Challenge for atheists - preach the word!

[BuddhistCommunist]

Thats right daniel. don't answer me again. i'll just sit back and wait... ignorant christian moron. the funny thing is... we walked your path and are telling you why its bad. You never walked our path, but think you know it, when you do not even know your own. pathetic

bye,

BC

[crazy-tiger]

You still haven't show us what is "christ-like behaviour" and you fit the description.

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Well, he keeps on saying that we're wrong to say his behaviour is unchristlike, so we can infer that he believes that christlike behaviour is EXACTLY the same behaviour as his own.

 

That would be arrogant, prideful, dishonest, unkind... just the kind of behaviour that Jesus was against.

 

 

 

Either he's behaving like Christ, in which case the Bible is well wrong about him, or he's wrong about himself behaving in a christlike fashion...

 

What more can you say?

[daniel_1012]

Certainly pritishd, I will try.

 

But Christ is the ultimate role model for Christians, and most christians believe that they should become like christ. However you don't seem to want to become like one.

 

It seems you look down on Amanda, even though she know Christ. You yourself said" it doesnt't matter that you are catholic, mormon or JW. The important thing is that you know christ." Yet you have such spite for Amanda. Isn't there something where Jesus said "you better check your eyes before pointing the speck in others"

 

1) I don't know that Amanda is a Christian. She is a universalist, and when non-Christians have told her she doesn't seem at all like a Christian, she has agreed with them. Like I said, she agrees to almost everything anyone says to her. I don't hate Amanda, I'm sure she'll make a great Christian once we get her converted. I'm sure you will too

 

2) Jesus is the roll model, and he can often be seen cutting to the hearts of the hypocrites, flipping over tables on occasion, speaking grace to the humble, loving the poor, rebuking the proud, rebuking the devil, informing the guilty of hell, and loving sinners enough to act perfectly whatever the time may require. Chirst/God is not a benevolent ball of jelly in the sky who doesn't care what people do -- He is righteous, he is holy, and he is quite concerned. Christ displayed the many necessary sides of Godliness... and great is its myster as we can both see.

 

3) When I said all that matters is that you know Christ... that is just it. You can have tradition, you can have family ties, you may have background unlike mine or a different way to worship. Surely we won't be perfected in our conduct while here on earth, but we will be improved day by day. The important thing is that one knowns Christ, and if a person doesn't know Christ... you bring them to Christ so that they would. I am not saying all Catholics are Christians -- I am saying Catholics *can be Christians* and there is a difference.

 

And no Amanda doesn't agree with everything that we say. She has very strong opinion about her beliefs, and she does a good job defending it. She still believes in the essential doctrine of christianity. Only thing is she shows respect towards her fellow beings. and she shows humbleness where she cannot further answers our questions. The only thing is that she doesn't believe in hell and many of the things that you believe.

 

I don't want to put her anymore on trial in this post than necessary. I imagine she will find it, I hope... and from it gather what is necessary to be brought to the person of Christ, and Christ personally.

 

In your mind you want all christians to believe in the same thing as you. If they don't then they are not true christians.

 

Personally I think people like Amanda will have a better chance of converting people to christianity than you.

 

Amanda in her current state... has no hope of converting anyone to Christ, that is my humble opinion. You have to present Christ, and though some here think that I don't... should I be surprised that I am so disagreeable among atheists?

 

All Christians, are part of one body... but all Christians know Christ -- and they will be known by their fruits. If their fruits are rotten, how can they be built on the foundation of Christ?

 

Pritishd, I'm trying to discuss with you. Often tone over a board is difficult to see. I try my best, to deliever the appropriet respose for the correct time/people. The Bible says God resists the proud and gives grace to the humble. So, I try to do that. I don't want to defend myself to much, but I end up doing that anyways... I just want to see Christ glorified, as He is.

[Mythra]

Neil, I'm still waiting to be convinced of the reason behind no reason.  It's impossible.  The Psalm writer really wasn't kidding when he talked about those who said in their hearts there was no God.  I agree with that psalm writter... so there is really nothing you can say.

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Ooh. That was a close one, Daniel. You almost called us fools.

 

And we all know what your LORD says about people who call other people fools.

 

Of course, Jesus did it, right after he said not to do it. Shit, maybe you are christlike after all.

