Im A Christian Again

[Michael]

Those people are regular people..they are sinners. I do feel compassion on them and I know that many many people are suffering injustly right now. But Jesus was/is Holy..thats the difference. He spent forever (an infinite amount of time) with God the Father and then He had to be seperated from that and come here so that He could save us! Thats the difference. You obviously have not counted how many people live and have lived and will live on this plant. I believe the count is about 20 billion right now (that is what I dug up, I could be wrong). So can you imagine never knowing pain and sorrow and sin for longer than time ever existed then coming down to earth and taking every single persons sin onto yourself. I dont think it was just physical pain He endured....it was spiritual murder too.

 

Oh well fuck them. They are just sinners. They might have deserved the torture (http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/images/2008/05/12/jewish_children.jpg). Jesus was holy, that is somehow different.

How should I imagine to "carry every single person sin"? Did he got beaten for every sin? What was the punishment for every SINGLE sin? Death? Well, he died once, not 20 billion times.

 

I do not understand your 20 billion count? People who already lived on earth? Since there are human beings? Or since 6000 years, when god created the earth?

[Guest Justyna]

Michael,

 

I am actually not looking forward to Jesus' return. I mean on one hand I am of course...but on the other hand I am not. I pray that He delays His coming. Not that I think that prayer matters to Him cause He is going to come when He wants, but I have an entire family that is unsaved. I have tons of friends who are unsaved. I have Christian friends who are not walking the walk and most importantly I do not think my walk with Him is perfect. I try but I am not perfect.

 

I think it is strange that people think I made up an account, waited about a year, pretended to have deconverted, then came back and made all this up. Not true at all. Im the real thing. I only spend about an hour here anyway each day because I want to answer questions to people who asked me. I do have a life to live, and I am not a troll. Would a troll type all this out as I have? Would a troll take the abuse that I have from complete strangers? Come to think of it..why do I take this? Its something deeper, better yet Someone deeper that is compelling me to do so. I dont take credit for anything that I might have said that will change someone...I do take responsibility if I offended anyone as those were not my intentions. Im a work in progress, and yeah I blackslid/deconverted for a whole year....did you expect perfection? I hope not. I probably should be further along in my Christian walk but I messed up too.

[Guest Justyna]

Michael,

 

I saw a documentary on the discovery channel (or maybe it was TLC) and it was about the beginning of time and how the Universe was formed. Not just the Earth but the entire Universe. I believe the narrator was Steven Hawking (he is the brilliant thinker that is bound to a wheel chair). Anyway, they were saying that they estimate that since the creation of Earth, 20 billion people have lived on it. Right now we have the largest population of people we ever had.

[Michael]

Michael,

 

I am actually not looking forward to Jesus' return. I mean on one hand I am of course...but on the other hand I am not. I pray that He delays His coming. Not that I think that prayer matters to Him cause He is going to come when He wants, but I have an entire family that is unsaved. I have tons of friends who are unsaved. I have Christian friends who are not walking the walk and most importantly I do not think my walk with Him is perfect. I try but I am not perfect.

 

You take the message seriously. That is a good thing. When I was a xian it hurt me most, that I could not become perfect. I have tried so hard to be like jesus, but the more I have tried the more I discovered, that I am just a sinner who needs grace and forgiveness. Since I am no longer a xian, I have found peace about the fact, that I am just a human being. I try my best, sometimes I succed, sometimes I fail. We all are just human beings that try to to their best.

 

I think it is strange that people think I made up an account, waited about a year, pretended to have deconverted, then came back and made all this up. Not true at all. Im the real thing. I only spend about an hour here anyway each day because I want to answer questions to people who asked me. I do have a life to live, and I am not a troll. Would a troll type all this out as I have? Would a troll take the abuse that I have from complete strangers? Come to think of it..why do I take this? Its something deeper, better yet Someone deeper that is compelling me to do so. I dont take credit for anything that I might have said that will change someone...I do take responsibility if I offended anyone as those were not my intentions. Im a work in progress, and yeah I blackslid/deconverted for a whole year....did you expect perfection? I hope not. I probably should be further along in my Christian walk but I messed up too.

