Who knows God

[Guest acorn]

Ahh,    5 months and you "believe" you have most of  the answers?  Many People here are escaping a large majority of their lifetime  from the Cults, and "knowing" the bible inside and out, Yet  you admit here you've only studied the bible for 5 months and want to win us over? LOL

 

Tell you what, Why don't you trace back your "religion" I'm not talking about jeezuses "Birth" either.  What ever Church you belong to, when was it founded, what  sect did it break off of, keep going backwards until you get to the founding of it.

 

Then Study Jewish Law and ideology of which Christianity claims they adopted.  Now you will have to remove your Jesus glasses in order to do this exercise Honestly.   Founders of Christianity were pagans, and oddly enough brought all their "SUN-God/ son god beliefs with them. Nothing new Under the sun indeed.

 

It's a joke, you've been had.

 

Btw, didja know they had a special on the history Channel on the Vatican, Know what's down deep  below? It was built on an old pagan cemetery.  Founder of all Christianity  is Rome.  Open your eyes, Truth is in front of ya.

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Thanks for your concern. I believe in simple faith, but I did get to the part were God asked is my arm shortened to anything. I prayed that I would understand the Bible before I started reading it, in which after this I understood everythingin it.

[Guest acorn]

What about the Luke 14:26 verse where  your Christ  demands you HATE your family, else you can't be a follower?

 

Hate is a pretty strong word, Yet it is that strong evil word he uses. If the bible is infallible, then perhaps you follow the bad with the good as well?  however considering all the home wreaking Churches do, I can see they follow Christ to the letter.

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I actually can relate to that personally. When God truly entered into my life I began to work for Him not me. Have you ever heard of the mustard seed parable?Well, i had a tree alright, a pretty corrupt, nonfruitful tree. God had to trim my branches, which was my carreer. Unfortuniately my wife didnt approve, or the rest of the world for that matter. So, I did actually get to a point were I reliased the untrue ways of my family, and my wifes desire for comfort and money. I did COME TO HIM in hate of my whole life, and He gracefully answered and pieced the missing puzzle pieces together. The point of this scripture is that yes, the world will hate us for our name sake, and human nature is to begin a tread of hatred toward those people as well. Thats why he said we will COME to Him.

 

Matt 11:29-30

29 "Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.

30 "For My yoke is easy and My burden is light."(NKJ)

[Japedo]

To answer this question I must tell you that I dont even know who these poeple are but I do have an answer, Have any of the other Gods in any religion, Rose from the dead, or claimed to have rose from the dead

 

 

YES

 

Before I give you the answer, you have in your bible story there the story of Lazerus, He rose from the dead, did it make him God too? If not, why not?

 

 

 

 

I'm Cutting and pasting here, however Feel free to do a search on any of these.

 

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Osiris and Horus, the Egyptian virgin-born gods, suffered death

 

 

Horus was also called "The Savior." "As Horus Sneb, he is the Redeemer. He is the Lord of Life and the Eternal One" (Bonwick, Egyptian Belief, P. 185). He is also called "The Only-Begotten" (Mysteries of Adonai, p. 88).

 

Attis, who was called the "Only Begotten Son" (Knight, Ancient Art and Mythology, p. xxii.) and "Savior," was worshipped by the Phrygians (who were regarded as one of the oldest races of Asia Minor). He was represented by them as a man tied to a tree, at the foot of which was a lamb (Dupuls, Origin of Religious Belief, p. 255). He is also characterized as a man nailed to the tree, or stake, for we find Lactantius making this Apollo of Miletus (anciently, the greatest and the most flourishing city of Ionia, in Asia Minor) say that : "He was a mortal according to the flesh; wise in miraculous works; but being arrested by an armed force by command of the Chaldean judges (Sadducee like), he suffered a death made bitter with nails and stakes" (Dupuls, Origin of Religious Belief, vol. ii).

 

 

 

Tammuz, or Adonis, the Syrian Adonai (Lord) was another virgin-born god, who suffered for mankind, and who had the title of "Savior." The accounts of his death are conflicting, just as it is with almost all of the so-called Saviors of mankind (including the Christian Savior). As we progress we shall see that the reason for such variation is the multiple variety of Sun Myths that deal with the dying of the sun. Every nation had their own spin to the story it seems, but the basic story was the same.

 

 

Prometheus was a crucified Savior. He was "an immortal god, a friend of the human race, "who does not shrink even from sacrificing himself for their salvation.

