multicultural… and the early Hebrews were insular. Do you get it yet?

 

The early Hebrews were also POLYTHEISTIC… and Asherah (Yahweh's consort) was prevalent until quite late.. funny, she was El's consort earlier (Canaanite father god) and also Baal's consort as well. Her figurines look almost identical to Astarte's or Innanna/Ishtar's  even... Ninhursag's. Same stance, same symbology…hmm….

 

You can NOT understand the Old Testament without understanding the culture of the area, and the beliefs that were prevalent at the time. Seeing it from our point of view is pretty much useless… because their mindset and world view was very different from ours.

[Guest tedbunnny]

 

The God of the BIble clearly changed his views...

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.

 

 

 

 

God is not man, that he should lie, or a son of man, that he should change his mind. Has he said, and will he not do it? Or has he spoken, and will he not fulfill it?

 

 

 

Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change.

 

 

God is not man, that he should lie, or a son of man, that he should change his mind.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So.....what religion are you following and what god do you believe in? Clearly your views have nothing to do with the Bible or Christianity.

 

 

 

 

Well, Im not denying that I don't understand these things.  Any translator will tell you a good percentage of words lose their meaning in translation.  God clearly does change his mind.  I can give you many examples.  It is undeniable that God changes his mind.  He was going to destroy Israel for their sins and moses interceded for them and it said God repented.

 

Christ also did away with the eye for an eye and tooth for a tooth. He also said let he who is without sin cast the first stone.  He also said prostitutes are entering the Kingdom of God ahead of the Religious people. But yes, the contradictions that I see in Scripture are my biggest stumbling block to being fervent or confident in my beliefs.

[Lucy]

The God of the BIble clearly changed his views on circumcision when he decided that and other pieces of the OT law no longer needed to be followed

 

 

This changed because most adult men don't want to convert to a religion that requires a very painful and possibly life threatening procedure. Paul wanted to convert the uncircumcised gentiles so he had to alter his religion to be more appealing. That's why a lot of OT laws were dropped.

 

The bible is not written directly by god, nor does it claim to be. It's written by people who claim to have god's revelations. If god is changing his mind all the time and using people to communicate these changes, then how do you decide whose revelation to trust? Only the people in the bible? Muhammad made a lot of claims about god as well. Was the Quran god changing his mind again or just Muhammad pushing his views on people while claiming it to be god's revelation?

 

If god is changing his mind and using people to reveal his new thoughts, then there is no real way to decide who is telling us god's views and who is just using god's name to push their views onto others.

[Orbit]

 

 

I'm busy at the moment so I will respond to the rest of you later.

 

I see repeatedly in the Bible God changes his mind as a result of intercession and I find a god who changes his mind and constantly changes to be uplifting.

 

it means that God is growing more tolerant and compassionate and understanding of us.

 

for instance, God doesn't like homosexuality or fornication.

 

however God has repeatedly seen homosexuals who are miserable and become happy when they fall in love with someone that they have genuine love for and companionship.

 

jesus never preached against homosexuality and even in the Old Testament there was far far more preaching against other vices and very little about homosexuality.

I've seen miserable men develop a gleam in their eye and a love for life when they get with a girl that they love deeply and are attracted to.

 

I think any father would rather have their child happy in a relationship as long as it's not a relationship where they are hurting each other but care deeply about each other and he knows that we are sexual creatures and it can be very healthy for our emotional and physical health to have a good lay and companionship.

You are making things up. You are making up in your head what you think God would think, but it's really just what YOU would think. There is no basis in the Bible for what you are saying.

 

I'm not making things up but I am blending my conscience of what is right and wrong and what Scripture says, which is what every theologion does as well though Im not a Theologian and I only read the Bible all the way through once and don't care to do it again. 

 

But here is some of my basis.  John 13 ³⁴ “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. ³⁵ By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.”  That was his primary commandment and one of his last things he said to his disciples before getting arrested.

 

He said All the Law and the Prophets hang on that commandment. 

 

So what is God's idea of love.  He went on to say what it is.  THose who entered paradise were those who eased the suffering of others:

 

Matthew 25

³¹ “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. ³² All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. ³³ He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

³⁴ “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. ³⁵ For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, ³⁶ I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

³⁷ “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? ³⁸ When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? ³⁹ When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

⁴⁰ “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

 

This is called "cherry picking". You are picking out the verses that suit your view, and ignoring what contradicts your views.

[mymistake]

 

 

So what is God's idea of love.  

 

 

 

God loves you so much that God created hell just in case you don't love him back.