 

I do not know you but I have no reason to call you a liar. Life can be difficult, so are people. Why should you be further in your xian walk? Do you have an aganda that tells you what you have to achieve in a day, week, month, year? How do you know, where you should be right now?

[OnceConvinced]

Well as far as Pauls claim that Jesus was coming soon (and of course He has not come back yet) 2,000+ years is nothing compared to eternity. It really is not. Paul said He was coming soon. Well its been a while and He has not come back yet. True. But what is 2,000 years or 3,000 years compared to eternity? Not a lot. So I am going to venture out and say that, even though I do not know what Paul meant for sure when he made those statements, thats what he was trying to say. Eternity goes on forever and ever and ever..with no end.

 

Paul was not looking at eternity. Nowhere in is writings is he suggesting anything like that. You are using an excuse to justify the fact that Jesus has not returned yet. Even Jesus said he would return in the life time of those who were witnessing his execution. Paul believed that to be the case. Paul saw all the signs of his coming (just like modern day Christians think they are seeing them now) and completely believed that Jesus would be returning in his life time and the life time of the Christians he was writing to. Not 2000 years into the future. Read through his letters and you will see the urgency in his tone. You will see that he believed Jesus's return was eminent. You will see Paul pointing out various prophecies and how they had been fulfilled right there and then. He believed that he had been out into the world and preached the gospel to everyone, a sure sign that Jesus was about to return. Paul was mistaken. The bible is wrong. Jesus is not returning.

 

Continue with your wolf crying, just like every other Christian. But I have been around long enough to know that's all it is. And who will be to blame if Jesus did return? The people who cry wolf of course. It will be their fault that so many people did not believe.

[Guest Justyna]

Michael,

 

No I do not have an agenda at all. But I can tell that my "witnessing skills" if you want to call them that SUCK big time! The truth is I was on my way out of this board and wanted to delete my account that I NEVER used. Then I thought I would post one last thread saying that I have re-converted again....just sort of as a good-bye farewell sort of thing. Not to be mean or spiteful, but simply to share my journey. I didnt think it would lead to 8 pages of everyone getting upset calling me names and the rest...I mean yeah I can walk away anytime, I do not have to answer anyones questions, but I figured I would do what I could. Then as the thread progressed I did sort of want to help lead people back to Him..but those were not my initial intentions. I was about to delete my account.

 

Well from it, I can see that I have a lot of growing to do because instead of people seeing my point of view, I get attacked by all. Maybe I am not the smartest person on the planet, but I can see that if everyone is saying something about my approach to this whole thing, then perhaps I need to grow in that area. I am sure I will have plenty more opportunities in the future to grow etc. Thats all I guess.

[Guest Justyna]

OnceConvined,

 

In what scripture does it say that Jesus Himself said that He was coming back during those people's lives?

[Guest Justyna]

OnceConverted,

 

I am not a Bible Scholar, but the only thing I can think of (without having scripture to see where exactly Jesus said that) is that Jesus DID return to those that witnessed Him get curucified. Dont you remember that He showed Himself to many people when He rose from the dead? So technically He did come back to the people who witnessed Him get killed. That is all I can think of, unless you show me otherwise.

[OnceConvinced]

Matt 16:28:

Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.

 

Mark 13:30 Assuredly, I say to you, this generation will by no means pass away till all these things take place.

 

If you check these verses out in context, he was clearly talking about the second coming and about the end times, not just his supposed visit to his desciples after his so-called ressurection.

 

People will try to justify the above verse and try to reinterpret these scriptures as meaning something different, but if you imagine you were there when he said these things to you, they can only mean one thing. Jesus intended his second coming to be within the life times of the people he was addressing. Paul certainly believed it to be so.

