Christians Know The Truth

[Dagan]

I have far more intimate experiences with God when I'm alone praying and reading the bible.

And I have far more intimate experiences with my pecker when I'm alone and reading Penthouse. So what?

You may believe otherwise, but it's just you in there, talking to yourself.

Every man talks to his pecker, but you should worry if it ever talks back.

 

Wait, that was supposed to be about God...

 

God did talk out of a man's ass. Does that count?

[Franko47]

 

 

Some of you were presented with a small test and failed. Being saved isn't difficult if you are doing it right. If you are keeping your eyes on the Lord and not this world. The bible says there is coming a deception so great it would deceive the very elect if it were possible. And personally I think this site is filled with people who fell for that deception. And why is that, because your faith wasn't deep enough to withstand some trouble. The Lord gives the power to overcome to whoever honestly ask for it but many of you had a "church" faith not a real deep faith.

 

 

Keep babbling. You just know so much about the many people and their varied experiences at this site.

 

The more you talk, the more you confirm our suspicions.

 

Self-styled prophet, constantly relying on the "deceptions" of everything, and "dark forces" to justify the fact that intelligent former Christians just no longer buy this stuff. There is no attempt to even understand our experiences.

 

It is you who lacks a bit of faith. You want to live in a hostile universe, where the earth is a huge haunted house with menacing monsters hiding in the shadows everywhere. Most of humanity are drenched in sin, and they are all going to burn in hell. All of thus constructed by a tyrant god, who forces humanity to live in shame and anguish, and that we have no real value unless we look to people like you to help us find the true "Jesus" that will save us and then everything will be alright.

 

I think you are bitter about life, and have accepted a bitter sense of theology and warped view of human history, let alone Christian history. You also pretty well hate humanity and the world. What you propose is a form of insanity, where everything can be explained and rationalized by believing in invisible monsters, and other forms of pagan superstitions.

 

From where I'm standing you are the one sitting in the darkness, Mr. Defender. Sorry to be so blunt. Even when I was a practicing Christian I recognized "obsessive" people like yourself. They would come into the church all grim and serious, and try and tell us we were all "wrong" in our method relating to God, and our method of worship.

 

I wouldn't worry about us. I'm more worried about you.

 

Peace.

 

If that's possible for people like you.

[Dagan]

Blah blah blah I'm right you're wrong blah blah blah you were never a true Christian blah blah blah I have a real relationship with God you never had blah blah blah.

 

Too much snow on the streets to preach today? Come on, surely a true Christian would endure a little hardship for the faith!

 

You keep saying the same things over and over again. It's obvious that you do not care about us as human beings. You do not want to dialogue. We are just targets at the end of your megaphone. You're not listening to us, you just want us to listen to you.

 

I think it's time to call in the banhammer.

[OnceConvinced]

 

1. I know what you meant when you said you "saw" something. There are people who researched trying to disprove christianity and wound up getting saved so I don't buy the painstaking research after painstaking research bit.

I myself spent my life painstakingly reseraching God and the bible. I came to the consclusion that it's all a crock of shit. I just wish I'd figured that out many years ago.

 

3. I'm sorry you know magic doesn't exist? Mind proving that to me? How do you know magic doesn't exist.

Every magic trick has a simple rational explanation. Perhaps you should watch more TV shows that expose that sort of rubbish?

4. Why would I wait for Santa I don't celebrate christmas. Its a pagan holiday.

Christianity in general has its roots in paganism. Why do you follow it?

 

3. If it wasn't true, it wouldn't offend you. I don't see why a bunch of atheist are getting so emotional when I say your faith wasn't that deep. I mean atheist try to tell me I was never a true atheist all the time and it doesn't bother me one bit.

Can you not understand? There are many of us who spent our lives diligently serving your God. We put all our time and effort and in some cases a lot of money into it. So when some arrogant prick like you comes along and tells us we were never true Christians or that we had no depth, you bet there are gonna be many of us pissed off. Because we know just how seriously we took it. We know just how deep it was to us. To us, you are simply a loud mouthed idiot who doesn't have a clue and makes presumptions about us based on your interpretation of the bible and what you believe God has taught you. You just don't get it. You are like some the kid that tries to tell the teacher how to do his job. The recruit who tries to tell the drill sergeant how he should be training the recruits. We have all been where you have been. We can see that you are all hot air. For many of us, we were you. And you wonder why so many of us get so emotional? Wake up!

[Guest FaithDefender619]

 

2. Obviously racism is an erroneous view point, but thats not the point. I was shown the error of my way and left atheism for christianity

 

You were an atheist?