[Poonis]

This is your hope, but why do you waste your time?  What awaits you in the nothingness you believe awaits you in death?  You say a Christian wastes their time here, but even if there were 991 gods to choose from, choosing only 1 still makes a person infinitely better off than someone who chooses none.  0 times infinity, is still zero.  How many times do you have to multiply until you reach even my number of 1?  Not even infinity will get you there, and you have nothing to stand on.  Who wastes there time here then... it is you, who go back and forth in debate, saying there is no God, as you walk into the nothingness -- how constructive is that.  You build up words and thoughts, beliefs and disbeliefs, but it is all for nothing.  What are you wagering if nothing awaits you?  Can nothing prove true or false in the end for you atheists?  But, you build up yourselves because you think you have a belief... that is, you think you have a belief... but what is a belief that says, "I believe in nothing."  Congratulations.

 

/snip lengthy post

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daniel_1012:

 

Keep this in mind when reading the rest of my reply, as it is foundational to my lack of belief as an atheist:

 

When I die, I neither desire to go to your Heaven, nor do I fear going to your Hell.

 

Now, having carved that in stone, I want you, daniel_1012, to go to your Heaven when you die. I think you desire it, deserve it, and should have no choice but to eternally live in your Heaven.

 

As for me, since you will be in your Heaven when you die, by the very essence of you existing in said Heaven, your Heaven has now transformed into my Hell, for no other reason but simply because you are there.

 

Wherever you are not found in the afterlife, daniel_1012, that is my idea of my Heaven.

[daniel_1012]

Thats right daniel. don't answer me again. i'll just sit back and wait... ignorant christian moron. the funny thing is... we walked your path and are telling you why its bad. You never walked our path, but think you know it, when you do not even know your own. pathetic

bye,

BC

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Can you direct me to the post that I should respond to? I'll try to answer, most of the time. It's just people like crazy-tiger, whom God resists -- the proud.

 

I'm more than happy to carry on a conversation with people that want to discuss things... otherwise

 

You have chosen to ignore crazy-tiger. View this post · Un-ignore crazy-tiger

 

I'm sure I'll be seeing this again shortly.

[Mr. Neil]

I just want to point out, again, that Daniel will comment on practically anything I say (or at least whatever he can distort), but when the big question arises, he has no response, and he runs away.

 

Of course, if you want to prove me wrong, you can always just tell me what a spirit is.

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And I see that you still don't have a coherent definition of a spirit.  You just continue to run from this question.

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So, why can't I get an answer to this question, Danny?

 

Can I answer for you? It's because you don't have one. You don't know what a spirit is, and thus any reference you make to supernatural beings, such as God, is meaningless.

 

Of course, it's just easier to behave as though I never asked the question in the first place.

 

Evasion is the calling card of the TrueChristian™.

[daniel_1012]

Neil,

 

The Spirit is our eternally dwelling selves. Now, don't ask for a reason to my belief... you are an atheists. Atheists don't believe in reason... wait yes they do, no they don't... yes they do!! no they don't!

[Mr. Neil]

Nice try.

 

I said a coherent definition, Daniel. Saying that spirits are "eternally dwelling selves" tells me nothing, Danny, because all you are saying is that it's something that exists externally from the body. That's more like telling me what a spirit isn't rather than what it is. But that's not actually a definition.

 

Give me the distinguishing characteristics of a spirit.

[daniel_1012]

Nice try.

 

I said a coherent definition, Daniel.  Give me the distinguishing characteristics of a spirit.

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Neil... we are not human beings thinking on spiritual occasions, having spiritual experiences... we are spiritual beings, having a human being experience. Understand that, and you will understand it is self defining. Human existance, is the proof of the our spirit.

[Mr. Neil]

Neil... we are not human beings thinking on spiritual occasions, having spiritual experiences... we are spiritual beings, having a human being experience.  Understand that, and you will understand it is self defining.  Human existance, is the proof of the our spirit.

If it's self-defining, then you should have no trouble telling me what it is.

 

Again, here you are using the term "spirit" and "spiritual" as though they are coherent, and yet you don't know what they are. These statements are meaningless.

[SkepticOfBible]

 

1) I don't know that Amanda is a Christian.  She is a universalist,

 

I am not saying all Catholics are Christians -- I am saying Catholics *can be Christians* and there is a difference.