[Michael]

Michael,

 

No I do not have an agenda at all. But I can tell that my "witnessing skills" if you want to call them that SUCK big time! The truth is I was on my way out of this board and wanted to delete my account that I NEVER used. Then I thought I would post one last thread saying that I have re-converted again....just sort of as a good-bye farewell sort of thing. Not to be mean or spiteful, but simply to share my journey. I didnt think it would lead to 8 pages of everyone getting upset calling me names and the rest...I mean yeah I can walk away anytime, I do not have to answer anyones questions, but I figured I would do what I could. Then as the thread progressed I did sort of want to help lead people back to Him..but those were not my initial intentions. I was about to delete my account.

 

Well from it, I can see that I have a lot of growing to do because instead of people seeing my point of view, I get attacked by all. Maybe I am not the smartest person on the planet, but I can see that if everyone is saying something about my approach to this whole thing, then perhaps I need to grow in that area. I am sure I will have plenty more opportunities in the future to grow etc. Thats all I guess.

 

Why do you think, that your "witnessing skills" suck? What do you expect from people hearing the gospel? That they fall on their knees and repent? Take people serious, accept that they might be as intelligent as you are. As long as you are the one with the REAL truth a discussion at eye level is impossible. Most people here have serious questions and arguments that get ignored by xians again and again. Why in the world should I build up my entire life on xian values and rules, when the xians are not able to answer my questions or take my doubts serious? My friend is a pastor with an "open church" approach. He loves people who convert, but he ignores people with real doubts. They are not worth the effort.

 

Btw. This entire "grow", "become mature", "become more like jesus", "become holier every day" is a disease that steals your life.

[OnceConvinced]

OnceConverted,

 

I am not a Bible Scholar, but the only thing I can think of (without having scripture to see where exactly Jesus said that) is that Jesus DID return to those that witnessed Him get curucified. Dont you remember that He showed Himself to many people when He rose from the dead? So technically He did come back to the people who witnessed Him get killed. That is all I can think of, unless you show me otherwise.

 

I can see the Christian mindset coming through in these posts. You are unfamiliar with the verses I am talking about, but yet you automatically presume that because Jesus hasn't returned yet it must mean those scriptures are referring to events 2000+ years into the future or that they are referring to something else that occurred. Your thinking will be forever tainted by that presumption. You will never see them for what they are - unfulfilled prophecies, because your mind will not allow you to see them as that. The defence mechanisms kick in and you have to justify and make excuses. You would not be even willing to consider the possibility that they might be unfulfilled prophecies and that both Jesus and Paul might have been completely wrong. Because of that you will always be relying on blind faith. I challenge you not to read the bible with a mindset but draw your conclusions based on what it says, not what you want it to say.

[Guest Justyna]

OnceConvinced,

 

That automatic thing in me is the Holy Spirit..it kicks in right away....it is automatic and I cannot control it as long as He lives in me as He does now. I will have to read the entire chapter because something tells me you are taking it out of context. Will get back to you on that one..I am getting sleepy now and will be signing off. Its not a cop out cause I have been here every night..its simply me saying I cant think straight to interpret the scripture for you because its late.

 

Michael,

 

Why do you have to have everything answered before you believe in Him? Of course part of my walk will always be based on faith and not logic/reason/proof. Dont you know that it pleases God when we believe but have not seen Him? We are more blessed when we believe Him when we do not physically see Him, then those that actually saw Him back in the day and believed. God counts faith as righteousness. When Moses was leading the Isrealites, his faith in God was accounted to him as righteousness..there were no Christians at the time. And since faith is the substance for things unseen, of course you will spend many times just believing Him even though you do not know where you are going. I do not know where I am going in my life. Have no clue, have no agenda. I will go where He takes me. I trust Him..trust that HIs will is better than mine. I dont need to know everything and have all my ts crossed and my i's dotted. Why do you? Why not take a leap of faith and believe?

 

Anyway..I got to go nite nite. It is waaay to late, and I spent more than my allocated one hour on this board. Plus I am afraid if I stay up longer I will start to make a lot of typos and misinterpret things and that is not going to be good. I will try to check this thread tomorrow if I can.

