Five Questions That Christians Can't Answer

[Japedo]

You say there is no proof that Jesus Christ lived... Check out the Judeo-Claudian Histories! Ask any Jew! For that matter, go to Jerusalem, and see His crypt and the manger where He was "born"! And you think I'm blind! At least most of the others on this board are smart enough to see the evidence when it stares them in the face!

 

 

Really? Oh dear DDM, how much you assume...

 

 

Will my fellow ex-cers please point me in the direction of ALL this evidence... Thanks all!!!

 

 

And also on an aside note, Jews also deny Christ as being a godman... How much studying have you done in Judaism that gives you rights to speak for them?

[Ouroboros]

Personally, I try to set an example to both sides by living by this ideal: I judge each human being on their individual actions, and treat them as I would wish to be treated. Eye for an eye is a failed plan of God in the OT. If Bush and friends in politics go around stereotyping atheists as one thing (like saying all blacks are thieves, that sort of thing), then I will rise above their simple-mindedness and act towards them as I would have them act towards me. Ironic, isn't it? If a Christian speaks with respect towards me and makes a genuine effort at respecting me, then I will honor them for that, even if we disagree philosophically. Agreeing is not a prerequisite for respect.

Agree. I tend to mirror people. The way they treat me, that's the way I treat them. Sometimes I get into the game though of pushing the buttons to see what comes out.

[Ouroboros]

You say there is no proof that Jesus Christ lived... Check out the Judeo-Claudian Histories! Ask any Jew! For that matter, go to Jerusalem, and see His crypt and the manger where He was "born"! And you think I'm blind! At least most of the others on this board are smart enough to see the evidence when it stares them in the face!

Yup. There is one evidence that Jesus lived. His ossuary. His dead and burried my friend. So case closed. He wasn't your savior. Didn't you hear, they found his tomb, and the bones, together with family members.

 

You got to be kidding me though with the crypt and manger... that's so silly. Don't offend your own intelligence by actually believing that.

[Japedo]

I ask you this: were the veterans of the Viet-Nam War monsters, because they killed children that would have eventually blown up the bases through which they were marched by the Viet-Kong and the North Vietnamese Army, or was it the Viet-Kong and the N.V.A. themselves, who were the monsters? Perhaps you are the one who is morally bankrupt...

 

Furthermore, you have already proven how little of the Bible you actually understand by taking one verse, or another, and interpreting it to serve your own purposes. Maybe, if you actually read the entire book, you would be able to make a more impressive argument.

 

-R.D.-

 

 

We're not talking about humans, we're talking about Gods. Gods are suppose to rise above human failures. Unless of course you need to use human failures to excuse gods lame ass actions, which seems to be the road you're taking.

 

The only side in war I'll defend is the defense side. I do not believe in pre-emotive strikes, I do not believe in killing on an assumption then asking questions later. I believe in sovereign nations staying sovereign,minding our own p's and q's. I do not believe forcing freedom or forcing any other ideology upon people whom don't wish to have it. I have actually read the buybull, it is you that has failed in doing so. You accuse me of cherry picking but you turn a blind eye to ANY and EVERYTHING that makes you uncomfortable or shows your god not as good as you profess.

 

 

As far as Soldiers go, they follow orders. I do not hold them personally accountable for the war, they have no way of dictating the war. Being a military brat myself, I'm not naive to believe that soldiers have a choice in the matter. they (Americans) are property of the US Government and sign their lives and rights away when joining.

[Grandpa Harley]

That kind of animosity is a huge reason why Christians have such a negative perception of atheists, and other non-Christians. If you can't have a civil discussion, you resort to back-biting, name-calling, and other infantile tactics? People with your kind of attitude give "ex-christians" and atheists a bad name. Where, in any of my posts, did I attack you? Perhaps you're attacking me because you know, deep down inside yourself, that you really have no argument, and you're just pulling pieces of the Bible out at random to try to trip people up.