 

No you could not have been a TRUE atheist or you would not believe in god now

 

 

Seriously though if you were really an atheist, why is you seem to have no idea what atheists really think about anything?

 

1. Sure was.

 

2. Not the first time I've heard that.

 

3. Like?

[Guest FaithDefender619]

 

1. I know what you meant when you said you "saw" something. There are people who researched trying to disprove christianity and wound up getting saved so I don't buy the painstaking research after painstaking research bit.

I myself spent my life painstakingly reseraching God and the bible. I came to the consclusion that it's all a crock of shit. I just wish I'd figured that out many years ago.

 

3. I'm sorry you know magic doesn't exist? Mind proving that to me? How do you know magic doesn't exist.

Every magic trick has a simple rational explanation. Perhaps you should watch more TV shows that expose that sort of rubbish?

4. Why would I wait for Santa I don't celebrate christmas. Its a pagan holiday.

Christianity in general has its roots in paganism. Why do you follow it?

 

3. If it wasn't true, it wouldn't offend you. I don't see why a bunch of atheist are getting so emotional when I say your faith wasn't that deep. I mean atheist try to tell me I was never a true atheist all the time and it doesn't bother me one bit.

Can you not understand? There are many of us who spent our lives diligently serving your God. We put all our time and effort and in some cases a lot of money into it. So when some arrogant prick like you comes along and tells us we were never true Christians or that we had no depth, you bet there are gonna be many of us pissed off. Because we know just how seriously we took it. We know just how deep it was to us. To us, you are simply a loud mouthed idiot who doesn't have a clue and makes presumptions about us based on your interpretation of the bible and what you believe God has taught you. You just don't get it. You are like some the kid that tries to tell the teacher how to do his job. The recruit who tries to tell the drill sergeant how he should be training the recruits. We have all been where you have been. We can see that you are all hot air. For many of us, we were you. And you wonder why so many of us get so emotional? Wake up!

 

1. And many people have done the same and come to the conclusion that it is true.

 

2. SO because its on tv it must be true?

 

3. That's what the bible says. You didn't have depth to your faith. You had one test and fell away. All the time, money and effort means nothign because you still fell away and forsook your faith. And that is proof that your faith had no depth. Mormons give money, muslims give time, Seventh Day Adventist give effort and they all follow a false religion. That doesn't mean anything. You again seem to think that your time in church equated to real faith. It doesn't I'm sorry.

 

4. Yeah I kinda do wonder why you get emotional, I mean many of you have no problems attacking christians and christianity but when a christian tells you that you never really were one of us or you were really only fooling yourself then yeah it does make me wonder. Why does it even matter? I mean I as an atheist spent as much time as I do debating for christianity now as I did for atheism. I often spread the gospel of atheism even deconverting some of my christian friends and even had my mom shook in her faith. I would mock and scoff at christians all the time when I was an atheist. I was a serious atheist, I didn't just disagree with christians I hated them, often when I was on myspace or even among some of my atheist friends I would get branded a "mal-atheist". But today when people say oh you were never a real atheist or what ever I'm like so what? I was an atheist probably more atheist than most atheist on here now but I don't really care if you don't think I was one. And even if you do believe that i was one so what that is to my own shame that I was in such a wicked and foolish mindset. I think the emotion comes in not because I'm some "loud mouth" idiot but because what I'm saying is true. Most of you had a very shallow faith. It was true with me when I was a catholic I had a very shallow faith and I was pretty active in the church. You keep telling me about what you did and how much you did. What it sounds like to me is that your whole christian walk was more about you and what you did than about Jesus.

[Guest FaithDefender619]

Blah blah blah I'm right you're wrong blah blah blah you were never a true Christian blah blah blah I have a real relationship with God you never had blah blah blah.

 

Too much snow on the streets to preach today? Come on, surely a true Christian would endure a little hardship for the faith!

 

You keep saying the same things over and over again. It's obvious that you do not care about us as human beings. You do not want to dialogue. We are just targets at the end of your megaphone. You're not listening to us, you just want us to listen to you.

 

I think it's time to call in the banhammer.

 

1. It doesn't snow in San Diego

 

2. Sure I care about you as human beings but its obvious many of you weren't really christians if you were then why do so many of you LIE on what the bible says and what we believe. I am listening to you which is why I can observe the things you are saying and gather that many of you were faking the funk.