 

The tragedy of the crucifixion of Prometheus, written by Eschylus, was acted in Athens five hundred years before the Christian Era, and is by many considered to be the most ancient dramatic poem now in existe

 

"Bacchus, the offspring of Jupiter and Semele, was called the "Savior" (Knight, Anct. Art and Mythology, p. 98) He was called the "Only Begotten Son," the "Slain One" (Knight, Ancient Art and Mythology, p. xxii), the "Sin Bearer"(Bonwick, Egyptian Belief, p. 169), the "Redeemer

 

Hercules, the son of Zeus, was called "The Savior" (Higgins, Anacalypsis, vol. i. p. 322). The words "Hercules the Savior" were engraven on ancient coins and monuments (Celtic Druids, Taylor, Diegesis, p. 153). He was also called "The Only Begotten," and the "Universal Word." He was re-absorbed into God. He was said by Ovid to be the sun "Self-produced," the Generator and Ruler of all things, and the Father of time

[Japedo]

Thanks for your concern. I believe in simple faith, but I did get to the part were God asked is my arm shortened to anything. I prayed that I would understand the Bible before I started reading it, in which after this I understood everythingin it.

 

 

 

 

Faith doesn't mean Fact. You put both on the same level they are not remotely the same. People had "faith" the Sun revolved around the earth, it was a crime to state or even think other wise. A form of blasphemy I should say.

 

Did their "faith" make it fact? Even with all the Fear to support it?

 

You prayed you'd understand the bible n' did Huh? .. well... Perhaps you can give me a little insight as to why Josephs "line" was traced back to the house of "David" Yet Joseph wasn't even the "father" of your Christ.

 

If Mary is the mother, and God planted his "seed" in her (even though he wasn't married to her, he musta sinned?) Why prove that jeezus is from the house of David? Jeezus wasn't related by Blood to Joseph in anyway shape or form, yet they give his blood line as "proof" ? Why only thing it proves was Jesus wasn't from the House of David.

[Guest acorn]

YES

 

Before I give you the answer, you have in  your bible story there the story of Lazerus, He rose from the dead, did it make him God too?  If not, why not?

I'm Cutting and pasting here, however Feel free to do a search on any of these.

 

<snip>

 

Osiris and Horus, the Egyptian virgin-born gods, suffered death

Horus was also called "The Savior." "As Horus Sneb, he is the Redeemer. He is the Lord of Life and the Eternal One" (Bonwick, Egyptian Belief, P. 185). He is also called "The Only-Begotten" (Mysteries of Adonai, p. 88).

 

Attis, who was called the "Only Begotten Son" (Knight, Ancient Art and Mythology, p. xxii.) and "Savior," was worshipped by the Phrygians (who were regarded as one of the oldest races of Asia Minor). He was represented by them as a man tied to a tree, at the foot of which was a lamb (Dupuls, Origin of Religious Belief, p. 255). He is also characterized as a man nailed to the tree, or stake, for we find Lactantius making this Apollo of Miletus (anciently, the greatest and the most flourishing city of Ionia, in Asia Minor) say that : "He was a mortal according to the flesh; wise in miraculous works; but being arrested by an armed force by command of the Chaldean judges (Sadducee like), he suffered a death made bitter with nails and stakes" (Dupuls, Origin of Religious Belief, vol. ii).

Tammuz, or Adonis, the Syrian Adonai (Lord) was another virgin-born god, who suffered for mankind, and who had the title of "Savior." The accounts of his death are conflicting, just as it is with almost all of the so-called Saviors of mankind (including the Christian Savior). As we progress we shall see that the reason for such variation is the multiple variety of Sun Myths that deal with the dying of the sun. Every nation had their own spin to the story it seems, but the basic story was the same.

Prometheus was a crucified Savior. He was "an immortal god, a friend of the human race, "who does not shrink even from sacrificing himself for their salvation.

 

The tragedy of the crucifixion of Prometheus, written by Eschylus, was acted in Athens five hundred years before the Christian Era, and is by many considered to be the most ancient dramatic poem now in existe

 

"Bacchus, the offspring of Jupiter and Semele, was called the "Savior" (Knight, Anct. Art and Mythology, p. 98) He was called the "Only Begotten Son," the "Slain One" (Knight, Ancient Art and Mythology, p. xxii), the "Sin Bearer"(Bonwick, Egyptian Belief, p. 169), the "Redeemer

 

Hercules, the son of Zeus, was called "The Savior" (Higgins, Anacalypsis, vol. i. p. 322). The words "Hercules the Savior" were engraven on ancient coins and monuments (Celtic Druids, Taylor, Diegesis, p. 153). He was also called "The Only Begotten," and the "Universal Word." He was re-absorbed into God. He was said by Ovid to be the sun "Self-produced," the Generator and Ruler of all things, and the Father of time

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Are these greek gods, cause you do know that there are only about 10 manuscripts that involve the whole existance of grrek gods, theres 1400 manuscripts to christianity, if these are greek gods which i assume.

[Merlinfmct87]

Osiris/Horus are Egyptian, the rest are Greek.

