Christians: Put Up Or Shut Up!

[RonVonDahm]

Seeing as this test, for any god of any religion to miraculously heal the amputated toes, was proposed in the year 2007 it is now 2010, nearly a full three years later, and no supernatural being has found it in their "all-encompassing ever-present loving heart" to heal on single foot on one single human, I propose the test be closed declaring ExC the victors and all religious, god-fearing people's of the world pussies for fearing a nonexistent being, liars for preaching against false-truths yet professing hundreds every sunday morning, and losers for completely missing the point of life.

 

Test complete.

 

Checkmate.

[Hydroman74]

And no amount of persecution of Evangelical Christianity by other religions (Islam, Hindu, paganism, etc) or governments (Roman Empire, Ottoman Empire, communism, etc), has stopped the steady progression of the Gospel's presence throughout the Earth.

 

Has the persecution of christians and governments against Islam, Hinduism, paganism, etc. stopped the growth of said beliefs? Nope. What's your point?

 

And wherever Christianity has spread, it has delivered a beneficial effect to that culture - as witnessed by the tribal wars which have significantly decreased in South America and Indonesia.

So I'm watching the news this morning and they are talking about Christians in Africa who have killed several people this week because they are trying to establish a democracy based on the 10 commandments.

 

You talk about the progression of the gospel's presence throughout the earth and seem to be in awe of it. Well, if you had the tip of a sword pointed at your throat, you'd probably accept it too. That's what happened in the history of christianity. That's how it spread, via force. This is history.

 

Americans claim to have been founded upon christian principles. Do you remember that the reason people of Europe fled to this country? It was for freedom to express what they believe without wanting to be persecuted by those who believe in the christian god. Well, they come here so they can have this freedom of expression, but what do they do? What happened to all the true inhabitants of this land? We wiped them out!! Praise baby jebus! Poor Native Americans. Then guess what? We began persecuting each other over religious beliefs here too.

[Shyone]

You talk about the progression of the gospel's presence throughout the earth and seem to be in awe of it. Well, if you had the tip of a sword pointed at your throat, you'd probably accept it too. That's what happened in the history of christianity. That's how it spread, via force. This is history.

Spreading Christianity by the Sword

 

For some centuries, Europeans had described non-Christian regions of the world as in partibus infidelium, assuming that God meant Christian nations to take dominion if possible. And since Europe had been the world’s most war-torn continent for several centuries, it had a substantial edge in the arts of war, with which to export Christianity by the sword.

 

Did you know there was an American Inquisition?

 

 

 

From other articles:

 

Paganism was deeply rooted in the minds of hereditary landowners, as the whole social system was largely founded upon its principles. Using fire and sword rather than persuasion, Olaf converted the whole of Norway in his short reign of five years. When he died in a naval battle, c. 1000, many of Olaf's subjects were Christians in name only.

 

Charlemagne was an extremely energetic king who spent a large part of his reign campaigning on his empire's ever widening frontiers: in Italy against the Lombards, in Spain against the Muslims, in the east against the Avars, and in Germany against the Saxons whom he forcibly converted to Christianity at the point of the sword.

 

Military superiority: Romans were superior to Germans and Franks who were superior to other outliers. Europeans were superior to Indians and Native Americans.

 

Shit rolls downhill.

[Guest Goathead]

I have to say I fully agree with checkmate! Just because there's no evidence for evolution doesn't mean Christians have to be so damn argumentative against it!

[Cracked]

I have to say I fully agree with checkmate! Just because there's no evidence for evolution doesn't mean Christians have to be so damn argumentative against it!

I thought there was lots of evidence.

[Deva]

I have to say I fully agree with checkmate! Just because there's no evidence for evolution doesn't mean Christians have to be so damn argumentative against it!

 

There is a truckload of evidence for evolution.

[Guest Goathead]

There is a truckload of evidence for evolution.

 

Haha that's a good one =)

[Ouroboros]

There is a truckload of evidence for evolution.

 

Haha that's a good one =)

 

There is.

 

Read: http://talkorigins.org/faqs/comdesc/

[Guest Goathead]

I think perhaps you could learn from this: http://www.timecube.com/

[Discordia]

Well... either I lack the mental capacity to understand that Time Cube page or that dude is a raving lunatic. Maybe its a combination of both. But why a cube (hexahedron)? Why not a dodecahedron or an icosahedron or a rhombic triacontahedron?

[Ouroboros]

I think perhaps you could learn from this: http://www.timecube.com/

Raging lunatic. Maybe even schizophrenic.

 

And a crazy man's words are relevant how?

 

Perhaps you could learn from taking a class in biological anthropology?

[Guest Goathead]

And a crazy man's words are relevant how?