 

3. Go ahead and ban me. Wouldn't be the first site that threatened me with banning.

[Guest FaithDefender619]

 

 

Some of you were presented with a small test and failed. Being saved isn't difficult if you are doing it right. If you are keeping your eyes on the Lord and not this world. The bible says there is coming a deception so great it would deceive the very elect if it were possible. And personally I think this site is filled with people who fell for that deception. And why is that, because your faith wasn't deep enough to withstand some trouble. The Lord gives the power to overcome to whoever honestly ask for it but many of you had a "church" faith not a real deep faith.

 

 

Keep babbling. You just know so much about the many people and their varied experiences at this site.

 

The more you talk, the more you confirm our suspicions.

 

Self-styled prophet, constantly relying on the "deceptions" of everything, and "dark forces" to justify the fact that intelligent former Christians just no longer buy this stuff. There is no attempt to even understand our experiences.

 

It is you who lacks a bit of faith. You want to live in a hostile universe, where the earth is a huge haunted house with menacing monsters hiding in the shadows everywhere. Most of humanity are drenched in sin, and they are all going to burn in hell. All of thus constructed by a tyrant god, who forces humanity to live in shame and anguish, and that we have no real value unless we look to people like you to help us find the true "Jesus" that will save us and then everything will be alright.

 

I think you are bitter about life, and have accepted a bitter sense of theology and warped view of human history, let alone Christian history. You also pretty well hate humanity and the world. What you propose is a form of insanity, where everything can be explained and rationalized by believing in invisible monsters, and other forms of pagan superstitions.

 

From where I'm standing you are the one sitting in the darkness, Mr. Defender. Sorry to be so blunt. Even when I was a practicing Christian I recognized "obsessive" people like yourself. They would come into the church all grim and serious, and try and tell us we were all "wrong" in our method relating to God, and our method of worship.

 

I wouldn't worry about us. I'm more worried about you.

 

Peace.

 

If that's possible for people like you.

 

1. I know what the fruit of your faith is. And I know from reading responses and reading threads on here that many weren't christian because so many poeple lie on what we believe and what the bible says and use such fallacious arguments against both. Its pretty surprising that a supposed former christian who read the bible dilligently doesn't know why we don't follow the law of moses, or that they think Dec 25 is biblical, or think that catholicism is the origianl christianity. That shows you had/have no real understanding of what you believed and still for the most part don't know what christians believe. That is the plain facts.

 

2. Don't blame your falling away on me. You give me far too much credit.

 

3. Which is to say that only the dumb christians still believe. Weren't people just trying to get on me for casting judegment on everybody? I guess its only wrong when I do it right?

 

3. Holy strawman arguments Batman.

 

4. Monsters hiding in the shadows everywhere?

Have you seen the world? A great deal of it is drenched in sin. And yes Jesus said many will fall down the road of destruction.

Define pagan superstitions.

And I have nothing to be bitter about, bitterness is an unchristian trait.

 

5. A lot of the way churches worship and relate to God are wrong. I don't see why people think that no matter what you believe christian is christian as long as you call yourself christian. The bible lays down specific qualifications that a christian will meet. There is a standard by which we can judge and as christians MUST judge. I know that doesn't fit into the world view of today where everything is relative and any and everybody can be a christian so long as they go to church on sunday but thats not what its about nor has it ever been about.

 

6. Very self righteous of you my friend.

[Kuroikaze]

1. Sure was.

 

Perhaps...realians are atheists AND alien conspiracy nuts, atheism is no guarantee of rational thought or skepticism.

 

2. Not the first time I've heard that.

 

Apparently you are incapable of noticing when I am making fun the things you say.

 

 

3. Like?

 

 

hmmm....suggesting that we all are just in denial of gods existence instead of truly and understandably skeptical of one. Even C.S. Lewis said he could understand how some people could find Christianity unbelievable.

 

It seems to me when you say "I was an atheist" what you mean is that you believed in god, but did not worship him. You would probably say something like "I was running from him" or something similar. I have heard (and given) enough testimonies to know how those things go.

 

I find it incredibly unlikely that you were an "atheist" for reasons of skepticism or rationality. I can say this with with good reason because you continue to asses our beliefs in a way that is not consistent with anything an atheist in favor of skepticism would say.

 

You grossly misrepresent scientific claims, and the scientific process, do not seem to understand even the basics of the logical process or how to form logical syllogisms, and come off as a sanctimonious ass.

[Kuroikaze]

3. Which is to say that only the dumb christians still believe. Weren't people just trying to get on me for casting judegment on everybody? I guess its only wrong when I do it right?

 

 

I personally do not think ALL Christians are idiots.

