The Question That Evolutionists Can't Answer

[florduh]

I find it funny that anybody who disagrees is "a troll." 

 

You know damn well that is not the reason you are considered a troll by most of us. This response of yours after all that has been explained and demonstrated to you is itself evidence of trolling. I suggest you read a book on science, evolution, anything at all that wasn't produced by the Christian apologist machine. You have demonstrated not only a woeful ignorance of scientific fact, but deliberate blind rejection of any facts that would negate your religious indoctrination. We don't just "disagree," you are demonstrably wrong in your assumptions and invalid conclusions. You can't even intelligently discuss the subject. Read. Learn. This isn't high school.

[Vigile]

I'm just asking people to think on their own.   

 

Let's look at humans.  One day, there was a cell. Nobody can explain how it built itself.   Suddenly, it started dividing (for reasons unexplained).   Eventually, there were 3 trillion cells in one area.  Even though these cells had no cognitive ability, they hatched a plan.   "Let's all 3 trillion of us hold hands and turn ourselves into a human.  You 500,000,000 cells go up top and turn yourselves into the brain. Make yourselves super smart.  You 200,000,000 turn yourselves into the heart.   You 100,000, 000 turn yourselves into a liver.  We're going to need to eat (even though there's no food), so we'll need to have a system in place than can filter our food.  You 250,000,000 turn yourselves into a stomach.  Make sure you teach yourselves how do break down food.  Then, make sure you have 3 trillion waiters ready to feed every cell in our new body, because we all need to eat.  As for you remaining cells, make yourselves useful and turn yourselves into eyes, a nose, a mouth, teeth, hands, feet, toes, etc.   Oh, and make sure to make yourselves aesthetically pleasing.  Any questions?  Okay, go for it."

 

And I'm the idiot.  

 

Indeed. Glad we can agree on something. 

 

[Brother Jeff]

I'm just asking people to think on their own.   

 

Let's look at humans.  One day, there was a cell. Nobody can explain how it built itself.   Suddenly, it started dividing (for reasons unexplained).   Eventually, there were 3 trillion cells in one area.  Even though these cells had no cognitive ability, they hatched a plan.   "Let's all 3 trillion of us hold hands and turn ourselves into a human.  You 500,000,000 cells go up top and turn yourselves into the brain. Make yourselves super smart.  You 200,000,000 turn yourselves into the heart.   You 100,000, 000 turn yourselves into a liver.  We're going to need to eat (even though there's no food), so we'll need to have a system in place than can filter our food.  You 250,000,000 turn yourselves into a stomach.  Make sure you teach yourselves how do break down food.  Then, make sure you have 3 trillion waiters ready to feed every cell in our new body, because we all need to eat.  As for you remaining cells, make yourselves useful and turn yourselves into eyes, a nose, a mouth, teeth, hands, feet, toes, etc.   Oh, and make sure to make yourselves aesthetically pleasing.  Any questions?  Okay, go for it."

 

And I'm the idiot.  

 

We do think on our own. We're asking you to do the same and LEARN. As for the rest of your post...

[slave2six]

I'm just asking people to think on their own. 

 

You are asking people to ignore the data that we have available to us and suppose, without any information, what can and cannot happen.

 

That is not thinking for yourself. That is imagining.

 

We are asking you to stop supposing, to look at the data, and then to draw conclusions based on the data. That, sir, involves thinking.

[pawn]

this thread... Funny. Creationist get PWND!

[R. S. Martin]

This question surely isn't intended to inflame.  It's just something that I can never get an answer too.  Whenever I ask it, people usually point me to an article or book.   I want anybody who believes in evolution to tell me five things about evolution that you know are true (i.e., in your own words). Honest discussion.   

 

In order to keep my reply "honest" and "uninflamed," I'm going to reply before reading the other answers.