The hate and fear mongering propaganda from Christians is why atheists are so angry. So it goes both ways. I've been at dinner parties where the hosts give their opinion about how evil and dangerous atheists are, without knowing I am one. So does it make me furious? YOU BET! Hate speech even from the president makes us afraid. We're not non-patriots because we have no belief in your particular God. And with laws changed to comform the country to Souther Baptist style Christianity means that we also pay taxes that goes into Church rebuildings. Would that piss someone off? Absolutely. Why not have a "Atheist Based Initiative" from the President? I guess that won't happen. So in the end, why many atheists gets a bit offensive in their arguments, it's because of the social climate and the anti-atheist-culture that even is presented in our country.

 

And why are you so offended? Why are you suddenly so angry? Maybe because deep down you know that your religion is a lie?

Personally, I try to set an example to both sides by living by this ideal: I judge each human being on their individual actions, and treat them as I would wish to be treated. Eye for an eye is a failed plan of God in the OT. If Bush and friends in politics go around stereotyping atheists as one thing (like saying all blacks are thieves, that sort of thing), then I will rise above their simple-mindedness and act towards them as I would have them act towards me. Ironic, isn't it? If a Christian speaks with respect towards me and makes a genuine effort at respecting me, then I will honor them for that, even if we disagree philosophically. Agreeing is not a prerequisite for respect.

 

(sermon over )

 

As a response to someone who has earned my respect, I would like to cordially disagree.

 

Respect IS, imo, earned. I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt and treat them as equal, until they prove me wrong.

 

Now, for a Christian to come here for any reason other than discuss their doubts over their faith means that, to me, they've already proved me wrong, and deserve the respect I accord to burrowing lice and intestinal parasites.

[Grandpa Harley]

That kind of animosity is a huge reason why Christians have such a negative perception of atheists, and other non-Christians. If you can't have a civil discussion, you resort to back-biting, name-calling, and other infantile tactics? People with your kind of attitude give "ex-christians" and atheists a bad name. Where, in any of my posts, did I attack you? Perhaps you're attacking me because you know, deep down inside yourself, that you really have no argument, and you're just pulling pieces of the Bible out at random to try to trip people up.

 

As to why Lot offered his own daughters... Don't you think he realized that the crowd wouldn't do anything to them? Obviously, the crowd wanted to have homosexual sex... meaning that they were aroused by the MEN! What, exactly, would a gay man do with a straight woman? Ask any gay man, and they'll probably tell you the same thing: NOTHING! At the worst, they might have cast the girls out of the city, whereupon they could return to Abraham and live with him. In any case, there are many times when people made up ideas and reasons that they knew wouldn't work, just to stall for time. Take, for example, the Pharaoh and the Jewish mid-wives. When they were asked why they didn't kill the boys, they stalled for time by making up the story that Jewish women give birth too fast. Did the Pharaoh stop the killings? NO! It just bought them some more time, so they could figure out how to get rid of the boys, without killing them. But, do you criticize the Egyptians for their atrocities against the Israelites? NO! Do you, likewise, criticize the communists for their beating and killing of political dissidents, and non-violent Christians? Have I seen anything where you lament their crimes against humanity? NO! So, what you're saying is that it's okay for Christians and Jews to die, but it's not okay for us to fight back. Any you judge mine, and my God's morality!

 

As to how we know that Lot could have been raped... If Lot were that kind of pervert, don't you think he'd have started raping his daughters in his own home? Yet, he refers to them as virgins! It seems you're the one who is favouring the offenders over the victim, and believing them, on the prejudice that the victim was drunk, and the offenders were teen-aged girls! I wonder, how many times would you have gotten a female rapist off on charges of rape or molestation?

 

You say there is no proof that Jesus Christ lived... Check out the Judeo-Claudian Histories! Ask any Jew! For that matter, go to Jerusalem, and see His crypt and the manger where He was "born"! And you think I'm blind! At least most of the others on this board are smart enough to see the evidence when it stares them in the face!

 

I ask you this: were the veterans of the Viet-Nam War monsters, because they killed children that would have eventually blown up the bases through which they were marched by the Viet-Kong and the North Vietnamese Army, or was it the Viet-Kong and the N.V.A. themselves, who were the monsters? Perhaps you are the one who is morally bankrupt...

 

Furthermore, you have already proven how little of the Bible you actually understand by taking one verse, or another, and interpreting it to serve your own purposes. Maybe, if you actually read the entire book, you would be able to make a more impressive argument.

 

-R.D.-

 

A grand example of why I think this Christian should be dragged outside and a tyre full of petrol set on fire round his neck...