 

I DO think you are an idiot, but the what else would YOU call someone who thinks 2+2 = 5?

 

And people who think the earth is only 6,000-10,000 years old or that science is involved in some giant conspiracy theory against them are in the same boat.

 

 

2. If you show up at my house and take a crap on my carpet am I being rude when I tell you to get the hell out of my house?

[Franko47]

Thanks for answering, Defender, but you don't have a clue what I believe, or have seen, or felt. You apply the dogmatic "cubbyhole" description for all those who just have it "wrong". You have trouble accepting the fact that many people of a sound spiritual nature just can't live in your frightened and paranoid world. If you're just going to respond to that by calling us "weak", then fine. This dialogue is over. But you are the one who seems out of touch with your own humanity.

 

The huge mistaken premise in all of this is the Bible itself, man. You are convinced that it is inerrant and a perfect authority, and that you are interpreting it "perfectly", and so on.

 

But why do you believe this ? Have you no internal intuitions that differ from what this authority supposedly says? If so, do you just crush it as something sinful ? What about personal revelation ? Does that not count for anything ? Is the power of Christ and his ability to change a person much more than this collection of stories, myths, legends and parables ? Or do you enjoy the idea that the path is so narrow, and so few are going to make it to paradise ? And why so overbearing about all of this ? By constantly repeating your rhetoric do you think it will have some magical effect upon us ?

 

Just pointing out all the mistakes that I think the over-zealous often make, even when communicating with regular Christians. I still have Christian friends, and they'd be turned off with your act. But I guess they're just aberrant and false believers, too.

[Guest FaithDefender619]

3. Which is to say that only the dumb christians still believe. Weren't people just trying to get on me for casting judegment on everybody? I guess its only wrong when I do it right?

 

 

I personally do not think ALL Christians are idiots.

 

I DO think you are an idiot, but the what else would YOU call someone who thinks 2+2 = 5?

 

And people who think the earth is only 6,000-10,000 years old or that science is involved in some giant conspiracy theory against them are in the same boat.

 

 

2. If you show up at my house and take a crap on my carpet am I being rude when I tell you to get the hell out of my house?

 

1. When did I say 2+2=5?

 

2. Why is it idiotic to believe the earth only 6-10 thousand years old? Because science told you its a lie.

 

3. Ever heard of climategate?

 

4. Lets listen to someone who might know what he's talking about. Lord Monckton former science advisor to Margaret Thatcher.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nH_tD2E1qXU

 

5. Is this YOUR house? You guys seemed to have no problem with christian bashing was going on with little to no opposition before. But now that I'm here and you view me as some sort of close minded atheist basher I'm crapping on the carpet, I'm hurting peoples feelings, I don't care about them as people, waaaah waaaah waaaah. Stop being so emitonal.

[Kuroikaze]

1. When did I say 2+2=5?

 

I didn't I said that believing the earth is only 6 thousand years old is JUST as stupid because it is, I was making a comparison....and you missed it, bravo you made yourself look more stupid.

 

 

2. Why is it idiotic to believe the earth only 6-10 thousand years old? Because science told you its a lie.

 

Because it does not fit the data, not just from science, but from history as well. There are good process and checks an balances in both of these areas that can be demonstrated. If science was not a good tool for understanding reality then where did your computer come from?

 

Are there any similar checks in your religion?

 

3. Ever heard of climategate?

 

I have heard a bunch of whining idiots overblowing the issue, and using the fact that Al Gore supports global warming to deny that it happens, like somehow Al Gore is a scientist, and skeptics give a damn what that idiotic has been of a politician with no personality thinks about anything. Since Gore gets the science wrong almost as often as you do I do not really care.

 

The emails do seem to indicate a problem with that ONE group of scientists, and an investigation should and likely will be made, but I think it is much too early to say they were involved in some kind of cover up, most likely the emails just indicate that the issue has become too politicized, which can happen.

 

There is no doubt that global warming is occurring, the debate is whether or not its cause is primarily human caused, and what, if anything, can be done. To my knowledge both of those two issues are open for debate in the realm of science. It is a complex issue, there are serious scientists on many sides of those last two points.

 

 

4. Lets listen to someone who might know what he's talking about. Lord Monckton former science advisor to Margaret Thatcher.