 

Perhaps you could learn from taking a class in biological anthropology?

 

So all you can do is throw insults instead of address the point? Why don't you go back to your high-school English class? They might teach you some debating tactics.

In the meantime, I feel that there is more evidence, (and from more reputable sources) for Timecube than there is for your evolution if this is the best you can argue it. Thanks.

[Ouroboros]

And a crazy man's words are relevant how?

 

Perhaps you could learn from taking a class in biological anthropology?

 

So all you can do is throw insults instead of address the point? Why don't you go back to your high-school English class? They might teach you some debating tactics.

I got A+ in honors English classes in college, up to the highest level. But that doesn't matter because when I debate here, I'm playing around. It's not a formal debate. Especially when I'm debating with a troll like you. I have not problem calling what I see even if it offends you.

 

Besides, the "crazy man" was a reference to the author of "Time Cube," not you. He's crazy. But as it so happens, I think you're a bit of a wanker too. You love the attention you get, don't you?

 

I've taken classes and learned how to research and evaluate the quality of sources, and his website screams crazy. So I'm actually using the skills, knowledge, and training I got in multiple classes involving research and study of source materials.

 

In the meantime, I feel that there is more evidence, (and from more reputable sources) for Timecube than there is for your evolution if this is the best you can argue it. Thanks.

You wanna bet?

 

I have access to a couple of million research papers and documents through the college campus library.

 

And I could talk to the professors in anthropology and biology to see if they agree with you.

 

Here is a quote from the Cube man's website:

Americans are dumb, educated ONE

 

stupid and they worship ONEism Evil.

 

It is not immoral to kill believers, for the stupid bastards EVOLVE from son

 

or daughter who precedes them. NOT one damn human adult has ever been

 

created - for ONLY babies are CREATED - and every adult has within them the LIFE given by children who DIE to give-up their lives to their parent

 

image - so their mom or Dad can live. Adults are EVIL to deny they evolved from children - and claim their adult EGO image is a god likeness. Such damn evil AMERICANS should have their tongue cut out for the heinous hoax they are perpetrating upon their own children. I know now why the Jews

 

deserved their holocaust - worshipping their own adult EGO image as a damn god whil ignoring and betraying the very children who sacrifice their LIFE

 

so their Moms and Dads could Live. There is nothing godly about stupid

 

and evil adults who betray their own children who gave them Life. I AM

 

WISER THAN ANY DAMN MAN OR GOD WHO EVER EXISTED. IF THE

 

HALF AND HALF CO-CREATED

 

JESUS RETURNS TO EARTH, I WILL PERSONALLY KILL THE BASTARD MYSELF. ALL CREATION OCCURS

 

BETWEEN AND AS OPPOSITES. YOU DUMB-ASS, EARTH, THE UNIVERSE

 

AND EVERY LIVING THING IN IT

He's not even making an argument or support his view. He is also using ad hominems. So why the fuck do you think he has anything valid to say? (Besides that you're just a troll, craving for attention, lurking to find stuff to attack, and never, ever, really contribute anything valuable?)

[Guest Goathead]

I got A+ in honors English classes in college, up to the highest level. But that doesn't matter because when I debate here, I'm playing around.

 

Oh, I see. So you're saying you *have* all the qualifications of a skilled debater but you're just... "playing around" here, so we shouldn't expect to see any of these said talents from you. All right. Thanks for clearing that up for me. I apologize as I thought you were being serious.

 

Especially when I'm debating with a troll like you. I have not problem calling what I see even if it offends you.

 

I actually *do* find this somewhat offensive, however I'll let it slide. Obviously you've been tackled into a logical corner and are using ad hominem attacks and crying "troll" in an attempt to force your own pathetic insecurities on honest members of the debate.

 

I'm actually using the skills, knowledge, and training I got in multiple classes involving research and study of source materials.

 

Well with a response like this:

 

And a crazy man's words are relevant how?

 

Perhaps you could learn from taking a class in biological anthropology?

 

I can't help but say "Yes Ouroboros you were right all along. You clearly seem like someone who got A+ grades throughout their English classes and knows how to maturely and rationally address the subject at hand." (In case you're too caught up in playing around to notice: this is sarcasm.)

[Ouroboros]

Oh, I see. So you're saying you *have* all the qualifications of a skilled debater but you're just... "playing around" here, so we shouldn't expect to see any of these said talents from you. All right. Thanks for clearing that up for me. I apologize as I thought you were being serious.

You trolls. You're too funny.

 

I actually *do* find this somewhat offensive, however I'll let it slide. Obviously you've been tackled into a logical corner and are using ad hominem attacks and crying "troll" in an attempt to force your own pathetic insecurities on honest members of the debate.