 

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So Catholics and Universalist are not true christians. Mmm so I was correct to say, that in your mind unless they succumb to your thinking you would not consider them christians.

 

So what is a christian?

 

I let your own people answer that for you

 

A Christian According to Carm.org

 

Within Christianity there are very few essential doctrines that make someone any Christian. These essential doctrines are,

Jesus is both God and man (John 1:1,14; 8:24; Col. 2:9; 1 John 4:1-4).

Jesus rose from the dead physically (John 2:19-21; 1 Cor. 15:14).

Salvation is by grace through faith (Rom. 5:1; Eph. 2:8-9; Gal. 3:1-2; 5:1-4).

The gospel is the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus (1 Cor. 15:1-4; Gal. 1:8-9).

There is only one God (Exodus 20:3; Isaiah 43:10; 44:6,8)

God exists as a Trinity of persons:  Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. (See Trinity)

Jesus was born of the Virgin Mary (nature of incarnation)

As long as a church believes in these essential doctrines, then it is Christian

 

Our salvation is based on our relationship with Christ.

 

There you go, according to your world view there are some essential doctrines and if they agree to these essentials then they christians and have a valid relationship with Christ.

 

Catholic and Universalist believe in all the doctrines according to your world view. At most they are a different denomination.

 

So are you gonna deny that they are not christians?Why?

 

I don't want to put her anymore on trial in this post than necessary.  I imagine she will find it, I hope... and from it gather what is necessary to be brought to the person of Christ, and Christ personally.

I also quoted Pug and Ipraciyan

 

Amanda in her current state... has no hope of converting anyone to Christ, that is my humble opinion. 

And you consider yourself as the best representative of christ.

 

 

2) Jesus is the roll model, and he can often be seen cutting to the hearts of the hypocrites, flipping over tables on occasion, speaking grace to the humble, loving the poor, rebuking the proud, rebuking the devil, informing the guilty of hell, and loving sinners enough to act perfectly whatever the time may require.  Chirst/God is not a benevolent ball of jelly in the sky who doesn't care what people do -- He is righteous, he is holy, and he is quite concerned.  Christ displayed the many necessary sides of Godliness... and great is its myster as we can both see.

 

You forgot to include humbleness and patience. So you consider yourself, Holy and righteousness. Hmmmmm

 

Plus as Crazy-tiger pointed out, you also lied. Is that a christ-like attitude too?

 

And I don't you consider your yourself as concerned person.

 

  I don't want to defend myself to much, but I end up doing that anyways... I just want to see Christ glorified, as He is.

 

Christians cannot make up their mind regarding how to glorify christ, so how do I know that your speak the truth.

[Guest Guess who...]

You have chosen to ignore crazy-tiger. View this post · Un-ignore crazy-tiger

 

I'm sure I'll be seeing this again shortly.

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Daniel... I've been trying to discuss things with you, but your evasions and outright lies have been blocking any kind of discussion...

 

I'm not the only one who's pointed this out to you, so maybe you should consider just who is refusing to discuss things.

It's just people like crazy-tiger, whom God resists -- the proud.

Am I proud? Or is it just that you WANT me to be proud so that you can give me a convinient label?

 

You, on the other hand, are proud of your own idiocy... and what does that say about you?

[Mr. Neil]

Once more, Daniel. Without negative definition this time, what is a spirit?

[daniel_1012]

So Catholics and Universalist are not true christians. Mmm so I was correct to say, that in your mind unless they succumb to your thinking you would not consider them christians.

 

So what is a christian?

 

I let your own people answer that for you

 

A Christian According to Carm.org

 

I would definitely say Universalists are not Christians. That is my current stance, and I can't see it any other way at this time. No... I am not saying Catholics are not Christians. I'm saying being Catholic doesn't make your Christian anymore than being Christian makes you Catholic. Some people think being American makes you a Chrsitian... it's the same thing really. Catholics CAN BE and many ARE Christians... but no denominational title by default, makes you a Christian -- it is Christ that does this.

 

And you consider yourself as the best representative of christ.

 

No, I wouldn't say say... just one of many different representatives. I am but a part of the body, which has many functions.