 

Looked this guy up and he accused a person of being a member of Hitler youth because they argued for global warming.....yeah HE is balanced and skeptical about the issue

 

 

From Wikipedia

He has been described in some quarters as a "former science adviser to British prime minister Margaret Thatcher and a world-renowned scholar."^[9] However, his credentials as a commentator on climate change have been questioned by some commentators. James Hoggan and Richard Littlemore note in their book Climate Cover-Up: The Crusade to Deny Global Warming that Monckton has "no training whatsoever in science", and criticize his asserted credentials as "unfounded self-promotion."^[10] The Daily Telegraph has described him as "a former economic adviser".^[4]

 

He has no formal training in science, and that alone makes him unqualified to be taken seriously on these subjects.

 

It also seems he was never a Science adviser.

 

5. Is this YOUR house? You guys seemed to have no problem with christian bashing was going on with little to no opposition before. But now that I'm here and you view me as some sort of close minded atheist basher I'm crapping on the carpet, I'm hurting peoples feelings, I don't care about them as people, waaaah waaaah waaaah. Stop being so emitonal.

 

It is OUR website so the analogy fits.

 

There are hundreds of christian websites full of people bashing atheists and we do not complain about them, because it is "their house." Millions of churches are full of Christians do the same thing every Sunday in church and we do not complain, because they have a right do do as they please in this country. A right a fully support. I do not show up in churches and tell I disagree with them because I respect those rights.

 

However, if a Christian showed up at my house and tried to start preaching I would tell them to get lost, because that is MY right, and they are interfering with MY life.

 

What did I say that seemed emotional to you? I never asked you to care about us...I don't care about you, so I do not expect you to return any feelings, but I do not see it as an emotional reaction to ask you show a modicum of respect. I cannot speak for everyone here, but I have been fairly respectful with you. Yes I called you an idiot, but I was just being honest about my thoughts, and I am not claiming to be nice. I do not believe in being political correct or anything, if I think an idea is stupid I say so, if that makes me a jerk I can live with that.

[OnceConvinced]

 

2. SO because its on tv it must be true?

No, because magic has been debunked time and time again and cannot be shown to be real. Every trick has a logical explanation. I do not go "wow, I can't explain that" so attribute it to God or the Devil. Doing that is showing ignorance. It's all trickery and conartistry, and faith healers are no different either. Do a little research. You'll see it's true. You dont have to rely on just the TV. Education is the key here. Don't fall for cheap tricks.

 

3. That's what the bible says. You didn't have depth to your faith. You had one test and fell away.

No, I did not have one test. I had decades of tests and did not fall away. Hardships had nothing to do with my fall from the faith. The unreliability of the bible was a huge factor. As was God's inactivity. It's all very well to say the bible says this and the bible says that, but I have seen for myself after many years of following its principles that it cannot be taken seriously. I can only hope that one day you will realise the same thing and become free of the delusion you are living in as I have.

 

All the time, money and effort means nothign because you still fell away and forsook your faith. And that is proof that your faith had no depth. Mormons give money, muslims give time, Seventh Day Adventist give effort and they all follow a false religion. That doesn't mean anything. You again seem to think that your time in church equated to real faith. It doesn't I'm sorry.

 

So please do enlighten us. What have you done that makes your faith so deep? What makes you so special? What can anyone do to ensure they have a deep faith like you? I assure you I did it all. So if my faith wasn't deep enough, then that's hardly my fault. It's just proof that the bible is a load of nonsense and that the Christian God is non existant.

 

 

You keep telling me about what you did and how much you did. What it sounds like to me is that your whole christian walk was more about you and what you did than about Jesus.

Nope. My faith was all about Jesus. He was my number one priority. You can try to reason it away as much as you like, but I know my own Christian walk and I know what the bible teaches and what is supposed to be done. If those things didn't work and my faith was not deep enough or not built on a strong enough foundation, then that shows a serious flaw in the bible and with your so-called God. It shows that your God is a major failure and his will is weak. Or is shows a God who just doesn't care about his followers. Or is is proof that your God is non-existant. I can only conclude that if God is real he is not the bible God and that the bible is simply man's wisdom, not Gods.

[Kuroikaze]

THIS is what our entire conversation looks like to me

 

 

[NonXNonExX]

Forget it, folks. I've already figured out FD's airtight (seriously flawed, but airtight NTL) logic. If you left Xtianity it proves you were never a true Xtian so nothing you can say can prove otherwise. And if you were once a Xtian, it "proves" you know in your heart that the bible is completely true.

 

Of course, in spite of being exposed by my Catholic relatives and going to church every Sun. as a child i never became a believer in any sense of the word. Even when i became really interested in studying the bible and history of Xtianity, it only made me more convinced that it was all BS. Doesn't say much for the "power" of the Holey Spook, does it?