 

First of all, I'm not sure what your question means. Evolution is not something a person "believes in." The theory of evolution is the logical conclusion a person arrives at based on the observable facts of nature we have available to us. You say you don't want to read books and articles to find out what those facts are and why they add up this way. I will not plagiarize and copy Charles Darwin's argument for evolution expounded in Origin of Species and Descent of Man. Nor will I copy anyone else's work. So I guess we're at an impasse. One must read the entire argument to understand it.

 

Here's my other problem with your question: the word "know." What do you mean by that? If you mean facts about biological reproduction and development that have been proven many times in controlled laboratories and environments, documented throughout the centuries, again it would seem your best bet would be to seek out the literature by those who specialize in it. If you mean a store of certain and unchanging knowledge that all "believers" subscribe to such as Christians claim to have regarding God's existence, then you are speaking of dogma and not about knowing things. There is no dogma for evolution.

 

The people who actively work with and contribute to the theory of evolution are mostly scientists of some kind. Science is always learning. There was a time perhaps 150 years ago, maybe more, when scientists thought all they had to do was learn all the facts of nature and that would be it. Today, as scientists keep finding ever bigger and ever tinier things, they no longer think that humans will ever know all there is to know about the natural universe. This includes not only astrophysics and abiogenesis but also biology and evolution, plus the earth sciences such as geology.

 

Another thing scientists discover all the time is that things they used to think they know are wrong. However, science learns from its mistakes and the fund of human knowledge ever expands. This includes our knowledge of evolution. If you want to, you can physically go see the fossil record. (I don't know what qualifications and permissions are required to get in but I understand it exists in physical material form.)

 

In summary, here are five things we know about evolution:

 

1. The theory of evolution is an ever-growing body of knowledge that belongs to the sciences, not dogma that a person "believes in."
2. Based on the facts of nature available to us, as explained by Charles Darwin and tested by many others in the laboratory since then, evolution is the logical answer to the question: How did life on earth come to take the form it does today?
3. Charles Darwin was not the first to think that lifeforms evolved as opposed to being specially created by a deity; the concept had been around for centuries if not millennia. He just figured out how it could possibly work. Since Darwin, no one has disproved it.
4. To say that humans, insects, trees, fish, elephants and other birds, plants and animals all came from the same primordial soup sounds preposterous if we do not take the time to study the argument for the theory of evolution.
5. To look at the whole of creation and note how the species were naturally distributed across the face of the earth (before the interference of humans) and say "God made them by special creation" defies logic. See Origin of Species.

A sixth thing we know is that we keep learning new things about evolution, meaning that some of the things we thought we knew are wrong but other amazing new knowledge takes its place, making a bigger and better picture.

 

As stated, these are not things we "believe in." Since the arguments and evidence fit empirical reality, we don't need weekly sermons to remind us not to give in to doubt. For those of us who don't really care that much about the details and prefer just to live in the world as it exists today, no one is going to punish us either in this life or after we die. The people who seem to care most about this are religious people because they think the universe is proof of their deity's existence. It's not.

 

When I get time I'll read what others posted.

[Brother Jeff]

 

This question surely isn't intended to inflame.  It's just something that I can never get an answer too.  Whenever I ask it, people usually point me to an article or book.   I want anybody who believes in evolution to tell me five things about evolution that you know are true (i.e., in your own words). Honest discussion.   

 

In order to keep my reply "honest" and "uninflamed," I'm going to reply before reading the other answers.

 

First of all, I'm not sure what your question means. Evolution is not something a person "believes in." The theory of evolution is the logical conclusion a person arrives at based on the observable facts of nature we have available to us. You say you don't want to read books and articles to find out what those facts are and why they add up this way. I will not plagiarize and copy Charles Darwin's argument for evolution expounded in Origin of Species and Descent of Man. Nor will I copy anyone else's work. So I guess we're at an impasse. One must read the entire argument to understand it.