Pfft. You're not attempting any honest debate at all. So far, you have portrayed a perfect troll. Nothing you've done have convinced me that you're serious.

 

Btw, are you Ray?

 

]

I can't help but say "Yes Ouroboros you were right all along. You clearly seem like someone who got A+ grades throughout their English classes and knows how to maturely and rationally address the subject at hand." (In case you're too caught up in playing around to notice: this is sarcasm.)

You haven't provided anything serious or scientific so far, so why should I take you serious?

 

So reveal your identity. Are you Gene Ray, the Cube Lunatic? Or are you just a regular troll?

 

 

You know, the first step is denial. We have revealed that you are a troll, and you must of course deny it. Good for you. 10 points for trollish authenticity.

[Guest Goathead]

I got A+ in honors English classes in college, up to the highest level. But that doesn't matter because when I debate here, I'm playing around.

 

Oh, I see. So you're saying you *have* all the qualifications of a skilled debater but you're just... "playing around" here, so we shouldn't expect to see any of these said talents from you. All right. Thanks for clearing that up for me. I apologize as I thought you were being serious.

 

Especially when I'm debating with a troll like you. I have not problem calling what I see even if it offends you.

 

I actually *do* find this somewhat offensive, however I'll let it slide. Obviously you've been tackled into a logical corner and are using ad hominem attacks and crying "troll" in an attempt to force your own pathetic insecurities on honest members of the debate.

 

I'm actually using the skills, knowledge, and training I got in multiple classes involving research and study of source materials.

 

Well with a response like this:

 

And a crazy man's words are relevant how?

 

Perhaps you could learn from taking a class in biological anthropology?

 

I can't help but say "Yes Ouroboros you were right all along. You clearly seem like someone who got A+ grades throughout their English classes and knows how to maturely and rationally address the subject at hand." (In case you're too caught up in playing around to notice: this is sarcasm.)

[Ouroboros]

Posting the same response twice somehow makes it better?

[Checkmate]

And a crazy man's words are relevant how?

 

Perhaps you could learn from taking a class in biological anthropology?

 

So all you can do is throw insults instead of address the point? .......

A-hem! Speaking of addressing the point...

 

Why is it that every time I return to check the status of MY thread I find that it's been hi-jacked by some troll spouting nonsense?!?

 

Once again: THIS thread is for Christians to show us a MIRACLE, thus providing evidence that what they say about god/Jesus is true. And failing that, simply shut the fuck up and go away. Don't throw childish temper tantrums and stamp your little feet, accusing the big, bad atheists of being liars and deceivers who won't believe "even if the dead were to rise from the grave", yadda, yadda, yadda.

 

Put up, or shut up.

 

Not a difficult concept to follow, people.

[charley]

I get pretty pissed, too. I work at a large corporation where religiosity is actually incorporated into their corporate mission statement. How's that for in-your-face nonsense! Also, there is time set aside for the righteously obsessed to gather together in daily prayer groups and together fight off the demonic influences of thought and reason ..... christian soldiers valiantly pressing forward. It's enough to make you sick. But, these cultural relics truly stratify the population. Try to find ways to make these people useful and productive in your life, or at least find some humor in their antics, is my unsolicited advice to you.

[Perfessor]

Actually arguing with one of them is like talking to a wall. Don't bother. They just walk away feeling superior because you just aren't gettin' it!

[Thought2Much]

Hey, this thread has been revived after being dead for over a year! It's a miracle!

[Lilith666]

I'm tired. I'm tired of all the yapping and yakking, back and forth, he said, she said, bullshit of Evangelical, Liberal and Fundamentalist Christians. I'm tired of all the baseless assertions, suppositions and mind bending rationalizations. I'm tired of arguing against YOUR ridiculous doctrines that don‘t even merit a retarded gopher’s consideration.

 

But most of all, I'm tired of all the lame Christian excuses. You promise "answers" and then proffer up "I don't know." You claim that your God can do anything, but when pressed for a demonstration you retreat behind ridiculous excuses. I'm drowning under an embarrassing Christian tsunami of "I don't know"s and “God‘s ways are not our wayâ€s.

 

So here it is, real simple: PUT UP or fucking SHUT UP!

 

Robert G. Ingersoll, in a more civil tone, once said...

 

“The church wishes us to believe. Let the church, or one of its intellectual saints, perform a miracle, and we will believe. We are told that nature has a superior. Let this superior, for one single instant, control nature, and we will admit the truth of your assertions."

..........