 

What Japedo is trying in vain to get through your thick skull is that Christianity didn't come via fax from god... it was assembled from cannabalized parts of other religions.

 

And as far as your point about 10 manuscripts... not only is that blatanly irrelivant, you might ask WHY there are only 10 manuscripts.

 

No, it's not because there were only 10 written.

 

It's because the Christians burned every one they could find.

 

Merlin

[Onyx]

Stupid them. They could have just tolerate the Greek Gods they got from the greeks...

[Guest Challenger]

Elisha received the blessing from Elijah, it never said he rose from the grave, Elijah was taken to heaven and gave the blessing to elisha who also witnessed this event.

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No, it said the man who touched his bones was revived.

[Reach]

Just a little question...

 

Is this topic, Who knows God?

 

or, Who knows God?

 

or is it, Who knows? God?

 

God who?

[atheist_thinker]

Give a hundred people their own bible and they will all develope their own interpretations. You know, if you want to believe it then your own mind will reenforce what you think is true.

[Japedo]

Acorn: Are these greek gods, cause you do know that there are only about 10 manuscripts that involve the whole existance of grrek gods, theres 1400 manuscripts to christianity, if these are greek gods which i assume.

 

LOL the point is irrelevant how many "manuscripts" exists. The point being these sungods existed long before your son-god. Exactly the same sort of Savior of the world, miracle births and what not. Please point to me anything remotely different in Christian religion that set its self apart from Sun worship, anything at all. Even the disciples which were 12 surrounding the "Son" are the same. (12 months follow the Sun) Nothing new in your New Testament other then re-do astrology.

 

You asked if there were any gods predating your god, I just merely pointed out there were many.

 

Again, you have still yet to answer the question about Lazarus in "your" bible. He died and was risen from the Dead, If he wasn't god incarnate why not? What made him different then the other "human" that was raised from the dead?

[quicksand]

Just a little question...

 

Is this topic, Who knows God?

 

or, Who knows God?

 

or is it, Who knows? God?

 

God who?

I actually got a Christian on other site to admit that in order to understand or even know God, you would have to be God.

 

So much for Christianity I thought.

[Reach]

I actually got a Christian on other site to admit that in order to understand or even know God, you would have to be God.

 

So much for Christianity I thought.

At least he admitted there is no way to make sense of his god.

[quicksand]

  At least he admitted there is no way to make sense of his god.

Yep. I appreciated his candor, but left him babbling on how to resolve the problem.

[Guest acorn]

Osiris/Horus are Egyptian, the rest are Greek.

 

Christianity didn't come via fax from god... it was assembled from cannabalized parts of other religions.

 

Merlin, I understand your frustration and concern. I do wonder what is the big news about the "cannabalize thing". What I do know is that the children of Israel were dirty, nonfaithful, corrupt people just like everyone else was at this period of time. When Moses entered the scene, and throughout the book of leviticus, God is telling His CHOOSEN people that they will be clean people, wont eat the meat unless the blood is drained.The most influential thing is that most of these things will still do today. For instance, God told these people to take baths, wash theirselves, daily; He told them how to cook there food, which resembles most of american traditions of food preparation; he also gave us most of the laws which this country is operated by:Two peoples testimony is verification of proof. these things are all still very much functioned in America. To answer directly your comment, maybe they were cannabals before God took control, and maybe they did seem cannabalistic when they offering animals, or pagan. The bottom line is that God sent Jesus to replace this type of sacrifice, He was our last offering of death to the Lord. So, are we still cannabals today, or did God knowing this generation already, know that He would have to do what happened. Jesus being "sacrificed" for all mankind.

[Dio]

What about the Luke 14:26 verse where  your Christ  demands you HATE your family, else you can't be a follower?

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I think my brother-in-law is kind of a jerk. Does that make me a follower?

[Guest acorn]

Again, you have still yet to answer the question about Lazarus in "your" bible. He died and was risen from the Dead, If he wasn't god incarnate why not?  What made him different then the other "human" that was raised from the dead? 

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Jesus rose lazarus from the grave. What I am referring to is if there any any other Gods, Saviors, Messiahs, Budda, Muhammed, etc.. that have also rose from the dead as claimed by Jesus through Christianity.

 

John 11:43-44

43 Now when He had said these things, He cried with a loud voice, "Lazarus, come forth!"

44 And he who had died came out bound hand and foot with graveclothes, and his face was wrapped with a cloth. Jesus said to them, "Loose him, and let him go."(NKJ)

[Guest acorn]

Does that make me a follower?

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Do you call on the name of Jesus?If not then no.

[Guest acorn]

Faith doesn't mean Fact.  You put both on the same level they are not remotely the same. People had "faith" the Sun revolved around the earth, it was a crime to state or even think other wise.  A form of blasphemy  I should say.