 

Here's my other problem with your question: the word "know." What do you mean by that? If you mean facts about biological reproduction and development that have been proven many times in controlled laboratories and environments, documented throughout the centuries, again it would seem your best bet would be to seek out the literature by those who specialize in it. If you mean a store of certain and unchanging knowledge that all "believers" subscribe to such as Christians claim to have regarding God's existence, then you are speaking of dogma and not about knowing things. There is no dogma for evolution.

 

The people who actively work with and contribute to the theory of evolution are mostly scientists of some kind. Science is always learning. There was a time perhaps 150 years ago, maybe more, when scientists thought all they had to do was learn all the facts of nature and that would be it. Today, as scientists keep finding ever bigger and ever tinier things, they no longer think that humans will ever know all there is to know about the natural universe. This includes not only astrophysics and abiogenesis but also biology and evolution, plus the earth sciences such as geology.

 

Another thing scientists discover all the time is that things they used to think they know are wrong. However, science learns from its mistakes and the fund of human knowledge ever expands. This includes our knowledge of evolution. If you want to, you can physically go see the fossil record. (I don't know what qualifications and permissions are required to get in but I understand it exists in physical material form.)

 

In summary, here are five things we know about evolution:

 

1. The theory of evolution is an ever-growing body of knowledge that belongs to the sciences, not dogma that a person "believes in."
2. Based on the facts of nature available to us, as explained by Charles Darwin and tested by many others in the laboratory since then, evolution is the logical answer to the question: How did life on earth come to take the form it does today?
3. Charles Darwin was not the first to think that lifeforms evolved as opposed to being specially created by a deity; the concept had been around for centuries if not millennia. He just figured out how it could possibly work. Since Darwin, no one has disproved it.
4. To say that humans, insects, trees, fish, elephants and other birds, plants and animals all came from the same primordial soup sounds preposterous if we do not take the time to study the argument for the theory of evolution.
5. To look at the whole of creation and note how the species were naturally distributed across the face of the earth (before the interference of humans) and say "God made them by special creation" defies logic. See Origin of Species.

A sixth thing we know is that we keep learning new things about evolution, meaning that some of the things we thought we knew are wrong but other amazing new knowledge takes its place, making a bigger and better picture.

 

As stated, these are not things we "believe in." Since the arguments and evidence fit empirical reality, we don't need weekly sermons to remind us not to give in to doubt. For those of us who don't really care that much about the details and prefer just to live in the world as it exists today, no one is going to punish us either in this life or after we die. The people who seem to care most about this are religious people because they think the universe is proof of their deity's existence. It's not.

 

When I get time I'll read what others posted.

 

 

Great response, but if you'd read the thread first you would have realized that sandiego4me is a troll. He's not interested in honest conversation or in learning in order to get out of his willful abysmal scientific ignorance. He's posted a lot of ignorant creationist bullshit that we refuted and he's gotten a lot of honest conversation and knowledge, which he has ignored. His last post was... OMG! Hilarious, but unspeakably ignorant. The guy hasn't got a clue what he is talking about, and it shows badly. Wow...

[RaLeah]

Listen, I worked for Answers in Genesis (AIG) when I was in college. I read all their stuff, believed in "creation science." I always enjoyed scientific programs on TV, but I mentally tuned out anything related to evolution. I "knew" that part was wrong, because God made the world, and I had no interest in exploring evolutionary concepts any further. Sure, I had some questions about how fossils worked and what happened to the dinosaurs and why cave formations appeared to be older than the age of the earth itself, but I just ignored them. 

 

Later in my 20s, a friend of mine was appalled at my ignorance on basic biology and evolution. "Look," he said, "even if you end up disagreeing with what you read, you should read about it to educate yourself. Read something that's from actual scientists, with no religious slant. Go on the internet and poke around for just a few hours. But you can't convince anyone that evolution isn't true until you have a basic understanding of what it is and why people hold that as the prevailing theory. After you know what you're talking about, then we can have a reasonable debate about it if you want to." 

 

So I did. After all, I "knew" I was right, and that nothing I read from anyone--scientists or anyone--was going to change my mind. 