 

Lets cover this point by point

 

Gayz iz eebile and form rape gangs

 

All teen-aged gurlz iz ASKIN' for a good shaggin' by pops or the pastor, since they iz HARLOTZ!!!!11

 

Kill all KIDZ in war, coz they GROW UP and KILL OUR BOYZ!

 

This is why Christians are evil... they don't have morality of a rabid fox in a hen house. And you have the temerity to accuse Japedo of 'moral bankruptcy'... you venal, degenerate, sack of fermenting, verminous sheep excrement! You have NO RIGHT to project your sick mind on these people... I'd suggest you not only remove the log in your eye, but have the pole up your arse removed too... then hopefully die, in great pain, in a cold place, alone, in a viscid puddle or your own body waste, vomit and foul smelling pus, while being eaten by maggots...

[Robbobrob]

I claim to all you christians that all you christians have taken the whole Jewish scriptures "out of context" and have twisted its meaning completely out of shape....all you need to do is ask a Jew, they will show you (say, jewsforjudaism.com as one source) just how out of context christians are with the books of the old testament.

 

So, now that we can stop the hypocritical use of the fallacy of "out of context", maybe a discussion of the previously stated verses can begin...

[Guest Notanotherchristian!?]

Ugh!

 

WR will now parody most of the christians who come in here:

 

*Looking wide-eyed and innocent"

"I don't understand these "christians" you speak of....I certainly don't do any of the things you describe christians as doing. They must not be true christians like me. These verses you speak of? Where do they come from? I'm not familiar with any of them, but of course the bible is true. What? Of course I've read the bible! I just don't happen to be familiar with any of the verses or stories you are talking about from it, but I've read it anyway....really. Christianity is all about love. Why don't any of you want the love. Feel the love. It's all your's. You just have to believe. Why won't you believe?"

 

<same christian after several Ex-C member's ask too many hard questions>

 

*Looking contorted by snarling fury*

 

"None of you ever were really christians! If you don't accept my word...(oops)...I mean god's word as true, then you are going to go to hell, and I'm going to watch! I'll be right and you'll all be wrong...you'll see! I don't care if I get banned! Go on....ban me for telling the truth! You all hate Jesus! I'm going to heaven! You're all wrong and I'm going to enjoy watching you fall! I can't believe you hate Jesus so much! You all just hate Jesus."

 

End.

 

 

I love this post! Have you had the 'undercover' christian pretending to sign up as an atheist and after about 50 posts or so, gradually 'sees the light' yet? Makes you want to gag really... If someone has an opinion, at least be upfront about it...

[Euthyphro's Thorn]

Scientists, for example, found a "blank spot" in space. If this universe were created at random, how do you explain that scientists have yet to find any other such spot?

I have never heard about that "blank spot". Can you provide a link or a reference please?

...He and a couple of colleagues have found what they think is another void in space...

 

source

So much for only being one such spot, which blows whatever argument the Rev was trying to make.

 

Rev, quit pulling excuses out of your ass. Your religion is bullshit, period.

[Guest Notanotherchristian!?]

I claim to all you christians that all you christians have taken the whole Jewish scriptures "out of context" and have twisted its meaning completely out of shape....all you need to do is ask a Jew, they will show you (say, jewsforjudaism.com as one source) just how out of context christians are with the books of the old testament.

 

So, now that we can stop the hypocritical use of the fallacy of "out of context", maybe a discussion of the previously stated verses can begin...

 

 

 

This is half-true. Jews can use that argument, just as Muslims can say that about Christians and Jews, just as Christians say about Muslims regarding scripture.

 

Maybe we are all wrong.

 

I'm pretty sure the reason why Jews aren't Christians is because they don't believe the same things surely?

 

There is the growing trend in Christianity to disrregard the Jewish scriptures altogether and to look at thousands of years old texts through the lenses of the 21st century. Many even belittle the Jewishness of Jesus (Yeshua) himself! "Jesus was a Christian!" I remember one person exclaiming. No he wasn't. He was a Jew, and a faithful Jew at that.