[par4dcourse]

All this preachin' and so far not one has fallen in the spirit, gave their lives to kryasst, or jumped back on the xian bandwagon.

You aren't much of a preacher, are you?

If you and gawd are as close chums as you claim, why he should have told you how to get a few rebels back in the fold. What gives?

So far, all you've managed is to push the membership farther from xianity. *gasp* You must be OF THE DEBBLE. Oh lawd hep us.

[centauri]

I know what the fruit of your faith is. And I know from reading responses and reading threads on here that many weren't christian because so many poeple lie on what we believe and what the bible says and use such fallacious arguments against both.

You can't even establish a consistent Christian doctrine on salvation.

You simply assume you've got it right while Mormons, Catholics, and other Christian sects have it wrong.

Why is that not self-righteousness on your part?

Also, according to the Bible, salvation has nothing to do with believing in a pagan human sacrifice.

That stipulation was laid down long before Christianity came along and changed the rules.

 

Its pretty surprising that a supposed former christian who read the bible dilligently doesn't know why we don't follow the law of moses, or that they think Dec 25 is biblical, or think that catholicism is the origianl christianity.

The early Christians are which sect today?

 

That shows you had/have no real understanding of what you believed and still for the most part don't know what christians believe. That is the plain facts.

Christians believe all sorts of things and are often at severe odds with each other.

Once again, demonstrate that you have it all right and other sects have it wrong.

 

A lot of the way churches worship and relate to God are wrong. I don't see why people think that no matter what you believe christian is christian as long as you call yourself christian. The bible lays down specific qualifications that a christian will meet.

You engage in Christian bashing.

You just got finished declaring other Christian sects as wrong and having a false religion.

What exactly are the specifications for a True Christian?

How many hospitals and nursing homes have you emptied with the wonder working power that you're supposed to have?

How many people have you fed by manifesting food from one loaf of bread?

How many mentally ill people have you cured by casting out their demons?

So far, all you've done is preach and assert.

Asserting is easy, demonstrating is much harder.

[Dagan]

 

1. It doesn't snow in San Diego

 

 

A) Ah, living the easy life, eh? If you REALLY wanted to persevere in the faith, you'd go street preach to the homeless drunks freezing to death in Minnesota.

 

 

2. Sure I care about you as human beings but its obvious many of you weren't really christians if you were then why do so many of you LIE on what the bible says and what we believe. I am listening to you which is why I can observe the things you are saying and gather that many of you were faking the funk.

 

 

ii) Please provide specific examples about how we are lying about the bible. Just because we're saying things you don't like doesn't mean we're lying.

 

And I'm not telling you my story about how I ended up here, the most psychologically painful experience of my life, because from what I've seen of the way you think and speak, all you'd say is that I was faking and spew a bunch more self-righteous venom. If you knew someone who was incredible physical pain and doctors couldn't find anything wrong, would you accuse the person in pain of faking? Because that's what you're doing here.

 

3. Go ahead and ban me. Wouldn't be the first site that threatened me with banning.

 

3.0.0.0.1) I have no power to ban you. But I would if I could because it would be a win-win for everyone. You'd get a persecution feather in your self-righteous heavenly crown and we wouldn't have to see your cancer hijacking interesting threads anymore.

[par4dcourse]

So far, all you've done is preach and assert.

Asserting is easy, demonstrating is much harder.

C'mon super-preacher. Type something god-inspired that will touch us all. Faith without works and all.....

Work some of god's magic on us. Heal somebody. Feed somebody. Change one sinner's mind.

Surely an all-powerful god could convince us poor ignorant sinners. I await your god-inspired message.

[NotBlinded]

I find it highly ironic that you talk about the Pharisees as if what they did is any different from what you are doing now. You talk about "depth" but you swim in the shallow end of the pool yourself. You take every word from that book at face value. There is no depth in your understanding FD.

 

So, stop offending us with your "insights". They are wrong. You need to look at yourself.

 

1. What am I doing that's like the pharisees?

 

2. Care to elaborate on what I lack in understanding or are we going to offer a shallow insult and then walk away.

 

3. If it wasn't true, it wouldn't offend you. I don't see why a bunch of atheist are getting so emotional when I say your faith wasn't that deep. I mean atheist try to tell me I was never a true atheist all the time and it doesn't bother me one bit.

Do you do your good "deeds" publically? Do you despise sinners or love them? Is your heart hard, cold and self-absorbed? Do you resemble anything in Matthew 23? Is there anything that has changed in your heart or is it just that you are following the rules listed in the bible? A bible, by the way, which created a religion around Jesus. Jesus wasn't a Christian. You are following people that wrote the bible.