 

And once I started reading and researching, those nagging questions (especially transition fossils, dinosaurs, etc.) I'd had? They got answered, and the evidence piled up and the history of the world clicked into place in my mind. The more I studied it, the more all those things that hadn't made sense to me before made perfect sense. And the evidence piled up. 

 

At first, I tried to reject what I was seeing, but I found it irrefutable. Then I started to feel angry. All this information had been withheld from me. What little scientific information that had been taught to me about evolution had been twisted, and outright lies and hoaxes were in my Christian school's science textbooks. 

 

Sure, I was educated, but I was misinformed rather than ignorant. That's worse, because you feel so certain you're right. After all, you've been given piles of "evidence" from trusted sources, your school, your church, your teachers, your text books. 

 

So all I can say is... Be brave enough to truly research what the other side has to say. The Christians tried to warn me not to look, that it would be giving in to the Devil's temptation and stuff like that. But I prayed for God to give me discernment, and now I realize that warning people not to look at the information and evidence out there is to try to scare people away from thinking and researching for themselves so they won't learn the truth--that the Bible's creation story is not literally true. But you know what? If your faith can't stand up under scrutiny, it isn't worth having. Christians have seen that people who decided to take "seek and ye shall find" literally ended up being convinced by the overwhelming evidence for evolution. They can't bear to think they themselves might be wrong and the seeker is now right. So they conclude that they tried to warn the person that Satan would trick them with lies, and that must be what happened. 

 

So, sadly, you're trapped believing this creation story myth as truth until you find the courage to challenge the brain washing. 

 

Until then, you will ignore fossil evidence and all the rest of the overwhelming evidence against the myth of God creating in one week every creature exactly as it appears on earth today. 

 

You can stay stuck in your ignorance and misinformation, or you can honestly search for truth with an open mind, even if it feels uncomfortable for you, and you might fear what you'll uncover if you look at the evidence to find out for yourself.

 

Still, I hope you find the courage and integrity to seek. If you do, you'll find. 

[Kris]

If we are to believe god had a hand in creating all of the things on earth-- why did he create pin worms? They live in people's butts and are parasitic. They serve no real purpose. An intelligent deity would not crate something like this----however, evolution would. This is just one example--- I am sure there are many more.

[bornagainathiest]

 

 

 

 

There is absolutely NO scientific evidence that says "at one time nothing in the universe existed".  

 

 

This is an entirely incorrect statement.  Einstein's Cosmological Constant Theory was an attempt to avoid the sticky situation that his discovery of the Theory of Relativity Produced:  If there was a beginning point for all matter in the universe, then there was a point when there was no matter.  I'm not making this up.  The uncomfortable net effect of this was that Einstein realized that something cannot come from nothing.  As such, he spent over 20 years trying to establish the Cosmological Constant, which proved to be impossible.  He candidly referred to his Cosmological Constants Theory is as the "biggest blunder" of his life. 

 

 

Sorry SD4M, but you are the one who's peddling the incorrect information.

 

Einstein did not formulate a Cosmological Constant 'Theory'.  There's no such thing.  

 

Einstein introduced the Cosmological Constant (the value of the energy density of the vacuum of space) as a new term in the equations of his theory of General Relativity, because that theory kept arriving at what he considered to be the 'wrong' answer.  This 'wrong' answer was a universe that expanded, rather than stayed static and unchanging.  The key to understanding why Einstein thought a static universe was 'right' and an expanding one was 'wrong' is the chronology of the events.

 

1916.

Einstein publishes his theory of General Relativity with the Cosmological Constant added into it as a fudge factor to stop the universe from expanding and to keep it static and unchanging.  Why did he do this?

 

1928.

Edwin Hubble's observations showed that, in contradiction to the prevailing understanding of cosmologists (and Einstein), the universe WAS expanding.  Prior to this, all scientists (including Einstein) had worked on the assumption that the universe was static, unchanging and eternal.  Hubble showed that assumption to be wrong.  The universe appeared to have a definite point of origin in time and was not eternal and unchanging.