 

What must be made clear is that Jesus and his followers were taking the many promises of return from exile and the promise of YHWH to become King through his Messiah (annointed one/nothing to do with being divine primarily) and were talking and behaving as though these promises were being fulfilled through Jesus and their community (Up until Jesus' crucifixion where things seem to go horribly wrong).

[Japedo]

This is half-true. Jews can use that argument, just as Muslims can say that about Christians and Jews, just as Christians say about Muslims regarding scripture.

 

 

 

You're mistaken,

 

First of all, the founding religion in both Islam and Christianity is the Jewish one. And in an odd twist in irony, Islam and Judaism have more in common with each other then either one does with Christianity .

 

Christianity would have zero 'prophecy' if not for the Hebrew texts and also have zero 'commandments' The issue is even though Judaism is a foundation of Christianity, Most Christians don't know jack diddly about the law and customs of Jews. They cherry pick what they like and understand and disregard the rest.

 

 

I'm pretty sure the reason why Jews aren't Christians is because they don't believe the same things surely?

 

Correct, for starters, Hell, Demons, Satan, the rapture and second coming, Blood for atonement, human gods, human sacrifice, virgin births, One has to earn their forgiveness both from god and the individuals they hurt the other gets a blind free pass to do what ever the hell they want with out consequence, One acknowledges 613 commandments the other only acknowledges 10. I could go on but I digress.

[Ouroboros]

Ah, that kind of spot, a void without stars. It is very detrimental to science, it's just as bad as science have a hard time explaining why the washing machine always "eat" one sock to leave you with odd pairs of socks. It must be God or maybe it's the Devil, hard to tell. Seriously, this isn't a "killer blow" for science at all. This is how science works! And when Christians react to news like this, it only proves they don't understand it. And this is why religious science tends to go wrong, because it reason through emotions and wishful thinking instead of trying to rationalize it. And it seems there's a problem to understand "randomness" and "order" too. Wouldn't it be just a huge problem too if the universe was ordered, and it had a blank spot? Yes it would, because ordered or chaotic, it does't matter, the void is just part of the mathematical formula to explain the distribution, so it's not "Creation" vs "Big Bang", it's "Old Mathematical Formula" vs "New Mathematical Formula", and the question is what goes into the new formula.

 

It is in the sense that the current formulation of Big Bang got some problems, which I knew from before, but it doesn't nullify science. That's what science is about. Formulate a model that fits what we observe, and when we see something that doesn't fit the model, then model has to change. News flash for you: Big Bang theory can actually be wrong and could be replaced eventually... no, here's the even bigger news flash for you: Big Bang theory isn't really the theory scientists go by anymore, it is called Inflation Theory which replaced Big Bang many years ago, but they are very similar and most everyone have kept the word Big Bang to describe the Inflation Theory just because it's a cool name. If the Brane Model of the Universe fits, then we might look into an even more different Inflation/Big Bang theory, maybe we will call it Infusion Theory, who the heck knows, and account for the "blank spots". Years ago they found that ripples in the back ground radiation, which shouldn't be there, and they're still a challenge. But my question is: why would a God create rippled space and blank spots some billion of light years apart? If God is that crazy, then who can say if God used or didn't use Evolution to create man, and if he maybe created 40 billion other species on some far away planets in the Universe? When we find them, will that be your answer? God created them too?

[Robbobrob]

I claim to all you christians that all you christians have taken the whole Jewish scriptures "out of context" and have twisted its meaning completely out of shape....all you need to do is ask a Jew, they will show you (say, jewsforjudaism.com as one source) just how out of context christians are with the books of the old testament.

 

So, now that we can stop the hypocritical use of the fallacy of "out of context", maybe a discussion of the previously stated verses can begin...

 

 

 

This is half-true. Jews can use that argument, just as Muslims can say that about Christians and Jews, just as Christians say about Muslims regarding scripture.

 

Maybe we are all wrong.

 

I'm pretty sure the reason why Jews aren't Christians is because they don't believe the same things surely?

 

There is the growing trend in Christianity to disrregard the Jewish scriptures altogether and to look at thousands of years old texts through the lenses of the 21st century. Many even belittle the Jewishness of Jesus (Yeshua) himself! "Jesus was a Christian!" I remember one person exclaiming. No he wasn't. He was a Jew, and a faithful Jew at that.