 

There is one things that makes a man Christian... that is Christ. Go to Him, and you will be one. Go to an idol, and you will not be a Christian.

 

Number 16:5

And he spake unto Korah and unto all his company, saying, Even to morrow the LORD will show who are his, and who is holy; and will cause him to come near unto him: even him whom he hath chosen will he cause to come near unto him.

 

2 Tim 2:17b-19

 

...Among them are Hymenaeus and Philetus, who have wandered away from the truth. They say that the resurrection has already taken place, and they destroy the faith of some. Nevertheless, God's solid foundation stands firm, sealed with this inscription: "The Lord knows those who are his," and, "Everyone who confesses the name of the Lord must turn away from wickedness."

 

Who are the Lord's? The Lord knows.

 

Revelation 3:9-13

 

Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee. Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown. Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name. He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

[crazy-tiger]

Once more, Daniel.  Without negative definition this time, what is a spirit?

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Neil... I don't think he's going to answer in any way that will actually define it.

[daniel_1012]

You have chosen to ignore crazy-tiger. View this post · Un-ignore crazy-tiger

 

That's so beautiful.

[Mr. Neil]

Neil... I don't think he's going to answer in any way that will actually define it.

Exactly. He can't. No Christian can answer that question. But the point is that he continues to use that word as though it means something.

[Guest Guess who...]

You have chosen to ignore crazy-tiger. View this post · Un-ignore crazy-tiger

 

That's so beautiful.

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That's so childish...

 

What gets me is you're trying to get me riled up when I wasn't even replying to what you said.

 

 

 

By the way, Jesus said that by their fruits you shall know them... The fruits you are showing are rotten.

[crazy-tiger]

Neil... I don't think he's going to answer in any way that will actually define it.

Exactly. He can't. No Christian can answer that question. But the point is that he continues to use that word as though it means something.

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As far as he's concerned, it does... and in a way he's right... but only if you presume it means something in the first place.

 

Can we say "circular argument"?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Bet he's going to make some kind of silly comment about how good it is to see the "ignore" thing instead of this post...

[Cerise]

pritishd -- great is the mystery of Godliness.

 

I am not the same as all Christians, and they are not all the same as me.  Christians are not as cookie-cutter-Christ as many here would like to believe.  For, as Paul wrote, we are all one body.

 

In the military of any country, sometimes you need guys to go in an blow stuff up.  Sometimes, you gotta just send in your military to clear a path for other useful tools.  Othertimes, you sneak in, you spy, you watch, and you are extra careful when needed.  Othertimes you fly overhead, and meet them in the sky.  There are many jobs available, but there is one task.  At times I may seem quiet, calm, and othertimes I may turn over some tables in the church of hypocrites.

 

So is this you, waving a bloody sword for Jesus daniel?

 

What would you say if Amanda, or TAP, or pug, or even one of us suddenly came to you with news of a revelation that you were actually worshipping satan, and not jesus? Could you even tell the difference yourself?

 

Why should we take your word on anything? You certainly don't take ours. How do I know you aren't really a follower of the anti-christ? You seem to have no problem contradicting the ways of followers of Christ as outlined in the bible. Should we take that as a sign that you are simply trying to schnooker us?

[daniel_1012]

Guest-tiger,

 

You're right there. I shouldn't waste my time doing that sort of thing... it is fruitless, and I'm wrong for doing it.

[daniel_1012]

pritishd -- great is the mystery of Godliness.

What would you say if Amanda, or TAP, or pug, or even one of us suddenly came to you with news of a revelation that you were actually worshipping satan, and not jesus? Could you even tell the difference yourself?

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Well, first I would ask you not to speak in vain on anyone's behalf. Secondly, I would remain calm and seek to know my God on what is right.

[Cerise]

Well, first I would ask you not to speak in vain on anyone's behalf.  Secondly, I would remain calm and seek to know my God on what is right.

 

And just how would you go about doing that? Just how confident are you that you are getting answers from God and not from a malevolent force? How are you telling the difference?

[Guest Guess who...]

Guest-tiger,

 

You're right there.  I shouldn't waste my time doing that sort of thing... it is fruitless, and I'm wrong for doing it.

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Doing what sort of thing?

 

Though I'm impressed that you managed to admit to doing something wrong... (believe it or not, that just gained a measure of respect)