 

In 1916 Einstein didn't know about the expanding universe, even though his theories implied this.  His greatest blunder was to ignore what his theories were telling him and to fudge them and bring them back into line with the eternal universe paradigm which everyone was holding to at that time.

 

Fast forward 12 years and Einstein does this... 

 

He was right, back in 1916, but lacked the courage to go with his math and fudged his equations instead.  THAT was his greatest blunder...ok?

 

So, the Cosmological Constant isn't a theory, it's a measurement of space's energy value...ok?

 

Einstein did not spend 20 years trying to establish the Cosmological Constant...ok?

 

If he'd already added it into his theory of General Relativity in 1916, that would have meant he began working on establishing the Constant in 1896, when he was 17.  Is that what you're saying SD4M?

 

If he spent 20 years trying to establish the Cosmological Constant from 1916 onward, then you're saying that he gave up in 1936, eight years after Hubble's discovery of the expanding universe.  Doesn't make any sense, SD4M!

 

Your information and understanding of what you're presenting here aren't just seriously compromised - they're flat-out wrong!

 

Check out the facts here... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmological_constant

.

.

.

Now, if you come clean and admit that you're wrong and misinformed, I'll be happy to discuss creatio ex nihilo, the current state of cosmology and the Big bang with you.  That's my price and it's non-negotiable.

.

.

.

.

Of course, you could always bypass me (an amateur astronomer) and go right to Bhim with this.  

After all, he's an astrophysicist by profession.

 

A word of caution tho'...

 

He doesn't suffer fools gladly -  so don't try and jerk him around!

 

BAA

[♦ ficino ♦]

Having misunderstood the OP, I'm giving some reasons why I "believe in" evolution:

 

fulfilled prophecies (e.g. new vaccines to counter new viruses - I got one a few weeks ago and I didn't get the flu!)

 

changed life (I'm a lot happier and more fulfilled now than I was when I "believed" that God made each species specially 6000 yrs ago or so)

 

miracles (e.g. advances in medicine, fossil fuels, etc - it ain't creation science that guides new research that yields results!)

 

blessings (still profiting from how my oil and gas stocks went up)

 

profundity (I think of the vast ages of the earth and the saga of all living things and I am overwhelmed)

 

I've been given a peace about it (the world of my experience makes so much more sense than it did when I was straining to explain away all the cognitive dissonance, so I have peace of mind)

 

 

I'm singing praises all the day long!  My hope is that you, too, sandiego, can experience the peace that comes from understanding.

 

 

[Brother Jeff]

For sandiego4me:

 

[3DollarBill]

 

 

One might also ask why the goo in your head doesn't turn into a brain.

 

And if you left a bacterial colony in your fridge for a million years...it WOULD evolve.  It would not evolve into a giraffe, or anything nearly so complex, as that took much longer than a million years, but it would absolutely certainly evolve.

[Kris]

I really thought my pinworm post nailed the argument!!

[mymistake]

I really thought my pinworm post nailed the argument!!

 

There is no discussion to nail.  Most of the people here understand science to a degree but there is one guy who spouts anti-science slogans and refuses to learn.  I'm sure next time SD will claim that he still has never seen an evolutionist who can say in his own words five things about evolution that are known to be true.

[slave2six]

And once I started reading and researching, those nagging questions (especially transition fossils, dinosaurs, etc.) I'd had? They got answered, and the evidence piled up and the history of the world clicked into place in my mind. The more I studied it, the more all those things that hadn't made sense to me before made perfect sense. And the evidence piled up. 

 

Great post. I really like how you articulate your thoughts RaLeah.

 

Lesson learned: Knowledge trumps faith every time. 