 

I can see from your "fruits" that you don't care about anyone but yourself. This is the understanding that comes with a superficial reading of the bible. Show me anywhere that you have gone deeper than the "rules".

 

(#3) What? The truth never offends, but ignorance and then tossing out your uninformed understanding is offensive. You are a lowly piece of shit. Was that offending? Is it offending because it's the truth? NO! Don't be so stupid. It's not the truth, but it's offensive isn't it?

[NotBlinded]

3. That's what the bible says. You didn't have depth to your faith. You had one test and fell away. All the time, money and effort means nothign because you still fell away and forsook your faith. And that is proof that your faith had no depth. Mormons give money, muslims give time, Seventh Day Adventist give effort and they all follow a false religion. That doesn't mean anything. You again seem to think that your time in church equated to real faith. It doesn't I'm sorry.

This is your understanding of faith FD? Again, you are very shallow. What you have is a belief, not faith. A belief is a ferverent hope that God will be just what YOU want it to be. Faith is letting go of all held beliefs and letting God work in your heart. It is letting God be what it is beyond what you want God to be. Many atheists that let go of the Chrisitian belief would be much more loving and caring in their lives because they don't have the belief about what God is. Ironic isn't it? You don't have faith at all FD. Many atheists have more faith in love and caring for others, regardless of their "sins" than you do at this point in your life.

 

Let me know if you want to go to the deep end of the pool. We'll see if you can stay afloat or if you will cling to the rock (belief) that is sinking beside you. Will you let go and have faith that you can float?

[NotBlinded]

5. A lot of the way churches worship and relate to God are wrong. I don't see why people think that no matter what you believe christian is christian as long as you call yourself christian. The bible lays down specific qualifications that a christian will meet. There is a standard by which we can judge and as christians MUST judge. I know that doesn't fit into the world view of today where everything is relative and any and everybody can be a christian so long as they go to church on sunday but thats not what its about nor has it ever been about.

And you honestly can't see that you are a Christian Pharisee? Really? The Torah layed down specific qualifications that a Jew must meet too. The Pharisees followed the letter of the law, but not the heart of the letters themselves. How in the hell are you any different?

 

Matthew 23

13"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You shut the kingdom of heaven in men's faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will you let those enter who are trying to.

 

Yes, you are a great teacher of the law, but where in this thread or anywhere else have you shown us the love of God? You have done nothing but "shut the kingdom of heaven" in our faces.

 

As par4dcourse said, "Show us something God-insired and touch us all."

 

Your phylacteries are showing FD.

[Guest FaithDefender619]

I know what the fruit of your faith is. And I know from reading responses and reading threads on here that many weren't christian because so many poeple lie on what we believe and what the bible says and use such fallacious arguments against both.

You can't even establish a consistent Christian doctrine on salvation.

You simply assume you've got it right while Mormons, Catholics, and other Christian sects have it wrong.

Why is that not self-righteousness on your part?

Also, according to the Bible, salvation has nothing to do with believing in a pagan human sacrifice.

That stipulation was laid down long before Christianity came along and changed the rules.

 

Its pretty surprising that a supposed former christian who read the bible dilligently doesn't know why we don't follow the law of moses, or that they think Dec 25 is biblical, or think that catholicism is the origianl christianity.

The early Christians are which sect today?

 

That shows you had/have no real understanding of what you believed and still for the most part don't know what christians believe. That is the plain facts.

Christians believe all sorts of things and are often at severe odds with each other.

Once again, demonstrate that you have it all right and other sects have it wrong.

 

A lot of the way churches worship and relate to God are wrong. I don't see why people think that no matter what you believe christian is christian as long as you call yourself christian. The bible lays down specific qualifications that a christian will meet.

You engage in Christian bashing.

You just got finished declaring other Christian sects as wrong and having a false religion.

What exactly are the specifications for a True Christian?

How many hospitals and nursing homes have you emptied with the wonder working power that you're supposed to have?

How many people have you fed by manifesting food from one loaf of bread?

How many mentally ill people have you cured by casting out their demons?

So far, all you've done is preach and assert.

Asserting is easy, demonstrating is much harder.

 

1. Yes I can. Read the bible. The Mormons don't even believe the bible is the only book they should use, there is the Pearl of Great Price and The Book of Mormon (which they believe is the only way to truly understand the bible). And mormon salvation looks nothing like biblical salvation. When a good mormon dies He and His wife become gods of their own planet and the woman populates the planet with children. The catholics likewise believe that the bible is true but needs to be supplemented with the cathecism of the church and all of its rulings (which have swung back and forth through the history of the catholic church, at times it was Christ alone that saved you, other times its Christ and Mary that save you).