 

What must be made clear is that Jesus and his followers were taking the many promises of return from exile and the promise of YHWH to become King through his Messiah (annointed one/nothing to do with being divine primarily) and were talking and behaving as though these promises were being fulfilled through Jesus and their community (Up until Jesus' crucifixion where things seem to go horribly wrong).

 

I like the reverse logic presented here. Jews are not the ones who need to believe as Christians, they are the original keeperrs of the Holy books they have in common. Christianity is the group that spun off of judaism, and has decided to believe in non-Jewish things like Original Sin.

 

Muslims are also a spin-off religion, once again, reinterpreting the Jewish laws to their own devices.

 

My point really is about attacking Atheists and non-believers for "out of context" verse attacks, when Christians have done that for centuries within their own personal interpretations of the Bible.

 

I would, and many here as well, argue that you are right....you are all wrong: Jew, Christian, and Muslim.....but that is not the arguement here.

[South2003]

Well? Have you stopped beating your wife?

 

Yes - You have admitted to beating your wife

No - You have admitted to still beating your wife.

 

Anothe way of saying - Does Yawheh exist?

 

Yes - Then Yahweh exist

No - Prove it. Since you can't prove it, then Yahweh exist

 

WTF!

[South2003]

Statement:

Correct, for starters, Hell, Demons, Satan, the rapture and second coming, Blood for atonement, human gods, human sacrifice, virgin births, One has to earn their forgiveness both from god and the individuals they hurt the other gets a blind free pass to do what ever the hell they want with out consequence, One acknowledges 613 commandments the other only acknowledges 10. I could go on but I digress.

 

Answer:

deep down inside yourself, that you really have no argument, and you're just pulling pieces of the Bible out at random to try to trip people up.

 

Oh such intelligence from a raging fundie. Trip over this then: http://www.evilbible.com

[South2003]

Statement:

Correct, for starters, Hell, Demons, Satan, the rapture and second coming, Blood for atonement, human gods, human sacrifice, virgin births, One has to earn their forgiveness both from god and the individuals they hurt the other gets a blind free pass to do what ever the hell they want with out consequence, One acknowledges 613 commandments the other only acknowledges 10. I could go on but I digress.

 

Answer:

deep down inside yourself, that you really have no argument, and you're just pulling pieces of the Bible out at random to try to trip people up.

 

Oh such intelligence from a raging fundie. Trip over this then: http://www.evilbible.com

[Grandpa Harley]

There is the growing trend in Christianity to disrregard the Jewish scriptures altogether and to look at thousands of years old texts through the lenses of the 21st century. Many even belittle the Jewishness of Jesus (Yeshua) himself! "Jesus was a Christian!" I remember one person exclaiming. No he wasn't. He was a Jew, and a faithful Jew at that.

 

What must be made clear is that Jesus and his followers were taking the many promises of return from exile and the promise of YHWH to become King through his Messiah (annointed one/nothing to do with being divine primarily) and were talking and behaving as though these promises were being fulfilled through Jesus and their community (Up until Jesus' crucifixion where things seem to go horribly wrong).

 

Yeshua was one of many making such claims. The best contender was Simon of Gitta, who does make Jewish, Roman, and ,passim, extant Christian records as a major figure in 1st Century Messianic movements...

[arseniajoaquin]

This might be a good topic to pin. Every Christian I have ever posed these questions to has never been able to give me a straight answer:

 

1) Which one better describes an all-loving God: a.) One that gives human beings one chance only to get it right and if you don't condemns you to an eternal hell, or b.) One that allows you multiple chances to get it right so that you can spend eternity in the best place possible?

 

2) People who speak of "hell" associate it with divine punishment, but punishment is usually used as a corrective measure. How do people suffering in an eternal hell learn their lesson? Doesn't that make hell mere torture with absolutely no point to it?

 

3) There are thousands of different denominations in Christianity, each thinking they have it right. All other religions think that they have it right, as well. How can you be sure that you have it right, when the odds are that you are actually wrong?

 

4) Where in the Bible does Jesus say that people must worship him or pray to him? Doesn't he identify himself as the "Son of Man" who was sent by the Father?