[slave2six]

This is an entirely incorrect statement.  Einstein's Cosmological Constant Theory was an attempt to avoid the sticky situation that his discovery of the Theory of Relativity Produced:  If there was a beginning point for all matter in the universe, then there was a point when there was no matter.  I'm not making this up.  The uncomfortable net effect of this was that Einstein realized that something cannot come from nothing.  As such, he spent over 20 years trying to establish the Cosmological Constant, which proved to be impossible.  He candidly referred to his Cosmological Constants Theory is as the "biggest blunder" of his life. 

 

 

Einstein was not the final authority on the subject of the beginnings of the universe.

 

Have you read the studies suggesting that universes can be created in black holes? Have you read anything about the likelihood of multiple universes? 

 

To assume that ours is the only universe leads to thinking this something-from-nothing stuff. That we are perhaps one of billions of universes begs a whole new set of questions, most (if not all) of which we will never be able to answer until we can get to or communicate with those other universes.

 

Your perspective is too small, IMHO.

[3DollarBill]

I'm just asking people to think on their own.   

 

Let's look at humans.  One day, there was a cell. Nobody can explain how it built itself.   Suddenly, it started dividing (for reasons unexplained).   Eventually, there were 3 trillion cells in one area.  Even though these cells had no cognitive ability, they hatched a plan.   "Let's all 3 trillion of us hold hands and turn ourselves into a human.  You 500,000,000 cells go up top and turn yourselves into the brain. Make yourselves super smart.  You 200,000,000 turn yourselves into the heart.   You 100,000, 000 turn yourselves into a liver.  We're going to need to eat (even though there's no food), so we'll need to have a system in place than can filter our food.  You 250,000,000 turn yourselves into a stomach.  Make sure you teach yourselves how do break down food.  Then, make sure you have 3 trillion waiters ready to feed every cell in our new body, because we all need to eat.  As for you remaining cells, make yourselves useful and turn yourselves into eyes, a nose, a mouth, teeth, hands, feet, toes, etc.   Oh, and make sure to make yourselves aesthetically pleasing.  Any questions?  Okay, go for it."

 

And I'm the idiot.  

 

Yes, actually, you are the idiot.  And no, I'm not calling you an idiot because you clearly have never bothered with even the faintest attempt to educate yourself on how the Theory of Evolution is actually supposed to work.  That's merely ignorance, and you could cure that if you bothered to sit down and research for a few days.  

 

You're an idiot because you choose to argue a topic with people who have, for 5 pages worth of posts, clearly demonstrated a higher level of knowledge than you yourself possess.  Someone lacking in basic knowledge of the subject could learn a hell of a lot about the Theory of Evolution from reading this thread, yet rather than even make the faintest attempt to understand what any of us are saying you instead continue making ridiculous statements like the one quoted above. 

 

And before you further embarrass yourself by trying to turn my last sentence around on me...let me remind you that everyone here fully understands your position and, unlike you, have demonstrated the ability to change our minds.  I'm sure a great many of us, at one point in our lives, rejected evolution giving the same fallacious arguments you do.  What differentiates me, a thinking human, from you, an idiot, is that one day I decided that I actually give a shit whether the things I believe in are true.  I evaluated the evidence, and came to the conclusion that my creationist beliefs were false.

 

So, do you care if the things you believe in are true?  Do you want to formulate your beliefs based on facts and evidence?  Or do you want to create evidence and arguments which support a foregone conclusion?  Do you want to believe things because you used your cognitive ability to evaluate them or because some leather-bound-book-wielding guy in a suit told you what to believe? Do you want to think for yourself or let others think for you?  Red pill or blue pill?  Make your choice.  I would like to help you, or at the very least, quit wasting my time.

[slave2six]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh and let me repeat Owen's challenge with a tiny twist.  List five things about Jesus that are verified by objective evidence.

 

 

You don't prove evolution by disproving Jesus.  That's akin to getting stuck on a math problem and then asking your neighbor why they went to Hawaii instead of Florida for vacation.  There is no causal connection between the two.  I'm simply asking you to solve the math problem. 

 

 

You keep talking as if you are the professor but in this discussion you have not even raised yourself to the level of a student. You are unwilling to consider the data that has been collected and are standing outside the classroom yelling uninformed platitudes.