[OnceConvinced]

.

 

I think it is strange that people think I made up an account, waited about a year, pretended to have deconverted, then came back and made all this up. Not true at all. Im the real thing. I only spend about an hour here anyway each day because I want to answer questions to people who asked me. I do have a life to live, and I am not a troll.

 

Well when you pretty much call us liars telling us we don't know what we're talking about when we say that we were UNABLE to believe, it shows us that you have never at any stage made any attempt to understand what it is to be an ex-Christian. Nor have you spent any time getting to know where we are coming from. Surely if you were here to learn or to find support you would have come to an understanding of a few facts, but you have shown this not to be the case. And now you get on your high horse, judging us just like a typical Christian does, one who has no desire to understand us. Yep, sounds like you chose this place as your personal mission ground to me.

 

Would a troll type all this out as I have? Would a troll take the abuse that I have from complete strangers?

 

That's what trolls do. They get a kick out of pissing people off.

 

Come to think of it..why do I take this? Its something deeper, better yet Someone deeper that is compelling me to do so.

 

I can think of many reasons:

1) You have chosen to make this your personal mission ground

2) You wish to earn brownie points with your imaginery deity.

3) You wish to be able to tell other Christians that you have suffered persecution at the hands of unbelievers, so that you can appear more holy to them.

4) You are stubborn and love a good argument.

5) You are a masochist.

 

I ask myself why I am a glutton for punishment and continue to debate people like you even though I know it is most likely futile. I guess is must be the real God compelling me to enlighten the deluded.

 

I dont take credit for anything that I might have said that will change someone...I do take responsibility if I offended anyone as those were not my intentions. Im a work in progress, and yeah I blackslid/deconverted for a whole year....did you expect perfection? I hope not. I probably should be further along in my Christian walk but I messed up too.

So do you admit that you were insensitive, insulting, condescending and judgemental with your accusations of us not wanting to believe, rather than being UNABLE to believe?

[OnceConvinced]

OnceConvinced,

 

That automatic thing in me is the Holy Spirit..it kicks in right away....it is automatic and I cannot control it as long as He lives in me as He does now.

Oh yeah, the holy spirit. Funny this holy spirit can't do what it says it will do and help you recall everything you need to know.

 

John 14:26

“But the Comforter, the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in My name, He shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.”

 

Still nothing coming to you Justyna? Oh dear... no holy spirit at work in your life then.

 

And if you had the holy spirit in you, you would be showing all these fruits:

 

Love, Joy, Peace, Patience/longsuffering, Kindness, Goodness, Faithfulness, Gentleness, Self-Control

 

Seeing as you have caused a lot of people to be angry with you, that's "Peace" out the door. Could very well mean you're not even a true Christian. The big teller for me will be patience/longsuffering. If you're still here in a months time I might admit you have that. If not... well simply more proof that you do not have the holy spirit in you and are not likely to be a true Christian.

 

Sorry, Justyna, it's not the holy spirit, it's fear kicking in trying to prevent you from losing the faith that you so desperately wish to keep a hold of.

 

I will have to read the entire chapter because something tells me you are taking it out of context.

Once again it's you being presumptious, unable to believe that your so-called infallible word is flawed and inspired by ignorant bronze aged tribesmen, not God. If the holy spirit was in you he would help you recall that chapter. You'll find it hasn't been taken out of context. You will need to take it out of context to try to mould it into what you want it to mean. I imagine what you'll be doing is running away to try to find some justification as to how those scriptures are talking about future generations or the nation of Israel.

 

Will get back to you on that one..I am getting sleepy now and will be signing off. Its not a cop out cause I have been here every night..its simply me saying I cant think straight to interpret the scripture for you because its late.

You need your sleep. But don't try to tell me you have the holy spirit in you, because obviously you don't otherwise you wouldn't be needing to go away to try to work out justifications for those scriptures. The holy spirit would be filling you in, tired or not.