 

Did their "faith" make it fact? Even with all the Fear to support it? 

 

You prayed you'd understand the bible n' did  Huh? .. well...  Perhaps you can give me a little insight as to why Josephs "line" was traced back to the house of "David" Yet Joseph wasn't even the "father"  of your Christ.

 

If Mary is the mother, and God planted his "seed" in her (even though he wasn't married to her, he musta sinned?) Why prove that jeezus is from the house of David?  Jeezus wasn't related by Blood to Joseph in anyway shape or form, yet they give his blood line as "proof" ? Why only thing it proves was Jesus wasn't from the House of David.     

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I understand your veiws, but I am a person that has simple faith that everything in this book is true. So, this is the origin as proclaimed in the Bible which maybe you already know. I just want you to know that I beleive what it says.

 

Matt 1:1-16

1 The book of the generation of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham.

2 Abraham begat Isaac; and Isaac begat Jacob; and Jacob begat Judas and his brethren;

3 And Judas begat Phares and Zara of Thamar; and Phares begat Esrom; and Esrom begat Aram;

4 And Aram begat Aminadab; and Aminadab begat Naasson; and Naasson begat Salmon;

5 And Salmon begat Booz of Rachab; and Booz begat Obed of Ruth; and Obed begat Jesse;

6 And Jesse begat David the king; and David the king begat Solomon of her that had been the wife of Urias;

7 And Solomon begat Roboam; and Roboam begat Abia; and Abia begat Asa;

8 And Asa begat Josaphat; and Josaphat begat Joram; and Joram begat Ozias;

9 And Ozias begat Joatham; and Joatham begat Achaz; and Achaz begat Ezekias;

10 And Ezekias begat Manasses; and Manasses begat Amon; and Amon begat Josias;

11 And Josias begat Jechonias and his brethren, about the time they were carried away to Babylon:

12 And after they were brought to Babylon, Jechonias begat Salathiel; and Salathiel begat Zorobabel;

13 And Zorobabel begat Abiud; and Abiud begat Eliakim; and Eliakim begat Azor;

14 And Azor begat Sadoc; and Sadoc begat Achim; and Achim begat Eliud;

15 And Eliud begat Eleazar; and Eleazar begat Matthan; and Matthan begat Jacob;

16 And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.

(KJV)

[Guest acorn]

Just a little question...

 

Is this topic, Who knows God?

 

or, Who knows God?

 

or is it, Who knows? God?

 

God who?

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lol!! I gues youre right it could be taken several ways. I was referring to WHO knows God?

[Vixentrox]

16 And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.

(KJV)

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Yo...dumb-ass...Joseph wasn't the real father. God was the one who raped Mary and knocked her up. Not your dear Joseph.

[Guest acorn]

No, it said the man who touched his bones was revived.

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Did they say that He ascended into Heaven? I was actually referring to other religions Gods, messiahs, saviors, muhammed, budda, etc..

[Japedo]

Acorn: The bottom line is that God sent Jesus to replace this type of sacrifice, He was our last offering of death to the Lord. So, are we still cannabals today, or did God knowing this generation already, know that He would have to do what happened. Jesus being "sacrificed" for all mankind.

 

Wrong, Jesus wasn't needed according to Jewish belife. There was forgiveness with out sacrifice thru out the entire Original Testament The God of Israel didn't Require Blood to be able to forgive. observing the Sabbath one could obtain forgiveness. One could also by participating in Yom Kippur to obtain atonement. and lastly God can forgive Just because, He can.

 

Blood sacrifice (human or animal) can be found in just about every ancient religions. You don't understand the Jewish understanding of "sacrifice". If The Jewish sacrifice was to take place, A) It wouldn't have been human, secondly It would have had to take place on a Sacred Temple. Neither of which happened in the god/man sacrifice. Also Christians have zero understanding of the Jewish Messiah. He would be a man, A great man (perhaps like Moses) But just a man never the less. None of the hocus pocus Half /man/god that already existed in pagan religions.

 

Christians still Symbolize Cannibalism every time they take communion eating the Flesh (Bread) of a human sacrifice and drinking the Blood (wine) It's symbolic, and quite horrifying when you think about it. Which is another thing that derives from the Sun worship.

 

Study the facts, don't rely on Blind faith. Communion existed before Christianity in pagan cultures.

[Japedo]

I think my brother-in-law is kind of a jerk.  Does that make me a follower?

 

 

NO, you have to actually HATE him, and not only him, your own self too...

[Japedo]

Acorn: 16 And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.

 

 

How can Joseph be connected to Christ if God put his "SEED" in Mary and it was supposedly an immaculate conception? Your Christ isn't connected to the house of David.