 

5) Jesus himself and his disciples seem to believe in reincarnation, as evidenced in Matthew 11:10-15, Matthew 17:10-13 and John 9:1-2. Why is the word of Paul in Hebrews 9:27 taken over Jesus in Christian doctrine?

 

Re No. 1 - You are not given only one chance, you are given all the chances, that's why there's no end of the world yet. There are bases of judgment and God laid down the bases already. In the law, the punishment is there and yet if people are not afraid and God would not have any other alternative but to give the corresponding punishment to the hard necked and the corresponding reward to the obedient. That shows that there is justice and fairness. God is an all-loving God, but He has to be just and fair.

 

2 - The learning process is here on earth. There should be an end and that would be the end - either heaven or hell. You are the one to choose, don't blame God or anyone if you will be thrown to hell.

 

3 - Those who believe in God has one standard and that is the Holy Bible. Follow the Holy Bible and God will not punish you. To know the truth, whatever would be the problem, search the scriptures and surely the answer is there. Good is that thing that God says to be good, and not what any man consider as good.

 

4 - Prayer is addressed to the Father but it should be in the name of the Son. If you worship the Father, you are worshiping the Son. If you do not like to worship the Son, that's up to you. You would be worshiping yourself if you are not subject to God.

 

5 - If you are saying John the Baptist is the reincarnation of Elijah, that's not true. There is no reincarnation in the Holy Bible for if there is, then it would be conflicting as who would be judged? The first or the second or the subsequent?

 

A better study of the Holy Bible should be undertaken to understand it.

[Deva]

Re No. 1 - You are not given only one chance, you are given all the chances, that's why there's no end of the world yet. There are bases of judgment and God laid down the bases already. In the law, the punishment is there and yet if people are not afraid and God would not have any other alternative but to give the corresponding punishment to the hard necked and the corresponding reward to the obedient. That shows that there is justice and fairness. God is an all-loving God, but He has to be just and fair.

 

That God would not have any other alternative shows that you worship a limited God.

 

As for your point 2- the learning process. How is it a learning process to be punished with hell? The first sentence doesn't go with the rest of it.

 

Point 3- newsflash, there are people on earth who believe in God, but it isn't the Bible God. Hindus, Muslims believe in a God or Gods.

 

Point 4- yes, when praying you are worshipping yourself. That's all you are doing.

 

As for the rest of your post, we have studied the Bible enough. We find it lacking in logic and morality.

[Robbobrob]

3 - Those who believe in God has one standard and that is the Holy Bible. Follow the Holy Bible and God will not punish you. To know the truth, whatever would be the problem, search the scriptures and surely the answer is there. Good is that thing that God says to be good, and not what any man consider as good.

Which version of the Holy Bible is the correct to study...there are many, many versions, and each has subtle and not so subtle differences. Should the Old Testament be Jewish Torah? Should it be only copies made by Christians? If we pick the wrong version, will God punish us?

 

Good is what God says to be good?....cool, I'm up for slavery, and killing, and torture, and all the things even us simple imperfect humans know to be morally wrong, yet were approved of by God.

 

Ick.

[mwc]

Re No. 1 - You are not given only one chance, you are given all the chances, that's why there's no end of the world yet. There are bases of judgment and God laid down the bases already. In the law, the punishment is there and yet if people are not afraid and God would not have any other alternative but to give the corresponding punishment to the hard necked and the corresponding reward to the obedient. That shows that there is justice and fairness. God is an all-loving God, but He has to be just and fair.

This is true. But at what cost? How much does YOUR PERSONAL SALVATION COST?

 

Think hard before you answer.

 

Let's start with jesus and the 12. He dies and flies away. Fine. The counter starts. There is a world of people to "save." The longer jesus delays his "return" the larger the population becomes because he did not do the wise thing and cause a population cap but instead the population slowly rose until relatively recently and then BOOM and explosion.

 

So the "12" head out and start the conversion process. It goes slowly because they are only targeting Jews. Paul hits the scene and things really start to take off. But is it fast enough? Not nearly. The population is still out-pacing conversions. People are dying in "sin." People are going to hell in record numbers. Jesus is still not coming back though. The clock is still running.

 

More and more people convert but the faster they convert the faster the are born and the faster they die away. This is a losing game. All over the world people are going to their graves in "sin." Still jesus delays.