 

And as for interpretation of scripture, I don't need you to do that for me. I'm quite capable of doing that myself without having to taint it with presumptions and I've heard all the silly justifications from Christians before and they don't hold water. Just desperate attempts to force prophecies to relate to the modern day.

 

The evidence is damning and that's that Jesus has not returned and it's 2000 years down the track. Everybody who's ever predicted his return in their life times has been wrong. EVERYONE. And you can't compare 2000 to eternity, because you're talking about a finite number being divided by an infinite number. Do the maths. You can't because it just doesn't work. Even 2000 would be impossibly quick. But anyway 2000 years is a long time in anyone's books and if God had meant 2000 years he would have said 2000 years, not "soon". Seems God was deliberately trying to mislead us all.

 

While I'm at it, I'll give you another thing to ponder on. Old testament prophecies of the first coming of the messiah were classed by he bible writers as events that were not to take place for a long time yet. They were a long way off. 4000 or so years later, along comes Jesus. So 4000 years was a long time in bible terms. So how can you now try to claim that 2000 years is a short period of time? Of course not. Let's be consistent here. No, if we're talking about a short period of time, we're talking about just a few years. Something that was due to happen in the first century BC. Not in the 21st century. More evidence that the prophecies of the 2nd coming were not fulfilled.

 

Are you listening, Justyn? Or are you refusing to hear?

 

Man, I would love to have read some writings from Paul in his final days alive. I wonder if he remained faithful till the end. I somehow doubt it. He would have been like Jesus I should imagine, lamenting, "My God, why have you forsaken me?"

 

 

Why do you have to have everything answered before you believe in Him? Of course part of my walk will always be based on faith and not logic/reason/proof. Dont you know that it pleases God when we believe but have not seen Him? We are more blessed when we believe Him when we do not physically see Him, then those that actually saw Him back in the day and believed.

God counts faith as righteousness.

Have you ever asked why? Why would it be so important to God? It would definitely be important for people who want to control others through religion and have people believe in a God that doesnt' exist, but I can't see why it would be important for an all knowing God who must surely understand that many of the people he created are unable to live by faith and require proof. Obviously he didn't give a shit about those particular people. I guess he intended to throw those ones into hell right from the beginning.

 

I for one would not expect my loved ones to believe in me on faith alone. I would expect that I would need to prove my love for them. Words would not be enough. I would expect that I would deal with them each as individuals and deal with their individual needs in the ways they need and perhaps even want. I would not put them all in one box and say "what's good for the goose is good for the gander." That's not loving. My love to them would have no conditions either. It would not be dependent on them loving me back or having faith in me. Even if my kids disowned me, I would still love them. I wouldn't abandom them like your God would.

[Michael]

Michael,

 

Why do you have to have everything answered before you believe in Him?

Because xianity as I see it, is something that influences your entire life. Your way of parenting, how to relate to people, how to lead your marriage, your value system, how to behave as an employee, how to live your sex life and so on. You expect me to change my entire life just because you have a warm feeling when talking about the intangible jesus. Because we all know it is not just a little prayer. You are asked to spent time with other xians, pray regularly, listen to sermons, read the bible... When you try to take xianity serious it will cost you a lot. And you know this. I have been a xian for nearly 20 years and I have lived this kind of life. I had my reasons to leave xianity.

 

Of course part of my walk will always be based on faith and not logic/reason/proof. Dont you know that it pleases God when we believe but have not seen Him? We are more blessed when we believe Him when we do not physically see Him, then those that actually saw Him back in the day and believed.

I wrote it in another thread. As a xian you can not stay intellectually honest. You have to ignore a lot of knowledge and lower your sights. And how should I know, that it pleases god when we believe but have not seen him? I have never met him. I do not know if he exists. So how should I know what pleases him? The bible is not a divine source for knowledge. It is just a book. Written by men, revised by men, adapted and abridged by men. It is not a reliable source.