"We have heard talk enough. We have listened to all the drowsy, idealess, vapid sermons that we wish to hear. We have read your Bible and the works of your best minds. We have heard your prayers, your solemn groans and your reverential ‘amens.’ All these amount to less than nothing. We want one fact. We beg at the doors of your churches for just one little fact. We pass our hats along your pews and under your pulpits and implore you for just one fact. We know all about your moldy wonders and your stale miracles. We want a 'this year's fact'. We ask only one. Give us one fact for charity. Your miracles are too ancient. The witnesses have been dead for nearly two thousand years. Their reputation for 'truth and veracity' in the neighborhood where they resided is wholly unknown to us. Give us a new miracle, and substantiate it by witnesses who still have the cheerful habit of living this world. Do not send us to Jericho to hear the winding horns, nor put us in the fire with Shadrach, Meshech and Abednego. Do not compel us to navigate the sea with Captain Jonah, nor dine with Mr. Ezekiel. There is no sort of use in sending us foxhunting with Samson. We have positively lost all interest in that little speech so eloquently delivered by Balaam's inspired donkey. It is worse than useless to show us fishes with money in their mouths, and call our attention to vast multitudes stuffing themselves with five crackers and two sardines. We demand a new miracle, and we demand it now. Let the church furnish at least one, or forever hold her peace.".........."The Gods" 1872

 

I don’t argue or debate religion anymore. The rest of you can do so if you like, but I won’t be joining you. I won’t argue or discuss god/Jesus for the exact same reason I won’t argue or discuss Santa/Frosty the Snowman. Self-evident, puerile tripe needs no intelligent refutation. It’s a pointless and silly endeavor to me. Besides, humoring idiots only serves to encourage them to keep babbling. I prefer to lambaste, lampoon, laugh and walk away.

 

I’m not interested in hearing/reading your mindless “reasons†for wishful thinking (a.k.a. “Beliefâ€). Your childish insistence that “something†must have happened, because you say so and you “believe†it, will fall on deaf ears and I will call you an idiot.

 

Talk is cheap. I don’t want to hear anymore tired excuses for why your God apparently can’t or won’t perform on command today as he did so effortlessly yesterday. What happened? He run out of “Jesus Juice†or something? Used up his quota resurrecting himself and converting Paul? Does God need some Viagra™? Or is God preserving his limited resources for when the time comes to fuck us over during the dreaded Apocalypse? What fucking gives here?!?

 

So here is what you Christians can do to prove to me that I’m wrong (to shut ME up) -- show me something -- an answered prayer, an amputated limb re-grown, a mountain moving, bona fide, honest-to-fucking-God MIRACLE that no one can deny! -- or forever hold your peace, because I'm tired of your incessant delusional buzzing around my ears. 2,000-plus years of this overgrown death cult is more than enough.

 

Put up (provide verifiable evidence) or shut up (keep your retarded “beliefs†to yourself and leave the rest of us alone).

 

That’s the deal. All things considered I think I’m being more than reasonable. You Christians are the ones writing checks your butts can’t cash. After all, “Outrageous claims demand outrageous proofs.â€

 

The ball is in your court, you delusional nitwits.

 

~ Checkmate (back by popular demand)

[Lilith666]

I tried to talk to the people in my Sunday School class about things like biblical double standards about men vs. women, Jews vs. Gentiles, and they couldn't explain it. The leader said we should all "give it over to the Lord" because he knows better than we do. This is his way of ignoring everything he doesn't understand. It scares him to think that there are challenges to Christianity which can't be neatly cleaned up. Thinking about it requires too much brain work for him. So much for Christians' radical open-mindedness. The ones I know aren't serious about finding truth because it would overturn their beliefs. Most of them mean well, but they're a bunch of hypocrites.

[antix]

I tried to talk to the people in my Sunday School class about things like biblical double standards about men vs. women, Jews vs. Gentiles, and they couldn't explain it. The leader said we should all "give it over to the Lord" because he knows better than we do. This is his way of ignoring everything he doesn't understand. It scares him to think that there are challenges to Christianity which can't be neatly cleaned up. Thinking about it requires too much brain work for him. So much for Christians' radical open-mindedness. The ones I know aren't serious about finding truth because it would overturn their beliefs. Most of them mean well, but they're a bunch of hypocrites.

 

the double standards are due to the culture and and the time of the writings. As for us christians being hypocrites. YUP! (And other christians reading this, you have to admit lillith666 is correct)

[RankStranger]

I think perhaps you could learn from this: http://www.timecube.com/

Raging lunatic. Maybe even schizophrenic.

 

And a crazy man's words are relevant how?

 

Perhaps you could learn from taking a class in biological anthropology?

 

This thread really brings back memories. Goathead had such potential- he was one of the best trolls I've ever seen. And banned so early- he never reached his full potential.

 

I know he's out there somewhere pushing peoples' buttons.

 

And whatever became of The Grinch?