 

"False" religions like Islam crop up drawing people away from the narrow path. Mormonism. Scientology. The pagan religions of the past never truly fall away. Where is jesus? The population of the planet creeps near to 7 BILLION people. Only 1/3 of those have any claim to a form of xianity and this is as wide-spread as the religion has ever been. The other 2/3 are dying in "sin."

 

In your assertion that your "god" is patient and that patience is contributing to MORE people being saved and coming closer to him it is quite apparent that the OPPOSITE is happening. The longer he has delayed his return the MORE people have went to their graves in "sin."

 

The road to "hell" is paved with your "god's" patience.

 

Had he returned shortly after his "resurrection" and subsequent "assent" into the heavens fewer people would have been taken to the eternal glory with him but far, far fewer would have went to "hell" and since those others would have never been born (like you and I) to begin with their final destination become a non-issue. So the price for YOUR PERSONAL SALVATION is extremely high since billions had to be born and subsequently die, in "sin," just so you could be born and come to know jesus.

 

How selfish you are if you find that to be an acceptable price for others to have paid just so you could get your "reward."

 

2 - The learning process is here on earth. There should be an end and that would be the end - either heaven or hell. You are the one to choose, don't blame God or anyone if you will be thrown to hell.

What's to learn? If I die. Go to "hell" and then think to myself "Perhaps I erred?" God cannot accept that? I learned did I not?

 

You do realize that "hell" is never once mentioned in the bible, right? As a "translator" I am assuming you do know this. So where is it that we truly go? Since all the places mentioned are NOT the same place it leaves several possibilities. Just because they sound similar doesn't mean they are the same.

 

3 - Those who believe in God has one standard and that is the Holy Bible. Follow the Holy Bible and God will not punish you. To know the truth, whatever would be the problem, search the scriptures and surely the answer is there. Good is that thing that God says to be good, and not what any man consider as good.

And which bible is that? There is no one standard bible. Even you made your own translation according to your web page.

 

Maybe it isn't the bible at all but any of the other things that are supposed to be from the god(s)? How are we supposed to know unless the god(s) tell us? Your word? Who are YOU?

 

I don't recall jesus ever saying "Read the soon to be compiled New Testament for the latest instructions. Oh and really give that Saul/Paul a thorough once over...especially if you're a Gentile. <wink wink>" No endorsements at all from "on high" unless you count the pulpit/throne.

 

4 - Prayer is addressed to the Father but it should be in the name of the Son. If you worship the Father, you are worshiping the Son. If you do not like to worship the Son, that's up to you. You would be worshiping yourself if you are not subject to God.

Heresy. The OT says nothing and I mean NOTHING about a "son" of YHWH and it says full well that if I want to go directly to GOD (the "father") then I can all I want and anytime I want...even as a lowly Gentile. There is nothing between me and old YHWH. The whole thing that I need jesus as a go between is absolutely, positively false. Made up junk. If I felt like it I could worship and pray to YHWH day and night without you or anyone else's help and be just fine. If I chose to do so that would NOT mean I had anything to do with your pagan "son" god. Go peddle that somewhere else.

 

5 - If you are saying John the Baptist is the reincarnation of Elijah, that's not true. There is no reincarnation in the Holy Bible for if there is, then it would be conflicting as who would be judged? The first or the second or the subsequent?

You like judgment. I guess that's how you keep your "flock" in-line.

 

A better study of the Holy Bible should be undertaken to understand it.

Teach me o' sage.

 

mwc

[South2003]

The Reveeeeeev said: Free will is a gift...

 

Like any gift, free will can be abused...

 

 

Yeah, it's my "free" gift so why should you or anyone cares what I damn well do with it...my gift?

[Deva]

The Reveeeeeev said: Free will is a gift...

 

Like any gift, free will can be abused...

 

 

Yeah, it's my "free" gift so why should you or anyone cares what I damn well do with it...my gift?

 

 

If free will is a gift, I want to give that sucker back if its going to send me to hell!

 

Absolutely ridiculous, the notion of "gift" in relation to xianity. It does not compute.

[Grandpa Harley]

Animals have free will too... we call it 'instinct' since we like to feel we're better than them, but it works just the same...

[Toaster]

Maybe you just haven't been asking the right Christians.........