 

God counts faith as righteousness. When Moses was leading the Isrealites, his faith in God was accounted to him as righteousness..there were no Christians at the time. And since faith is the substance for things unseen, of course you will spend many times just believing Him even though you do not know where you are going. I do not know where I am going in my life. Have no clue, have no agenda. I will go where He takes me. I trust Him..trust that HIs will is better than mine. I dont need to know everything and have all my ts crossed and my i's dotted. Why do you? Why not take a leap of faith and believe?

 

Why is faith so important for god? Why is it a virtue to trust in someone I can not see, hear, smell, touch? To blindly follow a set of rules? That is a good thing? Do you want your children to believe and follow blindly? Everyone? People in the 3rd Reich did it and it lead an entire world into chaos. Sects expect obedience = bad! Stalin expects obedience = bad! Your muslim preacher expect obedience = bad! Jesus expects obedience = good! What makes jesus special? Is it a virtue to believe in unicorns and dragons although I can not see them? No it is not. What makes your god different?

 

 

And again, you write as I have never been a xian. I have been a xian, I have read the books you have read, I have heard the sermons you have heard. I did my daily bible reading, went to church services every Sunday, worshiped god and gave my entire being to god. Why not take a leap of faith and believe? Because I have done it and after all those years of obedience toward god he failed to be the god he promised to be.

 

Btw. I would really enjoy xians answering the questions we "unbelievers" have asked instead of talking about some vague emotional impressions. It does not matter which xian I ask, they always ignore my real questions.

 

If there would be a god, a loving father that helps and comforts his children, a god that heals the sick and supports the poor and the weak, I would certainly trust in him and believe in him. It is rather difficult to reject such a nice idea. It is not that people do not want to believe in this nice idea. It is just not the truth. Yes it is comforting to believe in and dream of Pandora (the movie Avatar), but it is just not real.

[OnceConvinced]

 

Here's more words from the Gospel of Hank:

 

 

That was great. Did you write that? If so can I use it and quote you in the future?

[Midnight-mindwanderings]

[dagnarus]

Michael,

 

No I do not have an agenda at all. But I can tell that my "witnessing skills" if you want to call them that SUCK big time! The truth is I was on my way out of this board and wanted to delete my account that I NEVER used. Then I thought I would post one last thread saying that I have re-converted again....just sort of as a good-bye farewell sort of thing. Not to be mean or spiteful, but simply to share my journey. I didnt think it would lead to 8 pages of everyone getting upset calling me names and the rest...I mean yeah I can walk away anytime, I do not have to answer anyones questions, but I figured I would do what I could. Then as the thread progressed I did sort of want to help lead people back to Him..but those were not my initial intentions. I was about to delete my account.

 

Well from it, I can see that I have a lot of growing to do because instead of people seeing my point of view, I get attacked by all. Maybe I am not the smartest person on the planet, but I can see that if everyone is saying something about my approach to this whole thing, then perhaps I need to grow in that area. I am sure I will have plenty more opportunities in the future to grow etc. Thats all I guess.

 

You say that you have not come here with an agenda.

 

You just decided out of the blue to come back here and say goodbye to people you spoke with breifly for 4 days a full year ago.

 

Indeed you say you didn't come here to "Re-Convert" us but rather, you simply want to "share your journey and experience" with us?

 

Then how come we have heard lots and lots of preaching, and next to no experience?

 

I know that you supposedly wished to walk away from God, I don't really know why, You stated in the broadest terms that your athiest father convinced you and you wanted to do your own thing, I know nothing of the things which your father supposedly said to you which affected you so, I know nothing of the thoughts and feelings which you had to process in order to come to the conclusion you wished to leave Christianity, I know nothing of your experience.

 

I know you supposedly were brought by God back into the fold, but I know nothing of this experience, I know nothing of how he shepherded you, I know nothing of the specific experiences which touched you, and caused you to rededicate your life to Christianity, I know nothing of your experience, because you haven't told us. You haven't told us of any specific experiences of Gods working in your life afterwards. All you have talked about has been in the most general of terms possible.