[Fernweh]

The arguments presented by SD4M in this thread meet the criteria for Not Even Wrong. You have displayed your glaring ignorance of the subject matter. Just admit you are out of your depth here and that you have been pwned. You might have noticed the name of this website in the URL. Most of us would have made the same ignorant arguments at some point in our lives. We changed our minds to reflect the glaring reality of the world we live in.

[slave2six]

 

And I'm the idiot.  

 

And before you further embarrass yourself by trying to turn my last sentence around on me...let me remind you that everyone here fully understands your position and, unlike you, have demonstrated the ability to change our minds.  I'm sure a great many of us, at one point in our lives, rejected evolution giving the same fallacious arguments you do.  What differentiates me, a thinking human, from you, an idiot, is that one day I decided that I actually give a shit whether the things I believe in are true.  I evaluated the evidence, and came to the conclusion that my creationist beliefs were false.

 

Well stated. I certainly fall into the camp of one who was an uneducated creationist and began asking questions (very similar to RaLeah). I'm embarrassed by how woefully ignorant I was (and still am in many ways). But I am proud of myself that I have undertaken the journey of discovery.

 

Hopefully, SD4M will wake up one day. Perhaps he will return here and apologize for being such a numbskull.

 

Not holding my breath though.

[slave2six]

SD4M - Where do you go to church? My dad was a pastor at College Ave Baptist Church and then at Skyline Wesleyan back in the day. I'm curious where you attend.

[HymenaeusAlexander]

If we are to believe god had a hand in creating all of the things on earth-- why did he create pin worms? They live in people's butts and are parasitic. They serve no real purpose. An intelligent deity would not crate something like this----however, evolution would. This is just one example--- I am sure there are many more.

 

And since they need people's butts to survive one of the people on Noah's Ark would've had to have provided...er...housing for them during the Great Flood. Did they draw straws to see who the lucky host would be?

[mymistake]

 

If we are to believe god had a hand in creating all of the things on earth-- why did he create pin worms? They live in people's butts and are parasitic. They serve no real purpose. An intelligent deity would not crate something like this----however, evolution would. This is just one example--- I am sure there are many more.

 

And since they need people's butts to survive one of the people on Noah's Ark would've had to have provided...er...housing for them during the Great Flood. Did they draw straws to see who the lucky host would be?

 

 

Notice how well the human butt satisfies all the needs of the pinworm so perfectly?  Clearly the universe was created by the pinworm god.

[R. S. Martin]

 

Great response, but if you'd read the thread first you would have realized that sandiego4me is a troll. He's not interested in honest conversation or in learning in order to get out of his willful abysmal scientific ignorance. He's posted a lot of ignorant creationist bullshit that we refuted and he's gotten a lot of honest conversation and knowledge, which he has ignored. His last post was... OMG! Hilarious, but unspeakably ignorant. The guy hasn't got a clue what he is talking about, and it shows badly. Wow...

 

 

Hey Jeff, long time no see!

 

Anyway, thanks for the heads up. I read this last page now. Maybe I won't bother reading the rest if that's the way of it. Hopefully some lurker will get value out of the discussion even if this troll didn't. I think we get some seekers here.

 

 

If we are to believe god had a hand in creating all of the things on earth-- why did he create pin worms? They live in people's butts and are parasitic. They serve no real purpose. An intelligent deity would not crate something like this----however, evolution would. This is just one example--- I am sure there are many more.

 

And since they need people's butts to survive one of the people on Noah's Ark would've had to have provided...er...housing for them during the Great Flood. Did they draw straws to see who the lucky host would be?

 

 

Now there you've got food for thought. Okay, bad analogy but all the same...

 

If all the viruses and fleas, etc. in existence today were created once for all at Creation and no new ones ever came into existence since then, those eight people would have been too sick to survive all those months in the boat. Never thought of it that way but this in itself is proof that Noah's Flood never happened.