 

2. Since when is saying someone is wrong self-righteous. If the bible doesnt't teach what someone is saying, then that person is wrong. If mormons think they are going to become gods of their own planet but that cannot be found in scripture anywhere then the mormons are wrong.

 

3. Pagan human sacrifice? Yes the following the Torah was the stipulation in that day and age, however the bible talks about God giving a new covenant which was not like that of the Jews when they came out of Egypt, so simply because we are under a new covenant doesn't mean that we are changing the rules.

 

4. Who said they were sects? It was either you were a christian or not. There were groups that tried to pervert what the bible said and the teachings of the apostles like say the gnostics or the Arians but that only proves there were people who perverted the original teaching not that the original teaching gave creedance to such actions. Evolution doesn't inherently teach racism or eugenics on the scale we saw in America and Europe that sought to sterilize social undesirables or even imprison them. However people could and did indeed pervert the original teaching to mean just that. That isn't a mark against the teaching but rather a mark agains those who misused said teaching for their own ideas. Nor does it make both right.

 

Have what all right? Demonstrate it how?

 

5. I'm not christian bashing. I'm simply stating that simply because someone says they're a christian makes them a christian. Many people on here have said I was never a real atheist, which is to say there is a standard for what a real atheist is. Using that same logic there is a standard for what a real christian is. Simply going to church and doing some church activites doesn't make you a real christian.

 

6. I didn't say ALL christian sects are following a false religion and are wrong, I'm saying a lot of churches do engage in unbiblical and in most cases heretical practices and forms of worship.

 

7. I'm thinking of doing a thread as well as a youtube video on that topic so keep your eyes open for that.

 

8. What wonder working power? LOL.

 

9. None.

 

10. None.

 

11. ..........I think you are confusing clearing up obvious ignorance of what christians believe with preaching. I haven't once preached on here I'm simply clearing up what is appauling ignorance of what christians supposedly believe from a group of people who supposedly were all super christians in the past.

[Guest FaithDefender619]

5. A lot of the way churches worship and relate to God are wrong. I don't see why people think that no matter what you believe christian is christian as long as you call yourself christian. The bible lays down specific qualifications that a christian will meet. There is a standard by which we can judge and as christians MUST judge. I know that doesn't fit into the world view of today where everything is relative and any and everybody can be a christian so long as they go to church on sunday but thats not what its about nor has it ever been about.

And you honestly can't see that you are a Christian Pharisee? Really? The Torah layed down specific qualifications that a Jew must meet too. The Pharisees followed the letter of the law, but not the heart of the letters themselves. How in the hell are you any different?

 

Matthew 23

13"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You shut the kingdom of heaven in men's faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will you let those enter who are trying to.

 

Yes, you are a great teacher of the law, but where in this thread or anywhere else have you shown us the love of God? You have done nothing but "shut the kingdom of heaven" in our faces.

 

As par4dcourse said, "Show us something God-insired and touch us all."

 

Your phylacteries are showing FD.

 

1. Yes the Pharisees followed the Law and they were also breaking it at the same time. It would have been totally different if they were following the law and doing so out of love for God like the prophets (who preached against sin and were so hated by the jews that they killed all of them), and actually lived the life they were supposed to. But they didn't And on top of that the pharisees made up and added things to the law. Having no standards isn't the mark of a christian quite the opposite Jesus laid down the standards for a christian life. He said we MUST repent or perish, we MUST have child like faith in Him, we MUST walk the narrow path, we MUST not be friends with the world. The Pauline epistles as well as those of James, Jude, Peter and John all elaborate on these teachings as well. If you read past verse 13 you'd see what Jesus was talking about when addressing the pharisees.

 

2. What is the love of God? People in this modern age have confused what love is. Jesus said for as many as I love I chasten and rebuke. Love isn't a hug or a kiss or some touchy feely oh come here and give grandpappy Jesus a hug. Thats not what it is. It's wanting the greatest good for a person. The only time Jesus spoke of Gods love for man was at night in the house of Niccodemus in which Jesus spoke John 3:16. However elsewhere Jesus spoke of how man is to love God by doing His will and preaching about hell. The words hell and fire hadn't been put into one term hell fire until Jesus. Jesus is the original hell fire preacher. And I still would love to see one thing I've said that is hateful or something that would shut heaven off to you. Just one.

 

3. God inspired like what?