 

Indeed you haven't stated anything to make me think you have ever actually had a religious experience.

[Antlerman]

Well from it, I can see that I have a lot of growing to do because instead of people seeing my point of view, I get attacked by all.

What the hell? Where did you see me attack you? I addressed you respectfully and intelligently and you ignored anything I said, didn't respond, and then lump me into your pot of so-called "attackers". How do you expect any credibility in anyone's eyes when you treat others so unfairly?

 

My conclusion is you are acting emotionally and irrationally. That is evident. And as such, you fail to show the fruits of any sort of life "transformed by faith"; you have found no center, no font of Wisdom from which good works flow. You're clearly taking the wrong tact here. "By their fruits you shall know them."

[sumluvlifilth]

But the funny thing, I think I swear more than I ever did before, but I still do it so rarely that when I do, the kids jump and exclaim: "Dad! You cursed!?" It has a greater impact if not used too often.

That's the same reason I don't curse too often. I only really use it at home to get people's attention.

[Phanta]

Well I spoke with my own words and so perhaps it is best that I speak with Jesus' words instead now. Maybe that will be best. It seems that everything fell on deaf ears. *shrug*

 

Mark 4:9

And He said to them, “He who has ears to hear, let him hear!”

 

Most of you say that you cant believe again because you are unable to anymore. I do not agree with that statement. You do not believe because you do not want to. You let the world and all its lies into your hearts and into your heads and so it has complicated things. But Jesus can bring anyone back. All is not lost. You try to reason and figure it out, and try to develop new theories and concepts and they all lead to nothing in the end. Just fruitless searches. You want to understand everything, know everything as though we as humans are worthy to know such mysteries and great things... while all along your hearts are hard and your spirits are not open. So even if Jesus spoke directly to you, you would not listen. So why should He even waste His breath if you will not let Him in and surrender to Him and worship Him with all your might? He will not be mocked.

 

I guess I will just quietly leave on this note.

 

Matthew 10:14-15

And whoever will not receive you nor hear your words, when you depart from that house or city, shake off the dust from your feet. 15 Assuredly, I say to you, it will be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrah in the day of judgment than for that city!

 

Ugh. People.

 

We teach what we most need to learn.

 

Phanta

[bdp]

 

 

Fuck you.

[Phanta]

I am actually not looking forward to Jesus' return. I mean on one hand I am of course...but on the other hand I am not. I pray that He delays His coming. Not that I think that prayer matters to Him cause He is going to come when He wants, but I have an entire family that is unsaved. I have tons of friends who are unsaved. I have Christian friends who are not walking the walk and most importantly I do not think my walk with Him is perfect. I try but I am not perfect.

 

What's the point of ending the cycle God set up of new souls being created and going through toil and making choices, with free will? Why would God ever begin such a process, to end it?

 

I think it is strange that people think I made up an account, waited about a year, pretended to have deconverted, then came back and made all this up.

 

I don't find it strange, though I disagree. Human beings are complex, and our decisions are more complex than we ourselves even know. Humans are a lot of gray, but their thinking often isn't. Like the way you see us. Same behavior, different details.

 

Phanta

[Phanta]

Come to think of it..why do I take this? Its something deeper, better yet Someone deeper that is compelling me to do so.

 

You've got some lessons to learn here yet.

 

Phanta

[Phanta]

Then as the thread progressed I did sort of want to help lead people back to Him..but those were not my initial intentions. I was about to delete my account.

 

There's a bit of honesty and growth.

 

This is where a lot of the cries of "liar" came from. People here feel that intention pretty quickly, and it isn't welcome. I get that it rose in you and didn't feel strong. That's fine. It's still there, and it's still true, and when you deny it, as you did previously, people who are sensitive to it are going to call you out. That's people for you. They don't like to be lied to about stuff they find unpleasant. That's definitely going to harden many people to anything that you say.

 

Phanta